Moderators: Snakebites, dVs33, Cowology, theBigLip
sc8581 wrote:Snakebites wrote:You guys should know by now that sc8581 will stick to his guns no matter how good a job you do disputing his points. Use your valuable time on other things.
Just like how I stuck to my guns about Monroe being a bad fit and hindering the team?
sc8581 wrote:
I'm in the minority about 80% of the time on this forum, doesn't mean I'm wrong lol.
When I started posting on here two years ago, 3 of my first posts were...Trade Monroe for Leonard Trade Monroe for Hayward Trade Monroe for Ilyasova and a pick or another player
I got hated on then too but looking back all 3 would have been great moves huh?
Snakebites wrote:sc8581 wrote:Snakebites wrote:You guys should know by now that sc8581 will stick to his guns no matter how good a job you do disputing his points. Use your valuable time on other things.
Just like how I stuck to my guns about Monroe being a bad fit and hindering the team?
An ardent Josh Smith supporter during his time here would do well to not bring up past positions, because anyone who remembers your past posts will be able to call you out pretty devastatingly pretty immediately.
MrBigShot wrote:sc8581 wrote:
I'm in the minority about 80% of the time on this forum, doesn't mean I'm wrong lol.
When I started posting on here two years ago, 3 of my first posts were...Trade Monroe for Leonard Trade Monroe for Hayward Trade Monroe for Ilyasova and a pick or another player
I got hated on then too but looking back all 3 would have been great moves huh?
To be fair Monroe for Kawhi was never a realistic possibility from the Spurs POV. Pop said very early in Kawhi's career that he felt that he was the future of the Spurs. On this particular issue you're wrong though. I usually preface most of what I say with "in my opinion" for the sake of not sounding dismissive of opposing view points, but this one is pretty clear cut.
No doubt, athletes in general today are better. But in each and every era in the past there have been athletes who were clearly a notch above the rest and ahead of their time. MJ was one of those. Bill Russell played decades ago but if he was in the NBA today he'd be considered an elite athlete:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2AlFrOj5Mc[/youtube]
Just because MJ played in an earlier era doesn't mean his athleticism wouldn't be up to par in this era. Don't take my word for it, there's hours upon hours of footage on youtube...the combination of speed, first step, flexibility, strength, vertical and probably most impressive his body control would make him one of best athletes in the entire league today.
sc8581 wrote:Snakebites wrote:sc8581 wrote:
Just like how I stuck to my guns about Monroe being a bad fit and hindering the team?
An ardent Josh Smith supporter during his time here would do well to not bring up past positions, because anyone who remembers your past posts will be able to call you out pretty devastatingly pretty immediately.
I never "supported" Josh Smith, I said he was just as good if not a better fit than Monroe and he was already locked into a long-term untradeable deal so it was an awful idea to max out Monroe and have two overpaid bad fits at the same position. If I knew of the stretch provision I would have said to go with that though I still wanted to deal Moose either way in a trade similar to those I already mentioned. I found myself having to defend Smith to some degree because of some of the hyperbole around here and also all of the comparisons to Monroe we were doing at the time but I never said he was a great fit or anything like that.
Snakebites wrote:sc8581 wrote:Snakebites wrote:
An ardent Josh Smith supporter during his time here would do well to not bring up past positions, because anyone who remembers your past posts will be able to call you out pretty devastatingly pretty immediately.
I never "supported" Josh Smith, I said he was just as good if not a better fit than Monroe and he was already locked into a long-term untradeable deal so it was an awful idea to max out Monroe and have two overpaid bad fits at the same position. If I knew of the stretch provision I would have said to go with that though I still wanted to deal Moose either way in a trade similar to those I already mentioned. I found myself having to defend Smith to some degree because of some of the hyperbole around here and also all of the comparisons to Monroe we were doing at the time but I never said he was a great fit or anything like that.
See, I'm not sure it is possible to exaggerate how bad Smith was with the Pistons.
And if you think he was a better fit than Monroe, I think you were still proven wrong to the greatest extent that someone could be after Smith left. Again, don't bring up the past. Its not your friend.
Snakebites wrote:If all you have are excuses for why the data overwhelmingly refutes your position, then its probably time to get a new opinion.
Even after the shooting settled down and reality set in after that initial blitz, we were clearly demonstrably better than we had been with Smith.
Oh look, here I am, not following my own advice. I better get on that.
Pharaoh wrote:Ain't nothing wrong with sticking to your guns SC. Got a lot of respect for people who at least take the time to explain their position.
IMO you're wrong but such is life
Onto other matters: Monroe!
Where's he gonna go?
NY?
sc8581 wrote:MrBigShot wrote:sc8581 wrote:
I'm in the minority about 80% of the time on this forum, doesn't mean I'm wrong lol.
When I started posting on here two years ago, 3 of my first posts were...Trade Monroe for Leonard Trade Monroe for Hayward Trade Monroe for Ilyasova and a pick or another player
I got hated on then too but looking back all 3 would have been great moves huh?
To be fair Monroe for Kawhi was never a realistic possibility from the Spurs POV. Pop said very early in Kawhi's career that he felt that he was the future of the Spurs. On this particular issue you're wrong though. I usually preface most of what I say with "in my opinion" for the sake of not sounding dismissive of opposing view points, but this one is pretty clear cut.
No doubt, athletes in general today are better. But in each and every era in the past there have been athletes who were clearly a notch above the rest and ahead of their time. MJ was one of those. Bill Russell played decades ago but if he was in the NBA today he'd be considered an elite athlete:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2AlFrOj5Mc[/youtube]
Just because MJ played in an earlier era doesn't mean his athleticism wouldn't be up to par in this era. Don't take my word for it, there's hours upon hours of footage on youtube...the combination of speed, first step, flexibility, strength, vertical and probably most impressive his body control would make him one of best athletes in the entire league today.
I watched MJ from about 1987 until his last game, was an enormous fan so I don't need to watch YouTube videos of him thanks lol. Jordan was ahead of his time so to speak but that future time is now not some time that never comes. He did have all of those athletic assets you mentioned but players today are using them all together instead of one at a time and that's the major difference. I wasn't trying to say he would be some bum today, he would still be a good player but no way could he dominate like he did in the late 80s and early 90s.
sc8581 wrote:Pharaoh wrote:Ain't nothing wrong with sticking to your guns SC. Got a lot of respect for people who at least take the time to explain their position.
IMO you're wrong but such is life
Onto other matters: Monroe!
Where's he gonna go?
NY?
Maybe. There really aren't many teams looking for a center right now, that could help us net a veteran SF or backup center in a s&t.
Pharaoh wrote:sc8581 wrote:Pharaoh wrote:Ain't nothing wrong with sticking to your guns SC. Got a lot of respect for people who at least take the time to explain their position.
IMO you're wrong but such is life
Onto other matters: Monroe!
Where's he gonna go?
NY?
Maybe. There really aren't many teams looking for a center right now, that could help us net a veteran SF or backup center in a s&t.
S&T rules changed in the last CBA.
He can't get the 5 year Max deal if he leaves via S&T - only if he stays
ComboGuardCity wrote:sc8581 wrote:MrBigShot wrote:
To be fair Monroe for Kawhi was never a realistic possibility from the Spurs POV. Pop said very early in Kawhi's career that he felt that he was the future of the Spurs. On this particular issue you're wrong though. I usually preface most of what I say with "in my opinion" for the sake of not sounding dismissive of opposing view points, but this one is pretty clear cut.
No doubt, athletes in general today are better. But in each and every era in the past there have been athletes who were clearly a notch above the rest and ahead of their time. MJ was one of those. Bill Russell played decades ago but if he was in the NBA today he'd be considered an elite athlete:
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j2AlFrOj5Mc[/youtube]
Just because MJ played in an earlier era doesn't mean his athleticism wouldn't be up to par in this era. Don't take my word for it, there's hours upon hours of footage on youtube...the combination of speed, first step, flexibility, strength, vertical and probably most impressive his body control would make him one of best athletes in the entire league today.
I watched MJ from about 1987 until his last game, was an enormous fan so I don't need to watch YouTube videos of him thanks lol. Jordan was ahead of his time so to speak but that future time is now not some time that never comes. He did have all of those athletic assets you mentioned but players today are using them all together instead of one at a time and that's the major difference. I wasn't trying to say he would be some bum today, he would still be a good player but no way could he dominate like he did in the late 80s and early 90s.
So at 5 years old you started watching MJ and count that as a valid measure. Must be some basketball savant.
S
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Snakebites wrote:If all you have are excuses for why the data overwhelmingly refutes your position, then its probably time to get a new opinion.
Even after the shooting settled down and reality set in after that initial blitz, we were clearly demonstrably better than we had been with Smith.
Oh look, here I am, not following my own advice. I better get on that.
bkseven wrote:He's between average and above average.
