Official #1 pick thread

Arsenal · Post #261 » by **Arsenal** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:15 pm

Zach LaVine has a lot of potential and has done some nice things, but he plays zero D and appears to be a mental midget. It's premature to say that he is better than Saric. I'd guess their trade values are roughly equivalent right now, so only time will tell who was the right choice.

In our situation, even if they are equal players it is better that we got the "deferred asset" in Saric, as not having him on the roster contributed to our tanking efforts the last 2 seasons.

spikeslovechild · Post #262 » by **spikeslovechild** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:45 pm

Arsenal wrote:Zach LaVine has a lot of potential and has done some nice things, but he plays zero D and appears to be a mental midget. It's premature to say that he is better than Saric. I'd guess their trade values are roughly equivalent right now, so only time will tell who was the right choice.

In our situation, even if they are equal players it is better that we got the "deferred asset" in Saric, as not having him on the roster contributed to our tanking efforts the last 2 seasons.

The thing about Levine he still has a ton of growing to do especially on the defensive end. I think they are about equal value wise but wouldn't do a 1:1 for the following reasons. Levine has 2 years remaining on his rookie deal + QO. Saric if we can convince him to come over will have 4 plus the qualifying offer. Thats huge and cannot be discounted (has the potential to be 30-40 million). Levine ate through his first two years and gave the wolves very little. We had the benefit of keeping Saric in Europe developing.

I also think once RFA rolls around it's going to be harder and harder to keep players because the cap increase is going to make it tougher and tougher to give out max money to non star RFA's. For example it is projected two years from now the max offer for Noel is going to be 22 million PER. I'm not paying that. I doubt the sixers will either. Once it becomes less of an automatic process of teams offering and players accepting max deals I think you will start to see alot more poaching of RFA's happen as other teams start to get involved. I don't even know what the following year will look like but I doubt it gets better when Levine hits RFA.

The other reason why I want to keep Saric is very simple. I think we owe it to ourselves to see what we have with the kid. I trust Hinkie thought process and his picks in the draft have usually been the best player of the subsequent next 3-4 picks. He showed tremendous growth over in Europe lets see what we have.

Ericb5 · Post #263 » by **Ericb5** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:53 pm

I think that Saric is clearly ahead of Lavine value/potential wise. Saric was the better prospect then, and he has only gotten better.

The only argument for Lavine at this point is that he has played the last two years and Saric hasn't yet.

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76ciology · Post #264 » by **76ciology** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 5:56 pm

For me, Saric's improved 3pt shooting is a big development that can easily turn the pick into a steal. He'd be a good back-up for Simmons. But don't tell him that until he sign with is this july.

PhilasFinest · Post #265 » by **PhilasFinest** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:02 pm

Ericb5 wrote:I think that Saric is clearly ahead of Lavine value/potential wise. Saric was the better prospect then, and he has only gotten better.

The only argument for Lavine at this point is that he has played the last two years and Saric hasn't yet.

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I think that's a bit of a reach.

LaVine scored 14 ppg in under 30 mpg as a 20 year old, nearly 39% from 3 and is one of the most exciting high flyers in the league.

He's far from perfect, but he's a quick, athletic combo guard who can score and shoot from 3. That's valuable in the league.

Saric is a intriguing prospect as well and has improved while playing overseas but I fail to see how he's head aND shoulders above LaVine both in terms of a prospect and/or upside.

Given our current situation, I'd gladly trade Saric for LaVine.

76ciology · Post #266 » by **76ciology** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:07 pm

PhilasFinest wrote:
Ericb5 wrote:I think that Saric is clearly ahead of Lavine value/potential wise. Saric was the better prospect then, and he has only gotten better.

The only argument for Lavine at this point is that he has played the last two years and Saric hasn't yet.

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I think that's a bit of a reach.

LaVine scored 14 ppg in under 30 mpg as a 20 year old, nearly 39% from 3 and is one of the most exciting high flyers in the league.

He's far from perfect, but he's a quick, athletic combo guard who can score and shoot from 3. That's valuable in the league.

Saric is a intriguing prospect as well and has improved while playing overseas but I fail to see how he's head aND shoulders above LaVine both in terms of a prospect and/or upside.

Given our current situation, I'd gladly trade Saric for LaVine.

Do you see lavine as a two way player?
If no, do you think he can be a dominant scorer?
If both are no, do you think he can be a starter?

Saric may not be dominant but he fits the trend (mobile defender who can shoot and pass) that allows him to be a plug and play player. Lavine to me looks like an lou will/Jcraw type spark plug scorer off the bench.

Well, that's just the way I look at things.

Kobblehead · Post #267 » by **Kobblehead** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:10 pm

The elephant in the room in Minnesota is that Lavine has been the better player between he and Wiggins.

PhilasFinest · Post #268 » by **PhilasFinest** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:21 pm

76ciology wrote:
PhilasFinest wrote:
Ericb5 wrote:I think that Saric is clearly ahead of Lavine value/potential wise. Saric was the better prospect then, and he has only gotten better.

The only argument for Lavine at this point is that he has played the last two years and Saric hasn't yet.

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I think that's a bit of a reach.

LaVine scored 14 ppg in under 30 mpg as a 20 year old, nearly 39% from 3 and is one of the most exciting high flyers in the league.

He's far from perfect, but he's a quick, athletic combo guard who can score and shoot from 3. That's valuable in the league.

Saric is a intriguing prospect as well and has improved while playing overseas but I fail to see how he's head aND shoulders above LaVine both in terms of a prospect and/or upside.

Given our current situation, I'd gladly trade Saric for LaVine.

Do you see lavine as a two way player?
If no, do you think he can be a dominant scorer?
If both are no, do you think he can be a starter?

Saric may not be dominant but he fits the trend (mobile defender who can shoot and pass) that allows him to be a plug and play player. Lavine to me looks like an lou will/Jcraw type spark plug scorer off the bench.

Well, that's just the way I look at things.

No I dont see LaVine as a 2 way stud. He's athletic and tall enough to be an aqequate defender though.

Can he be a dominant scorer? Not nightly right now,and realistically I don't see him leading the league in scoring...but he can get you 18 a night....with starter minutes he was stringing together 20+ point games and providing 3 point shootin at a hugh level....at 20 years old.

Yes he can be a starter.

I don't see how Saric projects as a much better defender or a "2 way" player than Zach. LaVine is more athletic/mobile. Maybe Saric is more "scrappy" but he's not as quick, athletic and isn't exactly a big guy for a 4 either.

Shooting wise, I suppose Saric has shown tremendous improvement...but I'll take the kid shooting 39% in the NBA in that category.

LaVine, at the 2 for us would provide spacing and scoring which is desperately needed. He would also be electric in transition with Simmons/Noel and our uptempo pace, and would be an exciting player to watch.

sixers23 · Post #269 » by **sixers23** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 6:46 pm

Saric is better than lavine. He's gotten overrated bc of dunk contest. His rookie season was horrendous he improved sure but still has a long way to go

PhilasFinest · Post #270 » by **PhilasFinest** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:06 pm

sixers23 wrote:Saric is better than lavine. He's gotten overrated bc of dunk contest. His rookie season was horrendous he improved sure but still has a long way to go

And your basing this off of what? Your projection from Turkey to the nba ?

Unbreakable99 · Post #271 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:07 pm

Kobblehead wrote:The elephant in the room in Minnesota is that Lavine has been the better player between he and Wiggins.

Would you trade Saric for Lavine? Do you think Lavine is and will be he better player? Do you think Hinkie should have drafted Lavine or Saric?

Unbreakable99 · Post #272 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:13 pm

Simmons definitely needs to improve his outside shot. I don't want the media to say Simmons is too passive even if it's not true. I don't want teams to go under every screen either. He can't live trying to drive to the paint all the time. He must be able to have a consistent jumper to keep teams honest. Wade isn't a great shooter but you can't just lay off him either. He has a pretty good midrange jump shot.

Arsenal · Post #273 » by **Arsenal** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:24 pm

Hopefully Simmons is watching how LeBron is getting neutralized by GS because he can't shoot.

I also hope that Simmons is open to playing in a motion/Princeton/ball movement type of offense (ala GS or SA) instead of emulating LeBron's ball-stopping ways.

Unbreakable99 · Post #274 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:36 pm

Arsenal wrote:Hopefully Simmons is watching how LeBron is getting neutralized by GS because he can't shoot.

I also hope that Simmons is open to playing in a motion/Princeton/ball movement type of offense (ala GS or SA) instead of emulating LeBron's ball-stopping ways.

LeBron is still an all time great so if he plays as good as LeBron I would be ecstatic. But you can't just drive to the basket. You must have a respectable jump shot. Simmons is very unselfish much like LeBron. I think Simmons can play in an offense where there is a lot of passing and motion. When you have elite talent you can get away with playing one on one and not having much passing in the offense. But even then it is better to not play that way. I do know this much. If Okafor is on the team he will not be afraid to shoot and take over a game offensively lol. He definitely will not be passive.

Post #275 » by **Sixerscan** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:37 pm

Let's all hope where we get to the point where we have to worry about Simmons being neutralized by Golden State while he's almost averaging a triple double.

LongLiveHinkie · Post #276 » by **LongLiveHinkie** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:38 pm

Lebron improved his shot as much as he can. Not sure that's really his fault, some people just have better touch and a more natural feel for accuracy and shooting than others. Ben Simmons can watch him and go "Man, I really need to get my shot at _____ level" but he may not be able to. I have no idea what his ceiling on his jumper is though since I haven't seen him shoot enough.

I also think Simmons will need to learn to move without the ball to become an elite player. Can't just rely on having the ball in his hands all the time. Elite players need to be versatile and be able to play different styles.

Arsenal · Post #277 » by **Arsenal** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:47 pm

Sixerscan wrote:Let's all hope where we get to the point where we have to worry about Simmons being neutralized by Golden State while he's almost averaging a triple double.

Agree.

Nevertheless I think it's abundantly clear that "LeBron ball" is inferior to the modern motion offenses exemplified by GS and SA. It's no coincidence that those 2 teams will (soon) have won the last 3 championships while hammering LeBron's team in the finals.

It took peak LeBron, along with 2 other Hall of Famers in Wade and Bosh, plus an overall stacked team to steal the title in 2013 also, where they should have lost to SA as well.

Now that he's on the downslope, his style of ball isn't going to win against the western powers.

PhilasFinest · Post #278 » by **PhilasFinest** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:52 pm

Clevelands struggles stem far beyond LeBron.

There offense is stagnant, they don't move the ball, rely on isolation plays and lack depth.

They need a good coach and for LeBron to buy into it.

Unbreakable99 · Post #279 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:53 pm

Arsenal wrote:
Sixerscan wrote:Let's all hope where we get to the point where we have to worry about Simmons being neutralized by Golden State while he's almost averaging a triple double.

Agree.

Nevertheless I think it's abundantly clear that "LeBron ball" is inferior to the modern motion offenses exemplified by GS and SA. It's no coincidence that those 2 teams will (soon) have won the last 3 championships while hammering LeBron's team in the finals.

It took peak LeBron, along with 2 other Hall of Famers in Wade and Bosh, plus an overall stacked team to steal the title in 2013 also, where they should have lost to SA as well.

Now that he's on the downslope, his style of ball isn't going to win against the western powers.

Let's not act like you can't win that way. OKC should have beaten GS and they play hero ball a lot. They have elite talent to do so. It's all about great players. Look at the best players. They make the final 4 regardless of style of play.

Unbreakable99 · Post #280 » by **Unbreakable99** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 7:56 pm

LongLiveHinkie wrote:Lebron improved his shot as much as he can. Not sure that's really his fault, some people just have better touch and a more natural feel for accuracy and shooting than others. Ben Simmons can watch him and go "Man, I really need to get my shot at _____ level" but he may not be able to. I have no idea what his ceiling on his jumper is though since I haven't seen him shoot enough.

I also think Simmons will need to learn to move without the ball to become an elite player. Can't just rely on having the ball in his hands all the time. Elite players need to be versatile and be able to play different styles.

That would help but it's about having the most talent. LeBron wins and they don't move the ball that much. OKC wins a lot and they don't pass that much. The best players keep the ball in their hands a lot. Wade keeps it. LeBron. Durant. Westbrook. Lillard. Ethan's why they are the best players. The ball is in their hands a lot.

With #1 Philly should select