2019 Utah Jazz Off Season Thread

Post #241 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:28 pm

KqWIN wrote:How do you guys feel about giving up our 6th first round pick in attempt to find a long term solution at PG?

At least Dinwiddie is young enough to be good for a long period of time, unlike Conley. He'd be a much more sensible gamble than a Conley-type deal, even though he has a player option on his third year at 12M that he'll likely opt out of.

Post #242 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:29 pm

Rudy Gobert Named to All-NBA Third Team, KAT missed it, and it will cost him around 33M...

stitches · Post #243 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:30 pm

KqWIN wrote:
How do you guys feel about giving up our 6th first round pick in attempt to find a long term solution at PG?

I don't mind it at all. I'm sick of giving up picks for rentals though. If you get long-term solution to any position you should think about it.

stitches · Post #244 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:31 pm

Read on Twitter

stitches · Post #245 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:32 pm

Oh no!

Read on Twitter

Post #246 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:39 pm

Would a 5 Year - $262M be the biggest contract signed yet? Is there any other player who had already signed a contract of such an amount?

stitches · Post #247 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:41 pm

Kemba is eligible for super max too after he made All NBA 3d team... he might be staying...

If Kemba comes to Utah and takes much less money than he would with the Hornets, I'm calling the "Jazz aren't FA destination" thing a myth...

stitches · Post #248 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:46 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:Would a 5 Year - $262M be the biggest contract signed yet? Is there any other player who had already signed a contract of such an amount?

I think so... with the raising cap every new super max will be the richest contract ever.

Post #249 » by **Inigo Montoya** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:48 pm

stitches wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:Would a 5 Year - $262M be the biggest contract signed yet? Is there any other player who had already signed a contract of such an amount?

I think so... with the raising cap every new super max will be the richest contract ever.

I see Kemba eligible for the supermax of 5 yr, $221M and Giannis eligible for 5-year, $247.3M Super-Max Extension in 2020, so Gobert's $262M is still the largest number I've seen.

KqWIN · Post #250 » by **KqWIN** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:58 pm

Whenever Gobert signs, he will have the largest contract in NBA history because it scales with the cap. Someone else will pass it up later, but just be prepared for that. The stupidity of the NBA is so astounding I tend to believe that the NBA is not stupid at all and things are working as intended.

stitches · Post #251 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 7:58 pm

Inigo Montoya wrote:
stitches wrote:
Inigo Montoya wrote:Would a 5 Year - $262M be the biggest contract signed yet? Is there any other player who had already signed a contract of such an amount?

I think so... with the raising cap every new super max will be the richest contract ever.

I see Kemba eligible for the supermax of 5 yr, $221M and Giannis eligible for 5-year, $247.3M Super-Max Extension in 2020, so Gobert's $262M is still the largest number I've seen.

It all depends on when you start the contract. the Kemba 221 is this year, the 247 is next year, the 260+ is starting in '22

SoCalJazzFan · Post #252 » by **SoCalJazzFan** » Thu May 23, 2019 8:02 pm

Rudy is awesome, but he is going to have to develop a hook shot and/or a mid-range shot and average over 20pts/gm to come close to earning that kind of cap space.

sipclip · Post #253 » by **sipclip** » Thu May 23, 2019 9:04 pm

There is no way I spend that type of money on Rudy ever. Especially at 29yrs old. These damn supermax contracts are turning into franchise killers. If you don't offer the player the max they will get offended but if you do it cripples the teams ability to get better. A lose lose situation.

KqWIN · Post #254 » by **KqWIN** » Thu May 23, 2019 9:18 pm

The NBA has made it so much harder on small market teams by putting them in these situations. If we were a large market, large revenue team, it wouldn't matter as much because we'd be capped out anyways and it would just be more luxury tax payments.

I think the only solution for this is to ask Rudy to take a lesser amount, and if not you need to play hardball.

stitches · Post #255 » by **stitches** » Thu May 23, 2019 9:21 pm

KqWIN wrote:The NBA has made it so much harder on small market teams by putting them in these situations. If we were a large market, large revenue team, it wouldn't matter as much because we'd be capped out anyways and it would just be more luxury tax payments.

I think the only solution for this is to ask Rudy to take a lesser amount, and if not you need to play hardball.

Worth pointing out that Rudy did make the team a home-town discount for the previous contract. His current contract is NOT max and it's full of incentives. The Jazz showed him love and offered him contract before the season started and they got to an agreement. I can totally see something similar happening for the next contract and again - having incentives heavy upper levels of the salary.

KqWIN · Post #256 » by **KqWIN** » Thu May 23, 2019 9:26 pm

stitches wrote:
KqWIN wrote:The NBA has made it so much harder on small market teams by putting them in these situations. If we were a large market, large revenue team, it wouldn't matter as much because we'd be capped out anyways and it would just be more luxury tax payments.

I think the only solution for this is to ask Rudy to take a lesser amount, and if not you need to play hardball.

Worth pointing out that Rudy did make the team a home-town discount for the previous contract. His current contract is NOT max and it's full of incentives. The Jazz showed him love and offered him contract before the season started and they got to an agreement.

Great point. I will never hate on a player for not taking a hometown discount...but we really, really him to take one.

Rauxcee · Post #257 » by **Rauxcee** » Thu May 23, 2019 9:51 pm

When is the bext CBA negotiation and is there any chance the supermax can be removed before we have to give it to Gobert? No?

I hate the supermax. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

wco81 · Post #258 » by **wco81** » Thu May 23, 2019 10:49 pm

Rauxcee wrote:When is the bext CBA negotiation and is there any chance the supermax can be removed before we have to give it to Gobert? No?

I hate the supermax. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

It's not just the NBA. It's the NBA Players Association which negotiated the CBA with the NBA.

Of course the players want the most money possible when teams are raking in revenues.

I don't think it's about helping teams build the best teams. It's about maximizing the payout for their best players so that they stay.

It's up to the Jazz FO to make the case to him that they can't improve the team if he takes the full super max. Other franchise players will probably say they don't care, they want that money.

zero24gravity · Post #259 » by **zero24gravity** » Thu May 23, 2019 10:55 pm

SoCalJazzFan wrote:Rudy is awesome, but he is going to have to develop a hook shot and/or a mid-range shot and average over 20pts/gm to come close to earning that kind of cap space.

I'll refer you to my post a few hours ago in this thread for my thoughts on this way of thinking

It's not all about ppg.

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=1831092&start=20

KqWIN · Post #260 » by **KqWIN** » Thu May 23, 2019 11:08 pm

wco81 wrote:
Rauxcee wrote:When is the bext CBA negotiation and is there any chance the supermax can be removed before we have to give it to Gobert? No?

I hate the supermax. Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

It's not just the NBA. It's the NBA Players Association which negotiated the CBA with the NBA.

Of course the players want the most money possible when teams are raking in revenues.

I don't think it's about helping teams build the best teams. It's about maximizing the payout for their best players so that they stay.

It's up to the Jazz FO to make the case to him that they can't improve the team if he takes the full super max. Other franchise players will probably say they don't care, they want that money.

Easy solution, make the super max bonus not count against the cap. Players get their money, cap sheet not effected. Theoretically opens up more money for non supermax players as well.

Better solution, the supermax needs to turn into a super bonus. One of the reasons the super max is so punitive on teams is that it’s a 5 year deal after a player’s 7th or 8th year. Those last years are going to be a major pain because the player is likely past his prime at that point.

Instead, a player should receive bonus (not counted against the cap) whenever they achieve those benchmarks. Win DPOY? Get the bonus immediately. The idea that a player gets rewarded later for what he did now is dumb. The supermax player should get paid while he’s a supermax player and not after.

It also helps the players out because there’s a less strict time window for them to receive the benchmark. Towns and Beal wouldn’t have to sweat it this year because they could achieve it another year.

The only reason not to do this is if you want to incite player movement. Which is also why it won’t happen. The NBA loves player movement. They also want it to be more difficult for small market teams.