Luka Doncic

[WalterBenjamin]

The Doncic comparison with every other Euro player is stupid. As is comparing any other Euro player with any other Euro player.
From what i can see Doncic is already a top passer in the NBA. What is worrysome is his athleticism but not regarding his defensive capability. Just lacks verticaly not horizontaly. Does he have the upside i don't know. But from what I see he will start in the NBA. That has value in it self in the draft. Especialy a guy who can pass and shoot.

[UcanUwill]

How many super-skilled guard prospects came to the NBA at a young age? Because I swear I can't remember a single one. Who was it that failed, but was supposed to succeed?

Ricky Rubio say hello, he was supposed to be the next big thing, at age of 14 debuted in Euroleague, at age of 17 played for Spain in Olympics, he was super-skilled, only weaknesses before the draft was perimeter shooting and that was it. He is ok player, but he did not live up to his hype.

Again, was there even anybody else with great potential, drafted high, who failed? Maybe Gallo? But he is pretty close to the All-Star level when healthy. Borderline All-Star level for sure. So who was the super-skilled European draftee who got drafted in the lottery, and failed to become a good or great NBA player? The fact that Karasev didn't do it tells us anything? Or Belinelli? Were they ever expected to become stars?

Latest Jan Vesely, but he was a PF iirc, but the guy who I think you will not remember Yaroslav Korolev, I remember he was killing at age of 17 the competition in Europe (Russian league, U-18 tournament), the scouts were saying that he was supposed to be the next big thing in the NBA, was playing for CSKA and in 2005 draft was picked with the lottery pick by the Clips, but was on the roster for only 1 year iirc.

Well in that case it's clear that you don't watch him enough, because he is absolutely an elite shooter, and probably a better shooter at 17 than those guys were, or most certainly close to them. Of course if you compare him to peak Peja and Petronic, he is not as good, but why would you do that?

Haha so you are telling to me with the straight face, that Doncic right now is better shooter than Drazan Petrovic when Drazan was 17? Is Doncic scoring 40+ in a league at age of 17 and 18? Or maybe 100+ points in a game while shooting 66 % from the field and 50 % from 3, ok that was at age of 18 when he scored 110 points, but still man to call him a better shooter than him, it's disrespectful.

P.S.(I remember that 100 point game, because I did watch Divac documentary about Petrovic, it's a good documentary I recommend it.)

Shooting, passing, size, defensive instincts, rebounding, and the famous "feel for the game" attribute, which you can of course throw out, it's fair, but he is still an amazing prospect. I mean, I can't understand how anybody could deny this. He is the best 17-year-old in the world, with a supremely skilled all around game, why would you doubt that this will translate, especially in a year where Jokic is toying with the league?

So he is really next Lebron like in that article? What I was reading week ago.

Well but what about his lack of quickness and lateral speed? It concerns me, especially when he is playing 1 on 1 defense against more explosive opponents what will obviously be in the NBA. I agree with you about his, passing, rebounding, defensive instincts, but to tell he is an elite shooter is for me.

As i'm reading his weaknesses, can you comment this? He also needs to work on shot consistency, especially his mechanics and foot positioning.

He is great prospect, but yall are here talking about him, like he is the next first ballot HOF. Let him first get drafted and play in the league, what if his game doesn't translate in the NBA? Then what?

But if he is doing good, then good for him and good for European basketball, and I guess good for yall.

Ricky Rubio was 16 when he debuted in Euroleague. And he had a very small role on garbage Juventud team.

Yaroslav Korolev playing for CSKA is being generous. He was signed by CSKA as a domestic guy with potential, but he played the total of 2 minutes in euroleague, in the entire season. Pretty much no one knew who he was then, unless you really follow junior tournaments well. ANd nobody knows him now, its no surprise that post NBA, he turned into nothing more than a Euro journeyman who plays for barely known Euro teams. To even draw a comparison with Doncic, who is top 4 player on Real Madrid already, is absolutely absurd. I take 15 year old Doncic over prime Korolev any day.

Doncic will probably never be as good as Drazen Petrovic, but Petrovic didn't dominate nothing when he was 17.

[XTraderXL]

@JohnnyWillow
Haha so you are telling to me with the straight face, that Doncic right now is better shooter than Drazan Petrovic when Drazan was 17? Is Doncic scoring 40+ in a league at age of 17 and 18? Or maybe 100+ points in a game while shooting 66 % from the field and 50 % from 3, ok that was at age of 18 when he scored 110 points, but still man to call him a better shooter than him, it's disrespectful.

What Divac didnt tell you in that documentary was that Petrovic was playing at one of the best Euro teams at the time. That game was against Olimpija Ljubljana who had some problems and played the game with only 2 senior team players and the rest were players from U18. The goal of Petrovic in that game was to score 100 and the whole team helped him to do it.

You think Doncic or any other top prospect couldnt score 100 points against any youth or HS team if Real played them? Come on man, at least look up the whole story if you are using it as an argument. That documentary is extremely flawed, too many mistakes, exaggerations and false info in there to talk about.

[narcolepsy]

Also a thing to note is Dražen's nickname was "Kamenko" (Rocky in English) early on in his career due to his bad outside shooting. He became one of the best shooters of all time because of his hard work and dedication. So it's really not that absurd to say Luka might be a better shooter than Dražen was at 17.
I am NOT saying that means Luka will be as good as Dražen, it's waaay too early for these kind of comparisons.

[BoardCrusher]

Watch on YouTube

[Mirotic12]

How many super-skilled guard prospects came to the NBA at a young age? Because I swear I can't remember a single one. Who was it that failed, but was supposed to succeed?

Ricky Rubio say hello, he was supposed to be the next big thing, at age of 14 debuted in Euroleague, at age of 17 played for Spain in Olympics, he was super-skilled, only weaknesses before the draft was perimeter shooting and that was it. He is ok player, but he did not live up to his hype.

Again, was there even anybody else with great potential, drafted high, who failed? Maybe Gallo? But he is pretty close to the All-Star level when healthy. Borderline All-Star level for sure. So who was the super-skilled European draftee who got drafted in the lottery, and failed to become a good or great NBA player? The fact that Karasev didn't do it tells us anything? Or Belinelli? Were they ever expected to become stars?

Latest Jan Vesely, but he was a PF iirc, but the guy who I think you will not remember Yaroslav Korolev, I remember he was killing at age of 17 the competition in Europe (Russian league, U-18 tournament), the scouts were saying that he was supposed to be the next big thing in the NBA, was playing for CSKA and in 2005 draft was picked with the lottery pick by the Clips, but was on the roster for only 1 year iirc.

Well in that case it's clear that you don't watch him enough, because he is absolutely an elite shooter, and probably a better shooter at 17 than those guys were, or most certainly close to them. Of course if you compare him to peak Peja and Petronic, he is not as good, but why would you do that?

Haha so you are telling to me with the straight face, that Doncic right now is better shooter than Drazan Petrovic when Drazan was 17? Is Doncic scoring 40+ in a league at age of 17 and 18? Or maybe 100+ points in a game while shooting 66 % from the field and 50 % from 3, ok that was at age of 18 when he scored 110 points, but still man to call him a better shooter than him, it's disrespectful.

P.S.(I remember that 100 point game, because I did watch Divac documentary about Petrovic, it's a good documentary I recommend it.)

Shooting, passing, size, defensive instincts, rebounding, and the famous "feel for the game" attribute, which you can of course throw out, it's fair, but he is still an amazing prospect. I mean, I can't understand how anybody could deny this. He is the best 17-year-old in the world, with a supremely skilled all around game, why would you doubt that this will translate, especially in a year where Jokic is toying with the league?

So he is really next Lebron like in that article? What I was reading week ago.

Well but what about his lack of quickness and lateral speed? It concerns me, especially when he is playing 1 on 1 defense against more explosive opponents what will obviously be in the NBA. I agree with you about his, passing, rebounding, defensive instincts, but to tell he is an elite shooter is for me.

As i'm reading his weaknesses, can you comment this? He also needs to work on shot consistency, especially his mechanics and foot positioning.

He is great prospect, but yall are here talking about him, like he is the next first ballot HOF. Let him first get drafted and play in the league, what if his game doesn't translate in the NBA? Then what?

But if he is doing good, then good for him and good for European basketball, and I guess good for yall.

1. Ricky Rubio didn't play in EuroLeague at age 14. He debuted in EuroLeague at age 16. At age 16, he averaged 3.6 points and 2.8 assists for one of the worst teams in the league. At age 17, Doncic's age now, he was not playing in EuroLeague at all, and was in the 2nd tier European league of EuroCup, where he averaged 7.6 points and 4.5 assists (in the 2nd tier league).

The next year, at age 18, he was back in EuroLeague. Let's compare that with Doncic now, since Doncic is going to be 18 in like a week. Rubio at age 18, averaged 2.4 points and 2.8 assist per game, on one of the worst EuroLeague teams.

Can we please drop the Rubio as a template for Doncic nonsense?

Ricky Rubio's stats in Europe for proof:

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=LFW&seasoncode=E2010#!careerstats


2. Drazen Petrovic did NOT average over 40 points a game in a European professional league at age 17-18.

As shown right here ---> http://www.drazenpetrovic.com/statis/index.htm

Drazen Petrovic's stats In the Yugoslavian Federal League (NOT the EuroLeague, but the national league of Yugoslavia):

1979-80 - 0.8 points per game
1980-81 - 2.0 points per game
1981-82 - 16.3 points per game
1982-83 - 24.5 points per game
1983-84 - in the military
1984-85 - 32.2 points per game
1985-86 - 43.3 points per game
1986-87 - 37.2 points per game
1987-88 - 37.6 points per game


Drazen Petrovic's stats in the Spanish League:
1988-89 - 28.5 points per game


Drazen Petrovic's stats in European leagues:

EuroLeague (European top-tier):

1984-85 - 30.9 points per game
1985-86 - 37.0 points per game
1986-87 - played in 2nd tier European league
1987-88 - played in 3rd tier European league
1988-89 - played in 2nd tier European league

European 2nd tier level European Cup Winner's Cup:
1986-87 - 33.8 points per game
1988-89 - 27.4 points per game

European 3rd tier level Korac Cup:
1987-88 - 33.4 points per game

At age 17, Petrovic averaged 16.3 points in the Yugoslav League, and he was playing in the 3rd tier level European league. At age 18, he averaged 24.5 points in the Yugoslav League, and he was playing in the 3rd tier level European league. In fact, at age 24 (his last year in Europe), he averaged 28.5 points per game in the Spanish league, and 27.4 points per game in the 2nd tier European league...


3. Drazen Petrovic did NOT score 112 points in a game against "pro basketball players". He played that game against an under-16 junior team - or what they would call high school junior varsity in USA. Also, that game did not happen when "he was 18 years old" - it happened when he was 17 days from his 21st birthday.


Please stop trying to pass off ESPN mythology as facts.


4. Yaroslav Korolev - is this even serious? He was never a good player in his pro career. Not as a pro before NBA, not in NBA, and not as a pro after NBA. He was already retired at like age 29.

Korolev's European career:

http://www.euroleague.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=JLY&seasoncode=E2004#!careerstats

At best, he was a role player in secondary leagues and inconsequential teams.

[916fan]

Curious, does anyone know if Vlade Divac has any connections to Doncic? Kings recently traded their franchise player, DeMarcus Cousins. Doncic could be a trade target next year.

[SportsGuy8]

I am Vivek.

Must. Have. Doncic.

[KF10]

How does Doncic compares to this guy:

Watch on YouTube

[Mirotic12]

How does Doncic compares to this guy:

Not much similarity between them.

Bodiroga was bigger than Doncic is. He actually was the every bit of 6-9 to 6-10 that some people are incorrectly claiming Doncic is (he's certainly not that size, at least not now). He also had a much bigger build than Doncic does. Size wise, basically no comparison.

Bodiroga was like a 3/4 on defense then, but in today's EuroLeague, he would not be able to guard small forwards in the whole league. He would for sure only be guarding power forwards. On offense, Bodiroga would be in today's game something of a cross between a point forward and a stretch four (like what NBA falsely advertised Nemanja Bjelica to be)....

Bodiroga was much more skilled on offense than Doncic is - by a lot.

Bodiroga was also a better rebounder.

Doncic, by comparison, is without any doubt a lot quicker, faster, and more athletic than Bodiroga was. I also think he's already a better defender, even at just turning 18.

Two different sized players. Two different body types. Different positions in a team. Different skill sets on offense. Different players totally on defense and athletically.

I don't see much in similarity between those two at all.

[SportsGuy8]

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.

Doncic's skills and craftiness are slowly coming to the surface lately, mostly because he's getting more and more comfortable knowing that he's not going to get benched because of a mistake. He's never going to reach Bodiroga's skill-level, but that's no slight, Bodiroga was one of the most skilled players in the history of basketball.

Doncic obviously has more NBA potential, though. Even though I'm sure Bodiroga would have done just fine in the NBA if he tried it (he even proved that in multiple games against NBA stars, making them look like fools), Doncic has a much more NBA-suited body and athleticism.

Doncic really needs to develop either a so-called "Euro-step" or "El Latigo" (also called "Shammgod"), not having such a move is severely limiting his penetration game.

We're going to have to wait a bit to see what Doncic does when he's the first option on the team (it can happen sooner than you think). Judging by how effortlessly he pulled off that between the legs move after simply learning it from Llull at practice, he can actually surprise us ... It's one thing pulling such a thing off in a game when it's a move you've been making your whole life, but to do it after simply learning it from a teammate? Besides skills it also shows big cojones.

[Mirotic12]

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.

They are not at all similar as players. So there really is no need to compare them. If we want to compare to EuroLeague players of recent times that Doncic is similar to, that he resembles by player type...

Doncic is much closer to Marko Jaric (closest similarity I can think of). Maybe a little bit of traits of players like Zoran Planinic, Theo Papaloukas, or Ramunas Siskausas also.

Bodiroga was a totally different type of player.

[UcanUwill]

Bodiroga is an original Slow mo. He is like more polished Kyle Anderson with far more fakes. Doncic is much more ordinary looking player, which is probably for the best, I don't mean it as a bad thing.

[Bob8]

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.

They are not at all similar as players. So there really is no need to compare them. If we want to compare to EuroLeague players of recent times that Doncic is similar to, that he resembles by player type...

Doncic is much closer to Marko Jaric (closest similarity I can think of). Maybe a little bit of traits of players like Zoran Planinic, Theo Papaloukas, or Ramunas Siskausas also.

Bodiroga was a totally different type of player.

We have to understand when we are comparing Doncic to Bodiroga or some other legend, we're de facto comparing 17 years old kid to Legends in their prime years. Not only we compare Doncic to the great players, but in different stages of their carriers.

Having in mind his age, his stats. in copa del Rey are almost unbelievable 14.7 pts, 6.7 rbt, 5.3 ass.

Bodiroga, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/dejan-bodiroga-1.html

Jaric, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/marko-jaric-1.html

Planinic, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/zoran-planinic-1.html

Papaloukas, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/theodoros-papaloukas-1.html

Doncic this year Euroleague, http://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=005929&seasoncode=E2016

[Thespianoid]

If anyone wanted to watch the 3 Copa del Rey games to scout Doncic, I found them on youtube. Final vid is missing the first 6 minutes of the 1st quarter but you won't miss any Doncic playing time.

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

Watch on YouTube

[SportsGuy8]

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.

They are not at all similar as players. So there really is no need to compare them. If we want to compare to EuroLeague players of recent times that Doncic is similar to, that he resembles by player type...

Doncic is much closer to Marko Jaric (closest similarity I can think of). Maybe a little bit of traits of players like Zoran Planinic, Theo Papaloukas, or Ramunas Siskausas also.

Bodiroga was a totally different type of player.

We have to understand when we are comparing Doncic to Bodiroga or some other legend, we're de facto comparing 17 years old kid to Legends in their prime years. Not only we compare Doncic to the great players, but in different stages of their carriers.

Having in mind his age, his stats. in copa del Rey are almost unbelievable 14.7 pts, 6.7 rbt, 5.3 ass.

Bodiroga, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/dejan-bodiroga-1.html

Jaric, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/marko-jaric-1.html

Planinic, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/zoran-planinic-1.html

Papaloukas, http://www.basketball-reference.com/euro/players/theodoros-papaloukas-1.html

Doncic this year Euroleague, http://www.euroleaguebasketball.net/competition/players/showplayer?pcode=005929&seasoncode=E2016

To be fair, even though awarding assists is still more strict compared to the NBA, they loosened up a bit when it comes to awarding them. It's not that Doncic's assist numbers are inflated, more that these old stats have deflated numbers ... (compared to the NBA, of course; in reality those were probably accurately measured, and today everyone inflates them)

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.

They are not at all similar as players. So there really is no need to compare them. If we want to compare to EuroLeague players of recent times that Doncic is similar to, that he resembles by player type...

Doncic is much closer to Marko Jaric (closest similarity I can think of). Maybe a little bit of traits of players like Zoran Planinic, Theo Papaloukas, or Ramunas Siskausas also.

Bodiroga was a totally different type of player.

You're right. A better, efficient Marko Jaric sounds like the closest comparison I can think of also.

It's really hard to compare players, though, if not unfair, since everyone has a unique combination of traits.

[pohani komarac]

For me, it's possible he's eventually going to end up as a more athletic, but less skilled Bodiroga.





Doncic really needs to develop either a so-called "Euro-step" or "El Latigo" (also called "Shammgod"), not having such a move is severely limiting his penetration game.

where he comes from it is split two step or crossed 2 step, I guess that would be proper translation....just education, nothing important. Euro step was invented in ex Yugoslavia (his Slovenia was part of that)

ex Yugo League was best league in Europe in 80is till fall of ex Yugoslavia in 91., not 2tier or 3rd tier blabla. Mirotic please......

Doncic was born to play basketball, and way game is being developed and rules changes go into his favor so belive he sholud become an allstar

[BoardCrusher]

Curious, does anyone know if Vlade Divac has any connections to Doncic? Kings recently traded their franchise player, DeMarcus Cousins. Doncic could be a trade target next year.

Not sure how Luka would fit into Kings, but the connection between the two would be Đorđević.

[Mirotic12]

ex Yugo League was best league in Europe in 80is till fall of ex Yugoslavia in 91., not 2tier or 3rd tier blabla. Mirotic please......

Ex Yugo league was not the best national league in Europe in the 1980s. No way. That was clearly, without any doubt whatsoever, the Italian League. Also, the best national league has never been better than the top tier European-wide league.

And yes, Cup Winner's Cup (or Saporta Cup), and Korac Cup (the old European league - not the Serbian Cup of today) were 2nd and 3rd tier leagues. They were not the first tier European league (Champions Cup), which back then had the domestic league champions in it. And yes, Petrovic played in Cup Winner's Cup and Korac Cup.

In fact, Petrovic only played two seasons (1984-85 and 1985-86) in Champions Cup (later renamed to FIBA EuroLeague / EuroLeague).

It's not at all hard to keep such basic and actual facts straight.

[reanimator]

Is Doncic likely to go to the Nike Hoop Summit or are there any International U18 FIBA events that we will get to view him before the draft? I expect him to dominate but would still be interesting nonetheless.

A much stronger Marco Jaric with a post game is an interesting comp.