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Chicago-Bull-E wrote:I think to get Gobert, you’d have to put in Patrick Williams. Which I may do if Utah sends a small asset back. Something like Vuc/Pat/Green for Gobert/NAW.

Then trade Coby and the Bulls pick to trade up in the draft and select Tari Eason, a guy who is oozing potential and can do a lot of what Pat can do.

Nab Covington in free agency, and the team looks well rounded.

Ball/Ayo
Lavine/Caruso
Demar/NAW
Covington/Eason
Gobert/TT

It’s Lavine and Demar surrounded by elite defense.

I don't see AKME pushing all the chips to the table to pay Gobert 45 million per year for Zach and Demar to run it back lol

I think ultimately they will heed the tale of the Knicks and Randle and will make moves to get the team closer to their original plan

Gobert is a franchise killing contract. No thanks. You guys complain about Zach getting maxed...Rudy makes 41 mil a year to play interior defense and be a garbage man. The board would melt down.

Goberts advanced metrics would have him as the best player on the Bulls by a country mile. If you add up Zach’s and Demars RPM it doesn’t come close to Gobert. Some of y’all struggle to understand what impacts winning. But hey, Zach make pretty shot, right?

Utah fan checking in:

Is a package around Lonzo/Pat/1-2 picks for Donovan at all feasible or no?

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:I think to get Gobert, you’d have to put in Patrick Williams. Which I may do if Utah sends a small asset back. Something like Vuc/Pat/Green for Gobert/NAW.

Then trade Coby and the Bulls pick to trade up in the draft and select Tari Eason, a guy who is oozing potential and can do a lot of what Pat can do.

Nab Covington in free agency, and the team looks well rounded.

Ball/Ayo
Lavine/Caruso
Demar/NAW
Covington/Eason
Gobert/TT

It’s Lavine and Demar surrounded by elite defense.

That team simply doesn’t have enough offense. I know his advanced metrics are high but advanced stats aren’t everything. Plus they would switch to get Demar or Zach in a PNR with Gobert. I’d much rather go after Robinson, Poeltl, Portis, Capela, or even Holmes.

eminence wrote:Utah fan checking in:

Is a package around Lonzo/Pat/1-2 picks for Donovan at all feasible or no?

The value is good for Chicago, but the fit is poor. The Bulls would certainly look to ship out Lavine for defense, there would need to be follow up deals.

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:I think to get Gobert, you’d have to put in Patrick Williams. Which I may do if Utah sends a small asset back. Something like Vuc/Pat/Green for Gobert/NAW.

Then trade Coby and the Bulls pick to trade up in the draft and select Tari Eason, a guy who is oozing potential and can do a lot of what Pat can do.

Nab Covington in free agency, and the team looks well rounded.

Ball/Ayo
Lavine/Caruso
Demar/NAW
Covington/Eason
Gobert/TT

It’s Lavine and Demar surrounded by elite defense.

This could be a really good retool. Covington can also shoot well from the perimeter.

Michael Jackson wrote:

sco wrote:

PlayerUp wrote:
I would do it and it solves our center issues but Im guessing some team would outbid us. We may have to settle for someone like Myles Turner or Mitchell Robinson instead.

I like Turner over Robinson by a wide margin. Turner, obviously, has durability questions, but given his age, I'd take the risk. I wonder if Vuc + our 1st or POR 1st be enough?

I don’t think I would add the pick for Turner. I really don’t like him, his shot blocking would obviously help but he doesn’t move the needle much imho. Now if it was Sabonis, count me all in. If we are just looking to add shot blocking I’d rather keep the pick and draft a guy who can do that and see what else you can get for Vuc imho.

Personally I think Coby White + Nikola Vucevic is enough to get Myles Turner. Turner is an expiring contract so I agree there should be no need to give up a 1st for him. I agree Turner isn't a difference maker to put us over the top but he'd solve our center defensive issues.

Sabonis was already moved to the Kings so he's out. Kings went all in and it took Haliburton to get Sabonis who is averaging 18/10 in Indiana since the trade so I doubt they'll be moving Sabonis anytime soon.

Another option is we go with AKME rumored target Mitchell Robinson and acquire him for little to nothing via trade this offseason.

One X factor going forward is to increase the volume of 3 pt shots taken by Ayo & PWill. They seem timid and pàss up shooting opportunities which more often than not become iSO situations for Zach/DDR.

eminence wrote:Utah fan checking in:

Is a package around Lonzo/Pat/1-2 picks for Donovan at all feasible or no?

Is a Lavine sign-and-trade for Donovan an option?

I´m asking both of you Jazz and Bulls fans.

Tutupa wrote:

eminence wrote:Utah fan checking in:

Is a package around Lonzo/Pat/1-2 picks for Donovan at all feasible or no?

Is a Lavine sign-and-trade for Donovan an option?

I´m asking both of you Jazz and Bulls fans.

Not impossible but not really realistic imho. Mitchell is a worse defender and a bigger black hole so it isn’t like he changes those issues for the Bulls. Maybe Utah does it if they really want to make a run with Gobert and the rumors are true that the two don’t like each other but the trade in most senses is pretty lateral. Trades like that rarely happen.

Michael Jackson wrote:

Tutupa wrote:

eminence wrote:Utah fan checking in:

Is a package around Lonzo/Pat/1-2 picks for Donovan at all feasible or no?

Is a Lavine sign-and-trade for Donovan an option?

I´m asking both of you Jazz and Bulls fans.

Not impossible but not really realistic imho. Mitchell is a worse defender and a bigger black hole so it isn’t like he changes those issues for the Bulls. Maybe Utah does it if they really want to make a run with Gobert and the rumors are true that the two don’t like each other but the trade in most senses is pretty lateral. Trades like that rarely happen.

Saw that stat that he has passed to Gobert less then two times per game.

Jcool0 wrote:

Michael Jackson wrote:

Tutupa wrote:
Is a Lavine sign-and-trade for Donovan an option?

I´m asking both of you Jazz and Bulls fans.

Not impossible but not really realistic imho. Mitchell is a worse defender and a bigger black hole so it isn’t like he changes those issues for the Bulls. Maybe Utah does it if they really want to make a run with Gobert and the rumors are true that the two don’t like each other but the trade in most senses is pretty lateral. Trades like that rarely happen.

Saw that stat that he has passed to Gobert less then two times per game.

There is clearly beef between him and Gobert of some sort which lends to that but in general Spider doesn't pass much to anyone at all. Not saying the swap would be bad at all, but I don't think it changes much, if that makes sense. They will be similarly frustrating. He seems less likely to share with DDR, but Mitchell also can be a real killer and he surely isn't afraid of taking big shots in a game. Booker, Mitchell, LaVine and Beal they all to me are pretty similar, you can have your preference but I think they are all pretty interchangeable. If one's strength and weaknesses fit a teams specific system vs another guys a swap makes sense.

I'll take Lavines efficiency over Spider every day and twice on Sunday.


Sent from somewhere you've never been.

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:Goberts advanced metrics would have him as the best player on the Bulls by a country mile. If you add up Zach’s and Demars RPM it doesn’t come close to Gobert. Some of y’all struggle to understand what impacts winning. But hey, Zach make pretty shot, right?

No. Some of us understand that Rudy Gobert is a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. Some of us understand that he has been neutralized every single playoffs by small ball. Some of us understand that the dude got taken out of a series by Nic Batum. Some of understand that it's not wise to spend 40% of your cap on a player archetype that provides role player level production and leaves the team with zero flexibility. Some of understand that talent wins games. Some of us understand that great offense always beats defense.

Some of us don't understand any of those things.

Vuc and DJJ work in the trade machine but it's based off this years salary not next years which will be 3 mil higher. Maybe would have to add Coby, I don't know. I'm not sure if that would be enough from Utah's perspective but I'd kick the wheels and see. We get a better defender and rebounder. Utah gets out of Rudy's contract with shorter term contracts while still competing to keep Mitchell happy. I'm sure Utah would would picks or more young prospects as well but as others have mentioned I wouldn't want to sell the farm for Rudy AND give Zach his max. That's a lot of money tied up to have to rely on vet min contracts with no young prospects or picks going forward.

Tetlak wrote:

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:Goberts advanced metrics would have him as the best player on the Bulls by a country mile. If you add up Zach’s and Demars RPM it doesn’t come close to Gobert. Some of y’all struggle to understand what impacts winning. But hey, Zach make pretty shot, right?

No. Some of us understand that Rudy Gobert is a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. Some of us understand that he has been neutralized every single playoffs by small ball. Some of us understand that the dude got taken out of a series by Nic Batum. Some of understand that it's not wise to spend 40% of your cap on a player archetype that provides role player level production and leaves the team with zero flexibility. Some of understand that talent wins games. Some of us understand that great offense always beats defense.

Some of us don't understand any of those things.

Yeah, I think playoff success is something to use against Rudy when traded for Vuc and juxtaposed with Zach Lavine. If Lavine had never been on a winning team until this year, does that make him a floor-lowerer?

But hey, Gobert had 1 bad playoff series after continuing to perform well in the playoffs. let’s ignore his playoff numbers are higher than his regular season numbers, I’m sure you knew that. Jury is obviously still out on Zach, cause we’ll, he’s sucked for the majority of his career.

But hey, his ppg are low. Production. Let’s ignore the all nba teams and awards he’s accumulated. Those voters don’t know what they’re talking about. Points per game, amirite?!?!

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:

Tetlak wrote:

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:Goberts advanced metrics would have him as the best player on the Bulls by a country mile. If you add up Zach’s and Demars RPM it doesn’t come close to Gobert. Some of y’all struggle to understand what impacts winning. But hey, Zach make pretty shot, right?

No. Some of us understand that Rudy Gobert is a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. Some of us understand that he has been neutralized every single playoffs by small ball. Some of us understand that the dude got taken out of a series by Nic Batum. Some of understand that it's not wise to spend 40% of your cap on a player archetype that provides role player level production and leaves the team with zero flexibility. Some of understand that talent wins games. Some of us understand that great offense always beats defense.

Some of us don't understand any of those things.

Yeah, I think playoff success is something to use against Rudy when traded for Vuc and juxtaposed with Zach Lavine. If Lavine had never been on a winning team until this year, does that make him a floor-lowerer?

But hey, Gobert had 1 bad playoff series after continuing to perform well in the playoffs. let’s ignore his playoff numbers are higher than his regular season numbers, I’m sure you knew that. Jury is obviously still out on Zach, cause we’ll, he’s sucked for the majority of his career.

But hey, his ppg are low. Production. Let’s ignore the all nba teams and awards he’s accumulated. Those voters don’t know what they’re talking about. Points per game, amirite?!?!

Stats/advanced stats aren’t everything my guy. Using the super max on a guy that isn’t going to get you over the top isn’t a good idea. I’d much rather spend 40 million dollars on two above average front court starters like Grant and Portis.

NBA awards over actual stats for determining who the better player is doesn't seem factual??

PJSteven22 wrote:

Chicago-Bull-E wrote:

Tetlak wrote:
No. Some of us understand that Rudy Gobert is a floor raiser, not a ceiling raiser. Some of us understand that he has been neutralized every single playoffs by small ball. Some of us understand that the dude got taken out of a series by Nic Batum. Some of understand that it's not wise to spend 40% of your cap on a player archetype that provides role player level production and leaves the team with zero flexibility. Some of understand that talent wins games. Some of us understand that great offense always beats defense.

Some of us don't understand any of those things.

Yeah, I think playoff success is something to use against Rudy when traded for Vuc and juxtaposed with Zach Lavine. If Lavine had never been on a winning team until this year, does that make him a floor-lowerer?

But hey, Gobert had 1 bad playoff series after continuing to perform well in the playoffs. let’s ignore his playoff numbers are higher than his regular season numbers, I’m sure you knew that. Jury is obviously still out on Zach, cause we’ll, he’s sucked for the majority of his career.

But hey, his ppg are low. Production. Let’s ignore the all nba teams and awards he’s accumulated. Those voters don’t know what they’re talking about. Points per game, amirite?!?!

Stats/advanced stats aren’t everything my guy. Using the super max on a guy that isn’t going to get you over the top isn’t a good idea. I’d much rather spend 40 million dollars on two above average front court starters like Grant and Portis.

I mean, if you don’t like stats, Gobert has a history of winning that Zach and Vuc aren’t close to. So advanced metrics and winning is on his side. Seems pretty impactful.