The ROTY/Rookie Discussion Thread, Part III

theo42 · Post #2641 » by **theo42** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:39 pm

commentatorer wrote:Simmons has now won 3 games in a row without Embiid (Philly's last 2 games + the win over Miami in February).

I would argue 3.5 since Embiid missed most of the game he went out in.

Post #2642 » by **SmartWentCrazy** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:40 pm

711takeover wrote:
GameBredAPBT wrote:
SmartWentCrazy wrote:
I dont think it is— LeBron, in my opinion, is likely be the best athlete in human history. He’s been able to do things no man his size ever should be abld to do.

The guy is so universally disliked people will go to any lengths to make him seem pedestrian or less than his worth.

That's not the issue. It's just a very bold statement to say he's the best athlete in human history

Look at the overwhelming majority of athletic records— theyre set in the past 30 or so years. The advances in weight training and nutrition have allowed humans to grow in ways that just werent possible 50+ years ago. Humans have also naturally grown over time due to improvements in health and allowed for people to live longer. All of this leads me to believe that its likely hes one of (if not the) best athletes to ever walk the earth.

theo42 · Post #2643 » by **theo42** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:41 pm

SmartWentCrazy wrote:
SkyHookFTW wrote:
GameBredAPBT wrote:
Definitely not. The speed, the explosion, the visceral strength, the blinding speed, the elite fast twitch muscle fiber.... LBJ is probably the greatest athletic specimen mankind has ever seen. Simmons is athletic but he's several tiers below.

A bit of hyperbole there--greatest athletic specimen mankind has ever seen? He's not even the greatest in NBA history. Let's not go overboard. Simmons is not the athlete LeBron is yet, but LeBron at 21 was not the LeBron of today. Simmons may never get to that point, or he might. We'll just have to wait and see.

I dont think it is— LeBron, in my opinion, is likely be the best athlete in human history. He’s been able to do things no man his size ever should be abld to do.

Lebron was listed at 6'7" his rookie year and looked it. Ben is every bit of 6'10". While i agree, Lebron was faster and probably more athletic, the gap isn't as wide as most think especially considering that Ben does in about 3" taller.

pace31 · Post #2644 » by **pace31** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:48 pm

This race is just about over IMO. Simmons has upped his game and Philly has been winning like crazy, I think it's pretty much sealed unless Donovan and the Jazz go on a crazy dramatic run to end the season with him putting up insane numbers.

Post #2645 » by **Sixerscan** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:50 pm

Ben moved past Towns for 18th in rookie win shares in the 3 point era. Still 6 games to go. Depending on how much he plays he has a chance to push into the top 12 or so and approach some of the great rookie seasons of recent memory (Chris Paul, Blake Griffin)

bebopdeluxe · Post #2646 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:50 pm

QPR wrote:Josh Jackson's last 10 games: 21.2/5.3/3 and 2 steals

Way ahead of schedule.

He really has stepped up his game lately. Color me impressed.

What a rookie class.

bebopdeluxe · Post #2647 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 3:56 pm

voodooguru wrote:
mtron929 wrote:[Simmons]...kind of plays basketball like how an elite #10 plays futbol.

Fact fans?

Fact : Ben "Beige Magic" Simmons plays b-ball like a footballer. An Australian Football League (AFL) footballer.

Fact : Simmons would have been a Top Five AFL draftee [if he'd chosen love over money]. No. Doubt.

If yr one of the 8 people who read this and know the Aussie Rules game, you already know that :

Other than our beloved b-ball, Rules is the only other team sport with no offside rule.

Because of this,lol[?], it's the game that makes futbol/soccer look like croquet/badminton. The game will never take over the world but it is certainly the basketball of NFL, rugby, and soccer.

The game is very athletic and nigh unto nonstop. You wouldn't be able to see this in most AFL highlight videos but if you watch three minutes of an actual game you'll see for yourself how it's contributed to Beige Magic's passing game.

It's hard-running, physically demanding, physical [tackling] and highly athletic.

[I believe that as young athletes, guys like Bogut, Baynes, and Thuggervedova all MAY have given up the Rules game because they didn't have the athleticism it takes to play the game. Money-wise they got lucky.]

The most important Rules contribution to Beige Magic's game, as he's said himself, is that Rules is ALL about reading and reacting under [constant] pressure, a lot of which is very physical [tackling].

Watch a couple, three minutes and you'll see how much distributing, decision-making and drawing defenders goes down Down Under.

This is an underappreciated part of Simmons' development and what he brings to the NBA game. While I am in no means an AFL expert, your point about the extreme speed and physicality of that game is on point. When Simmons takes the rebound and GOES, he does not give a crap about contact - he almost welcomes it. The fact that he is able to convert at such a high level at the rim (over 74%, IIRC), despite the constant contact he is dealing with, is almost assuredly in part a function of his Aussie Rules football experience.

He would have been a RIDICULOUS Aussie Rules footballer. Unstoppable.

ItsMyPotPie · Post #2648 » by **ItsMyPotPie** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 6:17 pm

It's Simmons to lose as mentioned many times before. Maybe we will look back at this draft class as one of the GOATs of draft classes

Unbreakable99 · Post #2649 » by **Unbreakable99** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 6:22 pm

pace31 wrote:This race is just about over IMO. Simmons has upped his game and Philly has been winning like crazy, I think it's pretty much sealed unless Donovan and the Jazz go on a crazy dramatic run to end the season with him putting up insane numbers.

The race has been over for the last 2 months. Mitchell could score 75 points in every game remaining and it still would not be a close race.

Post #2650 » by **Capn'O** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 6:38 pm

SmartWentCrazy wrote:Jackson feels like the next Rudy Gay to me. Very talented and incredibly athletic, but reverts too often to bad habbits and inefficient volume scoring.

Still, not a bust and will have a 10+ year career.

Moving this here since I locked the other one.

Maayyyybe offensively but his defensive potential and ability as a facilitator go well beyond what Gay had. He's got a chance to be a very solid two way player. I also wouldn't pigeonhole his tendencies yet. They need to get him a real coach.

Post #2651 » by **Capn'O** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 6:40 pm

pace31 wrote:This race is just about over IMO. Simmons has upped his game and Philly has been winning like crazy, I think it's pretty much sealed unless Donovan and the Jazz go on a crazy dramatic run to end the season with him putting up insane numbers.

I'd have to agree. Mitchell has had a hell of a rookie campaign though.

Unbreakable99 · Post #2652 » by **Unbreakable99** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 7:06 pm

Read on Twitter

commentatorer · Post #2653 » by **commentatorer** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 7:20 pm

theo42 wrote:
commentatorer wrote:Simmons has now won 3 games in a row without Embiid (Philly's last 2 games + the win over Miami in February).

I would argue 3.5 since Embiid missed most of the game he went out in.

Yes very true.

Sixersftw · Post #2654 » by **Sixersftw** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 7:52 pm

Capn'O wrote:
pace31 wrote:This race is just about over IMO. Simmons has upped his game and Philly has been winning like crazy, I think it's pretty much sealed unless Donovan and the Jazz go on a crazy dramatic run to end the season with him putting up insane numbers.

I'd have to agree. Mitchell has had a hell of a rookie campaign though.

Simmons is having one of the best Rookie seasons of all time. The fact that Mitchell even made it a conversation speaks to how good Donovan is/is going to be.

bebopdeluxe · Post #2655 » by **bebopdeluxe** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 8:04 pm

Sixersftw wrote:
Capn'O wrote:
pace31 wrote:This race is just about over IMO. Simmons has upped his game and Philly has been winning like crazy, I think it's pretty much sealed unless Donovan and the Jazz go on a crazy dramatic run to end the season with him putting up insane numbers.

I'd have to agree. Mitchell has had a hell of a rookie campaign though.

Simmons is having one of the best Rookie seasons of all time. The fact that Mitchell even made it a conversation speaks to how good Donovan is/is going to be.

Agree 100%.

BlackKnight · Post #2656 » by **BlackKnight** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 8:21 pm

Delete

Post #2657 » by **SmartWentCrazy** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 8:26 pm

Capn'O wrote:
SmartWentCrazy wrote:Jackson feels like the next Rudy Gay to me. Very talented and incredibly athletic, but reverts too often to bad habbits and inefficient volume scoring.

Still, not a bust and will have a 10+ year career.

Moving this here since I locked the other one.

Maayyyybe offensively but his defensive potential and ability as a facilitator go well beyond what Gay had. He's got a chance to be a very solid two way player. I also wouldn't pigeonhole his tendencies yet. They need to get him a real coach.

Rudy Gay was 6’9 with a 7’3 wingspan and elite athleticism — he had all the defensive tools in the world but couldnt put it together. Thus far, Jackson has not been a good defender either, despite his tools.

The biggest issue is coaching— for his sake, I hope Phoenix gets the right guy this offseason.

Kabookalu · Post #2658 » by **Kabookalu** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 9:38 pm

Unbreakable99 wrote:

Read on Twitter

I have no idea how OG Anunoby is 5th in offense here. The guy has been a deadweight for the Raptors on that end.

PhilBlackson · Post #2659 » by **PhilBlackson** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 10:30 pm

SmartWentCrazy wrote:Jackson feels like the next Rudy Gay to me. Very talented and incredibly athletic, but reverts too often to bad habbits and inefficient volume scoring.

Still, not a bust and will have a 10+ year career.

Jackson & Gay's style of play offensively are not alike.

Post #2660 » by **lebron stopper** » Mon Apr 2, 2018 10:40 pm

Kabookalu wrote:
Unbreakable99 wrote:

Read on Twitter

I have no idea how OG Anunoby is 5th in offense here. The guy has been a deadweight for the Raptors on that end.

Earlier this season he was a great cutter, spot up shooter, and passer. Still kind of is but he doesn't see many minutes these days. So I'm guessing that's where that came from.

Who wins? (May select 2 options.)