Woelfel: Will Kohl shake up Bucks?

[paul]

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No GM is ever a sure thing, they could do well in one place and not so well in another. I do know though if Collins was given more power because Kohl felt he had some status, i'd rather take my chances with Collins making nearly all the calls over Kohl and his buddies.

An excellent point. By all reports this isn't a 'would Collins be better than Harris' decision, it's a 'would collins be better than Kohl and friends' decision, if he was able to keep them out of it of course.

[schweig]

spoke too soon

[skones]

I just think Harris gets a bad rap on this board. The guy seems like a smart gm. He's picked up quite a few productive players up off the scrap heap. All of his moves seem extremely solid at the time, he's just caught some bad luck, especially with the Bobby Simmons debacle. This team would be a different team if Harris wasn't held back by Kohl.

[pasting_monkeys]

Right now your two main figure heads in Larry H. and Larry K. are both getting neutered publicly with this story. This is a big development.

How is Larry K getting neutered...? Wasn't Coach K a Kohl hire?

[REDDzone]

I absolutely agree with PP. Collins is a much bigger named, non 'home grown' GM that would be making significantly more money and probably wouldn't take as much of Kohl's meddling or Kohl's idiotic lawyer's opinions.

Larry Harris may be better than Collins, but Collins has to be better than Harris + Kohl + Cronies...right?

[Chuck Diesel]

Doug Collins was very unpopular with players/fans when he was coach here in Washington a few years back. He

[carmelbrownqueen]

Gery needs to start calling out some players and team management. He has zero problems calling out Ted Thompson who has had far more success than Larry Harris....and calling out packer players as well. But he just can't bring himself to say anything negative about the Bucks.

What I'm trying to figure out is how that guy (Wojanarski?) from Yahoo sports got the Collins/Sund over everyone in the our local media.

And if Collins would take the job for $2mm a year, why wouldn't Kohl just pay that? If he got a four-year deal, the difference between $4mm and $8mm is a drop in the bucket compared to the player salaries. I know Kohl absolutely doesn't want to pay a dime if he doesn't think he has to, but $2mm is peanuts compared to what he was paying George Karl.

Isn't this the most important job in the franchise? I have a hard time believing those quoted numbers are accurate.

We've been down this road with Doug Collins before, my concern with him is that he's very wishy washy when it comes to whether he will step on board or not. And if he does, will Kohl take several steps back and let the man do his job? He hasn't done that with any other GM..

[unklchuk]

I respect Collins knowledge but am uneasy with his constancy (re CBQ) and with his player relations. I think this thread has summed it up pretty well. If Collins just takes on Larry H's "powers," it doesn't guarantee progress. If he's granted broad powers now wielded by the owner and his circle, it could be promising. And if he decides to tie himself to the Bucks, it could suggest he sees potential here.

The fact that the two men being mentioned both have a history of sorts with The Senator bothers me a bit. Why is Herb so averse to looking for the best possible person, whether or not Herb knows him?

Probably because Mr. Kohl can't get out of the box he's been in for decades.

[75totheMACCfund]

I just think Harris gets a bad rap on this board. The guy seems like a smart gm. He's picked up quite a few productive players up off the scrap heap. All of his moves seem extremely solid at the time, he's just caught some bad luck, especially with the Bobby Simmons debacle. This team would be a different team if Harris wasn't held back by Kohl.

completely agree with the exception of Gadz's contract. Gadz was only averaging 8 and 8 when LH signed him to that deal. I don't get this move? Hadn't we just drafted Bogut only 2 months earlier (Gadz signed on 8/12/05). Why give him so much money to be eventually be the back up to your number one pick? Then, they trade for Magloire and I understand they played Bogut at the 4, but his natural position being the 5, you have 3 centers. Gadz was more or less the third string center making 6 million a year for 6 years. It just makes no sense.

[skones]

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completely agree with the exception of Gadz's contract. Gadz was only averaging 8 and 8 when LH signed him to that deal. I don't get this move? Hadn't we just drafted Bogut only 2 months earlier (Gadz signed on 8/12/05). Why give him so much money to be eventually be the back up to your number one pick? Then, they trade for Magloire and I understand they played Bogut at the 4, but his natural position being the 5, you have 3 centers. Gadz was more or less the third string center making 6 million a year for 6 years. It just makes no sense.

I don't disagree, I just wonder if Kohl played a hand in that preferring Gadzuric over Zaza. I think the worst move by a wide margin the the CV for TJ deal which I was strongly against from the beginning.

[Chuck Diesel]

No Gadz over Zaza was a Harris deal. Harris was pretty confident in Gadz. I'm sure he could have traded him away multiple times before this season and chose not to.

[BucksRuleAll22]

As for the Article LH has done nothing for this team at all. Bogut was considered one of the top 3 players in the NBA draft, and Yi was a no brainer especially being left at pick #6. I rather have LH the GM anyday over that bum Sund, and I don't think Doug Collins is anything special and I rate him the same as LH. None of these guys are the answer.

[jokeboy86]

First off, it is painfully obvious that besides sports talk radio and Michael Hunt, the local media's relationship with the Bucks is way to cosy. Since the Bucks organization is full of nice guys and the Bucks don't generate alot of interest compared to other local teams, the media will never just flat out take them to task. Whether you hate him or love him, recently for the past two years Michael Hunt has attacked that organization on every issue including the arena topic.

I think Kohl is realizing he's running out of time and sports fans are tired of waiting on the Bucks. He might not want to and it might not be the right choice but he has to bring Doug Collins in. He needs either a big name coach, gm, or player to give fans some reason to think things are changing. If he fires Harris and hires Sund then he might start losing die-hards.

[Nowak008]

For better or worse, Doug Collins would have more power than Larry Harris.

.

Thats my take as well. How much experience does Collins have in the front office?

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

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That last bit was interesting. Do we think these 'wc officials' actually exist?

Journalists sometimes will flippantly add or cite 'other sources around the league' or 'other team officials' (not naming any names or give out any teams) to sucker the gullible fan or somehow add some credence to what they are saying, trying to con you into accepting what they say is gospel when there is no basis for it.

These "western conference officials' probaly don't exist. And if they did they don't know what the hell they are talking about. And why wouldn't he tell us who they are indirectly and provide a quote from them at least not naming names?...

Not this he said, she said crap and hearsay.

Many of these 'sources' or 'officials' give bias or off the cuff personal opinions just on principal because they may have wanted the same players or would have made the same moves Harris did!

What they would say to a reporter of a paper like Woeful whether off the record or on the record can't be trusted! That is commons sense. Even if they are friends of Woeful and he has known them for many years they are gonna say pretty much anything...

Like I said, I take what some journalists say with a grain of salt because they are mostly bias to whoever gives them interviews, or who they are buddy buddy with.

And Harris is very personable like that. So it is no wonder he sides with Harris not taking into account his body of work objectively!

Then using this "I spoke to other Western Conference officials who agree" slant to somehow increase his argument, when it actually lessens it.

Peter Vescey is much villified but he does not kiss up to get his work done.
Writers like Woeful will support Harris because harris gives him breaking or lead stories so he won't throw him under the bus.

So anything he says or writes I will usually feel is skewed...or bent to who would give them the best stories or leads to do their jobs.

Harris should be gone! And he made more mistakes then just those two moves Woeful mentioned! And Rick Sund and Doug Collins would be huge upgrades!!!

He and those Western Confernce officials who say otherwise are drunk!!!

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

I like this article. It brings up some very good points. Being the 3rd youngest starting lineup in the NBA, our team isn't built to "win now". However, that is what everyone expects from this outrageously young team.

Even so, Harris has made some mistakes. If young is the way he wants to go, it doesn't make sense as to why he'd sign some "older" (middle 20's) guys to long term deals. Having Redd is great because it'd at least bring us a few victories while the younger guys improved, but he locked up Simmons and Gadzuric too. I just don't understand why a player of Gadzuric's talent could possibly sign such a long term deal, let alone a deal for so much money.

... More excuses...

Portland is younger then we are and they are winning ....this is nutty! More frickin excuses by Woeful and you! The Bucks' core is not young!

Stop throwing that crap out there and do your homework! They are not too young. Woeful and you have said that the last 3 years!

All the starters excpet Yi have played atleast 3-4 years in the NBA! Young where? If you have 3 years experience you are considered an NBA VET!

Stop it with this young BS. It is a sorry a excuse! They are not young! There is no age on winning!

The Hawks can win...The Blazers can win! They are both even younger then we are, but they execute and they work hard and together and they buy into what their coach implements!

So Stop it...already.

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

Anonymous sources, especially with someone like Woelfel who likes to act like he's an insider, are always dubious.

He is kissing up to Harris to compete with Journal/Sentinel writers for his leads...So he will slant anything to Harris' side.

There are no Western Conference insiders...or sources. If there were you would name them like I've seen or read Enlund do and Bruan and some of the others...

[MilBucksBackOnTop06]

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He knows basketball yes.....talent not so sure. How much power did he have in that Wizards fiasco with Jordan? Wasn't that sort of a mutual thing? I just can't remember.

Another thing I am sick and tired of and I want you all to explain to me that I see a lot...

What Wizards fiasco thing!? In fact, a lot of those players the Wizards have is because of Jordan and Collins!

Large cap room was taken off of Pollin's payroll by Jordan moving it. Yes he may have made a mistake with Hamilton but Jordan's mistake was he having to deal with losers on that team where he had to come out of retirement to play!

And another thing...Jordan only had two years! Harris has 5! Keep that in mind. I am tired of fans ripping on Jordan for what he did not do with the Wizards.

Many did not want him to succeed. It took major moves this off season by Danny Ainge in Boston and look at him!

He was gonna be fired before the Allen and Garnett trade. Jordan had huge deals like Juwan Howard, Chris Webber and and another albatross deal Mitch Richmond on that team when he got there.

He drafted Kwame Brown but so what. Many GM's make lottery pick mis-haps.

Lay off him and Collins in Washington and get the facts straight. Many did not play for him out of spite. Adding Caron Butler and Gilbert Arenas and bringing in Jamison did not hurt either by Ernie Grunfeld.

Pollin opened his wallet when Jordan left, and fired him after he used him to stay on and reap the dividends for his farewell tour. The minute Jordan retired, he fired him...

Dirty son of a gun...Now that was lame. Why wasn't he given as much time and money as Harris!?

[icat2000]

So what are you trying to say MMMMMMMMMMMMMBOT. Hey your not from Hanson are you

[dao]

i'm against the idea of totally breaking up the team, but i'm in favor of minor tweaking and maybe try starting yi on the bench and see if Cv can do a better job