WCSF: (1) Los Angeles Lakers vs (4) Houston Rockets, Part 1 | Series Tied 1-1

[Buckets22]

King James shall send this basketball abomination back into the shadows from where it crawled out.

[gmoney411]

I say again Dwight and McGee are gonna play less than 20 mins combined in this series. They're both here to cheer lead the Lakers, not play against small ball. Dwight could've been productive, if he didn't pick up a foul for every 2 minutes on the floor, but well..

AD and Lebron, and 6'11 and 6'9 are average and good respectively at the perimeter D, and great at rim defense. Harden and Eric Gordon are gonna torch both of them and some of the Laker guards on some switches(Key word being - SOME) And we're gonna miss Avery Bradley so bad.

That said, AD is gonna just walk to 35-13-5 stat lines a game. Rockets don't have a shout against him, except maybe Tucker in the post sometimes. And then whose gonna guard Lebron. This is a terrible match up for them. Rockets don't have a shout outside of getting crazy hot from 3 in the fourth, while the Lakers are gonna feast at the rim with double digit rebounding advantages.

Rockets wanted the Clips in the semis, and the Clips wanted to avoid them at all costs for a reason.

The Rockets did not want the Clippers. They have two elite perimeter defenders and matchup perfectly with the Rockets when they go small. The Rockets would much rather take their chances exploiting switches on the Lakers bigs.

Eh.. can't disagree about their perimeter defensive prowess. Not saying they're winning against either LA team.

I just think they would've matched up better with the Clips, considering the lack of rim protection once they punish Zubac, and how their stocky smalls(Harden, Tucker, Eric Gordon and Austin Rivers) are able to match up against Kawhi and other combo forwards.

They are built to exploit teams who don't have agile elite bigs who can punish them offensively(extremely rare in today's game), as PJ Tucker, Harden & Gordon are underrated defenders in the post. And offensively, they leave you in a pick your poison situation -
- play a big and give them open 3s
- burn the naked defender on Harden / Westbrook, who will drive and finish / pass to the helper's man. They're both elite passers, which increases the threat.

More power to D'Antoni and Morey for creating something so audaciously brilliant, but they're still a one trick pony, which got derailed due to Harden's whim CP3 for Westbrook trade.

AD and Lebron are gonna be nightmares for this experiment on offense and defense. Lakers are not the most talented defense, but they are the most well connected one.

I believe Jazz would've been a tougher match up for Lakers, than Rockets, because of Gobert, but neither team were very good defensively in their 7 game marathon.

Fair assessment.

Harden didn't derail things, Tilman did. Harden wanted to trade for Russ and keep Paul. The Rockets front office didn't want to give up what they did for Russ but Tilman forced their hand. Tilman has whittled down the championship roster he inherited by shedding cap space and refusing to use the MLE. But Morey definitely deserves credit for getting the team this far with a cheap and interfering owner.

[lazybatman]

Gotta post this again, hope you will watch. Numbers tell a different story.

Watch on YouTube

AD at the 5 is cool but force us to shoot many 3s we don't want this.

Sure.. your video didn't post correctly. Can you please edit / repost it? Thanks.

Just dit it
I was surprised by the video tbh, as I thought the team were way better with AD at the 5, which is probably true but not for this match up.

Thanks fella..

I'm a numbers guy and this is indeed very interesting. 72% of Harden's offense coming from drives is f*cking insane for the perception we carry otherwise. And the sophistication to get the helper big on the strong side / Harden.

I'm still not entirely convinced about a couple of things -
- his analysis about our AD / Lebron post ups offense was centered around a total of 5 possessions, and a lot of Lakers offense data based on only 2 games against Houston this year. That's just data manipulation to serve your purpose and holds no ground. AD and Lebron don't just post up. They're both capable of driving in after dribble / screen into the wide open space, if we have 5 shooters who aren't having a terrible night. Even posting up,
- Lebron(when he wants.. of course he doesn't in the regular season) and AD(always) are agile decent rim protectors which gives us the versatility to play an extremely potent small / big ball line up.

I concede to the argument on the defensive side I guess. Again, the 72% number is just ridiculous.

But McGee has a huge weakness hedging the driver and roll man, where he just hangs way too far back giving away open jumpers, also a crappy P&R roll guy. Dwight's adept at both as can be, but has just been shyte so far in the bubble, picking up a foul every 2 minutes. Knocks the wind out of our runs, puts us in the penalty way too soon.

Also, Avery Bradley is the best defender to cheat screens, and we're missing him, so I see a considerable amount of times when Harden's gonna get the switch on McGee / Dwight, which just sends shivers down the spine.. lol. Heck, I love AD's defense overall, but I don't even think he can contain harden one on one. So to have 2 bigs on the floor just doesn't vibe for me, but I could be all wrong.

Lets go LAKERS!!!

[lazybatman]

The Rockets did not want the Clippers. They have two elite perimeter defenders and matchup perfectly with the Rockets when they go small. The Rockets would much rather take their chances exploiting switches on the Lakers bigs.

Eh.. can't disagree about their perimeter defensive prowess. Not saying they're winning against either LA team.

I just think they would've matched up better with the Clips, considering the lack of rim protection once they punish Zubac, and how their stocky smalls(Harden, Tucker, Eric Gordon and Austin Rivers) are able to match up against Kawhi and other combo forwards.

They are built to exploit teams who don't have agile elite bigs who can punish them offensively(extremely rare in today's game), as PJ Tucker, Harden & Gordon are underrated defenders in the post. And offensively, they leave you in a pick your poison situation -
- play a big and give them open 3s
- burn the naked defender on Harden / Westbrook, who will drive and finish / pass to the helper's man. They're both elite passers, which increases the threat.

More power to D'Antoni and Morey for creating something so audaciously brilliant, but they're still a one trick pony, which got derailed due to Harden's whim CP3 for Westbrook trade.

AD and Lebron are gonna be nightmares for this experiment on offense and defense. Lakers are not the most talented defense, but they are the most well connected one.

I believe Jazz would've been a tougher match up for Lakers, than Rockets, because of Gobert, but neither team were very good defensively in their 7 game marathon.

Fair assessment.

Harden didn't derail things, Tilman did. Harden wanted to trade for Russ and keep Paul. The Rockets front office didn't want to give up what they did for Russ but Tilman forced their hand. Tilman has whittled down the championship roster he inherited by shedding cap space and refusing to use the MLE. But Morey definitely deserves credit for getting the team this far with a cheap and interfering owner.

That's some inside info gold.. I just saw Harden's press conf after their last year's playoff run, where he cryptically said 'we know what's wrong and we will correct it in the off season'(not an exact quote) after there was the instance where CP3 was urging the coaches to let Harden be on the bench a bit longer when they were on a good run. It was 2+2 from there, but there's always stuff going on behind the scenes.

[lazybatman]

You do realize that the Lakers don’t switch a lot right? And given Harden is shooting just 26% on off the dribble threes in the bubble, the Lakers will probably go under the screen. If Harden starts hitting then they will have Dwight hedge on to him until his defender can get back to him after going over. If Harden wants to give the ball up to PJ Tucker to make a play 22 feet from the basket, feel free. Lakers will take that all day long.

Dude, you underestimate James Harden if you think he will allow Dwight to get out of a one on one. I don't like to watch him play but AI did this to a prime 12 time All defensive team player, people like to call the GOAT. Harden's the same league, and he can pass and shoot 3s at an above average clip.

Watch on YouTube

Harden is apparently in the same league as MJ

Your obsession with downplaying MJ is hilarious.

And I say that as even a Harden fan lately.

I'm obviously comparing Harden to AI, in terms of ball handling prowess. Point being, no one can stop elite ball handlers, let alone Dwight.

But sure, I would bring up 12 All defensive teams and GOAT argument to hate on him..
jeez dude.. Why are MJ and his fans so insecure? Hint: sense a "The second-last dance" dance so called documentary being ordered if the Lakers win this year. Take that for some hate..

[lazybatman]

You do realize that the Lakers don’t switch a lot right? And given Harden is shooting just 26% on off the dribble threes in the bubble, the Lakers will probably go under the screen. If Harden starts hitting then they will have Dwight hedge on to him until his defender can get back to him after going over. If Harden wants to give the ball up to PJ Tucker to make a play 22 feet from the basket, feel free. Lakers will take that all day long.

Dude, you underestimate James Harden if you think he will allow Dwight to get out of a one on one. I don't like to watch him play but AI did this to a prime 12 time All defensive team player, people like to call the GOAT. Harden's the same league, and he can pass and shoot 3s at an above average clip.

Watch on YouTube

You aren’t going to get a switch of a team doesn’t switch. Just because Houston likes to switch doesn’t mean all teams do it. Do I really need to teach you basketball 101? The Lakers will hedge the big on to Harden and recover back to his man when Harden’s defender gets there. This isn’t hard to understand. It’s basic defensive concepts here.

Lakers switch all the time, sometimes 3-4 times in less than 5 seconds, cos nobody can defend in this league without switching!

They just try the hedge when they have Dwight/McGee/AD in there to protect them from being iso-ed by the opposing star guards / giving the big a free run to the rim on a recovering guard. It's a what Vogel has game planned to do since the beginning of the season. That's the biggest Clippers super power have where they, unlike other teams can switch every thing every time, deeming P&Rs useless a lot of the time.

We have discussed it in this forum quite a bit and I don't have an absolute conclusive point of view about it, except that -
-our best cheater of screens (AB) is MIA as we speak.
-Green & Caruso are savvy, but bigger and find is more difficult to cheat screens, and it goes down from there.
-Tucker & Gordon are great stocky short dudes, who set great screens which are tough to recover back from for the original defender.
-James Harden is in conversation as one of the top 10 offensive scorers and passers ever, and needs a little more respect than hedging, which McGee doesn't know a the basketball 101 of, and Dwight won't survive more than 15 minutes around given his foul rate in the bubble. Harden, like Lebron, Kawhi, CP3, Kyrie, KD, etc will force you to do things you don't ideally wish to do. It's not as binary as you think it is.

Basic enough for you?

[hoosierdaddy34]

Gotta post this again, hope you will watch. Numbers tell a different story.

Watch on YouTube

AD at the 5 is cool but force us to shoot many 3s we don't want this.

Sure.. your video didn't post correctly. Can you please edit / repost it? Thanks.

Just dit it
I was surprised by the video tbh, as I thought the team were way better with AD at the 5, which is probably true but not for this match up.

As AD said today, Houston has to match up with us, we don’t matchup up to them. It’s clear the Lakers don’t respect the Rockets outside game and will just use their own physical advantages and defensive system to create opportunities.

[hoosierdaddy34]

Alright the last two pages were embarrassing, really Dwight Howard lol

Which part was embarrassing? The fact the league shot just 37% in ISO situations against Dwight this year? Or the fact they shot 32% in spot up situations against him? Or is it really just your basketball knowledge led to this comment that is embarrassing? The first two point to the latter.

[lazybatman]

Alright the last two pages were embarrassing, really Dwight Howard lol

Which part was embarrassing? The fact the league shot just 37% in ISO situations against Dwight this year? Or the fact they shot 32% in spot up situations against him? Or is it really just your basketball knowledge led to this comment that is embarrassing? The first two point to the latter.

that was a hell of a comeback.. lol.. and I hate Dwight

[hoosierdaddy34]

Dude, you underestimate James Harden if you think he will allow Dwight to get out of a one on one. I don't like to watch him play but AI did this to a prime 12 time All defensive team player, people like to call the GOAT. Harden's the same league, and he can pass and shoot 3s at an above average clip.

Watch on YouTube

You aren’t going to get a switch of a team doesn’t switch. Just because Houston likes to switch doesn’t mean all teams do it. Do I really need to teach you basketball 101? The Lakers will hedge the big on to Harden and recover back to his man when Harden’s defender gets there. This isn’t hard to understand. It’s basic defensive concepts here.

Lakers switch all the time, sometimes 3-4 times in less than 5 seconds, cos nobody can defend in this league without switching!

They just try the hedge when they have Dwight/McGee/AD in there to protect them from being iso-ed by the opposing star guards / giving the big a free run to the rim on a recovering guard. It's a what Vogel has game planned to do since the beginning of the season. That's the biggest Clippers super power have where they, unlike other teams can switch every thing every time, deeming P&Rs useless a lot of the time.

We have discussed it in this forum quite a bit and I don't have an absolute conclusive point of view about it, except that -
-our best cheater of screens (AB) is MIA as we speak.
-Green & Caruso are savvy, but bigger and find is more difficult to cheat screens, and it goes down from there.
-Tucker & Gordon are great stocky short dudes, who set great screens which are tough to recover back from for the original defender.
-James Harden is in conversation as one of the top 10 offensive scorers and passers ever, and needs a little more respect than hedging, which McGee doesn't know a the basketball 101 of, and Dwight won't survive more than 15 minutes around given his foul rate in the bubble. Harden, like Lebron, Kawhi, CP3, Kyrie, KD, etc will force you to do things you don't ideally wish to do. It's not as binary as you think it is.

Basic enough for you?

To back up what you are saying...according to nba.com...Dwight Howard has zero shot attempts against him by the pick and roll ball handler this season. Neither does Javale. The Lakers don’t switch their bigs, they hedge and recover.

This goes back to what I was saying early about Rockets fans and these delusions of these mismatches and advantages that aren’t bound in any sort of reality.

[hoosierdaddy34]

Alright the last two pages were embarrassing, really Dwight Howard lol

Which part was embarrassing? The fact the league shot just 37% in ISO situations against Dwight this year? Or the fact they shot 32% in spot up situations against him? Or is it really just your basketball knowledge led to this comment that is embarrassing? The first two point to the latter.

that was a hell of a comeback.. lol.. and I hate Dwight

Gracias

[Lalouie]

westbrook hasn't recovered. he is not pre-injury westbrook

but hou will claw harder than they ever have before. i think they will really need the bench.

lakers in 6 or 7 if westbrook can gather himself. in the end lakers is more consistent than hou

but it would be just like f'ing green to have a game or two of his life

[raptor jesus]

I think people are buying into the height disparity way too much. I'll take the team with more skilled players - Rockets in 6 for me.

[lazybatman]

You aren’t going to get a switch of a team doesn’t switch. Just because Houston likes to switch doesn’t mean all teams do it. Do I really need to teach you basketball 101? The Lakers will hedge the big on to Harden and recover back to his man when Harden’s defender gets there. This isn’t hard to understand. It’s basic defensive concepts here.

Lakers switch all the time, sometimes 3-4 times in less than 5 seconds, cos nobody can defend in this league without switching!

They just try the hedge when they have Dwight/McGee/AD in there to protect them from being iso-ed by the opposing star guards / giving the big a free run to the rim on a recovering guard. It's a what Vogel has game planned to do since the beginning of the season. That's the biggest Clippers super power have where they, unlike other teams can switch every thing every time, deeming P&Rs useless a lot of the time.

We have discussed it in this forum quite a bit and I don't have an absolute conclusive point of view about it, except that -
-our best cheater of screens (AB) is MIA as we speak.
-Green & Caruso are savvy, but bigger and find is more difficult to cheat screens, and it goes down from there.
-Tucker & Gordon are great stocky short dudes, who set great screens which are tough to recover back from for the original defender.
-James Harden is in conversation as one of the top 10 offensive scorers and passers ever, and needs a little more respect than hedging, which McGee doesn't know a the basketball 101 of, and Dwight won't survive more than 15 minutes around given his foul rate in the bubble. Harden, like Lebron, Kawhi, CP3, Kyrie, KD, etc will force you to do things you don't ideally wish to do. It's not as binary as you think it is.

Basic enough for you?

To back up what you are saying...according to nba.com...Dwight Howard has zero shot attempts against him by the pick and roll ball handler this season. Neither does Javale. The Lakers don’t switch their bigs, they hedge and recover.

This goes back to what I was saying early about Rockets fans and these delusions of these mismatches and advantages that aren’t bound in any sort of reality.

Agree.. The threat and concept is real, but not effective enough to trouble the more complete teams in this avatar. They needed a fitter CP3 / D'Angelo Russell / Malcom Brogdon / Kyle Lowry kinda addition, instead of Russ(and I absolutly love the dude. Would have him rather than Harden, Kyrie kinda guys on any team other than the D'Antoni system)

It's like the Mavericks, Spurs and Heat bringing about the 3 point threat, and Golden State really taking it to the next level with the right combination of stars.

[Jkam31]

Alright the last two pages were embarrassing, really Dwight Howard lol

Which part was embarrassing? The fact the league shot just 37% in ISO situations against Dwight this year? Or the fact they shot 32% in spot up situations against him? Or is it really just your basketball knowledge led to this comment that is embarrassing? The first two point to the latter.

My bad you got me Dwight will blow up anything harden tries

[K_chile22]

Alright the last two pages were embarrassing, really Dwight Howard lol

Which part was embarrassing? The fact the league shot just 37% in ISO situations against Dwight this year? Or the fact they shot 32% in spot up situations against him? Or is it really just your basketball knowledge led to this comment that is embarrassing? The first two point to the latter.

only 46 possessions, don't think that is statistically significant, thats a very low number, could be nothing but shooting luck, two threes that rimed out go in and all of a sudden he's all the way down to 39th percentile

[Heej]

34% * 3 is 1.02 points per possession. The leagues best half court offense is 1.09. Lakers are at .944. So I mean... You should be

Edited for decimal placement

Nah we good off your posts brah you think Dwight's finna play drop coverage all series. You exposed yourself already. Come back after watching the Portland series my guy

Ah you mean the one where he only played 70 non garbage time minutes and put up a -27 on/off (defense being 10 points per 100 worse when he was on)? That series? Ok will do, it'll be an exciting 14 minutes per game

*Sigh* once again talking out of your ass. Man's had a 124 ORTG and 108 DRTG. Delete your account my g

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2020-nba-western-conference-first-round-trail-blazers-vs-lakers.html

This is gonna be hilarious when the Lakers smoke the Rockets in like 5 games and clean them out on the offensive glass LMFAO.

[Dupp]

Tensions itt

[Young Stapler]

Tune in tonight and all your questions will be answered!

[K_chile22]

Nah we good off your posts brah you think Dwight's finna play drop coverage all series. You exposed yourself already. Come back after watching the Portland series my guy

Ah you mean the one where he only played 70 non garbage time minutes and put up a -27 on/off (defense being 10 points per 100 worse when he was on)? That series? Ok will do, it'll be an exciting 14 minutes per game

*Sigh* once again talking out of your ass. Man's had a 124 ORTG and 108 DRTG. Delete your account my g

https://www.basketball-reference.com/playoffs/2020-nba-western-conference-first-round-trail-blazers-vs-lakers.html

This is gonna be hilarious when the Lakers smoke the Rockets in like 5 games and clean them out on the offensive glass LMFAO.

That's a box score derived estimate not the actual defensive rating when he was on the floor. Almost everything on basketball reference is box score derived and does not include any kind of tracking
Nba dot com uses actual possessions and has him at 105.7 offensive rating on the floor, 113.9 defensive. Know the stats you're talking about before you say someone else doesn't know what they're talking about


Edit: to add, with Dwight off the Lakers had 119.4 offensive rating and 96.9 defensive rating. That's a -30.7 on/off. Original numbers I shared filtered out garbage time via cleaning the glass