***Official 2021-22 Offseason Thread***

[GTR11]

Not posted but the Brooklyn Nets deferred the first rd pick of the 76ers this year into next year.

I was for keeping it but after awhile, I'm ok with holding on for a better possible landing spot. But then I hear about it being used as a trade asset and that really puts me down. Ever since we traded our first for stupid Shamet (then our soul for Harden), I felt it's been one major damage after another with additions and trades...

There hasn't been any improvement.

Yet, where is all the money going to? KD has it and justifiably but where is the rest? Like if Ky leaves one would automatically think we have cap space but no, not the case....

I didn't want to pick this year simply because we have no clue who our coaches are and which direction we going.

Trading pick for what or who? LA rumors died quick and no leaks happening. Instead we actively hiring development coaches with experience. I don't see that pick being traded. However I can be wrong. We got two first round picks coming our way next year.

[GTR11]

Wrong tweet. Seem to be that guy deleted it. I'll post different ones later.

After watching some Lakers videos and evaluating how it can fit here. I'm ok with bringing Handi here. He actually alright with X's and O's even though that's not his strongest suit.

[MrDollarBills]

Read on Twitter

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[Eatgreenz]

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If we are keeping this moron Nash. Time to stock up on top assistant to handle strategy and x and o's. Only way if we are serious about winning.

[3pt_chucker]

We don't know yet what he'll be doing but I think it's a good hire on the surface. Tons of experience and has a great relationship with Nash.

Hopefully someone like Borrego or Handy is brought in as well. Nash needs all the help he can get.

[gigantes]

We don't know yet what he'll be doing but I think it's a good hire on the surface. Tons of experience and has a great relationship with Nash.

Hopefully someone like Borrego or Handy is brought in as well. Nash needs all the help he can get.

Man, I'm glad that you mentioned Handey in particular!

[MGrand15]

Well Kokoskov is supposed to be a really good and creative offensive coach. He didn't last in Phoenix because apparently the cultural divide made it difficult for players to relate to him. Something like that. It was weird. But they ran good stuff and his teams have always had good offenses with limited talent. This is a good hire.

Phil Handy gives me mixed feelings. I think he's really good but he's also 1000% a Kyrie guy. Last year I woulda been all for it. This year I'd hesitate. I do think he'd bring the kind of fire that our coaching staff lost when Udoka left tho.

[NyCeEvO]

Not posted but the Brooklyn Nets deferred the first rd pick of the 76ers this year into next year.

I was for keeping it but after awhile, I'm ok with holding on for a better possible landing spot. But then I hear about it being used as a trade asset and that really puts me down. Ever since we traded our first for stupid Shamet (then our soul for Harden), I felt it's been one major damage after another with additions and trades...

There hasn't been any improvement.

Yet, where is all the money going to? KD has it and justifiably but where is the rest? Like if Ky leaves one would automatically think we have cap space but no, not the case....

If we’re sticking with our core players, we need win-now players over developmental projects.

If trading our first can be used to acquire a solid rotation piece that Nash will use in the playoffs, it could be the difference between us going deep into the playoffs or flaming out like we did his year.

[BRO klyn]

Now that the dusts has settled, the weather is nice and some of the emotions of last season has faded I figure its a good time to look forward and not backward for the upcoming season...

To me, you keep the core together. At least until the halfway mark. Doing anything else just doesn't make sense. You would be selling low on Kyrie/Simmons, you would be creating animosity with Durant and maybe moving on from him after he committed to us. Bad returns and bad look as a franchise that will look to be a star destination in perpetuity.

Kyrie Irving: Obviously Kyrie is a powder keg for Fans, media, and hot takes. But the unemotional approach is pretty simple. Kyrie is a 30 year old, in prime, elite offensive player. I think all the circus around him (good, bad, deserved, unfair, indifferent) muddies the water a bit. He is a 6'3" Kobe. His lack of availability and the drama of the past 3 years not just for this team but for this country/world realy make it easy to gloss over that he had (by far?) the best offensive season in team history and one of the most efficient all time. Guys who score 27+ points on 50/40/90 are unicorns to themselves. that list is short: Kyrie, Larry Legend, Curry, and KD.

Great scorers get mislabeled as elite scorers too often. Beal is not an elite scorer. 30 a game, solid efficiency. what separates the beals from the Kyries, the Kobes is that guys like Kyrie cook everyone. Great defenders, great defenses, big games, etc. If we move Kyrie, we arent replacing him with anything near as impactful, even if we got a beal or a mitchell, which even then is unlikely.

You want Kyrie available. So i get like playing some hardball. but at the end of the day, you have to bring him back. maybe its 3 years instead of 4. maybe its not quite the max. but you do it, and you dont walk away if you need to give more then you would like. Marks is saying the right things, but you still need stars and especially offensive stars.

Kyrie missed more then half a year. Many (you can argue justifiably) said he was selfish. but selfish or not, it took a once a century global pandemic for him to miss those games. his availability out side of emergency mandates for global Armageddons is overblown. He missed single-digit games to personal reasons the year prior, played more then any star (harden/KD) and was great in the playoffs. We were taking it to the bucks until his injury. Had the pandemic/mandates not come down in NYC we are probably looking at another 55-60 game season from him and much more team success.

Mandates aside, and looking at this career history, he isn't really a big threat to miss many games for non-injury reasons. your taking about less then 20 games missed to "personal" reasons with a handfull of those being reasonable things we dont bash other guys for (His kids birth, Kobe's death, his tribe initiation). His injury risk FAR outweighs his "personal reasons" risk of missing games. his size + ability to get to the rim and how many times he hits the floor is much more of a concern. but again, the alternative is not better.

I dont buy the stuff about not being committed. you dont get to his level of skill or come back from missing half a year to drop 60 points if you are not committed. Its really bad Nets luck. one of like 3 states to have a mandate.

Bring him back. hopefully 3 years or with incentives, but bring him back. His value wont get (much lower) then it currently is. we are basically close to the floor for Kyrie for team success/and trade value. having him play one or both of those up makes sense. the risk is low given the cap restrictions if we moved on from him.

[BRO klyn]

Ben Simmons: Like Kyrie, it makes no sense to sell so low on him. his value could go lower, but its already in the bottom 20% of what it could be. the ability to raise team success/trade value has a much higher probability then his value going to 0. I also think you cant move him without him playing at least a few games to see what this big 3 looks like.

Ben/Kyrie/KD from an injury perspective scares me. but you still have to give it 1/2 to a full season to see what it looks like.

I think Ben has been criminally slandered from an on-court perspective. Too much anecdotal stuff on one play where he didnt take the open shot and his awful FT collapse and not enough focus on his 48 minute play. An argument can be made that during their tenure together Embiid was the bigger issue with regards to their playoff success.

14 points, 9 assists, 8 rebounds, 1.5 steals, 1 block on 58TS%

That is Ben Simmons CAREER playoff stats. For all the "he cant shoot threes" for all the missed free throws for all the "mental midget" stuff he has the same scoring efficiency in the playoffs as Embiid (or close, 57.7 for Ben and 58.2 for Embiid). This is not to make an argument that Simmons is better then Embiid. he is not. it is to point out how anecdotal the media coverage and perception of Simmons in the playoffs has been.

Durability and momentum is really all the Nets need from simmons. Like Kyrie i think the bigger concern is injuries not the media narrative of Narcissism/selfish/team culture/mental stuff. Ben on the floor gives you great defense and elite role play on both ends and in transition.

Team success on that comes down to health and coaching (which is also a huge question mark) as well as luck.

You get those 3 healthy for a 25-30 game stretch and its likely a .700+ stretch of winning and some strong momentum and confidence. similar to what we saw with Kyrie/Harden a year prior to this past one.

Team would be smart to insulate Simmons and get him on the floor on his timeline. publicly push back against any ideas the team is frustrated with his availability which i dont think the team has done very well with to this point. I know Woj is a marks mouthpiece but for these things you need to hear from the team. even if you are frustrated it is in the teams best interest to come out and say we are committed to Ben, we are happy he is here, and we are happy with however long it takes for him to return to play.

[BRO klyn]

Sean Marks: Marks has a tough hand. A bunch of aces and wildcards but also alot of bent 2s and 4s. At the same time, I think he is at the point where all the hands he won the last few years dont matter cause the last couple seasons drained his chip stack. in Short, moving forward Marks needs to be most accountable for the teams success. If we dont get it done, its on him or a big part on him....

I liked the moves last offseason. They made sense. We added toughness, we added shooting, we added defense. The problem was when those guys didnt pan out (Carter), the coach couldnt figure out how to properly integrate them (Milsap/Johnson/Blake), or injuries hit (Joe) Marks did nothing to stop the bleeding and add pieces to supplement them. We were screaming for wing shooting and Marks did nothing. not an end of the bench guy, not a 10-day. We needed a Max Strus or a Lance Stevenson or someone to provide shooting or a spark during a stretch where Duke Jr. was starting.

Looking forward though, Marks has work to do.

1. Needs to add coaches who can coach. Realistically we all know Nash needs to be fired. but it is clear that wont happen going into the year. So I love the Phil Handy/James Borrego talk. Those guys can coach. And this team needs a coach. Nash is not a coach. he is manager. Like the Ted Lasso of this team as opposed to the coach beard. He isnt going to make adjustments in game. he isnt going to make adjustments between game and he isnt going to develop players. he is a glorified guidance counselor... which you need on a team of stars. but once D'antoni/Ime left, it was clear this team was at a massive disadvantage on game days.

2. We need to add wings. alot of focus on "3 & D" wings but really we just need wings. we dont have any. Brown isnt really a wing, he is a weird tweener hybrid. he is the closest we have. its basically Brown, Kesller, Joe. Thats not enough. you need 6 wings on any team, with at least 4 or 5 who can play big minutes. we have too many PFs who need to be centers and too many SFs who are really just specialists. Ben helps alot if he can see the floor. but we need reliable bodies there. I though Bembry was an underrated loss, cause even though he was a bit shorter he could play wing on both ends with his athleticism. We all missed Jeff Green and while on paper Milsap was a decent replacement he cant play the wing, he was more F/C then he was wing. same with Johnson.

Forget about flaws. obviously we need guys who can shoot and defend. everyone does. but get a few stanley johnsons or troy brown jrs or Cody Martins. Those guys have flaws but they can play the position. you cant have 6'1" mills or milsap/Johsnon playing SF for tons of games and minutes. any flaws guys like Johnson or Martin have are made up by being guys in the 6'5-6'7" range who are strong/athletic and dont get you killed in transition or on switches. I love Mills but i'd let him walk for someone like Martin in a second if it required part of the MLE.

2. Solving the Bigs. we have too many that are not centers. LMA is a PF. he makes no sense at center since he dosnt protect the rim and his range doesnt go out to the 3PT line. this team did an awful job. Like brook lopez, he should be converted taking nothing but threes when he takes a jump shot. We encouraged him to take mid range. he can hit them at 60%. it doesnt matter. it doesnt space the floor and your better off with KD or Kyrie taking a shot. and you dont get rim protection or switching.

Blake was great the year prior. his 3PT shooting falling off killed us but Nash's handling of him was worse. Blake provided rim protection in the form of taking charges and gained possessions with hustle plays. good screener and high IQ and somewhat switchable. most importantly, we he played we had alot of team success. Claxton getting Blakes starting role was somewhat justifiable but Blake sitting for LMA was awful and Blake being a DNP even with Drummond here was unwise.

3. This team needs 3 centers. Keep claxton. From there we need a guy who can stretch the floor and another guy who has size. We need something like Claxton/Dedmond/mcGee. Get some real size. some real shot blocking. and someone who can knock down a 3. I know Hartenstein is name out there guys like. he is a legit 7 feet, loved him coming into the draft. has the tools to become a long range shooter. but id pass. we cant afford him and claxton, 2 guys you cant rely on to stay healthy. And i LOVE hartenstein as a competitor. i wouldnt hate it, but its a mistake. you can get more games and similar skill set cheaper without going into the MLE.

4. PG. LOVE the news Mike James wants a reunion. that guy plays with confidence, can shoot, and is fearless. he can run the offense. It allows Kyrie to play SG at all times whether Ben is on the floor or not. It makes KD an off ball guy you run plays for, not someone who turns it over trying to be a playmaker. (KD being a turnover machine is quietly one of the biggest failures of this team. it was quite obvious from early on that he couldnt handle double teams and struggled a ton with pressure as an offense creator. the team should have used his immense gravity to open things up for others and make him someone who moves around and attacks as soon as he catches it. instead we made him easy to guard by posting him up on the baseline which is easy to trap. we never ran him off multiple off ball screens above the three point line. our pin down screens we did run for a quick long 2 where very successful. hopefully the new assistants can help with that. but if we can get james, that makes it easier for nash as it requires less smarts/strategy and more just getting the lineups right.

5. young guys and picks. Love that we defered the pick. the pick is worth more as an asset that whoever we drafted who wouldnt have helped. I'd like to trade cam thomas for draft stock as well. He isnt going to become a defender, reliable 3 point shooter, or big contributor before he is eligible for an extension. so its better value to trade him for picks. picks could help us aquire a better player or draft a younger thomas later on a rookie deal. I know i will take heat for this but Thomas wont be in a playoff rotation soon. it does not make sense to have him on the roster. we are better off hoping a cheaper option like edwards who has a more reliable shot can contrinute to a shot 8 or 9 man rotation. Day'ron likely has no value, so moving him makes no sense. I'd give him reps in long island. he needs to do nothing but shoot threes from now until 2023. if he cant hit threes at 35% by next year, his value is low to us.

My ideal offseason is something like:
-Extend Kyrie with some concession from him (maybe 3 years, maybe team option, maybe incentives)
-Bring back Mike James
-Sign Cody Martin to all or part of the taxpayer MLE
-bring back Mills on his option or a similar deal if you can, otherwise sadly part ways
-Trade Cam for a future first
-Sign Alize Johnson
-Re-sign Bruce Brown (Tax is caculated at years end, could sell him off if its ugly at the deadline,e he has value)
-Re-sign Claxton
-Sign Naz reid
-look into trading for mo bamba. his 3 showed improvment, he has the wingspan to block shots. Cam + pick if it works.
-look into muscala, mo wagner, or even aaron baynes (could he be healthy enough for a return?) as stretch 5 options.
-reunite with bembry. trade/signing should be cheap with him returning. he was a great team guy

Ben | Mike James
Kyrie | Curry | Nembry
Harris | Martin | Alize Johnson
KD | Brown | Kessler
Claxton | Reid/Muscala | Bamba or a true 7-footer

Give me vet minimums on another vet PG and a PF with is 6'8" or bigger.

[BRO klyn]

Steve Nash: Not going to harp on it. We all know he should not be a head coach, skipped the line, embarrassingly underperformed and got massively outcoached by his former asssitant. He should never have been coach and should have long ago been given his pink slip.

Now that that is out of the way and reality is he will be back, lets fix it forward.

I really struggle to find the best role for nash. We know he isnt an in-game guy, a guy who will adjust, a guy who will watch film, or a guy who will implement strategic changes. which is ok. Long 2 years ago, we can bring in assistants who do that (Handy? Borrego?)....

That leaves nash being a manager of egos/players or nash being a PR savant.

my issue is, i dont think he does those things very well either. Other then KD really liking him what has he done from a management standpoint? He didnt get Harden to play hard, to ride it out, or to stay. He didnt get Kyrie to change his stance or manage the Kyrie thing once Kyrie was back to integrate it smoothly. He didnt get simmons on the floor. He didnt manage the blake thing well. he didnt manage the kessler thing well. Some of those were hard, but if your the highest paid coach in the league, and all you do is manage players/egos, you need to do better in my mind. like sure no one was going to get Kyrie to get the shot, but you could have made that better. have kyrie saying the right things and showing the right things. have harden not fly to strip clubs in vegas between teams. not let a team guy like blake end up hating you.

Then the PR thing... does he handle that well? we get lies where he is prove wrong constantly ("Harden wont be traded, Joe is close, Ben is ramping up closer to playing, there is no issue with player "X"). After games he deflects all blame and puts it on the players. he makes tons of excuses like injuries and the pandemic...

A good PR person is transpearant with the hard stuff ("I dont know with James, its not perfect but we want him here") doesnt throw their guys under the bus (His effort wasnt his best, but we didnt coach it well, we all could have done better, we will get back at that next game) and doesnt lean on excuses (We have guys out, important guys but so does everyone, the team we just lost to is without Kawhi, George... it is about next man up and overcoming adversity)... i just feel like if your coach is a dishonest excuse maker, that trickles down to the players.

For me, Nash really just needs to be a puppet. let Borrego do the coaching, let Handy handle the egos and management, and bring in some PR savant who can coach nash what to say in the post game.

it looks like thats the plan, hopefully it is

[TheNetsFan]

https://nypost.com/2022/06/06/all-signs-pointing-to-kyrie-irving-returning-to-nets/

Good read if you are interested in potential Kyrie contract structures.

Bobby Marks throws out 2 scenarios, both for 3 year deals. One would give him the potential to earn a max deal, with 15% of the total salary in games played incentives (60+ or 65+). The other would be for max salary, but year 3 only gets guaranteed if he plays 65+ games in each of the next 2 seasons. Personally, I think it should be both. His guaranteed salary should stay around his current option value, and he can get up to the max if he plays 60+ games. Same for year 2. Activate Year 3 if he plays 65+ games both years.

I've been advocating for having him expire with Harris, but if he plays 65+ games, he will have rehabbed some trade value by alleviating some of the availability concerns.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Good on Marks for playing hardball with Kyrie.

We need to reign him in. Hopefully he proves this season that he is committed and him, KD and Simmons get a full season together.

[MrDollarBills]

Good on Marks for playing hardball with Kyrie.

We need to reign him in. Hopefully he proves this season that he is committed and him, KD and Simmons get a full season together.

The fact that Kyrie would even think he deserves a max contract after everything that he's done is a complete lack of self awareness, but whatever. We're stuck with him.

The bright side is, outside of him randomly going AWOL, if he's healthy and we have an actual offensive system in place like we did the year we went to the 2nd round, he'll be a major positive.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Good on Marks for playing hardball with Kyrie.

We need to reign him in. Hopefully he proves this season that he is committed and him, KD and Simmons get a full season together.

The fact that Kyrie would even think he deserves a max contract after everything that he's done is a complete lack of self awareness, but whatever. We're stuck with him.

The bright side is, outside of him randomly going AWOL, if he's healthy and we have an actual offensive system in place like we did the year we went to the 2nd round, he'll be a major positive.

Kyrie has the sense to realize hes reached his limit hopefully.

Its time be serious about basketball or your time in this league may be done.

His talent is still at an all time high.

[MrDollarBills]

Good on Marks for playing hardball with Kyrie.

We need to reign him in. Hopefully he proves this season that he is committed and him, KD and Simmons get a full season together.

The fact that Kyrie would even think he deserves a max contract after everything that he's done is a complete lack of self awareness, but whatever. We're stuck with him.

The bright side is, outside of him randomly going AWOL, if he's healthy and we have an actual offensive system in place like we did the year we went to the 2nd round, he'll be a major positive.

Kyrie has the sense to realize hes reached his limit hopefully.

Its time be serious about basketball or your time in this league may be done.

His talent is still at an all time high.

Yeah I mean, I don't have high hopes because he's made it clear that this is just a job to him. And I get that from a human aspect. But it makes me not excited because it makes me think that he's not going to leave it all out there to win a title. I mean, we got demolished by Boston and he didn't care less. That was basically the same crap that Deron Williams pulled when we got beat by Atlanta and he clearly didn't care.

Most of our salary cap is being taken up by two guys whose love for the playing and wanting to win is highly questionable. I find it insane that Kevin Durant resigned on for another few years just to lose. I need to see commitment from those two guys before I even think we have a shot.

[Hello Brooklyn]

Its his last chance.

No matter what I think he will be tradable. Worst case we get off him and build around KD and Simmons.

[MrDollarBills]

Ben is chilling at the Liberty game with Seth and Cam. Seems like Ben has been staying in the area to work

[3pt_chucker]

Handy is staying with the Lakers. Wonder who else the NEts will be able to bring in/poach.