Official #2 Pick Thread - Ford #7: Parker

Post #2661 » by **paulpressey25** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:23 am

Was this Jabari Parker feature w/Grant Hill from earlier today already posted?

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_t ... arker.nba/

The only part that scares me about passing on Jabari is how grounded this guy is. It is hard to bet against guys like this, and his intangibles are pretty much everything the Bucks and this City have needed since Moncrief.

Baddy Chuck · Post #2662 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:24 am

Nowak008 wrote:
Baddy Chuck wrote:College competition is hardly a great judgement tool either.

Huh? It's not the end all be all, but I'd say its a pretty good tool.

Every year there's great college basketball players who never make it in the league and average players becoming very good players. I'm not saying none of it matters, but acting like it's leaps and bounds better of a judgement tool then another just isn't true. Otherwise guys like Kemba Walker, Shabazz Muhammad and Evan Turner would be running circles around the league.

breakchains · Post #2663 » by **breakchains** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:33 am

paulpressey25 wrote:Was this Jabari Parker feature w/Grant Hill from earlier today already posted?

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_t ... arker.nba/

The only part that scares me about passing on Jabari is how grounded this guy is. It is hard to bet against guys like this, and his intangibles are pretty much everything the Bucks and this City have needed since Moncrief.

Didn't see that, thanks for posting. The first thing I noticed was that he was significantly bigger than Hill. Also, as a Bucks fan, you have to love his answer to the draft question at the end.

I just wish we'd can Drew and get a real deal coach in here already. We will have two 19 year old players with the tools to be stars. We need them on the right track asap. They need to be coached up. Especially Jabari, so that we get him in the right habits right off the bat.

On_Wisconsin · Post #2664 » by **On_Wisconsin** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:40 am

I talked to someone today who has seen both Jabari and Wiggins play multiple times on the AAU circuit and is totally convinced Parker will be better. Says Wiggins has such great athleticism but doesn't have the skills he needs. He's about my age (16-17) but says Jabari will be so much better.

I respect his opinion, but think he's wrong. Just thought I'd give another opinion though.

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blazza18 · Post #2665 » by **blazza18** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:42 am

That Jabari interview was cool. Really likable dude. Seems to fit what we want as a face of the franchise guy more so than what' I've seen from the other guys.

Baddy Chuck · Post #2666 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:46 am

paulpressey25 wrote:Was this Jabari Parker feature w/Grant Hill from earlier today already posted?

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_t ... arker.nba/

The only part that scares me about passing on Jabari is how grounded this guy is. It is hard to bet against guys like this, and his intangibles are pretty much everything the Bucks and this City have needed since Moncrief.

"Definitely not" when asked if he wants to be the #1 pick. In some alternate universe Wise is spinning this 1000 ways how he won't go and shouldn't go #1 after Wiggins had said that.

Post #2667 » by **paulpressey25** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:47 am

blazza18 wrote:That Jabari interview was cool. Really likable dude. Seems to fit what we want as a face of the franchise guy more so than what' I've seen from the other guys.

That's where I get torn on this. When you look back at the great players, whether Bird, LeBron, Magic, Grant Hill, Duncan, etc, almost every one of them was a smart and driven leader. Jabari just screams that.

Then I think of the stress fracture in the foot and the hard fact that he's a tweener who may have many challenges on D.

Zeezprah · Post #2668 » by **Zeezprah** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:50 am

On_Wisconsin wrote:I talked to someone today who has seen both Jabari and Wiggins play multiple times on the AAU circuit and is totally convinced Parker will be better. Says Wiggins has such great athleticism but doesn't have the skills he needs. He's about my age (16-17) but says Jabari will be so much better.

I respect his opinion, but think he's wrong. Just thought I'd give another opinion though.

Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

i was 100% wiggins train, but i'm basically on the parker side at this point. wiggins has been a huge disappointment. no other way around it. 2-3 he was supposed to be the next lebron james. not lebron james-lite, he was supposed to be the next mega superstar. he still looks like he has the makings of a star, but more like a james harden type (not comparing the player, just the level).

i agree with your friend, the more and more i watch wiggins, the more i see the lack of skills. parker may not be the athlete wiggins is, but you see a basketball player much more in him than in wiggins.

i don't buy the bs parker's ceiling isn't as high or he doesn't have great athleticism. once nba trainers get ahold of that body, he'll be more than fine. in fact, if i was a trainer, i'd rather work with his body type than someone like giannis or henson where it's so hard to put good weight on.

i'm fully expecting parker to be the pick come draft day, and i'm definitely excited about it. trade ersan (one of the suns picks?) and plug parker in the 4 between larry and giannis and it'll be a lot of fun to watch. wolters at the 1, knight at the 2.

Zeezprah · Post #2669 » by **Zeezprah** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:52 am

paulpressey25 wrote:
blazza18 wrote:That Jabari interview was cool. Really likable dude. Seems to fit what we want as a face of the franchise guy more so than what' I've seen from the other guys.

That's where I get torn on this. When you look back at the great players, whether Bird, LeBron, Magic, Grant Hill, Duncan, etc, almost every one of them was a smart and driven leader. Jabari just screams that.

Then I think of the stress fracture in the foot and the hard fact that he's a tweener who may have many challenges on D.

this is another reason i've tipped the scale over to parker. parker just seems like one of the dudes that will be great for the culture we're trying to build. wiggins doesn't give off that same vibe, IMO.

come on over PP :wink:

breakchains · Post #2670 » by **breakchains** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:55 am

paulpressey25 wrote:
blazza18 wrote:That Jabari interview was cool. Really likable dude. Seems to fit what we want as a face of the franchise guy more so than what' I've seen from the other guys.

That's where I get torn on this. When you look back at the great players, whether Bird, LeBron, Magic, Grant Hill, Duncan, etc, almost every one of them was a smart and driven leader. Jabari just screams that.

This, combined with his actual tape, is what you need to be focused on. So many seem to be blinded by Wiggins' athleticism and make the enormous leap that it will translate into tangible basketball skill without really realizing that it is no guarantee at all that he will actually get there.

Wiggins isn't the only great athlete out there. Shoot, save for a few inches of height, LaVine is just as athletic, has a better shot, and a better handle. He (Lavine) strikes me as a bit of a tool, and may never put it all together, whereas Wiggins seems like a humble kid who has a better chance to do so, but the point remains that Wiggins' special athleticism doesn't necessarily mean that he has an unlimited ceiling, or that he has a great chance of getting to whatever ceiling you think he may have.

To me, the Parker/Wiggins debate is no more. I have Parker comfortably above Wiggins. Doesn't mean that Wiggins may not end up better.

Baddy Chuck · Post #2671 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 4:57 am

Zeezprah wrote:i was 100% wiggins train, but i'm basically on the parker side at this point. wiggins has been a huge disappointment. no other way around it. 2-3 he was supposed to be the next lebron james. not lebron james-lite, he was supposed to be the next mega superstar. he still looks like he has the makings of a star, but more like a james harden type (not comparing the player, just the level).

Anyone with those expectations would have been a disappointment. If Parker was hailed as Kevin Durant before the season, he'd have been a big disappointment. If Embiid was supposed to be Anthony Davis he'd have been a disappointment. If Wiggins had the fairly minimal amount of hype someone like Embiid had entering the season he'd still be a top 3 pick and probably viewed higher in a lot of peoples minds then he is now. Again, I have no problem who you have 1-2-3 but let's not act like Andrew Wiggins did nothing in his college basketball games.

Max Green · Post #2672 » by **Max Green** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:00 am

paulpressey25 wrote:Was this Jabari Parker feature w/Grant Hill from earlier today already posted?

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_t ... arker.nba/

The only part that scares me about passing on Jabari is how grounded this guy is. It is hard to bet against guys like this, and his intangibles are pretty much everything the Bucks and this City have needed since Moncrief.

Good find.

As to your point, he has all the tools of a Superstar this City can get behind and move our Franchise back into relevancy. It also doesn't hurt that he already has fans and ties with some of the great players from the past and in the game today. He's close with Wade and D. Rose, and Lebron, Kobe, Wade and a couple of other Heat players went to watch him play when Duke played Miami earlier in the season.

Zeezprah · Post #2673 » by **Zeezprah** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:01 am

Baddy Chuck wrote:
Zeezprah wrote:i was 100% wiggins train, but i'm basically on the parker side at this point. wiggins has been a huge disappointment. no other way around it. 2-3 he was supposed to be the next lebron james. not lebron james-lite, he was supposed to be the next mega superstar. he still looks like he has the makings of a star, but more like a james harden type (not comparing the player, just the level).

Anyone with those expectations would have been a disappointment. If Parker was hailed as Kevin Durant before the season, he'd have been a big disappointment. If Embiid was supposed to be Anthony Davis he'd have been a disappointment. If Wiggins had the fairly minimal amount of hype someone like Embiid had entering the season he'd still be a top 3 pick and probably viewed higher in a lot of peoples minds then he is now.

i know, i'm not saying they're fair, i'm just saying. he was NEXT. like he was supposed to be that superstar on lebron/durant level. the fact that we really didn't see any traits on that level kind of sucked.

breakchains · Post #2674 » by **breakchains** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:02 am

Baddy Chuck wrote: If Wiggins had the fairly minimal amount of hype someone like Embiid had entering the season he'd still be a top 3 pick and probably viewed higher in a lot of peoples minds then he is now.

I disagree with that. The prime example is that one of the main arguments you see from people is that "this is the guy people have been talking about for 2 years," or even posting his highschool highlights. I think people bought the hype on him, and a lot of them didn't actually evaluate the player with the new data (the college season). They looked at his raw numbers and figure that the hype was warranted.

Not saying everyone did that, and I'm not saying he's not a very intriguing prospect, but I don't think anyone would have him above Embiid (as many do now) if he wasn't named Andrew Wiggins but had the same exact tape and everything else that he had.

Baddy Chuck · Post #2675 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:04 am

breakchains wrote:Not saying everyone did that, and I'm not saying he's not a very intriguing prospect, but I don't think anyone would have him above Embiid (as many do now) if he wasn't named Andrew Wiggins but had the same exact tape and everything else that he had.

I don't think he'd be above Embiid either, I'm saying he'd certainly still be in that top tier of prospects and likely have a lot less of the unwarranted hate because he didn't become the LeBron people foolishly pegged him as. You got the new data, great. With that new data he's still a ridiculous player/prospect.

breakchains · Post #2676 » by **breakchains** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:06 am

I don't think there would be this big debate between him and Parker (which he seems to be the favorite in now), but do think he'd be the odds-on favorite to be the top guy of the next tier, with Exum probably.

Nowak008 · Post #2677 » by **Nowak008** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:08 am

paulpressey25 wrote:Was this Jabari Parker feature w/Grant Hill from earlier today already posted?

http://www.nba.com/video/channels/nba_t ... arker.nba/

The only part that scares me about passing on Jabari is how grounded this guy is. It is hard to bet against guys like this, and his intangibles are pretty much everything the Bucks and this City have needed since Moncrief.

Agreed. Grounded is a good way of describing him. When you are making such a high pick intangibles should matter more.

drew881 · Post #2678 » by **drew881** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:11 am

Max Green wrote:
As to your point, he has all the tools of a Superstar this City can get behind and move our Franchise back into relevancy. It also doesn't hurt that he already has fans and ties with some of the great players from the past and in the game today. He's close with Wade and D. Rose, and Lebron, Kobe, Wade and a couple of other Heat players went to watch him play when Duke played Miami earlier in the season.

Yet in the video he mentions twice that he needs to work on moves, and that he does not have a face up game. He says when he got the ball in college, that his instinct is to back a man down, but that now, he realizes he won't be able to do that. That worries me a bit.

I realize it is not something a Duke player would have (the face up game), as opposed to a Kentucky player, who does that on every possession, but I think Parkers game is going to have to change a decent amount for him to be successful.

Baddy Chuck · Post #2679 » by **Baddy Chuck** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:12 am

breakchains wrote:I don't think there would be this big debate between him and Parker (which he seems to be the favorite in now), but do think he'd be the odds-on favorite to be the top guy of the next tier, with Exum probably.

He'd certainly have been up there with Parker in discussions. He had a great freshman season overall and showed games with exceptional potential. After that last couple weeks he'd be the talk of the town in the prospect ranks rather than "well, where was that the rest of the reason". I think there's a ridiculous double standard between Parker and Wiggins. Parker wasn't consistent throughout the whole season and has areas where he certainly doesn't shine yet he's looked at almost exclusively by his end of the season production, usually even inflated by per 40, yet Wiggins is looked at for certain games and picked apart like none other. If Wiggins said he definitely did not want to be the first pick like Parker did in that interview he'd be torn apart saying he doesn't want it or he's just preparing for a fall on draft night. Parker does it and he's just this humble likable superstar.

breakchains · Post #2680 » by **breakchains** » Sun Jun 15, 2014 5:14 am

drew881 wrote:Yet in the video he mentions twice that he needs to work on moves, and that he does not have a face up game. He says when he got the ball in college, that his instinct is to back a man down, but that now, he realizes he won't be able to do that. That worries me a bit.

I realize it is not something a Duke player would have (the face up game), as opposed to a Kentucky player, who does that on every possession, but I think Parkers game is going to have to change a decent amount for him to be successful.

I look at his experience at Duke playing a lot in the post as a great thing. Most guys of his skill set and athletic ability like to camp out at the 3 point line and end up not developing a post game till later in their careers, despite having the size to take advantage of mismatches. Jabari already looks very comfortable in the post, despite having all kinds of skills away from the basket as well. He is just a natural ball player who on offense will have no weakness when it comes to scoring IMO.

Assuming Embiid goes #1, who is your guy at #2?