WCQF: P2 | (4) LA Clippers vs Utah Jazz (5) | UTA 4-3

[jazzfan1971]

Felton was quite effective the first 4 games. You wouldn't think so looking at him, but, he was.

[Hello Brooklyn]

not sure that's correct... the Jazz has become a really good team ...they have everything, a top level defensive anchor rim protector, long defensive wings, a two-way PG who can really defend and make every opposing PG miserable, good shooters etc... depth too if Favors is fully healthy... it is hard to find another more complete team than the Jazz in NBA nowadays...

The Jazz have no playoff experience and Chris Paul is BY FAR the best player.

The Clippers also have a coach with Championship experience and home court advantage.

Of course they should win the series. The Jazz are not yet ready to make a serious run. Their key guy in the 4th quarter has been Joe Johnson.

Having the best player only gets you so far. You still need other contributors and you still need to defend. Durant was by far the best player in the OKC vs Memphis series in 12-13. Most of them. Had been to the finals and their coach had led the team to the finals, but with Westbrook out, the Grizzlies had the 2nd and 3rd best players in the series, and the Thunder lose 4-1.

A team wins a series not the best player in the series. The Jazz as a group don't have playoff experience together, but two of their biggest contributors in Hill and Johnson have extensive playoff experience as well as another good contributor in Diaz having a ton of playoff experience. So I don't know if playoff experience is going to change anything when it is Johnson, the guy with a ton of it who hits the majority of the big shots on the Clippers. On the other side, they just need to keep up their intensity and focus on defense.

Bro, the Clippers still have two all star level players and a supposed top 3 coach in the League. That's without Blake Griffin.

I don't think Durant should have lost to the Grizzlies in 13 either. Didn't an OKC newspaper run a headline in that series calling him Mr. Unreliable?

Joe Johnson is a nice player but all he does is run ISO plays. As a Nets fan, I've probably watched more of Johnson than you have.

If he gets it going in the 4th quarter then double him and get the ball out of his hands.

I just don't buy the argument that the Jazz have a better team than the Clippers when you have two all stars one of who is supposed to be a top 10 player and a top coach.

If I was a Clippers fan I would be pissed.

[10DayContract]

Seriously. I'm not impressed with The Clipper's roster. They've done exactly what I'd expect them to do honestly. People using getting to the Conference Finals as some barometer for their success trip me out. So them winning 2 or 3 more games in a few different seasons would've changed your entire feelings about this team? Not for me. They are what they are. Stop expecting them to really be great, that's the reason you guys sit around dumbfounded at the end of every season.

[Hello Brooklyn]

not sure that's correct... the Jazz has become a really good team ...they have everything, a top level defensive anchor rim protector, long defensive wings, a two-way PG who can really defend and make every opposing PG miserable, good shooters etc... depth too if Favors is fully healthy... it is hard to find another more complete team than the Jazz in NBA nowadays...

The Jazz have no playoff experience and Chris Paul is BY FAR the best player.

The Clippers also have a coach with Championship experience and home court advantage.

Of course they should win the series. The Jazz are not yet ready to make a serious run. Their key guy in the 4th quarter has been Joe Johnson.

The Jazz are a mega deep team that have two all-star players on their team, and they are not a green team. They have players with playoff experience. You're talking like they're the Bucks or something.


The Clippers have 3 notable players, Cp3, DeAndre Jordan and JJ Reddick and Reddick hasn't played well other than last night.

The Clippers have three all-stars, two now without Griffin.

And let's not forget that both Hayward and Gobert were out at points in this series.

The vast majority of players on the Jazz have little to no playoff experience.

This has to be put on someone. Either Doc or CP3.

[jazzfan1971]

I think the Jazz are clearly a better team than then Clippers when Griffin is injured and the Jazz are healthy. If you watched game 5 you 'd have seen that with your own eyes. Teh Jazz were clearly the better team, even if they were bricking tons of open looks. But, the deal is that they got TONS of open looks to brick. And they still won the game even though the Clippers had a huge advantage in free throw attempts.

When both teams are healthy I think it's pretty even. Clippers a little stronger starting 5, Jazz a stronger bench. But, with Griffin sitting, it's clearly advantage Jazz.

[Woodsanity]

Clippers are a really flawed and poorly constructed team. I don't see the Clippers winning this next one unless a miracle occurs and their scrub players like Jamal Crawful actually contribute.

[OkcSinceSGA]

I think the Jazz are clearly a better team than then Clippers when Griffin is injured and the Jazz are healthy. If you watched game 5 you 'd have seen that with your own eyes. Teh Jazz were clearly the better team, even if they were bricking tons of open looks. But, the deal is that they got TONS of open looks to brick. And they still won the game even though the Clippers had a huge advantage in free throw attempts.

When both teams are healthy I think it's pretty even. Clippers a little stronger starting 5, Jazz a stronger bench. But, with Griffin sitting, it's clearly advantage Jazz.

Seems fair. This is the result of the Clippers declining over the last couple years as a team+Jazz growing rapidly. The Clippers on PAPER have a potential super team and should be 10-15 wins better. But the injuries, lack of heart, poor coaching and constant underachieving change things.

[Woodsanity]

The Jazz have no playoff experience and Chris Paul is BY FAR the best player.

The Clippers also have a coach with Championship experience and home court advantage.

Of course they should win the series. The Jazz are not yet ready to make a serious run. Their key guy in the 4th quarter has been Joe Johnson.

The Jazz are a mega deep team that have two all-star players on their team, and they are not a green team. They have players with playoff experience. You're talking like they're the Bucks or something.


The Clippers have 3 notable players, Cp3, DeAndre Jordan and JJ Reddick and Reddick hasn't played well other than last night.

The Clippers have three all-stars, two now without Griffin.

And let's not forget that both Hayward and Gobert were out at points in this series.

The vast majority of players on the Jazz have little to no playoff experience.

This has to be put on someone. Either Doc or CP3.

I would put it on CP3 because a PER of 34.3 and a BPM of 16.7 isn't good enough.

[XtremeDunkz]

I had the Jazz winning this series from the beginning. Just a better team. I have seen enough of the Clippers over the years (feels like their roster hasn't changed in years) to know what to expect from them. They are not a big time team.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Clippers are a really flawed and poorly constructed team. I don't see the Clippers winning this next one unless a miracle occurs and their scrub players like Jamal Crawful actually contribute.

Oddly enough Doc constructed his best bench yet. Felton+Speights+Rivers etc were dominating early in the season. Then they fell off a cliff (probably conditioning in the case of Felton and Speights). I also can't figure out why Doc fails to try other guys instead of ones performing badly. For example every game I've seen Brandon Bass play he's had a big impact, yet he almost never plays. Even now with Griffin down. Then Wes Johnson while inconsistent proved last year when healthy he can contribute quite a bit defensively with his length and with corner 3's. I mean this guy had multiple 4-5 steal games last season.

[Woodsanity]

I think the Jazz are clearly a better team than then Clippers when Griffin is injured and the Jazz are healthy. If you watched game 5 you 'd have seen that with your own eyes. Teh Jazz were clearly the better team, even if they were bricking tons of open looks. But, the deal is that they got TONS of open looks to brick. And they still won the game even though the Clippers had a huge advantage in free throw attempts.

When both teams are healthy I think it's pretty even. Clippers a little stronger starting 5, Jazz a stronger bench. But, with Griffin sitting, it's clearly advantage Jazz.

Seems fair. This is the result of the Clippers declining over the last couple years as a team+Jazz growing rapidly. The Clippers on PAPER have a potential super team and should be 10-15 wins better. But the injuries, lack of heart, poor coaching and constant underachieving change things.

They never really did to be honest. The team is extremely flawed and its largely Gm River's fault. Still don't have a competent wing player after all this time. Luc is actually decent but he is a defensive specialist who is incompetent on offense. The bench is generally pretty bad, there have been seasons where it was putrid.

I mean any team that plays the corpse of PP and Jamal Crawful meaningful minutes isn't a well constructed team.

[Woodsanity]

Clippers are a really flawed and poorly constructed team. I don't see the Clippers winning this next one unless a miracle occurs and their scrub players like Jamal Crawful actually contribute.

Oddly enough Doc constructed his best bench yet. Felton+Speights+Rivers etc were dominating early in the season. Then they fell off a cliff (probably conditioning in the case of Felton and Speights). I also can't figure out why Doc fails to try other guys instead of ones performing badly. For example every game I've seen Brandon Bass play he's had a big impact, yet he almost never plays. Even now with Griffin down. Then Wes Johnson while inconsistent proved last year when healthy he can contribute quite a bit defensively with his length and with corner 3's. I mean this guy had multiple 4-5 steal games last season.

Bass should have gotten far more minutes to be honest and Crawford should have his minutes dramatically reduced but Doc keeps using the same bad strategies. No matter how awful Crawford is he keeps playing him to the Clippers detriment.

I really don't buy that Doc is even a good coach at this point. Forget about elite cause he is nowhere close to elite. As a GM he is even worse.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Clippers remind me of the Mark Jackson Warriors. Lots of talent, but horrible coaching, poorly used players. Clippers with a much better coach would literally win 10 more games IMO.

[Woodsanity]

Clippers remind me of the Mark Jackson Warriors. Lots of talent, but horrible coaching, poorly used players. Clippers with a much better coach would literally win 10 more games IMO.

I don't necessarily agree since the Clips don't have as good of a bench and have always had mediocre-bad wing players. Both are extremely crucial and have been a weak point for the Clips every season.

I think Doc is better than Mark Jackson as a coach too. Though both have their similarities.... Overrated coaches who are snake oil salesmen.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Clippers are a really flawed and poorly constructed team. I don't see the Clippers winning this next one unless a miracle occurs and their scrub players like Jamal Crawful actually contribute.

Oddly enough Doc constructed his best bench yet. Felton+Speights+Rivers etc were dominating early in the season. Then they fell off a cliff (probably conditioning in the case of Felton and Speights). I also can't figure out why Doc fails to try other guys instead of ones performing badly. For example every game I've seen Brandon Bass play he's had a big impact, yet he almost never plays. Even now with Griffin down. Then Wes Johnson while inconsistent proved last year when healthy he can contribute quite a bit defensively with his length and with corner 3's. I mean this guy had multiple 4-5 steal games last season.

Bass should have gotten far more minutes to be honest and Crawford should have his minutes dramatically reduced but Doc keeps using the same bad strategies. No matter how awful Crawford is he keeps playing him to the Clippers detriment.

I really don't buy that Doc is even a good coach at this point. Forget about elite cause he is nowhere close to elite. As a GM he is even worse.

I remember at least 3 interviews where Doc said his all bench lineups would never be used in regular season/playoffs, just preseason. Yet he consistently does it over and over again. The team has had good success staggering lineups like all good teams do, yet he almost never does it. The rule should be NEVER, UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCE is all 3 all stars on the bench. Also he mismanaged Pierce badly all year. When Pierce is hitting shots, Doc barely plays him. But when he's bricking shot after shot, like Jamal.. he overplays him. It's so head scratching. If I was coach I'd try a bunch of different lineups. You never know if a random mix like say Wes Johnson+Brandon Bass will kill it as a duo and have good chemistry.

[OkcSinceSGA]

Clippers remind me of the Mark Jackson Warriors. Lots of talent, but horrible coaching, poorly used players. Clippers with a much better coach would literally win 10 more games IMO.

I don't necessarily agree since the Clips don't have as good of a bench and have always had mediocre-bad wing players. Both are extremely crucial and have been a weak point for the Clips every season.

I think Doc is better than Mark Jackson as a coach too. Though both have their similarities.... Overrated coaches who are snake oil salesmen.

I don't think Clippers with a coach change become Warriors 2.0. Obviously it's a talent mix issue as well. I'm more saying in the sense that they are teams with great core players who are definitely being greatly held back by coaching largely. One area I disagree is bench. Warriors bench on paper isn't even that good. The thing is their coaches and management know how to maximize talent nowadays similar to how SA does. On paper, raw talent wise the Clippers bench this year is significantly better than the Warriors bench. Problem is no chemistry, odd lineups, bad coaching.

You will be hard pressed to find a more loaded bench in the league than Felton, Speights, Crawford, Rivers, Bass, Johnson in terms of on paper talent. That's legitimately 5 or 6 guys who would be in multiple team's rotations in the league. Jamal just won his 3rd 6th man of the year (deserved or not, means he's at least one of the better bench guys). Felton killed it for Dallas in the playoffs last year and has been good for us much of this year. Speights put up 22/12/3 PER 36 last year on nearly 40% shooting from 3. Rivers emerged into a legit role player and put up 12/2/3 on 44/37/69, all career highs. Bass put up 18/8 PER 36 this year.

Don't underestimate what coaching could do for these guys.

[Hadley]

Damn, I predicted Jazz in 5 - but that was before Gobert got hurt ._.

[Edrees]

not sure that's correct... the Jazz has become a really good team ...they have everything, a top level defensive anchor rim protector, long defensive wings, a two-way PG who can really defend and make every opposing PG miserable, good shooters etc... depth too if Favors is fully healthy... it is hard to find another more complete team than the Jazz in NBA nowadays...

The Jazz have no playoff experience and Chris Paul is BY FAR the best player.

The Clippers also have a coach with Championship experience and home court advantage.

Of course they should win the series. The Jazz are not yet ready to make a serious run. Their key guy in the 4th quarter has been Joe Johnson.

This is not completely true. JJ, Hill and Diaw have extensive playoff experience. Also Favors and Hayward this is their second time.

Doc River is massively overrated as a coach. I could have been the coach in Boston during their championship season and they'd still have made the finals. Snyder has completely outperformed him. I mean who doesn't game plan for Gobert,...

Jazz are the better team and that's not a slight on the Clippers.

CP3 is the best player (gap isn't as wide as you state) but the next two are Gobert and Hayward.

Hayward is averaging 26.5ppg, 8 rpg and 3 apg on 49% FGs, 48% 3s and 96% FTs.

Gobert has come back and completely changed the defense and rebounding elements of this series.

Clippers should have been good enough to win against Utah in a game Gordon Hayward doesn't play. Plain and simple the clippers choked that game which is what blew them the series. I understand blake has been missing but gobert has missed games and Hayward miss a game, and clippers still lose the series?

[OkcSinceSGA]

But at this point it's too late. Too many years wasted, CP3 is 32. Now Warriors dynasty forming, Lebron still crushing the playoffs.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Apparently the Clippers are keeping Doc regardless of result. What a nightmare for fans.

Blame has to fall on Balmer here. Doc clearly isn't cutting it as a GM anymore. How can you have so much talent on a team and constantly under perform?

The Clippers should be beating the Jazz without Griffin.

not sure that's correct... the Jazz has become a really good team ...they have everything, a top level defensive anchor rim protector, long defensive wings, a two-way PG who can really defend and make every opposing PG miserable, good shooters etc... depth too if Favors is fully healthy... it is hard to find another more complete team than the Jazz in NBA nowadays...

The Jazz have no playoff experience and Chris Paul is BY FAR the best player.

The Clippers also have a coach with Championship experience and home court advantage.

Of course they should win the series. The Jazz are not yet ready to make a serious run. Their key guy in the 4th quarter has been Joe Johnson.

The Clippers gave up HCA in game one with Griffin Healthy and Utah with no Gobert. You are overrating Doc Rivers tremendously which should be obvious considering all the clips fans who have been pushing for him to be fired for some time now.

As for playoff experience, losing a lot in the playoffs isn't quite the same as winning playoff experience

Both of these teams would be around 60 win teams if completely healthy. So yeah, you are pretty blatantly underrating Utah here.