Fire Ainge: Thanks Danny, but it's time to go

[Captain_Caveman]

It’s before my time so it’s hard to say but didn’t Red draft Ainge? I’m sure he wasn’t a lottery pick. I’m def not saying Ainge should be fired but put all stats aside, he’s had trouble finding rotational players outside of the lottery. Def need something out of Langford/Nesmith.

Rotational players he's acquired with non-lottery picks:
Rondo, IT*, Bradley, Jefferson, TA, Olynyk**, Rozier, Big Baby, Grant Williams, Sullinger, Powe, Gerald Green, Delonte, Semi, Gomes, E'Twaun Moore, Perkins***.

Jury still out: Robert Williams, Abdel Nader, Zizic, Pritchard, Edwards, Waters. Would include Langford and Nesmith, but both were technically lottery picks. Ainge also had a draft promise out to Amir Johnson that he had to rescind due to getting leveraged by Orien Greene's agent (I believe it was Jeff Schwartz, who also repped Pierce and Perkins).

* via trade
** drafted lottery, after trade with no lottery picks given up
** Technically drafted by Wallace

I thought the story was he had the promise out to Greene and hence couldn't pick Johnson when he slipped.

There is a Herald article about it, but since I don't subscribe to that rag, I will have to defer on confirming that. I know that Gomes was just a few picks prior, so maybe he thought he was looking at both Amir and Greene.

[Fencer reregistered]

Rotational players he's acquired with non-lottery picks:
Rondo, IT*, Bradley, Jefferson, TA, Olynyk**, Rozier, Big Baby, Grant Williams, Sullinger, Powe, Gerald Green, Delonte, Semi, Gomes, E'Twaun Moore, Perkins***.

Jury still out: Robert Williams, Abdel Nader, Zizic, Pritchard, Edwards, Waters. Would include Langford and Nesmith, but both were technically lottery picks. Ainge also had a draft promise out to Amir Johnson that he had to rescind due to getting leveraged by Orien Greene's agent (I believe it was Jeff Schwartz, who also repped Pierce and Perkins).

* via trade
** drafted lottery, after trade with no lottery picks given up
** Technically drafted by Wallace

I thought the story was he had the promise out to Greene and hence couldn't pick Johnson when he slipped.

There is a Herald article about it, but since I don't subscribe to that rag, I will have to defer on confirming that. I know that Gomes was just a few picks prior, so maybe he thought he was looking at both Amir and Greene.

I don't subscribe to the Herald either.

The problem was Ainge and his staff had figured Johnson would get picked before the 23rd position in the second round, and, worse still, the C’s already had gone ahead and made a promise with that 53rd overall slot. The Celts had been impressed by Orien Greene, a hard-defending guard from Louisiana-Lafayette, and got him to stop working out for other teams with the assurance they would draft him.

But when Johnson was still up for grabs, the Celtics tried to call an audible. The C’s spoke to Greene and his people and said the team would give him the exact same contract as a free agent if he’d let them out of the commitment. But Greene held firm, the Celts drafted him, and Johnson went three picks later to the Detroit Pistons.

https://www.bostonherald.com/2016/04/27/amir-johnson-with-cs-now-after-miss-in-2005-draft/

[Ernest]

I thought the story was he had the promise out to Greene and hence couldn't pick Johnson when he slipped.

There is a Herald article about it, but since I don't subscribe to that rag, I will have to defer on confirming that. I know that Gomes was just a few picks prior, so maybe he thought he was looking at both Amir and Greene.

I don't subscribe to the Herald either.

The problem was Ainge and his staff had figured Johnson would get picked before the 23rd position in the second round, and, worse still, the C’s already had gone ahead and made a promise with that 53rd overall slot. The Celts had been impressed by Orien Greene, a hard-defending guard from Louisiana-Lafayette, and got him to stop working out for other teams with the assurance they would draft him.

But when Johnson was still up for grabs, the Celtics tried to call an audible. The C’s spoke to Greene and his people and said the team would give him the exact same contract as a free agent if he’d let them out of the commitment. But Greene held firm, the Celts drafted him, and Johnson went three picks later to the Detroit Pistons.

https://www.bostonherald.com/2016/04/27/amir-johnson-with-cs-now-after-miss-in-2005-draft/

Surprised he didn't get fired for that.

[Fencer reregistered]

There is a Herald article about it, but since I don't subscribe to that rag, I will have to defer on confirming that. I know that Gomes was just a few picks prior, so maybe he thought he was looking at both Amir and Greene.

I don't subscribe to the Herald either.

The problem was Ainge and his staff had figured Johnson would get picked before the 23rd position in the second round, and, worse still, the C’s already had gone ahead and made a promise with that 53rd overall slot. The Celts had been impressed by Orien Greene, a hard-defending guard from Louisiana-Lafayette, and got him to stop working out for other teams with the assurance they would draft him.

But when Johnson was still up for grabs, the Celtics tried to call an audible. The C’s spoke to Greene and his people and said the team would give him the exact same contract as a free agent if he’d let them out of the commitment. But Greene held firm, the Celts drafted him, and Johnson went three picks later to the Detroit Pistons.

https://www.bostonherald.com/2016/04/27/amir-johnson-with-cs-now-after-miss-in-2005-draft/

Surprised he didn't get fired for that.

Surprised who didn't get fired? You surely can't mean Ainge in this context, unless you're being sarcastic and forgot the green font.

[Ernest]

I don't subscribe to the Herald either.



https://www.bostonherald.com/2016/04/27/amir-johnson-with-cs-now-after-miss-in-2005-draft/

Surprised he didn't get fired for that.

Surprised who didn't get fired? You surely can't mean Ainge in this context, unless you're being sarcastic and forgot the green font.

No, I was talking about you dude. You should be fired for not realizing I was messing about.

[Celts17Pride]

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[Fencer reregistered]

Surprised he didn't get fired for that.

Surprised who didn't get fired? You surely can't mean Ainge in this context, unless you're being sarcastic and forgot the green font.

No, I was talking about you dude. You should be fired for not realizing I was messing about.

Apologies for taking you seriously. It won't happen again.

[themoneyteam2]

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[GoGreen]

I see Danny's sycophants in the media are really laying it on thick with the spin. Dude knows how to work the pr game, that's for sure

[Ernest]

I see Danny's sycophants in the media are really laying it on thick with the spin. Dude knows how to work the pr game, that's for sure

lol, yeah, that's what's going on here.

[hugepatsfan]

I've been thinking a lot about the talk of how we keep losing people for nothing. I think you have to be honest in your criticism - trade Kyrie at the deadline isn't the easiest thing to make work. Horford's deal was big and not sure what type of trade value he had despite his on court value. Same for Hayward.

That being said, Kyrie proved to be addition by subtraction. Hayward has been injured for the two playoff runs he's been on the team for. The loss of Horford proved to hurt, but not kill us.

I know it's using hind sight to look back and say he should have traded those guys to a large degree. But part of being a GM is operating with FORESIGHT. To some degree, it's not unrealistic to ask that Ainge apply some of that. Should he be able to look at things and see that Kyrie is having a negative influence? Should he be able to see that the loss of Horford isn't crippling? Or the loss of Hayward?

Based on how we've played after stars walked/got injured, it seems many fans and critics have overstated the importance of those stars to our team. I think it's fair to consider if Ainge similarly overstated that value and was more reluctant to trade them than he should have been,

I'm not trying to hammer him because these aren't yes/no, black/white things. The only options here aren't "Ainge is perfect" or "fire Ainge".

[Fencer reregistered]

Before Smart and the Jays, Ainge's highest quality draftees were:

-- Rondo, who had a career-limiting injury.
-- Jefferson, who had a career-limiting injury after Ainge traded him for Garnett.
-- Perk, who had a career-limiting injury.
-- Tony Allen, who had a severe injury.
-- West, who had severe mental health problems (manifested after Ainge traded him in the package for Ray Allen).

If only some of those things had happened instead of all of them, he'd look like a bigger star as a drafter.

[jirrit]

This whole premise is based on Ainge not doing that trade for Myles F-in Turner? If Smart/Kemba/Tatum/Brown would have loved playing with him in the Olympics he’d be here already, believe me. What exactly has he achieved to spend the rest of our cap room to?

Can you Ainge apologists please make a list of all drafts and trades all GM’s out there have made the last 20 years and still call out Ainge as one of the worst? He’s top tier and you cant deny the facts. Offcourse he’s made wrong decisions but who hasnt?

This just wow’s me. It’s not irrational awe the so called ‘Ainge apologists’ have but it’s the fact that many of arent able to see the big picture for every franchise out there and then still conclude we’re not better off with Danny & his team.

[Captain_Caveman]

None of these critics are hitting the mark. It's like criticizing Tony Gwynn for not hitting 1.000.

Taking everything in the aggregate, and holding everyone to the same standard, and we are a top 5 front office in the league. Deal with that.

The defending champs drafted D'Angelo Russell and Lonzo Ball #2 overall, over guys like Tatum and Porzingis. Ainge doesn't have any **** like that on his resume, only to be covered up by being a top FA destination.

[Fencer reregistered]

The two vets Ainge acquired who were top-5 MVP vote getters for him were KG and IT. Both quickly had career-limiting injuries.

The health of his other top vet acquisitions wasn't great either. We know the Hayward story. Irving missed one of his postseasons. Ray Allen, while basically healthy overall, took a hard hit from Ron Artest in the Finals and started missing his shots. Horford had decent health for a guy his age, but it wasn't so great as to cancel any of the bad luck out.

[Ernest]

Not getting Turner set this team back 50 years. Worst. GM. Ever. Anyone here who can't see that Ainge is worse than Covid 19 is a professional ball washer.

[thomas1897]

Remember Danny Ainge has done an admirable job and he has made some mistakes. Being the General Manager look at all the accomplishments compared to the errors; recently he signed Gordon Hayward to a multi year contract and during that period Hayward was injuried more than he played ( a lot of money to tie up in an injury prone player) . Next Yabusele Guerschon was drafted ahead of Pascal Siakam and missing out on Tyler Herro not moving up in the draft. Look at Danny Ainge's record and he is a mover and shaker making good decisions with a minimal amount of errors. He has kept the team competitive. Danny Ainge did a good job and cutting losses and moving forward from Gordon Hayward. The respect to Gordon Hayward is a good ball player when healthy. Yes the Celtics need a championship winning team. I can not find a better GM who is capable of building a championship team through the draft, trades and signing some free agents without breaking the bank. There are only a handful of GMs and front offices that are as good or better LA, Miami and Golden State next Toronto, Cleveland and San Antonio these teams have won championships. LA, Miami, Golden State and San Antonio all won multiple titles. The Celtics are tied for the most titles in NBA history. Before you criticize Mr. Ainge over one player look at the total record he has achieved.

[theman]

Not getting Turner set this team back 50 years. Worst. GM. Ever. Anyone here who can't see that Ainge is worse than Covid 19 is a professional ball washer.

Just so you know sarcasm is hard to pull off in an internet post. What you see as clearly satirical others may take as sincere.

[Taget]

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Even then the trade was still the correct call. The mistake was not flipping Kyrie after we saw a potentially bright future without him during the late first season playoff run.

[Ernest]

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Even then the trade was still the correct call. The mistake was not flipping Kyrie after we saw a potentially bright future without him during the late first season playoff run.

It's always a hindsight thing with the Ainge hate. The one people used to blast him for was the Perk for Green trade. In hindsight we know Green would have a heart problem and both Shaq and JO would go out in the playoffs. But the hindsight thing only seems to look at one side of things. Perk was never good again. IT was done after we traded him too.

Maybe there the truth is that we could have had Turner and while Ainge tried to get more out of the deal CHA swooped in and signed him. No way to really know. But even if it's true, its a real weird approach to think that Ainge should have magically known that and quickly finished the deal. People live in a funny world where oh it must be true and Ainge was just being greedy. But was he greedy when he fleeced the Nets in the PP KG trade? Maybe he should have let them keep the pick that turned into Tatum? It doesn't work both ways.