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Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST)

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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#261 » by winforlose » Wed Oct 13, 2021 2:43 pm

Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:One other thought occurred to me. The Warriors are going to play almost half the season without Klay and when he does come back he will be heavily minute restricted. Beasley to GSW would be perfect for them, (especially in light of having lost Oubre Jr.) Meanwhile, they have Wiseman who doesn’t quite fit their timeline and whose size benefits us. We can talk about throw in players or maybe a protected pick, but what do people think of the general premise?

Golden State would laugh at you.

I don't think Beasley is viewed in that light at this point. Honestly, I think there's a better chance of that type of trade with GSW getting Luke Kennard.


I doubt the Clippers would deal with GSW. They would see them as direct competition. Most of the west would (the teams trying to make the playoffs at least.) Beasley as a catch and shoot sharpshooter paired with Curry would be solid. When Klay comes back Beasley goes to the bench and adds scoring there as well. I think you may be right that GSW would view him as damaged goods given his poor performance in the preseason and the drama last year. That said, Curry is 33, the window for their return to dynasty glory is closing more and more every year. Who knows how good Klay will be when he is back. GSW could very well miss the playoffs for a 3rd straight year. OPJ isn’t likely to make the difference and the new rookies don’t seem to be game changers. Otherwise GSW is doing a run back. You may be right that it wouldn’t be Beasley, but I could see them making a move for a SG.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#262 » by Takingbaconback » Wed Oct 13, 2021 8:27 pm

I think Beasley is a very talented player, but his off court stuff appears very distracting to his game and dedication.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#263 » by Klomp » Wed Oct 13, 2021 8:37 pm

Takingbaconback wrote:I think Beasley is a very talented player, but his off court stuff appears very distracting to his game and dedication.

I think it has to do with spending 2.5 months in jail not helping him stay in good basketball shape.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#264 » by Neeva » Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:23 pm

Klomp wrote:
Takingbaconback wrote:I think Beasley is a very talented player, but his off court stuff appears very distracting to his game and dedication.

I think it has to do with spending 2.5 months in jail not helping him stay in good basketball shape.


beasley was terrible after he got back from his suspension as well, if he doesn’t shape up he will be a terrible contract for a bench player.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#265 » by NebWolvesFan » Wed Oct 13, 2021 9:54 pm

Neeva wrote:
Klomp wrote:
Takingbaconback wrote:I think Beasley is a very talented player, but his off court stuff appears very distracting to his game and dedication.

I think it has to do with spending 2.5 months in jail not helping him stay in good basketball shape.


beasley was terrible after he got back from his suspension as well, if he doesn’t shape up he will be a terrible contract for a bench player.


With Beasley stuck behind Ant, he better get into shape. If he's not playing well, Finch can use Ant/Bev and maybe Nowell at the two and win games. This team doesn't need Beasley.

That being said, in-shape Beasley is a sniper, so I hope he's finds his stride soon.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#266 » by winforlose » Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:04 pm

NebWolvesFan wrote:
Neeva wrote:
Klomp wrote:I think it has to do with spending 2.5 months in jail not helping him stay in good basketball shape.


beasley was terrible after he got back from his suspension as well, if he doesn’t shape up he will be a terrible contract for a bench player.


With Beasley stuck behind Ant, he better get into shape. If he's not playing well, Finch can use Ant/Bev and maybe Nowell at the two and win games. This team doesn't need Beasley.

That being said, in-shape Beasley is a sniper, so I hope he's finds his stride soon.


1. Ant can and probably should play the 3. Ant is the perfect drive and kick partner with Beasley. Also, Ants frame and inaccuracy from range mean he is likely guarded by opposing 3s. The only reason to play Ant at the 2 is to play MCD, Vando, and Towns at 3-5 to gain a size advantage and make it harder to guard our size. The flaw in this lineup is the second unit is going to be small because we only have so much size. Prince is your default backup 4 with everyone listed in the starting lineup. Your backup 3 is likely Okogie and Beverly isn’t exactly tall. Reid is an undersized center and now Beasley or Nowell aren’t exactly huge for their position.

2. Beasley does create spacing for Dlo and KAT on the perimeter. He is a player good enough from distance that your defense must account for him. Once his groove is back he will have value (both trade and play.) We absolutely need him and he should be starting. Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#267 » by Klomp » Wed Oct 13, 2021 10:53 pm

winforlose wrote:Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.

I just want to point out that this is a fallacy. Just use our own roster as an example in this case study. With Ant being ball-dominant/the initiator, would you rather have him be defended by Russell (first unit) or Beverley (second unit)? Playing with the second unit doesn't guarantee being guarded by worse defenders. In fact, being the top option with the second unit guarantees that the opponent would assign their best defender on the floor to guard him. That's not guaranteed when playing primarily with the starters.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#268 » by winforlose » Wed Oct 13, 2021 11:51 pm

Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.

I just want to point out that this is a fallacy. Just use our own roster as an example in this case study. With Ant being ball-dominant/the initiator, would you rather have him be defended by Russell (first unit) or Beverley (second unit)? Playing with the second unit doesn't guarantee being guarded by worse defenders. In fact, being the top option with the second unit guarantees that the opponent would assign their best defender on the floor to guard him. That's not guaranteed when playing primarily with the starters.


A fair point, and yet it presumes quite a bit. For example, we would not assign Dlo to guard Ant, we would assign an Okogie or V8, or MCD. Moreover, the defensive acumen of our best non big defender in the starting lineup might be as good or better than the best non big bench defender. Additionally, we know from Finch that Ant struggles to get his touches when playing with Dlo and KAT. Finch is making it a point of emphasis to get Ant more involved. I mention this because in a way Ant is being very well defended by the lack of usage in the offense. Better to overcome a tough defender than to get reduced value by default. Also, with shooters in the second unit Ant can drive and kick or drive and finish. Ant is best off the attack and struggles to do so as effectively against the leagues best bigs. Those bigs will be on the bench. I trust Ant to get around his primary defender, I seek for him to encounter less physical and less skilled bigs in the paint.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#269 » by fattymcgee » Thu Oct 14, 2021 12:05 am

Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.

I just want to point out that this is a fallacy. Just use our own roster as an example in this case study. With Ant being ball-dominant/the initiator, would you rather have him be defended by Russell (first unit) or Beverley (second unit)? Playing with the second unit doesn't guarantee being guarded by worse defenders. In fact, being the top option with the second unit guarantees that the opponent would assign their best defender on the floor to guard him. That's not guaranteed when playing primarily with the starters.


It's not guaranteed that the second unit on other teams has better wing defenders than their starters.

I'd prefer either DLo or Ant be rotated out earlier. DLo has been hogging the ball and Ant barely ever gets to initiate. We need to continue to develop him.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#270 » by winforlose » Thu Oct 14, 2021 12:12 am

fattymcgee wrote:
Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.

I just want to point out that this is a fallacy. Just use our own roster as an example in this case study. With Ant being ball-dominant/the initiator, would you rather have him be defended by Russell (first unit) or Beverley (second unit)? Playing with the second unit doesn't guarantee being guarded by worse defenders. In fact, being the top option with the second unit guarantees that the opponent would assign their best defender on the floor to guard him. That's not guaranteed when playing primarily with the starters.


It's not guaranteed that the second unit on other teams has better wing defenders than their starters.

I'd prefer either DLo or Ant be rotated out earlier. DLo has been hogging the ball and Ant barely ever gets to initiate. We need to continue to develop him.


This, and Ant would bring the dribble penetration to the second unit that both Dlo and KAT provide to the first unit. KAT has been torching people and Dlo in the two man game has been on fire. This pairing needs to be left alone and Ant needs room to take control. That room is with the second unit.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#271 » by Folklore » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:48 am

NebWolvesFan wrote:
Folklore wrote:We're just too small.



Wolves get
D. Finney-Smith
Moses Brown

Dallas get
Jake Layman
J. Nowell


I just want Moses on the team.

Nowell sees himself as a max player so he'll want to get paid.


The problem with Moses or any pure center is that Towns and Reid are going to take up all the minutes at the five. Minnesota really needs to find a strong power forward with the ability to rebound. I'd love to get Paul Reed on this team somehow. For more of a vet - Thad Young would be a great fit. I still think V8 can be solid.


Towns can play at the 4 along with Naz. we need a real C and a above the rim PF.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#272 » by Folklore » Fri Oct 15, 2021 1:54 am

Domejandro wrote:No shot Minnesota poaches a terrific role player like DFS for nothing. Dude is really good and locked in for peanuts.


Have you seen his stats? He was only playing because Dwight Powell was out.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#273 » by FinnTheHuman » Fri Oct 15, 2021 11:00 am

fattymcgee wrote:
Klomp wrote:
winforlose wrote:Ant should be rotated out 4 minutes in (or sooner) and spend most of his time with the second unit. This allows him to ball dominate without depriving KAT, Beasley, and Dlo of their shots while also letting Ant play against 2nd line defenders.

I just want to point out that this is a fallacy. Just use our own roster as an example in this case study. With Ant being ball-dominant/the initiator, would you rather have him be defended by Russell (first unit) or Beverley (second unit)? Playing with the second unit doesn't guarantee being guarded by worse defenders. In fact, being the top option with the second unit guarantees that the opponent would assign their best defender on the floor to guard him. That's not guaranteed when playing primarily with the starters.


It's not guaranteed that the second unit on other teams has better wing defenders than their starters.

I'd prefer either DLo or Ant be rotated out earlier. DLo has been hogging the ball and Ant barely ever gets to initiate. We need to continue to develop him.


DLo doesn't depend on spacing as much as Ant, because DLo doesn't attack the rim at all, and creates an efficient 3pt shot off the dribble better than anyone on the team. Ant should play with the best shooters we have, meaning KAT, Beasley (he'll find his stroke soon I'm sure), Beverley, corner McD, Prince. DLo can work with Naz in the PnR. So DLo should play the most minutes with the bench unit out of our 'big 3', he should probably get subbed out for Beasley/Beverley after 5 minutes or so, and then brought back in for Ant near the end of the 1st/3rd quarter.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#274 » by Klomp » Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:16 pm

Folklore wrote:
Domejandro wrote:No shot Minnesota poaches a terrific role player like DFS for nothing. Dude is really good and locked in for peanuts.


Have you seen his stats? He was only playing because Dwight Powell was out.

This is not a good take. DFS is a very good role player.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#275 » by Domejandro » Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:42 pm

Folklore wrote:
Domejandro wrote:No shot Minnesota poaches a terrific role player like DFS for nothing. Dude is really good and locked in for peanuts.


Have you seen his stats? He was only playing because Dwight Powell was out.

With respect, this is objectively untrue. Like, not even remotely accurate.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#276 » by Krapinsky » Fri Oct 15, 2021 2:47 pm

Domejandro wrote:
Folklore wrote:
Domejandro wrote:No shot Minnesota poaches a terrific role player like DFS for nothing. Dude is really good and locked in for peanuts.


Have you seen his stats? He was only playing because Dwight Powell was out.

With respect, this is objectively untrue. Like, not even remotely accurate.


I'm with you. DFS is probably one of the top 5 players i wish we could trade for given his position, role, ability, age, and contract. I can't see a team playing for home field willing to give him up.
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#277 » by KGdaBom » Fri Oct 15, 2021 3:50 pm

Is the Ben Simmons trade completed yet?
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#278 » by wolves_89 » Sat Oct 16, 2021 10:34 pm

The Wolves should be looking to claim Harry Giles off of waivers. His contract is a non-guaranteed minimum deal so he could be waived later in order to stay under the luxury tax line. We really need to add someone with even a little size to help balance the roster and give the team a chance if Towns or Reid misses time
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#279 » by Norseman79 » Sun Oct 17, 2021 12:31 am

Whoever they target needs to be 7'+ 250lbs+...and not necessarily a starter, but could be. Anything smaller they already have
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Re: Trade Talk (Part Nine) (READ FIRST POST) 

Post#280 » by winforlose » Sun Oct 17, 2021 12:52 am

I still think Paul Reed or Obi Toppin may be good targets. Reed is 3rd on the depth chart for the 76ers according to ESPN and that is before a Simmons deal could bury him further. Toppin had a disappointing season last year and Taj Gibson could fill whatever minutes he is expected to play this year. Toppin showed promise this off season and could play beside Towns or Reid. Reed could do the same. In either case the cost would no doubt be somewhat high, but the reward seems worth it.

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