What do the next 4 or 5 top ranked teams need to do

[dhsilv2]

See my photo of him against Gobert.

Gobert is much better conditioning. Calling Jokic the best conditioned big man is wild considering how tired he got. He may be the least injury prone because he's strong. If you want to last through the playoffs with his role, you have to condition yourself to a low body fat.

If you mean body building conditioning well then...ok he's not. But in terms of cardio conditioning he's about the best there is. Jokic can run harder, longer, and faster than Gobert.

Don't believe me...ask a young dude gasping for breath trying to defend him...

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/jnX0w30eMZk

That's one player.

It's known that in Europe, one of his coaches literally begged him to stop eating. You can find this on youtube.

WTF? AND?

Jokic has clearly lost like 20 plus pound before his title season and he's kept it off while become one of the best conditioned guys in the league. Yeah if this was 2020 you'd be right because Jokic was fat. He fixed that already!

[bledredwine]

If you mean body building conditioning well then...ok he's not. But in terms of cardio conditioning he's about the best there is. Jokic can run harder, longer, and faster than Gobert.

Don't believe me...ask a young dude gasping for breath trying to defend him...

https://www.youtube.com/shorts/jnX0w30eMZk

That's one player.

It's known that in Europe, one of his coaches literally begged him to stop eating. You can find this on youtube.

WTF? AND?

Jokic has clearly lost like 20 plus pound before his title season and he's kept it off while become one of the best conditioned guys in the league. Yeah if this was 2020 you'd be right because Jokic was fat. He fixed that already!

Yeah, good enough conditioning to be tired by round two of the playoffs

That's your best conditioned player in the league? Really?

[dhsilv2]

That's one player.

It's known that in Europe, one of his coaches literally begged him to stop eating. You can find this on youtube.

WTF? AND?

Jokic has clearly lost like 20 plus pound before his title season and he's kept it off while become one of the best conditioned guys in the league. Yeah if this was 2020 you'd be right because Jokic was fat. He fixed that already!

Yeah, good enough conditioning to be tired by round two of the playoffs

That's your best conditioned player in the league? Really?

Best among BIG MEN! No he's not more conditioned than some of the guys who are 220 pounds or less. You can even go and lookup distance run by players...he's among the best. Even in the playoffs his per game distances were among the top players.

Jokic's conditioning is like an 80% free throw shooter. It's not league leading but no sane person is claiming that's why a guy isn't winning.

[SuperDeluxe]

Did the Lakers go up against other teams that were fully healthy during those playoffs?

Facts are facts, Boston played 3 teams in the eastern conference playoffs that were missing their best players.

I don't really remember, but that Celtics team was the best in the league. For reference:

Feb. 19, 2009 -- The Celtics were the best team in the world. Period. Not only were they the defending Champions, they were on top of the standings with a gaudy 44-11 record. Earlier in the year they posted a 19 game winning streak. They were dominant on defense and efficient on offense. Everything was going according to plan and the word "dynasty" was starting to creep into people's minds.
(...)
That was a painful process for fans (not to mention Kevin himself) as the team kept hinting at a return before the playoffs. The team posted a very solid record down the stretch without him (finishing 62-20) but they were visibly undermanned in the playoffs.

Source: https://www.celticsblog.com/2013/8/21/4638636/what-if-kevin-garnett-doesnt-get-hurt-in-2009

In light of this, does it really matter of those Lakers went up against other teams that were fully healthy during those playoffs? The fact is, the absolute best team was missing its best player, yet no one called for asterisks or context for that Lakers' title. So I'm just wondering why in the Celtics case it's important to have "context."

If you want to bring up a championship that was clearly affected by health let's talk about the 2015 Warriors - when Cleveland lost Kevin Love in the first round and Kyrie Irving in game 1. It took historic performances by Lebron in games 2 and 3 to make it a 2-1 series before CLE ran out of gas.

You're making my point, thank you. Injuries are a fact of life and happen every single year. Yet only the Celtics seem to get the need for context or an asterisk. Makes certain fans of other teams look pretty bad if you ask me.

[JustBuzzin]

Bucks win a championship they are the next dynasty.

Nuggets win a championship they are the next dynasty.

Celtics on the other hand have something those other 2 teams didn't have. 2 superstars just entering their prime. If I had to bet on one team making a dynasty run this Celtics team has that feel. Jrue/KP/White is just a trio you can't match as far as role players. This Celtics team is stacked!

Biggest thing the celtics have is depth and a complete roster...something nobody else has had. Jrue and Al are their only real concerns with age.

White/Jrue/KP would probably be a playoff team in the East. Their core group is loaded with talent. If there is a next dynasty this team probably becomes the closest.

KP gotta stay healthy though he's the key.

[dhsilv2]

You're making my point, thank you. Injuries are a fact of life and happen every single year. Yet only the Celtics seem to get the need for context or an asterisk. Makes certain fans of other teams look pretty bad if you ask me.

Every single year people talk asterisk. I'm not sure there's been a title in a decade without someone saying this...this isn't a celtics thing lol.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/g9q855/steph_curry_after_hearing_all_summer_that_the/

[eyriq]

Jokic & Murray, Luka & Irving, SGA & Chet, Giannis & Dame, Embiid & Maxey, Durant & Booker are all good enough duos to anchor a championship core. Just need health and depth.

[Drakeem]

Denver just needs to hope Murrays body holds up and making sure they find a way to get at least 2 more guys off the bench that can be relied on. Bruce Brown was MASSIVE during their title run and they most likely come out the West again if they just had one or two consistent bench contributors.

Dallas needs to find one more player who can put the ball on the floor, whether off the bench (weirdly enough Bruce Brown probably slot well in that role if they can find a way to make a deal with Toronto) or upgrading that 3 spot from DJJ. Lively also has to improve and become the starter that Dallas can consistently depend on. Gafford is cool but the team is lacking too much talent outside of the main two players for him to be the full-time starter.

OKC needs to make a move and go for the ring next year. With the way the cap is set up, they aren't going to be able to keep all the young guys together ANYWAY, and they wont have enough roster space for their picks. I know Ainge is going to strong arm them but getting Lauri and having that type of spacing with him and Chet to let SGA and J Dub carve up the opposing team would be massive, and you arguably match Boston as far as sheer talent if Chet pans out how he should.

Philly needs a high level wing and bad. Not necessarily a PG all-star level player (although that would work) but even an OG or Mikal Bridges would work wonders for that team. Oubre is cool but not the level that they need, and Tobias just doesn't fit on this team when there's no reason to have him ISO having Embiid play the same spots. Upgrade that wing position and they have a chance.

Knicks really gotta see if they can find a way to move on from Randle and get a star back as a replacement. I think even if he was healthy, he wouldn't have provided the level of impact you would think he should be able to do given his stats. Not saying he's bad, but I'm not of the belief that Brunson is a true superstar, championship #1 option type of player, but at the very least if you build the team up like Boston where you have 2 players who are really good and you surround them with dynamic defenders, they might be able to make some noise. Off the the top of my head I can't figure out who they should go for. I think it would be a mistake to go for another guard though.

Minny I think can stay pat unless they find a good package for KAT. Gobert's trade value is too low for you to get equal talent back (and tbh I think the hate for him this post season was massively overdone). Edwards also needs to be THAT GUY consistently. His bad games can't be THAT bad, and he can't swing back and forth from game to game and expect to make it all the way.

[Drakeem]

I don't really remember, but that Celtics team was the best in the league. For reference:


Source: https://www.celticsblog.com/2013/8/21/4638636/what-if-kevin-garnett-doesnt-get-hurt-in-2009

In light of this, does it really matter of those Lakers went up against other teams that were fully healthy during those playoffs? The fact is, the absolute best team was missing its best player, yet no one called for asterisks or context for that Lakers' title. So I'm just wondering why in the Celtics case it's important to have "context."

If you want to bring up a championship that was clearly affected by health let's talk about the 2015 Warriors - when Cleveland lost Kevin Love in the first round and Kyrie Irving in game 1. It took historic performances by Lebron in games 2 and 3 to make it a 2-1 series before CLE ran out of gas.

You're making my point, thank you. Injuries are a fact of life and happen every single year. Yet only the Celtics seem to get the need for context or an asterisk. Makes certain fans of other teams look pretty bad if you ask me.

We're going to forget the "Mickey Mouse Ring" asterisk for the Lakers, or the KD/Klay injury asterisk for the Raptors, or the Harden/Irving injury asterisk for the Bucks? I think even Phoenix was begin given an asterisk just for their finals berth. To claim it's only happening to Boston is funny. The only thing I'll say is that the last time I've seen a run with as many teams banged up as this one was when Golden State won their first ring (which also had MASSIVE talks of an asterisk, especially with Irving/Love out that year and them losing the same match up the following year).

[SuperDeluxe]

If you want to bring up a championship that was clearly affected by health let's talk about the 2015 Warriors - when Cleveland lost Kevin Love in the first round and Kyrie Irving in game 1. It took historic performances by Lebron in games 2 and 3 to make it a 2-1 series before CLE ran out of gas.

You're making my point, thank you. Injuries are a fact of life and happen every single year. Yet only the Celtics seem to get the need for context or an asterisk. Makes certain fans of other teams look pretty bad if you ask me.

We're going to forget the "Mickey Mouse Ring" asterisk for the Lakers, or the KD/Klay injury asterisk for the Raptors, or the Harden/Irving injury asterisk for the Bucks? I think even Phoenix was begin given an asterisk just for their finals berth. To claim it's only happening to Boston is funny. The only thing I'll say is that the last time I've seen a run with as many teams banged up as this one was when Golden State won their first ring (which also had MASSIVE talks of an asterisk, especially with Irving/Love out that year and them losing the same match up the following year).

I wasn't aware of any other asterisk, probably because I didn't venture to the General Board much before. I think it's pathetic.

[Lalouie]

bucks - stay healthy
denver - regain your focus
okc - it's not your turn
minnie - it's not your turn
gsw, lakers, clips - hot tub time machine

[Lo Wang]

Trade for Jimmy Butler.

[madskillz8]

But this is what happens every season in the playoffs. Some players are sidelined, some play through injuries. So why is it that this Celtics championship needs context? For example, when Kevin Garnett got injured in 2009, did the Lakers' championship need some context?

Did the Lakers go up against other teams that were fully healthy during those playoffs?

Facts are facts, Boston played 3 teams in the eastern conference playoffs that were missing their best players.

Celtics dominated the Finals.

Ok. Let's investigate this domination from first round to finals a bit. Hindsight is not 20/20 because that's a post I wrote during the last game of ECF.

--------------

As a 1st seed team in EC, you play 8th seed and then 4th/5th seed for sure. After that, you normally expect to play 2nd or 3rd seeded teams (see *) unless they both flop at the same time for some reason such as injuries. Then, you normally expect 1th/2nd/3rd seeds (see **) from WC.

Now look at Boston's journey so far:

In the first round, they played 8th seed Miami without Butler and without him they are not even a play-in team despite having a great coach in Spo.

Well, we all knew this year's 4th/5th matchup was weak with 76ers dropping to 7th because of Embiid's injuries. Orlando is up and coming team but not the 5th best team in EC yet. On top of that Cavs missing Jarrett Allen for all games and Mitchell for last two games just made it easier for Boston.

Then, in ECF, you normally expect 2nd/3rd seeds (see *). Unfortunate for Bucks (3rd), they played whole first round without two-time MVP Giannis, and were eliminated by Pacers. Dame missing few games also contributed to that. On the other hand, 2nd seed NYK was already without their max player in Randle but still grabbed 2nd seed. They overperformed in the RS for sure, and in the playoffs their soon to be max player (OG) missed important games. They were also gassed out, and finally eliminated in game 7 to a healthier, fresher, and very well coached team in Pacers. As a result, Celtics avoided 2nd/3rd seeded teams which a 1st seed team normally expect in ECF.

Lastly, they would likely play with 5th seed WC team in Mavs in the finals, which would be one of the weakest WC champions of in the last two decades. Here, I am not saying Dallas isn't good, or cannot be a serious threat for Boston. I am just talking relatively, comparing Dallas to previous WCF champs.

Boston definitely dominated the RS and they were one of two favorites to win it all, thus they could have won even when all opponents were healthy. And they played without Porzingis in the last few games. These does not mean that they eventually have one of the easiest paths to the chip as I've explained above.

What I am saying is, Boston is a great team AND they have one of the easiest paths to championship - Both can be true at the same time. A similar argument can be made for last year's Denver team IMO. It doesn't mean they were legit the best team last year. But I think my post explains why we can put this domination an asterisk ( not to their championship), until they would dominate less injured EC teams next year.


Notes:

* winner of 2/7 vs 3/6 side of the EC bracket
2023: 2nd - BOS
2022: 2nd - BOS

Spoiler:

2021: 3rd - MIL
2020: 3rd - BOS
2019: 2nd - TOR
2018: 2nd - BOS
2017: 2nd - CLE
2016: 2nd - TOR
2015: 2nd - CLE
2014: 2nd - MIA
2013: 2nd - CHI
2012: 2nd - CLE
2011: 2nd - BOS
2010: 2nd - ORL
2009: 3rd - ORL
2008: 2nd - DET
2007: 2nd - CLE
2006: 2nd - MIA
2005: 2nd - DET
2004: 3rd - DET
2003: 2nd - NJN
2002: 3rd - BOS
2001: 2nd - MIL
2000: 3rd - NYN
1999: 2nd - IND
1998: 3rd - IND
1997: 2nd - MIA
1996: 2nd - ORL
1995: 2nd - IND
1994: 2nd - NYK
1993: 2nd - CHI
1992: 3rd - CLE
1991: 3rd - DET
1990: 2nd - CHI

1989: 6th - CHI .. finally


** winner of WCF
2023: 1st - DEN
2022: 3rd - GSW

Spoiler:

2021: 2nd - PHO
2020: 1st - LAL
2019: 1st - GSW
2018: 2nd - GSW
2017: 1st - GSW
2016: 1st - GSW
2015: 1st - GSW
2014: 1st - SAS
2013: 2nd - SAS
2012: 2nd - OKC
2011: 3rd - DAL
2010: 1st - LAL
2009: 1st - LAL
2008: 1st - LAL
2007: 3rd - SAS

2006: 4th - DAL

[Asian Celtic]

1. Philadelphia - spend that cap money to get some elite guys. Look at Paul George, OG Anunoby, KCP, Klay Thompson, Tyus Jones, etc.

2. Milwaukee - Let Doc cook, find some value depth pieces

3. Denver - break MPJ's contract into Kyle Kuzma and Corey Kispert

4. Minnesota - Trade KAT for Mikal Bridges and Cam Johnson

5. OKC - Sign Derrick White, Andre Drummond, and Jonas Valancunas

6. Dallas - Get rid of Maxi Kleber, put all effort into acquiring Sam Hauser

Never did I expect Sam Hauser would be a trade target, but dude played his ass off so he's probably gone in the next contract negotiations.

[Fencer reregistered]

Did the Lakers go up against other teams that were fully healthy during those playoffs?

Facts are facts, Boston played 3 teams in the eastern conference playoffs that were missing their best players.

Celtics dominated the Finals.

Ok. Let's investigate this domination from first round to finals a bit. Hindsight is not 20/20 because that's a post I wrote during the last game of ECF.

--------------

As a 1st seed team in EC, you play 8th seed and then 4th/5th seed for sure. After that, you normally expect to play 2nd or 3rd seeded teams (see *) unless they both flop at the same time for some reason such as injuries. Then, you normally expect 1th/2nd/3rd seeds (see **) from WC.

Now look at Boston's journey so far:

In the first round, they played 8th seed Miami without Butler and without him they are not even a play-in team despite having a great coach in Spo.

Well, we all knew this year's 4th/5th matchup was weak with 76ers dropping to 7th because of Embiid's injuries. Orlando is up and coming team but not the 5th best team in EC yet. On top of that Cavs missing Jarrett Allen for all games and Mitchell for last two games just made it easier for Boston.

Then, in ECF, you normally expect 2nd/3rd seeds (see *). Unfortunate for Bucks (3rd), they played whole first round without two-time MVP Giannis, and were eliminated by Pacers. Dame missing few games also contributed to that. On the other hand, 2nd seed NYK was already without their max player in Randle but still grabbed 2nd seed. They overperformed in the RS for sure, and in the playoffs their soon to be max player (OG) missed important games. They were also gassed out, and finally eliminated in game 7 to a healthier, fresher, and very well coached team in Pacers. As a result, Celtics avoided 2nd/3rd seeded teams which a 1st seed team normally expect in ECF.

Lastly, they would likely play with 5th seed WC team in Mavs in the finals, which would be one of the weakest WC champions of in the last two decades. Here, I am not saying Dallas isn't good, or cannot be a serious threat for Boston. I am just talking relatively, comparing Dallas to previous WCF champs.

Boston definitely dominated the RS and they were one of two favorites to win it all, thus they could have won even when all opponents were healthy. And they played without Porzingis in the last few games. These does not mean that they eventually have one of the easiest paths to the chip as I've explained above.

What I am saying is, Boston is a great team AND they have one of the easiest paths to championship - Both can be true at the same time. A similar argument can be made for last year's Denver team IMO. It doesn't mean they were legit the best team last year. But I think my post explains why we can put this domination an asterisk ( not to their championship).


Notes:

* winner of 2/7 vs 3/6 side of the EC bracket
2023: 2nd - BOS
2022: 2nd - BOS

Spoiler:

2021: 3rd - MIL
2020: 3rd - BOS
2019: 2nd - TOR
2018: 2nd - BOS
2017: 2nd - CLE
2016: 2nd - TOR
2015: 2nd - CLE
2014: 2nd - MIA
2013: 2nd - CHI
2012: 2nd - CLE
2011: 2nd - BOS
2010: 2nd - ORL
2009: 3rd - ORL
2008: 2nd - DET
2007: 2nd - CLE
2006: 2nd - MIA
2005: 2nd - DET
2004: 3rd - DET
2003: 2nd - NJN
2002: 3rd - BOS
2001: 2nd - MIL
2000: 3rd - NYN
1999: 2nd - IND
1998: 3rd - IND
1997: 2nd - MIA
1996: 2nd - ORL
1995: 2nd - IND
1994: 2nd - NYK
1993: 2nd - CHI
1992: 3rd - CLE
1991: 3rd - DET
1990: 2nd - CHI

1989: 6th - CHI .. finally


** winner of WCF
2023: 1st - DEN
2022: 3rd - GSW

Spoiler:

2021: 2nd - PHO
2020: 1st - LAL
2019: 1st - GSW
2018: 2nd - GSW
2017: 1st - GSW
2016: 1st - GSW
2015: 1st - GSW
2014: 1st - SAS
2013: 2nd - SAS
2012: 2nd - OKC
2011: 3rd - DAL
2010: 1st - LAL
2009: 1st - LAL
2008: 1st - LAL
2007: 3rd - SAS

2006: 4th - DAL

My point is that whatever Dallas did in the regular season, before or after trades or injuries, in the postseason they ACTUALLY defeated 3 of the top 4 seeds in the West. So they seemed pretty good.

And then the Celtics dominated them.

[Darth Celtic]

The Bucks will just have to be healthy and I think it’s theres to lose.

They’ll be hungrier, and Dame will be getting desperate.

With Horford getting old, we hope Tillman will start filling his shoes and be the Giannis primary.

If Porzingis is healthy in the postseason (seems unlikely unfortunately, probably my favorite dude in the league) and Tillman becomes a respectable shooter, Boston is the favorite but these are big ifs.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

We have already established Celtics are favorite, as has Vegas betting lines. Vegas assumes all players healthy at this point so, I don't think it's fair to say the bucks are favorite

[bisme37]

You're making my point, thank you. Injuries are a fact of life and happen every single year. Yet only the Celtics seem to get the need for context or an asterisk. Makes certain fans of other teams look pretty bad if you ask me.

We're going to forget the "Mickey Mouse Ring" asterisk for the Lakers, or the KD/Klay injury asterisk for the Raptors, or the Harden/Irving injury asterisk for the Bucks? I think even Phoenix was begin given an asterisk just for their finals berth. To claim it's only happening to Boston is funny. The only thing I'll say is that the last time I've seen a run with as many teams banged up as this one was when Golden State won their first ring (which also had MASSIVE talks of an asterisk, especially with Irving/Love out that year and them losing the same match up the following year).

I wasn't aware of any other asterisk, probably because I didn't venture to the General Board much before. I think it's pathetic.

You have to develop a high tolerance for nonsense to feel at home on the GB haha. Not sure it's a good thing but for me it came naturally over time. Just roll your eyes and keep scrolling.

[madskillz8]

My point is that whatever Dallas did in the regular season, before or after trades or injuries, in the postseason they ACTUALLY defeated 3 of the top 4 seeds in the West. So they seemed pretty good.

And then the Celtics dominated them.

No disrespect to Dallas, and their late season surge was great but still they are one of the weakest WC champions in recent memory.

And I know it is not Boston's fault that Luka being gassed out (bc of his conditioning and chest wall contusion IMO) but this together with Boston having an easy path the finals due to the injuries contributed to this "domination". Boston is my favorite to win it all next year, and unlike most NBA fans I like watching them, especially White, but the gap vs other teams is smaller than it looked in this playoffs.

[SuperDeluxe]

We're going to forget the "Mickey Mouse Ring" asterisk for the Lakers, or the KD/Klay injury asterisk for the Raptors, or the Harden/Irving injury asterisk for the Bucks? I think even Phoenix was begin given an asterisk just for their finals berth. To claim it's only happening to Boston is funny. The only thing I'll say is that the last time I've seen a run with as many teams banged up as this one was when Golden State won their first ring (which also had MASSIVE talks of an asterisk, especially with Irving/Love out that year and them losing the same match up the following year).

I wasn't aware of any other asterisk, probably because I didn't venture to the General Board much before. I think it's pathetic.

You have to develop a high tolerance for nonsense to feel at home on the GB haha. Not sure it's a good thing but for me it came naturally over time. Just roll your eyes and keep scrolling.

When I said "pathetic" I was referring to the asterisk thing, not the GB, lol! I can see how my post could be misinterpreted though. Sorry about that.

[bisme37]

I wasn't aware of any other asterisk, probably because I didn't venture to the General Board much before. I think it's pathetic.

You have to develop a high tolerance for nonsense to feel at home on the GB haha. Not sure it's a good thing but for me it came naturally over time. Just roll your eyes and keep scrolling.

When I said "pathetic" I was referring to the asterisk thing, not the GB, lol! I can see how my post could be misinterpreted though. Sorry about that.

I was not offended haha