NBA Draft 2024

[KdoubleDees23]

Imagine that both are available at #22... who would you prefer to select? Kolek or Collier?

Collier has more size, more athleticism, and a higher ceiling, BUT Kolek is already a better passer, and shooter, much better "in-game" processing. So ultimately, I'd go with Kolek for his more ready immediate impact. Collier would be more ideal if we were in a rebuild filled with younger prospects on a different timeline perhaps?

Take Collier 100xs over Kolek. Kolek is another Ty Jerome. Won't be anything in the NBA. Collier has higher potential.

[Ghost of Kleine]

Imagine that both are available at #22... who would you prefer to select? Kolek or Collier?

Collier has more size, more athleticism, and a higher ceiling, BUT Kolek is already a better passer, and shooter, much better "in-game" processing. So ultimately, I'd go with Kolek for his more ready immediate impact. Collier would be more ideal if we were in a rebuild filled with younger prospects on a different timeline perhaps?

Take Collier 100xs over Kolek. Kolek is another Ty Jerome. Won't be anything in the NBA. Collier has higher potential.

Collier is an intriguing consideration too for sure man. And I do see him as a higher upside long term development piece with potential starter upside and can see the Bledsoe/ Marbury comparisons. He'd also be an extreme value prospect since he was initially considered a potential #1 pick. What concerns me with Collier is his lack of shooting and moderately below the rim athleticism. Collier's scoring is highly dependent upon his bulk and strength, but he may not be as successful (initially) in his career against NBA level athletes and size.

However, Collier is to me, still a very solid guard consideration that we should consider if we believe that we can advance his shooting and he can improve his athleticism through a professional NBA strength training program. IF he could do those things, then in fairness, he'd be a starting caliber guard with a higher overall potential ceiling than Kolek as a starting guard vs a quality backup. Currently though, Kolek has the edge due to his floor spacing/ shooting, and advanced in game processing.

But the gap isn't very big between them and I'd be pretty happy with either, even though I'd prefer a big athletic shotblocking center backup option at 22, OR for us to add an additional pick or two and take a guard at 22 and a big with the additional pick/ picks. But I do see and understand your perspective man.

[Ghost of Kleine]

I really like Kolek, one of my favorite prospects in our range…. I just think we need more size, defense and athleticism next to book/beal/allen/Oneal in the backcourt

I agree we need more size and athleticism, but mainly at the 5, but those picks are risky. Especially 1 year guys.

I think Kolek is a good investment not only for now, but the future. Obviously we need guys who can contribute now, but we will need guys for the next decade.

I really worry about a guy like Dunn, who is a 20% 3 pt shooter and a 51% FT shooter. That just doesn't cut it in today's NBA. You can't have a guy on the floor that people won't guard. I fear he would just become another Okogie/KBD. A young team with a lot of picks can risk that, but I don't really think we should.

I agree but the same could be said about Herb Jones and he is now a solid two-way starter in the league.

Read on Twitter

We are trying to get this offseason "a young athletic wing". Dunn makes sense for us. He is different from O'Neale and with both on the roster we would be more versatile than last year at the 3/4 spot.

Okogie is similar to Dunn but he is way smaller and he doesn't have the same upside as a wing player.

Another wing that makes sense for us is Jaylon Tyson.

He is a very well rounded player who can create his own offense and is more polished than Dunn.

Sabrestar makes great points here!
Ryan Dunn really only has one glaring weakness to his game, and that's his lack of yet reliable offensive game. But as many scouts have indicated, and as the game tape shows too, his mechanics/ form aren't completely broken, and he does show distinct indications of a nice touch at times. In his role at Virginia, he was specifically tasked with being their lockdown defender all over the court, and he willingly excelled in that role becoming the consensus best defender in all of college basketball AND projects as a game-changing defender with 1st team all defensive potential even if his offense were somehow never to translate. Now in a draft that is considered to be weak and without any legitimate star talent, teams like us that already have superstar core pieces in place should be looking at low usage complimentary utility and connective players with high-elite potential COMPLIMENTARY skillsets that help support our big three! Now our big three are all elite offensive scorers and shooters that need significant touches for us to be successful. So we're already very strong offensively and it'd be counterproductive to target young players that need the ball in their hands to be successful in their roles.

Dunn is an unbelievably ideal fit for us in that:
- He doesn't need the ball in his hands to be impactful as an elite lockdown disruptive defender.
- He doesn't need to be a significant shooter upon entering the league because we already have multiple elite offensive weapons AND he's a great cutter with a high IQ.
- His elite lockdown defense and relentless motor impact the game at a high level in that he racks up tons of steals and deflections leading to increased possessions for our big three, etc. His weakside shot-blocking for a wing is incredible with over 2 blocks a game which would allow our center option to roam more freely in drop coverage and our other wings to extend out further because his recovery and defensive anticipation are also very elite too, getting back to block shots even when out around the 3 point line.
- His relentless non-stop motor, willing physicality, elite athleticism, and high-end recovery speed result in him getting significant 50/50 ball possessions, breaking up the opposing team's offensive schemes, relentlessly frustrating the opposition's best offensive players, and limiting opposing teams' abilities to even go on runs or get high percentage shots.

Now these attributes play to our advantage BIG TIME because with our offense already being potentially elite, Dunns' ability to limit the opposition from being able to score, go on runs, function offensively, AND in wearing down opposing teams' star players too as well as locking down the perimeter and blowing up the pick n roll too, make our offensive capabilities of our big three even more impossible to overcome or come back from once we build a big lad early on! This also creates a HUGE advantage for us in that because he causes the opposing team to struggle greatly in being able to run an effective offense, our starters (once we build a lead) can now get more significant time to rest and recover on the bench. Doing this will help sustain them much better heading into the 3rd and 4th quarters of the game, helping eliminate late collapses that plagued us throughout the season because our stars were worn down early trying to not only carry our offense, but defend heavily because we really didn't have any legit high-end defensive anchors aside from KD which obviously wore him down quicker too, to the point where he struggled with efficiency/impact late in games.

Having Dunn also be able to lock down the perimeter defensively, switch effectively 1-5, and also be able to offer help recovery only makes our team more dominant and nearly impossible to overcome. How happy would we have been to actually have an elite lockdown defender like Dunn in the postseason who could've stopped, slowed down, or frustrated ANT, Conley, and other players on Minnesotas' roster, or could help lockdown opposing star guards, forwards, and wings in the postseason and regular season too.

My point is Dunn already offers a guaranteed high-impact translatable skillset right from the jump even without any significant offensive impact coming into the league as he can bring lockdown defense coming into the league, doesn't need the ball (which should be in our big threes hands anyways) to impact games for us, and brings high-level non-stop energy and athleticism that can fuel our team when they become passive at times. And if his only real glaring weakness is shooting on a team that is already elite offensively, then that weakness is clearly significantly reduced by our elite offensive capabilities and his cutting, athleticism, and high IQ. And with Ishbia being a billionaire more than willing to spend, it'll be really easy to hire the top shooting coaches available to help correct his form and mechanics, and IF you can correct his shooting to even impactful levels on that end, then you'd have an elite two-way player with all-star potential and premium value as an impact asset.

** The way the league is trending too means that Dunns' game is perfectly fitted for the postseason too.

[bwgood77]

I agree we need more size and athleticism, but mainly at the 5, but those picks are risky. Especially 1 year guys.

I think Kolek is a good investment not only for now, but the future. Obviously we need guys who can contribute now, but we will need guys for the next decade.

I really worry about a guy like Dunn, who is a 20% 3 pt shooter and a 51% FT shooter. That just doesn't cut it in today's NBA. You can't have a guy on the floor that people won't guard. I fear he would just become another Okogie/KBD. A young team with a lot of picks can risk that, but I don't really think we should.

I agree but the same could be said about Herb Jones and he is now a solid two-way starter in the league.

Read on Twitter

We are trying to get this offseason "a young athletic wing". Dunn makes sense for us. He is different from O'Neale and with both on the roster we would be more versatile than last year at the 3/4 spot.

Okogie is similar to Dunn but he is way smaller and he doesn't have the same upside as a wing player.

Another wing that makes sense for us is Jaylon Tyson.

He is a very well rounded player who can create his own offense and is more polished than Dunn.

Sabrestar makes great points here!
Ryan Dunn really only has one glaring weakness to his game, and that's his lack of yet reliable offensive game. But as many scouts have indicated, and as the game tape shows too, his mechanics/ form aren't completely broken, and he does show distinct indications of a nice touch at times. In his role at Virginia, he was specifically tasked with being their lockdown defender all over the court, and he willingly excelled in that role becoming the consensus best defender in all of college basketball AND projects as a game-changing defender with 1st team all defensive potential even if his offense were somehow never to translate. Now in a draft that is considered to be weak and without any legitimate star talent, teams like us that already have superstar core pieces in place should be looking at low usage complimentary utility and connective players with high-elite potential COMPLIMENTARY skillsets that help support our big three! Now our big three are all elite offensive scorers and shooters that need significant touches for us to be successful. So we're already very strong offensively and it'd be counterproductive to target young players that need the ball in their hands to be successful in their roles.

Dunn is an unbelievably ideal fit for us in that:
- He doesn't need the ball in his hands to be impactful as an elite lockdown disruptive defender.
- He doesn't need to be a significant shooter upon entering the league because we already have multiple elite offensive weapons AND he's a great cutter with a high IQ.
- His elite lockdown defense and relentless motor impact the game at a high level in that he racks up tons of steals and deflections leading to increased possessions for our big three, etc. His weakside shot-blocking for a wing is incredible with over 2 blocks a game which would allow our center option to roam more freely in drop coverage and our other wings to extend out further because his recovery and defensive anticipation are also very elite too, getting back to block shots even when out around the 3 point line.
- His relentless non-stop motor, willing physicality, elite athleticism, and high-end recovery speed result in him getting significant 50/50 ball possessions, breaking up the opposing team's offensive schemes, relentlessly frustrating the opposition's best offensive players, and limiting opposing teams' abilities to even go on runs or get high percentage shots.

Now these attributes play to our advantage BIG TIME because with our offense already being potentially elite, Dunns' ability to limit the opposition from being able to score, go on runs, function offensively, AND in wearing down opposing teams' star players too as well as locking down the perimeter and blowing up the pick n roll too, make our offensive capabilities of our big three even more impossible to overcome or come back from once we build a big lad early on! This also creates a HUGE advantage for us in that because he causes the opposing team to struggle greatly in being able to run an effective offense, our starters (once we build a lead) can now get more significant time to rest and recover on the bench. Doing this will help sustain them much better heading into the 3rd and 4th quarters of the game, helping eliminate late collapses that plagued us throughout the season because our stars were worn down early trying to not only carry our offense, but defend heavily because we really didn't have any legit high-end defensive anchors aside from KD which obviously wore him down quicker too, to the point where he struggled with efficiency/impact late in games.

Having Dunn also be able to lock down the perimeter defensively, switch effectively 1-5, and also be able to offer help recovery only makes our team more dominant and nearly impossible to overcome. How happy would we have been to actually have an elite lockdown defender like Dunn in the postseason who could've stopped, slowed down, or frustrated ANT, Conley, and other players on Minnesotas' roster, or could help lockdown opposing star guards, forwards, and wings in the postseason and regular season too.

My point is Dunn already offers a guaranteed high-impact translatable skillset right from the jump even without any significant offensive impact coming into the league as he can bring lockdown defense coming into the league, doesn't need the ball (which should be in our big threes hands anyways) to impact games for us, and brings high-level non-stop energy and athleticism that can fuel our team when they become passive at times. And if his only real glaring weakness is shooting on a team that is already elite offensively, then that weakness is clearly significantly reduced by our elite offensive capabilities and his cutting, athleticism, and high IQ. And with Ishbia being a billionaire more than willing to spend, it'll be really easy to hire the top shooting coaches available to help correct his form and mechanics, and IF you can correct his shooting to even impactful levels on that end, then you'd have an elite two-way player with all-star potential and premium value as an impact asset.

** The way the league is trending too means that Dunns' game is perfectly fitted for the postseason too.

There are always outliers. I'd be cautiously optimistic to assume just because one guy was an outlier, that some other guy is as well. There are too many red flags for a team that can't afford to wait to have a raw player who can't shoot *hopefully* develop.

[Saberestar]

Read on Twitter

[Blonde]

I don't think I've posted on here since we were eliminated, but I always enjoy draft season and have been looking into prospects for the last two months or so. There are some nice bigs that should be available mid-late first: Edey, Holmes II, and Filipowski are all high on my wish list. Missi in the next tier and Ware another tier behind. As for guards, obviously Collier and Kolek are being discussed in our range, I don't see any situation where Collier is available at 22 but he'd be an exciting pick even with his flaws.

The wings/forwards have been the most difficult to evaluate in this class. Da Silva is interesting if he's available. Dunn was initially one of my guys a few months ago but I've cooled on him dramatically - another non shooting wing with this group is a huge issue. I wouldn't be surprised if one of the highly projected guys slips down all the way to 22 and then we'd have to consider it.

I'd lean toward drafting a big depending on how it all shakes out for us - it feels like the most obvious need for the team. I think Filipowski is currently on top of my wish list - he has legitimate on ball skills, can play-make and put it on the floor a bit - I like him the most as a floor spacer too (though Holmes could have an argument there). Here's to hoping we don't blow this pick!

[Ghost of Kleine]

Spoiler:

I agree but the same could be said about Herb Jones and he is now a solid two-way starter in the league.

Read on Twitter

We are trying to get this offseason "a young athletic wing". Dunn makes sense for us. He is different from O'Neale and with both on the roster we would be more versatile than last year at the 3/4 spot.

Okogie is similar to Dunn but he is way smaller and he doesn't have the same upside as a wing player.

Another wing that makes sense for us is Jaylon Tyson.

He is a very well rounded player who can create his own offense and is more polished than Dunn.

Sabrestar makes great points here!
Ryan Dunn really only has one glaring weakness to his game, and that's his lack of yet reliable offensive game. But as many scouts have indicated, and as the game tape shows too, his mechanics/ form aren't completely broken, and he does show distinct indications of a nice touch at times. In his role at Virginia, he was specifically tasked with being their lockdown defender all over the court, and he willingly excelled in that role becoming the consensus best defender in all of college basketball AND projects as a game-changing defender with 1st team all defensive potential even if his offense were somehow never to translate. Now in a draft that is considered to be weak and without any legitimate star talent, teams like us that already have superstar core pieces in place should be looking at low usage complimentary utility and connective players with high-elite potential COMPLIMENTARY skillsets that help support our big three! Now our big three are all elite offensive scorers and shooters that need significant touches for us to be successful. So we're already very strong offensively and it'd be counterproductive to target young players that need the ball in their hands to be successful in their roles.

Dunn is an unbelievably ideal fit for us in that:
- He doesn't need the ball in his hands to be impactful as an elite lockdown disruptive defender.
- He doesn't need to be a significant shooter upon entering the league because we already have multiple elite offensive weapons AND he's a great cutter with a high IQ.
- His elite lockdown defense and relentless motor impact the game at a high level in that he racks up tons of steals and deflections leading to increased possessions for our big three, etc. His weakside shot-blocking for a wing is incredible with over 2 blocks a game which would allow our center option to roam more freely in drop coverage and our other wings to extend out further because his recovery and defensive anticipation are also very elite too, getting back to block shots even when out around the 3 point line.
- His relentless non-stop motor, willing physicality, elite athleticism, and high-end recovery speed result in him getting significant 50/50 ball possessions, breaking up the opposing team's offensive schemes, relentlessly frustrating the opposition's best offensive players, and limiting opposing teams' abilities to even go on runs or get high percentage shots.

Now these attributes play to our advantage BIG TIME because with our offense already being potentially elite, Dunns' ability to limit the opposition from being able to score, go on runs, function offensively, AND in wearing down opposing teams' star players too as well as locking down the perimeter and blowing up the pick n roll too, make our offensive capabilities of our big three even more impossible to overcome or come back from once we build a big lad early on! This also creates a HUGE advantage for us in that because he causes the opposing team to struggle greatly in being able to run an effective offense, our starters (once we build a lead) can now get more significant time to rest and recover on the bench. Doing this will help sustain them much better heading into the 3rd and 4th quarters of the game, helping eliminate late collapses that plagued us throughout the season because our stars were worn down early trying to not only carry our offense, but defend heavily because we really didn't have any legit high-end defensive anchors aside from KD which obviously wore him down quicker too, to the point where he struggled with efficiency/impact late in games.

Having Dunn also be able to lock down the perimeter defensively, switch effectively 1-5, and also be able to offer help recovery only makes our team more dominant and nearly impossible to overcome. How happy would we have been to actually have an elite lockdown defender like Dunn in the postseason who could've stopped, slowed down, or frustrated ANT, Conley, and other players on Minnesotas' roster, or could help lockdown opposing star guards, forwards, and wings in the postseason and regular season too.

My point is Dunn already offers a guaranteed high-impact translatable skillset right from the jump even without any significant offensive impact coming into the league as he can bring lockdown defense coming into the league, doesn't need the ball (which should be in our big threes hands anyways) to impact games for us, and brings high-level non-stop energy and athleticism that can fuel our team when they become passive at times. And if his only real glaring weakness is shooting on a team that is already elite offensively, then that weakness is clearly significantly reduced by our elite offensive capabilities and his cutting, athleticism, and high IQ. And with Ishbia being a billionaire more than willing to spend, it'll be really easy to hire the top shooting coaches available to help correct his form and mechanics, and IF you can correct his shooting to even impactful levels on that end, then you'd have an elite two-way player with all-star potential and premium value as an impact asset.

** The way the league is trending too means that Dunns' game is perfectly fitted for the postseason too.

There are always outliers. I'd be cautiously optimistic to assume just because one guy was an outlier, that some other guy is as well. There are too many red flags for a team that can't afford to wait to have a raw player who can't shoot *hopefully* develop.

For my part, I'm not at all disillusioned to believe that we're an actual contender (as constructed and with our attached limitations and positional weaknesses either) within the next two years anyway until we fully address our distinct positional weakness:
1- More frontcourt size, physicality, length, and top-shelf athleticism BOTH at/around the rim and on the wing for switch defense.
2- Acquiring a competent playmaking floor general point guard who can cut down our turnovers and put our bench players in the right positions to score.
3- Add 3-point shooting/spacing to keep up with the rest of the leagues' high-volume shooting.

Dunn again would add significant beneficial potential game-changing impact through his elite defense even without being a prominent offensive factor on that end. IF we're being honest here, a huge part of why our stars were rendered less effective and struggled significantly in the later stages of games was simply because of early exhaustion trying to build and hold leads in games because we didn't really have any legitimate high-level defenders to stop or even slow opposing teams down and limit runs that allowed them to make runs on us and overcome deficits. This forced our stars to have to play heavier minutes to try and carry us through games and rebuild leads w kept giving up, and in having to play those extended minutes throughout games, they experienced more severe early exhaustion that resulted in obviously decreased efficiency late in games. This was a root cause for us becoming one of the worst 4th quarter-closing teams in the league despite having 3 big-name offensive stars.

ven a legendary closer/finisher like Durant struggled at times because we depended upon him AT 35 YEARS OLD!!! to be our sole defensive anchor. And that's obviously an unreasonable amount of defensive pressure to put on a 35-year-old, much less our other two young stars that we need to keep fresh for the later stages of games to allow them to be fully potent in closing out those very games. Dunn for the many reasons I mentioned above, takes a huge amount of that pressure placed on our stars off of their shoulders defensively. So much unnecessary focus is being placed on Dunns' offensive limitations when he clearly would bring high-impact defense, energy, and athleticism as a utility defensive connector again even without any shooting or significant offensive contributions. We talk about value in a weak draft and Dunn is absolutely an example of that because if he didn't have his shooting issues, then he'd easily be a high lottery pick in a draft such as this.

Our offense (aside from three-point shooting volume hasn't/isn't the problem for us that played part in our collapse as much as it was our inability to stop, shut down, and limit the opposing team's runs against us by getting high percentage shots easily at the rim and from the perimeter. This caused exponential issues for us by virtue of forcing us to have to play our star's heavy minutes to try and rebuild leads that we give up easily because we don't have any significant or elite defenders on our roster currently (aside from KD who shouldn't have to shoulder the burden of carrying us on both ends of the floor at 35. Dunns' lockdown defense is just so elite both on the perimeter AND in weakside recovery, that it would solve a large portion of our issues, and because our teams' offense is already very elite, this again minimizes the critical need for him to bring a significant offensive contribution.

I often hear the argument that having a non-shooter on the floor is a liability as it allows opposing teams the opportunity to sag, drop, and double. But again, our team is unique in that we have three elite offensive talents that make it virtually impossible to effectively double anyway. And that's again, not taking into account that Dunn is a very good cutter, good at finishing at the rim, is a great lob target, and is a high IQ connector with underrated/ untapped connective playmaking abilities. Anyone who chooses to go back and look at more game tape on Dunn will see the clear flashes of this being present at times too. Now to close, I'm not at all suggesting we target Dunn solely with our lone 22nd pick. But rather w assertively get creative in adding an additional late first/early 2nd round pick so that we can add him from that 2nd pick as another key piece that can significantly address multiple glaring issues without requiring significant touches or usage in our system. Any shooting development adding to his overall offensive game is a clear bonus for us only further escalating his long-term value and impact versatility as a utility/ connective piece to our star core.

*** (I believe aside from New York targeting Kolek at 24 and Dunn at 25), He'd be available in the 32- 38 range as an extreme value complimentary piece to a contender.

[Qwigglez]

After doing some more research (very little) on Kolek, I'm not sure he's an NBA player quite yet. He has no in-between game. He can catch and shoot 3's, and he can run some pick and roll action where he gets to the basket, but that's about it. He doesn't have the ability to take contested shots as I feel his jumper is shaky and the ball is too low when he goes into his shooting motion. It won't work in the NBA. He has no mid-range, so it's easy for the opposing team to scout him. He can obviously improve, but I'm not a fan of he shot mechanics. Though, being on the Suns with Booker, Beal, and KD might make his transition easier where his weaknesses can be better masked.
IDK... I haven't checked on any other prospects to be honest.

[bwgood77]

Spoiler:

Sabrestar makes great points here!
Ryan Dunn really only has one glaring weakness to his game, and that's his lack of yet reliable offensive game. But as many scouts have indicated, and as the game tape shows too, his mechanics/ form aren't completely broken, and he does show distinct indications of a nice touch at times. In his role at Virginia, he was specifically tasked with being their lockdown defender all over the court, and he willingly excelled in that role becoming the consensus best defender in all of college basketball AND projects as a game-changing defender with 1st team all defensive potential even if his offense were somehow never to translate. Now in a draft that is considered to be weak and without any legitimate star talent, teams like us that already have superstar core pieces in place should be looking at low usage complimentary utility and connective players with high-elite potential COMPLIMENTARY skillsets that help support our big three! Now our big three are all elite offensive scorers and shooters that need significant touches for us to be successful. So we're already very strong offensively and it'd be counterproductive to target young players that need the ball in their hands to be successful in their roles.

Dunn is an unbelievably ideal fit for us in that:
- He doesn't need the ball in his hands to be impactful as an elite lockdown disruptive defender.
- He doesn't need to be a significant shooter upon entering the league because we already have multiple elite offensive weapons AND he's a great cutter with a high IQ.
- His elite lockdown defense and relentless motor impact the game at a high level in that he racks up tons of steals and deflections leading to increased possessions for our big three, etc. His weakside shot-blocking for a wing is incredible with over 2 blocks a game which would allow our center option to roam more freely in drop coverage and our other wings to extend out further because his recovery and defensive anticipation are also very elite too, getting back to block shots even when out around the 3 point line.
- His relentless non-stop motor, willing physicality, elite athleticism, and high-end recovery speed result in him getting significant 50/50 ball possessions, breaking up the opposing team's offensive schemes, relentlessly frustrating the opposition's best offensive players, and limiting opposing teams' abilities to even go on runs or get high percentage shots.

Now these attributes play to our advantage BIG TIME because with our offense already being potentially elite, Dunns' ability to limit the opposition from being able to score, go on runs, function offensively, AND in wearing down opposing teams' star players too as well as locking down the perimeter and blowing up the pick n roll too, make our offensive capabilities of our big three even more impossible to overcome or come back from once we build a big lad early on! This also creates a HUGE advantage for us in that because he causes the opposing team to struggle greatly in being able to run an effective offense, our starters (once we build a lead) can now get more significant time to rest and recover on the bench. Doing this will help sustain them much better heading into the 3rd and 4th quarters of the game, helping eliminate late collapses that plagued us throughout the season because our stars were worn down early trying to not only carry our offense, but defend heavily because we really didn't have any legit high-end defensive anchors aside from KD which obviously wore him down quicker too, to the point where he struggled with efficiency/impact late in games.

Having Dunn also be able to lock down the perimeter defensively, switch effectively 1-5, and also be able to offer help recovery only makes our team more dominant and nearly impossible to overcome. How happy would we have been to actually have an elite lockdown defender like Dunn in the postseason who could've stopped, slowed down, or frustrated ANT, Conley, and other players on Minnesotas' roster, or could help lockdown opposing star guards, forwards, and wings in the postseason and regular season too.

My point is Dunn already offers a guaranteed high-impact translatable skillset right from the jump even without any significant offensive impact coming into the league as he can bring lockdown defense coming into the league, doesn't need the ball (which should be in our big threes hands anyways) to impact games for us, and brings high-level non-stop energy and athleticism that can fuel our team when they become passive at times. And if his only real glaring weakness is shooting on a team that is already elite offensively, then that weakness is clearly significantly reduced by our elite offensive capabilities and his cutting, athleticism, and high IQ. And with Ishbia being a billionaire more than willing to spend, it'll be really easy to hire the top shooting coaches available to help correct his form and mechanics, and IF you can correct his shooting to even impactful levels on that end, then you'd have an elite two-way player with all-star potential and premium value as an impact asset.

** The way the league is trending too means that Dunns' game is perfectly fitted for the postseason too.

There are always outliers. I'd be cautiously optimistic to assume just because one guy was an outlier, that some other guy is as well. There are too many red flags for a team that can't afford to wait to have a raw player who can't shoot *hopefully* develop.

For my part, I'm not at all disillusioned to believe that we're an actual contender (as constructed and with our attached limitations and positional weaknesses either) within the next two years anyway until we fully address our distinct positional weakness:
1- More frontcourt size, physicality, length, and top-shelf athleticism BOTH at/around the rim and on the wing for switch defense.
2- Acquiring a competent playmaking floor general point guard who can cut down our turnovers and put our bench players in the right positions to score.
3- Add 3-point shooting/spacing to keep up with the rest of the leagues' high-volume shooting.

Dunn again would add significant beneficial potential game-changing impact through his elite defense even without being a prominent offensive factor on that end. IF we're being honest here, a huge part of why our stars were rendered less effective and struggled significantly in the later stages of games was simply because of early exhaustion trying to build and hold leads in games because we didn't really have any legitimate high-level defenders to stop or even slow opposing teams down and limit runs that allowed them to make runs on us and overcome deficits. This forced our stars to have to play heavier minutes to try and carry us through games and rebuild leads w kept giving up, and in having to play those extended minutes throughout games, they experienced more severe early exhaustion that resulted in obviously decreased efficiency late in games. This was a root cause for us becoming one of the worst 4th quarter-closing teams in the league despite having 3 big-name offensive stars.

ven a legendary closer/finisher like Durant struggled at times because we depended upon him AT 35 YEARS OLD!!! to be our sole defensive anchor. And that's obviously an unreasonable amount of defensive pressure to put on a 35-year-old, much less our other two young stars that we need to keep fresh for the later stages of games to allow them to be fully potent in closing out those very games. Dunn for the many reasons I mentioned above, takes a huge amount of that pressure placed on our stars off of their shoulders defensively. So much unnecessary focus is being placed on Dunns' offensive limitations when he clearly would bring high-impact defense, energy, and athleticism as a utility defensive connector again even without any shooting or significant offensive contributions. We talk about value in a weak draft and Dunn is absolutely an example of that because if he didn't have his shooting issues, then he'd easily be a high lottery pick in a draft such as this.

Our offense (aside from three-point shooting volume hasn't/isn't the problem for us that played part in our collapse as much as it was our inability to stop, shut down, and limit the opposing team's runs against us by getting high percentage shots easily at the rim and from the perimeter. This caused exponential issues for us by virtue of forcing us to have to play our star's heavy minutes to try and rebuild leads that we give up easily because we don't have any significant or elite defenders on our roster currently (aside from KD who shouldn't have to shoulder the burden of carrying us on both ends of the floor at 35. Dunns' lockdown defense is just so elite both on the perimeter AND in weakside recovery, that it would solve a large portion of our issues, and because our teams' offense is already very elite, this again minimizes the critical need for him to bring a significant offensive contribution.

I often hear the argument that having a non-shooter on the floor is a liability as it allows opposing teams the opportunity to sag, drop, and double. But again, our team is unique in that we have three elite offensive talents that make it virtually impossible to effectively double anyway. And that's again, not taking into account that Dunn is a very good cutter, good at finishing at the rim, is a great lob target, and is a high IQ connector with underrated/ untapped connective playmaking abilities. Anyone who chooses to go back and look at more game tape on Dunn will see the clear flashes of this being present at times too. Now to close, I'm not at all suggesting we target Dunn solely with our lone 22nd pick. But rather w assertively get creative in adding an additional late first/early 2nd round pick so that we can add him from that 2nd pick as another key piece that can significantly address multiple glaring issues without requiring significant touches or usage in our system. Any shooting development adding to his overall offensive game is a clear bonus for us only further escalating his long-term value and impact versatility as a utility/ connective piece to our star core.

*** (I believe aside from Nw York targeting Kolek at 24 and Dunn at 25), He'd be available in the 32- 38 range as an extreme value complimentary piece to a contender.

In response to what I've read. You start with we are not and won't be a contender in the next 2 years and will have to address some things. In 2 years our window with these stars is probably gone.

I don't agree with the "one guy on the court doesn't need to shoot because we have multiple offensive weapons". Whoever is on the court besides the big 3 who will get doubled NEEDS to make them pay like Allen did. Now if we have lights out 3 pt shooting C, it would help a little, but ideally you want all guys who can shoot. Guys that can't very rarely play in the NBA for long.

OKC didn't take a major step until Lu Dort could finally hit 3s at a 40% rate. Of course they have other young guys getting better but Dort hitting shots is another big part of it.

Probably not worth discussing though, as I see extremely little chance we draft Dunn anyway.

[bwgood77]

After doing some more research (very little) on Kolek, I'm not sure he's an NBA player quite yet. He has no in-between game. He can catch and shoot 3's, and he can run some pick and roll action where he gets to the basket, but that's about it. He doesn't have the ability to take contested shots as I feel his jumper is shaky and the ball is too low when he goes into his shooting motion. It won't work in the NBA. He has no mid-range, so it's easy for the opposing team to scout him. He can obviously improve, but I'm not a fan of he shot mechanics. Though, being on the Suns with Booker, Beal, and KD might make his transition easier where his weaknesses can be better masked.
IDK... I haven't checked on any other prospects to be honest.

I get this, but ideally you want to score at the rim and shoot 3s anyway. Your critiques sound very similar to the critiques on Haliburton. I don't think it's necessary for him to have a midrange game. He would need to drive and dish/score at rim, or space the floor when others handle it and hit 3s. He ultimately just helps us cut down on turnovers off the bench and hit shots.

We already take too many mid range shots and need to shoot more 3s.

[lilfishi22]

After doing some more research (very little) on Kolek, I'm not sure he's an NBA player quite yet. He has no in-between game. He can catch and shoot 3's, and he can run some pick and roll action where he gets to the basket, but that's about it. He doesn't have the ability to take contested shots as I feel his jumper is shaky and the ball is too low when he goes into his shooting motion. It won't work in the NBA. He has no mid-range, so it's easy for the opposing team to scout him. He can obviously improve, but I'm not a fan of he shot mechanics. Though, being on the Suns with Booker, Beal, and KD might make his transition easier where his weaknesses can be better masked.
IDK... I haven't checked on any other prospects to be honest.

I get this, but ideally you want to score at the rim and shoot 3s anyway. Your critiques sound very similar to the critiques on Haliburton. I don't think it's necessary for him to have a midrange game. He would need to drive and dish/score at rim, or space the floor when others handle it and hit 3s. He ultimately just helps us cut down on turnovers off the bench and hit shots.

We already take too many mid range shots and need to shoot more 3s.

Very few dudes in the NBA have a legit in-between game anyway, especially in today's NBA. Those are generally reserved for the elite stars of the game. And as you mentioned, you don't really want a role player taking too many pull up J's anyway.

With Kolek, I see a guy who shoot 3's (tick), can get into the lane(tick), very decent finisher at the rim (tick), can attack closeouts (tick), can make the right passes (tick), can already run a solid 2-man game, and has very high BBIQ (tick). If Kolek only had OK efficiency, I'd be more worried about his scoring translating but he's been super efficient and has been for the last two seasons. He has his weaknesses but no one coming into the league is without weaknesses.

[lilfishi22]

Read on Twitter

I think that's a great sign but I'm still skeptical some rando team won't tempt us during the draft. We also could be drafting BPA and then end up shipping him off in December or whenever draft dudes become trade eligible.

I'd love for us to draft, keep and develop a young guy but I've been burned too many times to truly believe we will, especially in this win now era

[Saberestar]

Givony: "NBA teams that I talk to say they cannot get Bronny James into their building. Teams that are drafting in the late 20s and the 30s. The Phoenix Suns have a second workout scheduled with Bronny later this week but other than that we have not seen any NBA team be able to work him out."

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/OzmPZWJGHe

[sunsbg]

Draft Bronny and pray KD and Book convince Lebron during the Olympics to leave the money and come play in Phoenix is the offseason plan it seems.

[Ghost of Kleine]

https://arizonasports.com/story/3549323/nba-draft-prospect-potential-suns-target-tyler-kolek-visits-the-valley/

NBA Draft prospect, potential Suns target Tyler Kolek visits the Valley

Jun 18, 2024, 8:35 PM

Read on Twitter

[sunsbum]

After doing some more research (very little) on Kolek, I'm not sure he's an NBA player quite yet. He has no in-between game. He can catch and shoot 3's, and he can run some pick and roll action where he gets to the basket, but that's about it. He doesn't have the ability to take contested shots as I feel his jumper is shaky and the ball is too low when he goes into his shooting motion. It won't work in the NBA. He has no mid-range, so it's easy for the opposing team to scout him. He can obviously improve, but I'm not a fan of he shot mechanics. Though, being on the Suns with Booker, Beal, and KD might make his transition easier where his weaknesses can be better masked.
IDK... I haven't checked on any other prospects to be honest.

last thing we need is another midrange shooter. Honestly if that’s his biggest weakness that’s a pretty ok sign to me. Me having Teardrop Tony nightmare flashbacks

[lilfishi22]

Givony: "NBA teams that I talk to say they cannot get Bronny James into their building. Teams that are drafting in the late 20s and the 30s. The Phoenix Suns have a second workout scheduled with Bronny later this week but other than that we have not seen any NBA team be able to work him out."

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/OzmPZWJGHe

This worries me to no end. How does not doing any work outs with any teams, let alone two with the Suns, help Bronny or the Suns unless we're serious about taking him. I've seen the narrative being spun that Bronny/Rich Paul is using us for leverage...ok but how?

[King4Day]

Givony: "NBA teams that I talk to say they cannot get Bronny James into their building. Teams that are drafting in the late 20s and the 30s. The Phoenix Suns have a second workout scheduled with Bronny later this week but other than that we have not seen any NBA team be able to work him out."

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/OzmPZWJGHe

This worries me to no end. How does not doing any work outs with any teams, let alone two with the Suns, help Bronny or the Suns unless we're serious about taking him. I've seen the narrative being spun that Bronny/Rich Paul is using us for leverage...ok but how?

Part of me wonders if the Suns told Rich Paul they would take him if he's left undrafted.
It does Bronny no good to not workout for other teams unless his people know he stinks, and he'll only look worse when working out with other teams.

Or, the Suns have a trade lined up to move back a few spots where they'll nab a 2nd rounder.

I wouldn't be happy if we did that and got him with a pick in the 40's/50's as I have to believe there are better prospects.

[Iceman36]

I'm absolute incompetent in Draft things. So just one question I'm asking myself every year:
Is really anyone picking live or do the GMs know before, who takes who?

[Fo-Real]

Givony: "NBA teams that I talk to say they cannot get Bronny James into their building. Teams that are drafting in the late 20s and the 30s. The Phoenix Suns have a second workout scheduled with Bronny later this week but other than that we have not seen any NBA team be able to work him out."

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/s/OzmPZWJGHe

This has to be all in the ploy to make the Lakers take him at 17, It benefits us either way. Jones is a loyal friend to Lebron and thus probably has a friendship with Rich Paul. We get him drafted at 17 and maybe get a better vet min guy.. MAYBE!?!? Also, if the Lakers are forced to do that, it leaves another prospect on the board.