Warriors exploring S&T for Kuminga

[TB]

Just patiently waiting for Saric contract to be available mid September.

Keon, Carter, Saric for Kuminga (and maybe a pick headed their way)

For that deal to happen there would need to be more teams and salaries involved. If Sac is going to pay JK 21M, the max they can sending out those salaries, they'll end up over their 1st apron hard cap. Plus, the Warriors will end up hard-capped, which they really can't afford. Another minus, IMO, the Warriors end up with Saric.

Worth it for Keon imo. And Saric is well liked in our organization so no harm as an end of bench guy.

But ya, some additional work needed salary wise, but seems like both teams are open to that since they have been in talks recently.

[xdrta+]

Just patiently waiting for Saric contract to be available mid September.

Keon, Carter, Saric for Kuminga (and maybe a pick headed their way)

For that deal to happen there would need to be more teams and salaries involved. If Sac is going to pay JK 21M, the max they can sending out those salaries, they'll end up over their 1st apron hard cap. Plus, the Warriors will end up hard-capped, which they really can't afford. Another minus, IMO, the Warriors end up with Saric.

Worth it for Keon imo. And Saric is well liked in our organization so no harm as an end of bench guy.

But ya, some additional work needed salary wise, but seems like both teams are open to that since they have been in talks recently.

5.4M for an end of the bench guy, just because he's well-liked, when money and aprons are so tight...not my idea of good resource management. And it means more salary would have to go out from the Warriors to avoid a hard cap.

[TB]

For that deal to happen there would need to be more teams and salaries involved. If Sac is going to pay JK 21M, the max they can sending out those salaries, they'll end up over their 1st apron hard cap. Plus, the Warriors will end up hard-capped, which they really can't afford. Another minus, IMO, the Warriors end up with Saric.

Worth it for Keon imo. And Saric is well liked in our organization so no harm as an end of bench guy.

But ya, some additional work needed salary wise, but seems like both teams are open to that since they have been in talks recently.

5.4M for an end of the bench guy, just because he's well-liked, when money and aprons are so tight...not my idea of good resource management. And it means more salary would have to go out from the Warriors to avoid a hard cap.

Fair, but if it gets Keon Ellis on this team you find a way to do it. He’s a perfect fit.

[watch1958]

There were several missteps with JK. To me, the worst was season 2. By mid season it was clear that the team was floundering. Klay never had his head together, Draymond and Poole had melted down and Wiggins had his crisis. By mid February at the latest they should have switched gears.

For the last few months, JK should have been playing 30+ minutes each game, even if it cost them some wins, or even kept them out of the playoffs.

What would be different? You are misdiagnosing the problem.

It might have clarified for th FO what they had (and didn’t have), and buffed his shiny object value for an early trade.

[Onus]

There were several missteps with JK. To me, the worst was season 2. By mid season it was clear that the team was floundering. Klay never had his head together, Draymond and Poole had melted down and Wiggins had his crisis. By mid February at the latest they should have switched gears.

For the last few months, JK should have been playing 30+ minutes each game, even if it cost them some wins, or even kept them out of the playoffs.

What would be different? You are misdiagnosing the problem.

It might have clarified for th FO what they had (and didn’t have), and buffed his shiny object value for an early trade.

Think the front office is clear. The owner on the other hand …

[vvoland]

Worth it for Keon imo. And Saric is well liked in our organization so no harm as an end of bench guy.

But ya, some additional work needed salary wise, but seems like both teams are open to that since they have been in talks recently.

5.4M for an end of the bench guy, just because he's well-liked, when money and aprons are so tight...not my idea of good resource management. And it means more salary would have to go out from the Warriors to avoid a hard cap.

Fair, but if it gets Keon Ellis on this team you find a way to do it. He’s a perfect fit.

Let's not get carried away. He's good and better than I thought. He's not a perfect fit. We need forwards and guys that can create offense (for themselvss or others). He's neither a forward (on defense) nor a createor. He's a lot of other things we need but we have a logjam at the combo guard spot and a number of folks that can't guard forwards (steph, podz, buddy) and more we're, allegedly, bringing in (seth, melton) and a few i'd rather not see do it (moody & gui).

Sure, he'd help us at POA and spot up shooting. If we get the players we're rumored to get, I don't think the spot up shooting will be that necessary. Horford, Seth, Melton, Buddy, Podz, Moody, Post, & Steph give us 8 players that are KNOCK DOWN catch and shoot threats. To be honest, I'm mostly fine with Moody and Podz as the POA in most lineups. JK as the on-ball defender against big ball handlers (luka, JT, Lamelo) and moody/podz on smaller lead guards and I don't think we'll have much trouble defending when Jimmy, Dray, and big Al are all playing behind them.

We were the best defense in the league, after the JB trade (or top 2?), and that was without anyone over 6'6 that could defend. a 6'10 center, even at 40, will be a huge change of pace. One that can shoot can be an actual difference maker.

[whatisacenter]

There were several missteps with JK. To me, the worst was season 2. By mid season it was clear that the team was floundering. Klay never had his head together, Draymond and Poole had melted down and Wiggins had his crisis. By mid February at the latest they should have switched gears.

For the last few months, JK should have been playing 30+ minutes each game, even if it cost them some wins, or even kept them out of the playoffs.

What would be different? You are misdiagnosing the problem.

It might have clarified for th FO what they had (and didn’t have), and buffed his shiny object value for an early trade.

Yeah, the Warriors put themselves into this position by the way they have handled Jk since the end of the '23 season. He had filled in for Wiggins while he was on sabbatical and played pretty well helping the Warriors secure the 6th seed. Then once the playoffs started they went back to Wiggins and had JK on a super short leash.

Jonathan Kuminga benefitted from increased playing time in March, averaging a career-best 14.2 points on 59.5 percent from the field and 44.1 percent from three.

Kuminga averaged double-digit points for four consecutive months to end the regular season before seeing his minutes significantly reduce in the postseason. After playing 67 games (16 starts) and 20.8 minutes per game in the regular season, he played in 10 playoff games (zero starts) and played 6.1 minutes per game in the postseason.

The time to trade JK was after the season was over and they had decided to stick with Draymond by giving him an extension. Instead JK has had his role and playing time jerked around for the past two seasons and are now stuck with a RFA who doesn't want to be on the team and no good avenues for getting value back for him.

I like what Houston did with Whitmore by sending him out when they realized there was not going to be a defined role and minutes for him to develop.

[EvanZ]

5.4M for an end of the bench guy, just because he's well-liked, when money and aprons are so tight...not my idea of good resource management. And it means more salary would have to go out from the Warriors to avoid a hard cap.

Fair, but if it gets Keon Ellis on this team you find a way to do it. He’s a perfect fit.

Let's not get carried away. He's good and better than I thought. He's not a perfect fit. We need forwards and guys that can create offense (for themselvss or others). He's neither a forward (on defense) nor a createor. He's a lot of other things we need but we have a logjam at the combo guard spot and a number of folks that can't guard forwards (steph, podz, buddy) and more we're, allegedly, bringing in (seth, melton) and a few i'd rather not see do it (moody & gui).

Sure, he'd help us at POA and spot up shooting. If we get the players we're rumored to get, I don't think the spot up shooting will be that necessary. Horford, Seth, Melton, Buddy, Podz, Moody, Post, & Steph give us 8 players that are KNOCK DOWN catch and shoot threats. To be honest, I'm mostly fine with Moody and Podz as the POA in most lineups. JK as the on-ball defender against big ball handlers (luka, JT, Lamelo) and moody/podz on smaller lead guards and I don't think we'll have much trouble defending when Jimmy, Dray, and big Al are all playing behind them.

We were the best defense in the league, after the JB trade (or top 2?), and that was without anyone over 6'6 that could defend. a 6'10 center, even at 40, will be a huge change of pace. One that can shoot can be an actual difference maker.

Imagine going into the season thinking we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis.

[vvoland]

Fair, but if it gets Keon Ellis on this team you find a way to do it. He’s a perfect fit.

Let's not get carried away. He's good and better than I thought. He's not a perfect fit. We need forwards and guys that can create offense (for themselvss or others). He's neither a forward (on defense) nor a createor. He's a lot of other things we need but we have a logjam at the combo guard spot and a number of folks that can't guard forwards (steph, podz, buddy) and more we're, allegedly, bringing in (seth, melton) and a few i'd rather not see do it (moody & gui).

Sure, he'd help us at POA and spot up shooting. If we get the players we're rumored to get, I don't think the spot up shooting will be that necessary. Horford, Seth, Melton, Buddy, Podz, Moody, Post, & Steph give us 8 players that are KNOCK DOWN catch and shoot threats. To be honest, I'm mostly fine with Moody and Podz as the POA in most lineups. JK as the on-ball defender against big ball handlers (luka, JT, Lamelo) and moody/podz on smaller lead guards and I don't think we'll have much trouble defending when Jimmy, Dray, and big Al are all playing behind them.

We were the best defense in the league, after the JB trade (or top 2?), and that was without anyone over 6'6 that could defend. a 6'10 center, even at 40, will be a huge change of pace. One that can shoot can be an actual difference maker.

Imagine going into the season thinking we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis.

Imagine having such a hard time with reading comprehension. Seth was one of 8 players I listed, all of whom are very good to great shooters and all you took from that is, "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis." Just for your own sanity, I would prefer Keon to Seth, sure. That's not how real life works or what we were discussing above.

Keep constructing strawmen to attack. Instead of having an actual conversation, you choose to try and 'win' some type of pisssssing contest; one that you made up in your own mind. Be better. If you can't, let the adults talk and stfu.

[vvoland]

A co-worker from Chi tells me that the local nbc affiliate's beat reporter is saying JG will sign something in the 4 year, 20M/yr, range. IF true, sucks for chicago fans and decent people but should get the ball rolling for the other RFAs.

[statsman]

A co-worker from Chi tells me that the local nbc affiliate's beat reporter is saying JG will sign something in the 4 year, 20M/yr, range. IF true, sucks for chicago fans and decent people but should get the ball rolling for the other RFAs.

Why would that suck for Bulls fans? I get that it may suck for Giddey. Now, *if* it starts at $20M, that would be about 4/90 with 8% raises.

[EvanZ]

Let's not get carried away. He's good and better than I thought. He's not a perfect fit. We need forwards and guys that can create offense (for themselvss or others). He's neither a forward (on defense) nor a createor. He's a lot of other things we need but we have a logjam at the combo guard spot and a number of folks that can't guard forwards (steph, podz, buddy) and more we're, allegedly, bringing in (seth, melton) and a few i'd rather not see do it (moody & gui).

Sure, he'd help us at POA and spot up shooting. If we get the players we're rumored to get, I don't think the spot up shooting will be that necessary. Horford, Seth, Melton, Buddy, Podz, Moody, Post, & Steph give us 8 players that are KNOCK DOWN catch and shoot threats. To be honest, I'm mostly fine with Moody and Podz as the POA in most lineups. JK as the on-ball defender against big ball handlers (luka, JT, Lamelo) and moody/podz on smaller lead guards and I don't think we'll have much trouble defending when Jimmy, Dray, and big Al are all playing behind them.

We were the best defense in the league, after the JB trade (or top 2?), and that was without anyone over 6'6 that could defend. a 6'10 center, even at 40, will be a huge change of pace. One that can shoot can be an actual difference maker.

Imagine going into the season thinking we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis.

Imagine having such a hard time with reading comprehension. Seth was one of 8 players I listed, all of whom are very good to great shooters and all you took from that is, "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis." Just for your own sanity, I would prefer Keon to Seth, sure. That's not how real life works or what we were discussing above.

Keep constructing strawmen to attack. Instead of having an actual conversation, you choose to try and 'win' some type of pisssssing contest; one that you made up in your own mind. Be better. If you can't, let the adults talk and stfu.

Literally just reading the words you wrote bro. If you don't want people to read your words, stop writing them.

[EvanZ]

A co-worker from Chi tells me that the local nbc affiliate's beat reporter is saying JG will sign something in the 4 year, 20M/yr, range. IF true, sucks for chicago fans and decent people but should get the ball rolling for the other RFAs.

Why would that suck for Bulls fans? I get that it may suck for Giddey. Now, *if* it starts at $20M, that would be about 4/90 with 8% raises.

Because vvoland has this insane notion that Giddey is a pedophile. Because you know HE HAS DAUGHTERS.

As to the deal terms, they seem very reasonable if true.

[xdrta+]

Worth it for Keon imo. And Saric is well liked in our organization so no harm as an end of bench guy.

But ya, some additional work needed salary wise, but seems like both teams are open to that since they have been in talks recently.

5.4M for an end of the bench guy, just because he's well-liked, when money and aprons are so tight...not my idea of good resource management. And it means more salary would have to go out from the Warriors to avoid a hard cap.

Fair, but if it gets Keon Ellis on this team you find a way to do it. He’s a perfect fit.

You can't just pull "a way to do it" out of thin air. We have access to the same rules and constraints that the FO does, so if there's a way to do it someone should be able to construct a deal that works for both sides. So far I haven't seen anyone come close. I've seen a lot of "we need to get this guy" but never a workable deal.

[vvoland]

Imagine going into the season thinking we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis.

Imagine having such a hard time with reading comprehension. Seth was one of 8 players I listed, all of whom are very good to great shooters and all you took from that is, "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis." Just for your own sanity, I would prefer Keon to Seth, sure. That's not how real life works or what we were discussing above.

Keep constructing strawmen to attack. Instead of having an actual conversation, you choose to try and 'win' some type of pisssssing contest; one that you made up in your own mind. Be better. If you can't, let the adults talk and stfu.

Literally just reading the words you wrote bro. If you don't want people to read your words, stop writing them.

quote where I wrote "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis" and you won't read another word from me.

[vvoland]

A co-worker from Chi tells me that the local nbc affiliate's beat reporter is saying JG will sign something in the 4 year, 20M/yr, range. IF true, sucks for chicago fans and decent people but should get the ball rolling for the other RFAs.

Why would that suck for Bulls fans? I get that it may suck for Giddey. Now, *if* it starts at $20M, that would be about 4/90 with 8% raises.

Because vvoland has this insane notion that Giddey is a pedophile. Because you know HE HAS DAUGHTERS.

As to the deal terms, they seem very reasonable if true.

I can't believe you decided to double down on this, AGAIN.

Yes, Giddey IS a pedophile. Not because I have daughters but because, as a 21 year old, he had an multi-month sexual relationship with a 15 year old. Oh, i'm sorry, he's not a pedophile because the child in question may have had physical features that made her look like less of a child (i'm actually not sure since I never saw a picture but Evan seems certain). So yes, JG isn't a pedophile in the strict dictionary definition. He's a child rapist.

Keep defending all of this stuff, Evan, and you will only make yourself look worse than you already have, you feeble-minded gout survivor.

[whatisacenter]

Imagine having such a hard time with reading comprehension. Seth was one of 8 players I listed, all of whom are very good to great shooters and all you took from that is, "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis." Just for your own sanity, I would prefer Keon to Seth, sure. That's not how real life works or what we were discussing above.

Keep constructing strawmen to attack. Instead of having an actual conversation, you choose to try and 'win' some type of pisssssing contest; one that you made up in your own mind. Be better. If you can't, let the adults talk and stfu.

Literally just reading the words you wrote bro. If you don't want people to read your words, stop writing them.

quote where I wrote "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis" and you won't read another word from me.

Don’t waste your time.

Some people are here just to feel like they are the smartest guy in the room and not for discussion….unless of course you already agree with them.

[vvoland]

Literally just reading the words you wrote bro. If you don't want people to read your words, stop writing them.

quote where I wrote "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis" and you won't read another word from me.

Don’t waste your time.

Some people are here just to feel like they are the smartest guy in the room and not for discussion….unless of course you already agree with them.

I really appreciated the stuff CDM brought to this board, the advanced stats, nuanced takes, etc. He was, however, extremely condescending and impatient. As a result, once he left the board, the level of discourse actually rose and I felt like posters were more respectful and patient. With a few minor exceptions and despite the loss of, objectively, good content, I think the board is in a better place.

Evan is like a off-brand version of CDM. None of the valuable takes & data CDM brought but with all of the arrogance and condescension. Topped with an obsession with defending pedophilia and child rape. Once he says something heinous enough to get booted by the moderators, the board will be a much healthier place. I clearly disagree with most of the posters here but, for the most part, we find a way to do so in an adult manner. Plus, none of them defend raping children.

[vvoland]

Literally just reading the words you wrote bro. If you don't want people to read your words, stop writing them.

quote where I wrote "we are better off relying on 35-year old Seth Curry than Keon Ellis" and you won't read another word from me.

Don’t waste your time.

Some people are here just to feel like they are the smartest guy in the room and not for discussion….unless of course you already agree with them.

Oh, and I actually agree with him on Keon (to an extent, clearly) and actually gave him props in this thread, for opening my eyes to a player that's much better than I thought. So no, I don't even think "agreeing" is enough.

[Larry Ellison]

What would be different? You are misdiagnosing the problem.

It might have clarified for th FO what they had (and didn’t have), and buffed his shiny object value for an early trade.

Yeah, the Warriors put themselves into this position by the way they have handled Jk since the end of the '23 season. He had filled in for Wiggins while he was on sabbatical and played pretty well helping the Warriors secure the 6th seed. Then once the playoffs started they went back to Wiggins and had JK on a super short leash.

Jonathan Kuminga benefitted from increased playing time in March, averaging a career-best 14.2 points on 59.5 percent from the field and 44.1 percent from three.

Kuminga averaged double-digit points for four consecutive months to end the regular season before seeing his minutes significantly reduce in the postseason. After playing 67 games (16 starts) and 20.8 minutes per game in the regular season, he played in 10 playoff games (zero starts) and played 6.1 minutes per game in the postseason.

The time to trade JK was after the season was over and they had decided to stick with Draymond by giving him an extension. Instead JK has had his role and playing time jerked around for the past two seasons and are now stuck with a RFA who doesn't want to be on the team and no good avenues for getting value back for him.

I like what Houston did with Whitmore by sending him out when they realized there was not going to be a defined role and minutes for him to develop.

To be fair, I think trading JK wasn't as obvious a move at those earlier points in time, even if he would have had more value. There was still hope JK could improve. The team tried playing a frontcourt of Dray-JK-Wiggins and it had some success. It was the trade for Butler that made JK expendable. They play the same position. There is no question JK's value is at its lowest point right now.