What if Mike Jordan never retires in 1998?

[BigtimeNBAfan]

They easily win in 1999.

Not even close. Jordan cut himself with a cigar cutter so he wouldn't have been the same for 99 and Pippen and Rodman serious regressed the next year and were getting older. Even in 97-98 Pippen missed half the season.

[tondi123]

I'm a huge MJ fan and even I doubt the Bulls would win in 99. MJ was still probably the best player in the league but the team was in disarray. Now if MJ had left and landed in a good situation I could see him willing the right team to a title. A lot of things would have had to go right however as Duncan and Shaq/Kobe were coming into their own and would have been a huge obstacle for an old MJ to surmount.

[jc23]

Minimum 24 peat.

[pipfan]

Char lost (to the Bulls) in the 2nd round in 98. Imagine if MJ pulls an F-you to the Bulls and signs there-and brings a title to NC

[dhsilv2]

The Bulls core was going to be dismantled. Phil Jackson was also leaving. Everyone knew it. So it doesn't really matter if Jordan stayed or not, the Bulls were done.

8 straight titles if he didn't retire the first time though.

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

Pippen was almost 100% going to leave, he hated management and he wanted to finally get paid.

[planetmars]

98-99 was a weird year since it was the lock out shortened season. Phil Jackson was never staying in Chicago. Scottie Pippen wanted to get paid and was going to leave because Krause essentially lit their bridge on fire when he gave him his previous contract.

There will be an ESPN 30 for 30 documentary (10 part series) coming up about that season. Can't wait to see all the drama from behind the scenes played out.

I don't think MJ really wanted to retire. I just think he had no place to play. Remember he was making about $33M a year and I'm sure he didn't want to take a pay cut just to keep playing. He was not going to find a team that had that cap space.. especially after the new CBA deals that were put in place after the lock out.

The Bulls with Jordan and a bunch of nobodies might have squeaked into the playoffs but they would have lost early. No way he wins another ring. Even if he goes to Charlotte.. their best player was Eddie Jones. He's not winning anything their either.

I think it was the best move for his career to "retire" when he did. That "shot" became infamous and a book end to his career.

Now the gambling/baseball mini-retirement is a different story. Would have loved to seen him play then.

[Tor_Raps]

Then Tim Duncan busts his ass in the finals and makes him retire in 1999

[BigtimeNBAfan]

I would also throw in Phil Jackson wasn't going to be the coach regardless of whether Jordan came back or not. Tim Floyd was hired before Jordan retired. That is a huge drop off in coaching. Even if you say "the coach is on autopilot" with a superstar like MJ, I disagree. Having a coach MJ respects gives you a far bigger advantage compared to one he will second guess the whole season and especially in the playoffs.

[Clippers2020]

The Bulls core was going to be dismantled. Phil Jackson was also leaving. Everyone knew it. So it doesn't really matter if Jordan stayed or not, the Bulls were done.

8 straight titles if he didn't retire the first time though.

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

[Clippers2020]

I'm a huge MJ fan and even I doubt the Bulls would win in 99. MJ was still probably the best player in the league but the team was in disarray. Now if MJ had left and landed in a good situation I could see him willing the right team to a title. A lot of things would have had to go right however as Duncan and Shaq/Kobe were coming into their own and would have been a huge obstacle for an old MJ to surmount.

Shaq/Kobe were crap.
The Spurs swept the Lakers in 1999.

[benson13]

He would have made a run at Kareem's record, but I'm not sure it would be a certainty. Beyond that, I really can't say. I remember Jackson saying he was leaving for sure. Pippen wanted money. Jordan didn't want to be in Chicago without Jackson. The Bulls wanted to start the rebuild process. I just don't think management wanted to keep that team together given the "difficulties" of the previous season.

It would have been interesting to see him go to Detroit. The Wizards didn't have much in the way of playmaking when Jordan returned in 01, so they had to lean on him more than any 38 year old should be leaned on. Playing with Grant Hill would have prevented that and made the game easier on Michael.

[Soulcatcher33]

They easily win in 1999.

Not even close. Jordan cut himself with a cigar cutter so he wouldn't have been the same for 99 and Pippen and Rodman serious regressed the next year and were getting older. Even in 97-98 Pippen missed half the season.

Pippen didn't really regress. He was pretty much the same quality in 99 and 2000 as he was in 98, but he just took a step back. In 99 on the Rockets they didn't really play to his strengths at all and had him just throwing it in to an ancient Hakeem and Barkley. As everyone remembers, he basically hated playing on that team. I'd say if he was playing on the bulls he would have had a better season in 99 than he did in 98 for the simple fact he wasn't coming back from an injury and was healthy. There is then the fact that the season was basically cut in half so injury concerns and minutes weren't that big of deal. He ended up playing a career high 40mpg for the Rockets and clearly looked better with more hop to his step than he did in 98. In 2000 he was pretty much just coasting through the regular season, but played at a high impact level in the playoffs. After that his bad back and knee injuries problems started affecting him regularly.

[Soulcatcher33]

The Bulls core was going to be dismantled. Phil Jackson was also leaving. Everyone knew it. So it doesn't really matter if Jordan stayed or not, the Bulls were done.

8 straight titles if he didn't retire the first time though.

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

Yeah...and they also added Rodman in 96. Horace Grant left a huge hole in the Bulls front line when he left. It wasn't just Jordan being rusty. They needed to shore up the front line and did just that when they got Rodman.

[Clippers2020]

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

z

Yeah...and they also added Rodman in 96. Horace Grant left a huge hole in the Bulls front line when he left. It wasn't just Jordan being rusty. They needed to shore up the front line and did just that when they got Rodman.

True, Rodman was significant, especially in the 1996 Finals.
Although they still would have dominated the regular season without Rodman, because in 1996-97 they won 69 games despite Rodman only playing 55 games.

And even without Rodman there is an extremely good chance Chicago would have won that 1995 Orlando series if Jordan wasn't rusty.
The series still went 6 games, and if MJ didn't lose the ball....that incident alone may have decided the series, and if you get rid of his rust then it'd also impact all other moments that could have decided games.

The irony is though, despite the rust MJ still averaged 31.0 points, .477 field, 6.5 rebounds, 3.7 assists, 2.5 steals, 1.8 blocks, 4.0 turnovers.
It was more his decision-making skills and overall awareness that was lacking, than his production.
While Penny Hardaway averaged: 18.5 points, .442 field, 3.7 rebounds, 7.5 assists, 1.8 steals, 0.7 blocks, 3.7 turnovers.
Shaq averaged 24.3 points, 13.2 rebounds.
Pippen averaged 19.0 points, .409 field, 9.5 rebounds, 5.7 assists, 1.0 steals, 1.3 blocks.

[BigtimeNBAfan]

They easily win in 1999.

Not even close. Jordan cut himself with a cigar cutter so he wouldn't have been the same for 99 and Pippen and Rodman serious regressed the next year and were getting older. Even in 97-98 Pippen missed half the season.

Pippen didn't really regress. He was pretty much the same quality in 99 and 2000 as he was in 98, but he just took a step back. In 99 on the Rockets they didn't really play to his strengths at all and had him just throwing it in to an ancient Hakeem and Barkley. As everyone remembers, he basically hated playing on that team. I'd say if he was playing on the bulls he would have had a better season in 99 than he did in 98 for the simple fact he wasn't coming back from an injury and was healthy. There is then the fact that the season was basically cut in half so injury concerns and minutes weren't that big of deal. He ended up playing a career high 40mpg for the Rockets and clearly looked better with more hop to his step than he did in 98. In 2000 he was pretty much just coasting through the regular season, but played at a high impact level in the playoffs. After that his bad back and knee injuries problems started affecting him regularly.

Yeah maybe. He certainly wasn't that good for Houston. You also got to realize Rodman's antics ran their course after Chicago. He only played 35 games the rest of his career after leaving the Bulls. Phil Jackson being replaced by Tim Floyd is a massive dropoff. Floyd was one of the worst coaches in NBA history. Then you have Jordan playing at age 36 with a cut finger. I just don't see them beating the Spurs in 99.

[12footrim]

The Bulls core was going to be dismantled. Phil Jackson was also leaving. Everyone knew it. So it doesn't really matter if Jordan stayed or not, the Bulls were done.

8 straight titles if he didn't retire the first time though.

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

That's a cop out. Jordan cameback in March and played 17 regular season games and was practicing even before that with baseball being on strike. How much time do you really need? He averaged 31ppg on .557 true shooting in the playoffs on top of that. His playoff PER and true shooting were nearly identical to the 72 win season the next year. He wasn't the problem, they didn't have Horace Grant or Rodman. They had Will Perdue instead.

[12footrim]

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

Yeah...and they also added Rodman in 96. Horace Grant left a huge hole in the Bulls front line when he left. It wasn't just Jordan being rusty. They needed to shore up the front line and did just that when they got Rodman.

Yeah, they had Will Perdue starting instead of Horace Grant or Rodman.

[dhsilv2]

The Bulls core was going to be dismantled. Phil Jackson was also leaving. Everyone knew it. So it doesn't really matter if Jordan stayed or not, the Bulls were done.

8 straight titles if he didn't retire the first time though.

Steve Kerr said they would have never won 8 in a row , it was too taxing. Also Jordan was back in 1995 and they lost anyway so I tend to agree with that.

Also I've read where if Jordan had come back in 1999, they would have kept the band together. Everyone pretty much agreed with that.

They only lost in 1995 because Jordan was so rusty (after playing baseball instead of basketball) he couldn't even be relied upon to dribble the ball up the court without losing it....
Jordan lost to Orlando in the 1995 playoffs, and then swept Orlando in the 1996 playoffs.

That dennis rodman guy had nothing to do with that...

[Profound23]

Then Tim Duncan busts his ass in the finals and makes him retire in 1999

Or MJ joins the Spurs and wins 3 more before retiring?

[BigtimeNBAfan]

Yeah it is revisionist history to say "Jordan was rusty" or "wasn't the same Jordan" in 1995. His playoff stats in 95 were better in every category than they were in the 96 playoffs when "Jordan was Jordan again." The Bulls were 13-4 in the regular season with Jordan which over the course of a season equals about 60 wins. It was the addition of Rodman that put them from the equivalent of a 60 win team to a 72 win juggernaut. It wasn't just "MJ getting in better shape." He was fine in 95. It is funny how narratives work because it is actually Jordan fans who like to discredit him in 95 so they can promote the narrative that he would have won 8 in a row or that he actually did win 6 in a row since 95 shouldn't count. Reality is he played well, it counts, the Magic were just better than the Bulls that year.