Flagrant 2 on Draymond Green...Good call or not?

[rtiff68]

When it comes to questions like this, it's a lot like politics-- people don't base their answers on the play, they base their answers on whether or not they like the player and/or team in question.

That isn't the kind of play that should get a player kicked out of a playoff game. It's really that simple.

[scrabbarista]

Should've gotten a 3rd tech for the dance.

Why not a suspension for the dance? You guys get waaaay too into your feelings about Dray



I wouldnt have made the F2 call but I tend to not mind hard fouls as much, and I care way more about intent. He tried to brace Clarke as he dragged him down, so no intent to hurt, but F2s not based on that anymore, so totally understand the call and have no problem with it.. Dray needs to adjust or he will be sitting out another important game

And W's fans need to stop with the whataboutisms.. Poole barely got nicked on the head a couple times later, thats no big deal. And certainly not in comparison to what Dray did

Why are you ignoring the right hand punch to the face, no play on the ball, before the left hand pulled him down to the "helping up" ground?

After review, the ref said ... "it was the wind up to the face, impact the the face, the follow thru with the jersey, and the throw down to the ground" exact words


Go watch it. Clarke was hit in the face before he left his feet.


Just reading the rule book...


A technical foul shall be assessed for unsportsmanlike tactics such as:
Disrespectfully addressing an official
Physically contacting an official
Overt actions indicating resentment to a call or no-call
Use of profanity
A coach entering onto the court without permission of an official
A deliberately-thrown elbow or any unnatural physical act towards an opponent with no contact involved
Taunting
Cursing or blaspheming an official shall not be considered the only cause for imposing technical foul.
Running tirades, continuous criticism or griping may be sufficient cause to assess a technical. Excessive misconduct shall result in ejection from the game.

You could bold "tautning," too, because he was taunting the crowd.

[FNQ]

Why are you ignoring the right hand punch to the face, no play on the ball, before the left hand pulled him down to the "helping up" ground?

After review, the ref said ... "it was the wind up to the face, impact the the face, the follow thru with the jersey, and the throw down to the ground" exact words


Go watch it. Clarke was hit in the face before he left his feet.


Just reading the rule book...


A technical foul shall be assessed for unsportsmanlike tactics such as:
Disrespectfully addressing an official
Physically contacting an official
Overt actions indicating resentment to a call or no-call
Use of profanity
A coach entering onto the court without permission of an official
A deliberately-thrown elbow or any unnatural physical act towards an opponent with no contact involved
Taunting
Cursing or blaspheming an official shall not be considered the only cause for imposing technical foul.
Running tirades, continuous criticism or griping may be sufficient cause to assess a technical. Excessive misconduct shall result in ejection from the game.

Was actually referring to his right hand holding him up as he fell, softening the impact on the ground.

You've decided he wasn't playing the ball, that he meant to punch him in the face, and are arguing something I'm not even saying. So there's no real point in responding to you right? You've made up your mind, the evil Draymond was trying to assault someone.

You literally listed profanity on here.. let him out of your head man. Its not normal. People have disrobed leaving the court too.. throwing a technical on there for dancing his way out and pumping up his team? Get a grip

[FNQ]

That isn't the kind of play that should get a player kicked out of a playoff game. It's really that simple.

Yeah it was. The rules are what they are, they were followed, it happens. Its very unlikely the league will ever walk back the intent thing, so he, and others, need to adapt

[cpower]

this is Flagrant 2 because this is Draymond Green. if this is Lebron could have been a common call. This should answer all your questions.

[LuDux1]

Watch on YouTube

[Duffman100]

When it comes to questions like this, it's a lot like politics-- people don't base their answers on the play, they base their answers on whether or not they like the player and/or team in question.

That isn't the kind of play that should get a player kicked out of a playoff game. It's really that simple.

I pose the question again...

You get hit the face, that's a flagrant 1.
You pull someone down by their jersey, it's a flagrant 1.

So ... how many flagrants do you get in one sequence?

[C64]

Why are you ignoring the right hand punch to the face, no play on the ball, before the left hand pulled him down to the "helping up" ground?

After review, the ref said ... "it was the wind up to the face, impact the the face, the follow thru with the jersey, and the throw down to the ground" exact words


Go watch it. Clarke was hit in the face before he left his feet.


Just reading the rule book...


A technical foul shall be assessed for unsportsmanlike tactics such as:
Disrespectfully addressing an official
Physically contacting an official
Overt actions indicating resentment to a call or no-call
Use of profanity
A coach entering onto the court without permission of an official
A deliberately-thrown elbow or any unnatural physical act towards an opponent with no contact involved
Taunting
Cursing or blaspheming an official shall not be considered the only cause for imposing technical foul.
Running tirades, continuous criticism or griping may be sufficient cause to assess a technical. Excessive misconduct shall result in ejection from the game.

Was actually referring to his right hand holding him up as he fell, softening the impact on the ground.

You've decided he wasn't playing the ball, that he meant to punch him in the face, and are arguing something I'm not even saying. So there's no real point in responding to you right? You've made up your mind, the evil Draymond was trying to assault someone.

You literally listed profanity on here.. let him out of your head man. Its not normal. People have disrobed leaving the court too.. throwing a technical on there for dancing his way out and pumping up his team? Get a grip

There’s no real reason to respond to me because I’m right. End of story.
I’m not promoting some “narrative” just straight facts.
Go watch the play, there’s a wind up and a punch to the face, his face/head is not a basketball, this is just a simple irrefutable fact.
He double fisted Clarke, hit him with his right hand, pulled him to the ground with his left hand.

I saw it.
The refs saw it.
The instant replay guys saw it.
The announcers saw it.
The refs stated is as fact after review and threw him out.
It hasn’t been rescinded today.
End of facts, end of discussion.

Should have had a tech as well running around taunting and shouting at the entire arena.
Not only, but he has a history of questionable plays just like that.
His team knows it.
Every other team knows it.
The refs know it.
The league knows it.
The fans know it.
The talking heads on tv know it.
Again….these are known facts, end of discussion.

Sorry if you don’t see the actual facts of the event that way and/or your interpretation of the rules is different from what the officiating body thinks warrants the call.

And I don’t think Draymond is an “evil” player, that’s silly. I do think he’s emotional and let’s that get the best of him sometimes. I think he’s also a great player in his own right but also think he tries to get away with some sneaky crap on occasion just to test himself and the officials.

In any case, Clarke wasn’t hurt and what transpired cannot be undone, on to the next game.

[FNQ]

"he wasnt making a play on the ball"
"he double fisted Clarke"
"he should have been T'd up for dancing as he left the court"
-- actual facts, not an interpretation, exaggeration or opinion


I bet you thought Ja was fouled to end the game too right?

[NyKnicks1714]

Lol Draymond is so full of ****

[Diop]

It was a really dumb play by green, it hurt the team more than the initial 2 points would have.

Unfortunately he won’t learn, as he thinks he knows better

[Cavsfansince84]

Draymond has more than earned it over the years and if the refs give him an inch he will just take a mile for the entire playoffs which he has done in the past. Draymond doesn't get to play by his own rules.

[C64]

"he wasnt making a play on the ball"
"he double fisted Clarke"
"he should have been T'd up for dancing as he left the court"
-- actual facts, not an interpretation, exaggeration or opinion


I bet you thought Ja was fouled to end the game too right?

Yep.
Klay pushed him away from the rim and towards out of bounds. He didn’t use his hand, he used his forearm to do it.
Technically a foul … honestly though, there’s no way they call it and I’m not upset about it as long as they call it even throughout the series.

[Big J]

It was a really dumb play by green, it hurt the team more than the initial 2 points would have.

Unfortunately he won’t learn, as he thinks he knows better

They won the game, so it didn't actually hurt them at all. If anything it galvanized the team.

[Big J]

When it comes to questions like this, it's a lot like politics-- people don't base their answers on the play, they base their answers on whether or not they like the player and/or team in question.

That isn't the kind of play that should get a player kicked out of a playoff game. It's really that simple.

Yea pretty much. If Jokic had done this the poll would be 90% no.

[michaelm]

I don’t care because they won anyway.

Might calm him down for the rest of the series.

[DonaldSanders]

I don’t care because they won anyway.

Might calm him down for the rest of the series.

I'm a lot more upset about the flagrant foul points that accumulate than the ejection in game. It was borderline whether it was a flagrant 2, but if it's just one game, fine. The issue is that flagrant 1s now get tossed around like candy -- you see like 3-4 every series. This series just started and if the Warriors go the distance, that is up 20 games where Draymond can only get 1 flagrant or he is suspended.

If we were talking about older flagrant foul rules, I'd not be worried at all. Flagrants have become a lot more common to call, it could be a legit issue later. I know the anti Draymond fools will just say "don't committ a flagrant" but this has become an extremely soft whistle, it doesn't matter how dangerous is is to the other player. You can get barely touched on the face and if the refs review it, boom flagrant.

On the plus side Draymond only had 1 this season though it was shorter for him. I think we'll be OK, it's just frustrating that someone eliminated in round 1 gets the same # of FF allowed that someone who goes to the finals does.

[Diop]

I think the NBA like other leagues want to get rid of hitting people to stop a score, hence more flagrant fouls.
You have to at least make a play for the ball.

If I pulled a guys jersey like that in my rec league, I would be expecting to dodge a punch when the bloke got up.

[DroseReturnChi]

Dray was already riled the 2 plays before this.
The shirt pull was clearly intentionally. I would have called a Flagrant 1 but understand that it was borderline. And the refs were whistling for the home team this game.

His dancing around came because the crowd chanted to throw him out and the refs complied.

Should've gotten a 3rd tech for the dance.

Why not a suspension for the dance? You guys get waaaay too into your feelings about Dray

so we should reward dray for trying to injure someone and laugh off a dance. dray is one of the few fav players but he needs to stop the troll hecking and play basketball. if he is that aggressive and cant contain even with a threat of flagrant 2, he should get suspended and find a fighting job.

[DroseReturnChi]

this is Flagrant 2 because this is Draymond Green. if this is Lebron could have been a common call. This should answer all your questions.

is dray face of the league? him missing hardly matters. why would you ruin the fun by ejecting lebron?
lebron missed the playoffs and yet still more relevant this role player.