The 2016 Offseason Thread

[bigfoot]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Joe Johnson was a seven-time all-star and was 1st option on the Hawks for many years. I'd love to see Booker at that level. Booker's second season will be indicative of his star potential.

Also, there was this 18 year old guy who for his rookie season averaged 7.6 points .417 shooting 1.9 rebounds 1.3 assists .7 steals 1.6 turnovers over 15.5 minutes per game. Nothing special. Next season he was an all-star. Chriss and Bender haven't even had a chance to play an NBA game and you have christened them as lifetime rotation players. You can't make snap judgements dude. Joe Johnson had three years under his belt before he really took off. BTW Kobe was that player I mentioned and he was drafted 13th. By your judge of player talent Kobe would been less than an average starter.

[NavLDO]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Ummm....you kinda did:

This is just a bad roster without a lot of upside. The best young talent on the roster has an upside of being adequate starters at best. There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team.

I'm not sure if you are aware of what you even posted, but there it is again, for you. So, when you say this is a 'bad roster without a lot of upside', then follow that with 'There are no young...potential stars...', well, that's saying that 'none of these players has any upside', and I'm not sure how you can defend that. Are you going to try and go the semantics route and say that since you said 'without A LOT OF UPSIDE', that that does not = 'any upside'?? Because if you try that, well, that's not going to fly, especially when you follow that up with 'There are no young...potential stars...', that's pretty much saying that none of our young guys have upside.

And if you honestly think we do not have any 'All-Star' potential between Len, Warren, Booker, Chriss, Bender, or Ulis, not to mention Bledsoe, well, that's simply impossible to speculate for everyone on that list I just provided besides Bledsoe. How can you POSSIBLY have ANY clue as to how an 18-22YO player will develop in 3-4 years??? That's no different than saying that all of them have major upside and all are definite future All-Stars. No one can possibly know this. Can you even fathom how many different factors go into how these guys will develop??

There's Team Trainers, Asst Coaching, Head Coaching, Veteran mentorship, Free Agency, self-motivation, playing opportunity, injuries, so on and so forth. NO ONE has any idea what these young players will become.

And then, this gem..."There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team"...just, wow, hence my 'crystal-ball' comment. Are you aware that the 60th overall player from the 2011 draft was an All-Star this year? The guy we just traded away a year and a half ago? Did you imagine he would become an All-Star? I'm sure if we asked you that question 5 years ago, you would've said the exact same thing you posted earlier.

So when you say silly things like 'there are no superstars or potential stars who can be building blocks of a contending team', you can sure as heck expect others to call you out on that, because you are clueless. Booker's ceiling is an 'adequate starter'?? I mean, do you read what you type before you post it??

OK, no point even continuing, and I've just wasted several minutes of my life that I'll never get back debating with a poster who thinks Booker's ceiling is an adequate starter. Do me a favor and go post that on the GB and see what responses you get from non-Suns fans...

Oh, and then there's this:

"Ulis and (Anthony) Davis, the former national player of the year and No. 1 overall draft pick, are the only players in league history to earn player of the year and defensive player of the year in the same season."

Yep, Ulis doesn't have "a lot of upside"...ok...

Oh, and one more thing...you know Joe Johnson was a 7-time All-Star, right??

[JMac1]

His first post regarding this subject was after JMac was complaining how much the media hates us, us and he was just responding basically saying that maybe the media is right and that he was overrating our own players. Both are opinions and all opinions are ok.

Immediately resorting to calling someone a troll, and putting those after every sentence is not necessary. Half of the warning is for posting 10 emoticons that were all the same. This was brought up long ago. It bothers some people, is against the rules, and one gets your point across.

A troll is someone who intentionally shows up to create havoc.

Pong's second statement isn't a popular one, but other than Bledsoe and maybe Booker right now I wouldn't say we really have any above average starters. Booker is probably the best player at his age right now, so he certainly has upside. The no upside comment I definitely don't agree with and saying any 18 or 19 year old doesn't have much upside doesn't make much sense to me.

Complaining? What's wrong with you BW? I was providing and explanation for why we were so low in the rankings. Why I felt the Suns didn't get any love from the media. I was complaining? I didn't say it wasn't fair. I didn't say they should like us or do something about it.....Come the **** on. Other posters disagreed with us being at the same level as Philly and I gave my opinion.

But if you saw that as "complaining," then that explains it all.

Well if you were not complaining then, now you are. Well done.

Nope.

Complaining: to express dissatisfaction, pain, uneasiness, censure, resentment, or grief;

Explaining: to make known in detail:

See the difference?

Complain: BW you are a horrible moderator, you always...... it makes me.......I am furious.
Explain: BW that is not what I said, I said..... I stated..... I didn't.....

I'm explaining to you now.

[bwgood77]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Ummm....you kinda did:

This is just a bad roster without a lot of upside. The best young talent on the roster has an upside of being adequate starters at best. There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team.

I'm not sure if you are aware of what you even posted, but there it is again, for you. So, when you say this is a 'bad roster without a lot of upside', then follow that with 'There are no young...potential stars...', well, that's saying that 'none of these players has any upside', and I'm not sure how you can defend that. Are you going to try and go the semantics route and say that since you said 'without A LOT OF UPSIDE', that that does not = 'any upside'?? Because if you try that, well, that's not going to fly, especially when you follow that up with 'There are no young...potential stars...', that's pretty much saying that none of our young guys have upside.

And if you honestly think we do not have any 'All-Star' potential between Len, Warren, Booker, Chriss, Bender, or Ulis, not to mention Bledsoe, well, that's simply impossible to speculate for everyone on that list I just provided besides Bledsoe. How can you POSSIBLY have ANY clue as to how an 18-22YO player will develop in 3-4 years??? That's no different than saying that all of them have major upside and all are definite future All-Stars. No one can possibly know this. Can you even fathom how many different factors go into how these guys will develop??

There's Team Trainers, Asst Coaching, Head Coaching, Veteran mentorship, Free Agency, self-motivation, playing opportunity, injuries, so on and so forth. NO ONE has any idea what these young players will become.

And then, this gem..."There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team"...just, wow, hence my 'crystal-ball' comment. Are you aware that the 60th overall player from the 2011 draft was an All-Star this year? The guy we just traded away a year and a half ago? Did you imagine he would become an All-Star? I'm sure if we asked you that question 5 years ago, you would've said the exact same thing you posted earlier.

So when you say silly things like 'there are no superstars or potential stars who can be building blocks of a contending team', you can sure as heck expect others to call you out on that, because you are clueless. Booker's ceiling is an 'adequate starter'?? I mean, do you read what you type before you post it??

OK, no point even continuing, and I've just wasted several minutes of my life that I'll never get back debating with a poster who thinks Booker's ceiling is an adequate starter. Do me a favor and go post that on the GB and see what responses you get from non-Suns fans...

Oh, and then there's this:

"Ulis and (Anthony) Davis, the former national player of the year and No. 1 overall draft pick, are the only players in league history to earn player of the year and defensive player of the year in the same season."

Yep, Ulis doesn't have "a lot of upside"...ok...

Oh, and one more thing...you know Joe Johnson was a 7-time All-Star, right??

It looks to me like he didn't say NO upside, but he said not a lot of upside. It's just his opinion. I think we have a couple of players that have quite a bit of upside. You're not likely to change his mind with 300 word posts. Before you count and tell me it was only 292 or something that is just an estimation. Maybe it's 275.

[Joe Pong]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Ummm....you kinda did:

This is just a bad roster without a lot of upside. The best young talent on the roster has an upside of being adequate starters at best. There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team.

I'm not sure if you are aware of what you even posted, but there it is again, for you. So, when you say this is a 'bad roster without a lot of upside', then follow that with 'There are no young...potential stars...', well, that's saying that 'none of these players has any upside', and I'm not sure how you can defend that. Are you going to try and go the semantics route and say that since you said 'without A LOT OF UPSIDE', that that does not = 'any upside'?? Because if you try that, well, that's not going to fly, especially when you follow that up with 'There are no young...potential stars...', that's pretty much saying that none of our young guys have upside.

And if you honestly think we do not have any 'All-Star' potential between Len, Warren, Booker, Chriss, Bender, or Ulis, not to mention Bledsoe, well, that's simply impossible to speculate for everyone on that list I just provided besides Bledsoe. How can you POSSIBLY have ANY clue as to how an 18-22YO player will develop in 3-4 years??? That's no different than saying that all of them have major upside and all are definite future All-Stars. No one can possibly know this. Can you even fathom how many different factors go into how these guys will develop??

There's Team Trainers, Asst Coaching, Head Coaching, Veteran mentorship, Free Agency, self-motivation, playing opportunity, injuries, so on and so forth. NO ONE has any idea what these young players will become.

And then, this gem..."There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team"...just, wow, hence my 'crystal-ball' comment. Are you aware that the 60th overall player from the 2011 draft was an All-Star this year? The guy we just traded away a year and a half ago? Did you imagine he would become an All-Star? I'm sure if we asked you that question 5 years ago, you would've said the exact same thing you posted earlier.

So when you say silly things like 'there are no superstars or potential stars who can be building blocks of a contending team', you can sure as heck expect others to call you out on that, because you are clueless. Booker's ceiling is an 'adequate starter'?? I mean, do you read what you type before you post it??

OK, no point even continuing, and I've just wasted several minutes of my life that I'll never get back debating with a poster who thinks Booker's ceiling is an adequate starter. Do me a favor and go post that on the GB and see what responses you get from non-Suns fans...

Oh, and then there's this:

"Ulis and (Anthony) Davis, the former national player of the year and No. 1 overall draft pick, are the only players in league history to earn player of the year and defensive player of the year in the same season."

Yep, Ulis doesn't have "a lot of upside"...ok...

Oh, and one more thing...you know Joe Johnson was a 7-time All-Star, right??

I'll just respond by saying you have a much more inflated view of the talent level of this team than I do. You obviously think the roster is loaded future stars. I don't really see anything special, and really nobody who I think will be more than an adequate starter or a rotational player. Booker, I think may be solid, but again, a third or fourth option on a contending team.

[sunskerr]

I'll just respond by saying you have a much more inflated view of the talent level of this team than I do. You obviously think the roster is loaded future stars. I don't really see anything special, and really nobody who I think will be more than an adequate starter or a rotational player. Booker, I think may be solid, but again, a third or fourth option on a contending team.

Stop the straw manning. He wasn't saying that any of these guys for sure is going to become a star. However, what you're saying is that you have a magical orb that is telling you that nobody we have has the potential to become a star. Where do you draw such conclusions? You cannot say that "I feel, therefore this must be the case". You have to look at what players have done well and what they haven't done well. Then you look at what they haven't done well and ask "how easily can this flaw be worked on?". Even after doing that, we'd still nearly be playing darts while blindfolded.

Again, since you're going to misinterpret my post to make a rebuttal, I'll state this again: nobody knows for sure who or if any of our guys will become great. We're just saying that their potential looks promising.

[NavLDO]

Spoiler:

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Ummm....you kinda did:

This is just a bad roster without a lot of upside. The best young talent on the roster has an upside of being adequate starters at best. There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team.

I'm not sure if you are aware of what you even posted, but there it is again, for you. So, when you say this is a 'bad roster without a lot of upside', then follow that with 'There are no young...potential stars...', well, that's saying that 'none of these players has any upside', and I'm not sure how you can defend that. Are you going to try and go the semantics route and say that since you said 'without A LOT OF UPSIDE', that that does not = 'any upside'?? Because if you try that, well, that's not going to fly, especially when you follow that up with 'There are no young...potential stars...', that's pretty much saying that none of our young guys have upside.

And if you honestly think we do not have any 'All-Star' potential between Len, Warren, Booker, Chriss, Bender, or Ulis, not to mention Bledsoe, well, that's simply impossible to speculate for everyone on that list I just provided besides Bledsoe. How can you POSSIBLY have ANY clue as to how an 18-22YO player will develop in 3-4 years??? That's no different than saying that all of them have major upside and all are definite future All-Stars. No one can possibly know this. Can you even fathom how many different factors go into how these guys will develop??

There's Team Trainers, Asst Coaching, Head Coaching, Veteran mentorship, Free Agency, self-motivation, playing opportunity, injuries, so on and so forth. NO ONE has any idea what these young players will become.

And then, this gem..."There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team"...just, wow, hence my 'crystal-ball' comment. Are you aware that the 60th overall player from the 2011 draft was an All-Star this year? The guy we just traded away a year and a half ago? Did you imagine he would become an All-Star? I'm sure if we asked you that question 5 years ago, you would've said the exact same thing you posted earlier.

So when you say silly things like 'there are no superstars or potential stars who can be building blocks of a contending team', you can sure as heck expect others to call you out on that, because you are clueless. Booker's ceiling is an 'adequate starter'?? I mean, do you read what you type before you post it??

OK, no point even continuing, and I've just wasted several minutes of my life that I'll never get back debating with a poster who thinks Booker's ceiling is an adequate starter. Do me a favor and go post that on the GB and see what responses you get from non-Suns fans...

Oh, and then there's this:

"Ulis and (Anthony) Davis, the former national player of the year and No. 1 overall draft pick, are the only players in league history to earn player of the year and defensive player of the year in the same season."

Yep, Ulis doesn't have "a lot of upside"...ok...

Oh, and one more thing...you know Joe Johnson was a 7-time All-Star, right??

I'll just respond by saying you have a much more inflated view of the talent level of this team than I do. You obviously think the roster is loaded future stars. I don't really see anything special, and really nobody who I think will be more than an adequate starter or a rotational player. Booker, I think may be solid, but again, a third or fourth option on a contending team.

No, I don't, actually. I honestly have no idea how these guys will turn out. My point is you are speculating about things you can't possibly know. Like I said. Did you think IT was going to be an All-Star?? Was he a "3rd or 4th option" on a contender?? He was, at the lowest, the 2nd option on a contender.

Then you compare Booker to a 7-time All-Star, yet then say he won't be anything more than a "3rd or 4th option" on a contender. Hate to break it to you, but Joe Johnson was a lot more than an 'adequate starter'. But hey, if you want to call Booker an 'adequate starter' on his way to 7 All-Star games, then by all means, call him that. I'd be perfectly fine with Booker having a career like Johnson. Maybe you just don't know what 'adequate' means, or the difference between 1st/2nd vs 3rd/4th. IDK, but I DO know Johnson was a lot more than that.

But please, do tell, what makes a young NBA player 'adequate' vs having 'a lot of upside'?? Which Drafted prospects from this draft have 'a lot of upside', and why don't Bender or Chriss have it? What metrics are you using to make this determination?? What about Booker's game do you not like that makes you think he'll only be 'adequate'?? How about Warren?? Basically, what's the difference between a young NBA player with 'a lot of upside' vs one without 'a lot of upside'?? And what credentials do you have to make that determination??

Like I said. Please, post what you did about Booker on the General Board and see what kind of response you get.

Sorry, BW, did that cross some imaginary acceptable post word limit?? If there is one, I'm not aware of it.

[MrMiyagi]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Joe Johnson was a seven-time all-star and was 1st option on the Hawks for many years. I'd love to see Booker at that level. Booker's second season will be indicative of his star potential.

Also, there was this 18 year old guy who for his rookie season averaged 7.6 points .417 shooting 1.9 rebounds 1.3 assists .7 steals 1.6 turnovers over 15.5 minutes per game. Nothing special. Next season he was an all-star. Chriss and Bender haven't even had a chance to play an NBA game and you have christened them as lifetime rotation players. You can't make snap judgements dude. Joe Johnson had three years under his belt before he really took off. BTW Kobe was that player I mentioned and he was drafted 13th. By your judge of player talent Kobe would been less than an average starter.

You really going to try and use Kobe as an example? It was obvious Kobe was going to be fhujknmdfhbjdksnmgasjldfknabhlsjfn God I can't even finish my sarcastic response because it's so asinine....

Some former Suns to consider who were late bloomers:

Nash's numbers in his first 4 seasons: 21.7 minutes 43.8% FG 7.2 points 3.8 assists 1.9 rebounds 1.5 turnovers

Goran "I wish he was here!" Dragic after 3 seasons: 16.6 minutes 43.4% FG 6.8 points 2.7 assists 2.0 rebounds 1.5 turnovers

Marcin "Grown Ass Man, Best Suns Center" Gortat after 3 seasons: 12.8 minutes 54.5% FG 3.7 points 4.3 rebounds .8 blocks

From around the league:

Jimmy Butler after 3 seasons: 26.6 minutes 42.5% FG 8.9 points 1.6 assists 3.7 rebounds 1.1 steals .9 turnovers

Jeff "Better than our guards" Teague after 3 seasons: 18.7 minutes 45.1% FG 6.9 points 2.8 assists 1.6 rebounds 1.2 turnovers

Paul "We should trade for him now!" Millsap after 3 seasons: 22.8 minutes 52.3 FG% 9.4 points 6.4 rebounds .9 blocks

Now, let's look at our "busts":

Alex "Should've had Noel" Len after 3 seasons: 19.6 minutes 45.1% FG 6.5 points 6.1 rebounds 1.0 block

Archie "Miyagi's" Goodwin after 3 seasons: 14.5 minutes 41.9% FG 6.2 points 1.2 assists 2.0 rebounds 1.3 turnovers

EDIT: Realized everyone but Nash was 3 seasons so here are Nash's numbers after 3: 20.0 minutes 42.5% FG 6.7 points 3.4 assists 1.9 rebounds 1.3 turnovers

[Frank Lee]

The biggest drawback of upside is the time it takes to realize it... either yay or nay. Odds say more nays than yays. Maybe we get lucky... again?

[MrMiyagi]

The biggest drawback of upside is the time it takes to realize it...

You worried you don't got that kinda time, Frank?

[SarcasticSun]

I didn't say none of these players has any upside. Just that their upside isn't all that great. I think they're complementary players. I like Booker - but at best, I see him as a Joe Johnson level of player- who was a third or fourth option on a good team.

Chriss a a pretty good athlete, but not sure how much he well develop as a basketball player. Bender may eventually be a decent player, but both are so young they will likely be playing for another team by the time they're ready to contribute.

I still have hopes for Len, and I like Warren. But again, these guys aren't stars. Just solid complementary players or rotation guys.

Ummm....you kinda did:

This is just a bad roster without a lot of upside. The best young talent on the roster has an upside of being adequate starters at best. There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team.

I'm not sure if you are aware of what you even posted, but there it is again, for you. So, when you say this is a 'bad roster without a lot of upside', then follow that with 'There are no young...potential stars...', well, that's saying that 'none of these players has any upside', and I'm not sure how you can defend that. Are you going to try and go the semantics route and say that since you said 'without A LOT OF UPSIDE', that that does not = 'any upside'?? Because if you try that, well, that's not going to fly, especially when you follow that up with 'There are no young...potential stars...', that's pretty much saying that none of our young guys have upside.

And if you honestly think we do not have any 'All-Star' potential between Len, Warren, Booker, Chriss, Bender, or Ulis, not to mention Bledsoe, well, that's simply impossible to speculate for everyone on that list I just provided besides Bledsoe. How can you POSSIBLY have ANY clue as to how an 18-22YO player will develop in 3-4 years??? That's no different than saying that all of them have major upside and all are definite future All-Stars. No one can possibly know this. Can you even fathom how many different factors go into how these guys will develop??

There's Team Trainers, Asst Coaching, Head Coaching, Veteran mentorship, Free Agency, self-motivation, playing opportunity, injuries, so on and so forth. NO ONE has any idea what these young players will become.

And then, this gem..."There are no young superstars or potential stars who can be the building blocks of a contending team"...just, wow, hence my 'crystal-ball' comment. Are you aware that the 60th overall player from the 2011 draft was an All-Star this year? The guy we just traded away a year and a half ago? Did you imagine he would become an All-Star? I'm sure if we asked you that question 5 years ago, you would've said the exact same thing you posted earlier.

So when you say silly things like 'there are no superstars or potential stars who can be building blocks of a contending team', you can sure as heck expect others to call you out on that, because you are clueless. Booker's ceiling is an 'adequate starter'?? I mean, do you read what you type before you post it??

OK, no point even continuing, and I've just wasted several minutes of my life that I'll never get back debating with a poster who thinks Booker's ceiling is an adequate starter. Do me a favor and go post that on the GB and see what responses you get from non-Suns fans...

Oh, and then there's this:

"Ulis and (Anthony) Davis, the former national player of the year and No. 1 overall draft pick, are the only players in league history to earn player of the year and defensive player of the year in the same season."

Yep, Ulis doesn't have "a lot of upside"...ok...

Oh, and one more thing...you know Joe Johnson was a 7-time All-Star, right??

I'll just respond by saying you have a much more inflated view of the talent level of this team than I do. You obviously think the roster is loaded future stars. I don't really see anything special, and really nobody who I think will be more than an adequate starter or a rotational player. Booker, I think may be solid, but again, a third or fourth option on a contending team.

So let me get this straight, you think that Booker will be no more than an adequate starter, yet also say he would be the third or fourth option for a contender? The third option on a contender is often an all star.

It sounds like you would have written off Steph Curry a few years ago as a third option at best too. Honestly, if you don't see Booker as something special, you're never going to see any young Suns player as something special unless it's a LeBron James consensus number 1 pick style player because that's the only type of young player that you can be more optimistic about than Booker.

[Zelaznyrules]

The biggest drawback of upside is the time it takes to realize it... either yay or nay. Odds say more nays than yays. Maybe we get lucky... again?

Quite true. Sometimes you draft a guy and it's immediately clear who he'll be in a few years and sometimes it's a mystery. Other than Booker, most of our young players fall in the mystery category. But if you're going to rebuild through the draft, that's just the way it goes. Hopefully in 5 years we'll be the team everyone else is trying to mimic but yeah, the odds say most of our prized youth will be napping on the bench or out of the league completely by then. But even with the question marks, there's plenty of reason for optimism about this group.

[MrMiyagi]

The biggest drawback of upside is the time it takes to realize it... either yay or nay. Odds say more nays than yays. Maybe we get lucky... again?

Quite true. Sometimes you draft a guy and it's immediately clear who he'll be in a few years and sometimes it's a mystery. Other than Booker, most of our young players fall in the mystery category. But if you're going to rebuild through the draft, that's just the way it goes. Hopefully in 5 years we'll be the team everyone else is trying to mimic but yeah, the odds say most of our prized youth will be napping on the bench or out of the league completely by then. But even with the question marks, there's plenty of reason for optimism about this group.

TJ? Ulis? I think it's pretty clear who they'll be.

Bender, Chriss, Len and Archie all have demonstrable skills, whether they max out their effectiveness/become consistent is another thing.

[Zelaznyrules]

The biggest drawback of upside is the time it takes to realize it... either yay or nay. Odds say more nays than yays. Maybe we get lucky... again?

Quite true. Sometimes you draft a guy and it's immediately clear who he'll be in a few years and sometimes it's a mystery. Other than Booker, most of our young players fall in the mystery category. But if you're going to rebuild through the draft, that's just the way it goes. Hopefully in 5 years we'll be the team everyone else is trying to mimic but yeah, the odds say most of our prized youth will be napping on the bench or out of the league completely by then. But even with the question marks, there's plenty of reason for optimism about this group.

TJ? Ulis? I think it's pretty clear who they'll be.

Bender, Chriss, Len and Archie all have demonstrable skills, whether they max out their effectiveness/become consistent is another thing.

I have no clue what TJ will be. I could see him turning into a frequent All Star and I could see him being the 2nd person off the bench for a decade. I like Ulis a lot and the only reason I hated our trade to get Chriss was because I hoped Tyler might drop to our 28th pick. Getting him in the 2nd round was a huge steal. But I don't know what his ceiling is. If he becomes a real threat from 3 and develops a KJ like short game, he could be a top 3 PG in a few years. But he could easily just top out as a bottom of the pack starting guard, always limited by his size. And so on down the roster.

IMO Booker, Bender, Chriss, Len, Warren, Ulis and Knight (yes, even Knight) all have the potential to one day be all stars. We know it's almost surely not going to happen for all of them but it's also quite possible that it happens for none of them. But if I were guessing I'd say Booker moves into the top 5 argument in a few years and in 2046 he gets added to the NBA top 100 team , Len ends up in our ROH as the greatest Suns center ever, Bender has a long career with us and retires as arguably the best modern NBA player to not make an all star game, Knight makes a couple of All Star games for Brooklyn, Tyler becomes our starting point guard within 18 months and has a career similar to Conley's, Archie gets to see the world and Chriss fizzles. Oh, and TJ wins finals MVP for us 2 years in a row.

[thamadkant]

Everyone has different opinions on the team and the players.

Let that be the case.

If everyone has the same opinion might as well just let one poster post his or her opinion and everyone just And 1 it or quote it with a reply "I agree".


I would HATE to be on a forum where everyone has the same opinion.

[Years90Suns]

If anyone thinks the 76ers blueprint is the way to go, then Idk what to tell you. In the past three seasons, they have won 19, 18, and 10 games. Talk about three years of irrelevance. Who is on their team now? Noel? That guy has done absolutely nothing in the league and was drafted years ago. He might get traded. Embiid? Drafted in 2014 and sadly has not even suited up to practice. No one has a clue when he will ever take the court and what he will do if and when he does. Okafor? The 76ers have been pushing to trade him all Summer. Oh yeah, all three of those guys play the same position and as far we know, are not versatile. So three guys and only one can be on the court at a time.

The 76ers new draft pick Simmons has the most potential of them all. There is one problem. He is one guy. Yes, one player. What are they supposed to do with one player? Oh yeah I forgot about Saric. The international player that was the 12th pick of 2014 draft. He is going to save them. Then there are all the top free agents that are breaking down the door to sign with the 76ers. I forgot about them too. Simmons and one of Noel/Embiid/Okafor would have to turn into Magic and Kareem from them to become anything. Does anyone see that happening? Good luck with that.

The worst thing about Simmons and Saric is that they both play PF and like to create through the ball.

[MrMiyagi]

I think we're in a good spot. Health is always everyone's enemy so I will concede that point first - it can derail just about any team. Otherwise, I think our starting five is a reasonable enough bunch that we won't be at the bottom of the standings. Bledsoe and Knight/Booker can score, PJ and Dudley bring effort and spacing and Chandler (if he won't mope) can rebound and rim protect. Not the GSW by any means, but a serviceable lineup, not to mention quite moveable should we find a deal to make.

We've got Knight or Booker and TJ providing a good scoring punch off the bench, Len is a more than serviceable bench big, Ulis who will own being the 2nd unit commander, and Bender and Chriss don't have to carry any burden but to play their most basic game and will have the freedom to make the inevitable mistakes. Plus we have Barbosa, Archie and whoever we fill the rest of the roster (Williams^2, Kuric, Jenkins).

If I'm being honest, we're probably finish somewhere between 9 and 12. That's a perfectly fine zone to be in given that Booker, Ulis, Bender, Chriss and even guys like Len, TJ and even Archie are still developing, not to mention whoever we'd draft in the lottery. And if we sneak into the playoffs, that's great too because then these young guys get playoff experience and that tends to help boost development.

[RaisingArizona]

WB, SF88.

[JMac1]

Is this guy officially considered a troll BW?

Walks and talks like a duck.....

[Frank Lee]

Best Homer ?

take your pick. You guys just have such a hard time with alternative views, especially if the 'pessimism meter' is equal to your 'optimism meter'. Then its a full on dog pile, biting, scratching, and kicking optional. Troll ? really ? Hardly. So what am I then ? A cranky old guy who sits on a porch rather than under a bridge ? hahaha

I hope these kids pan out eventually... and sooner than later. What I find disturbing is the lackluster attempt to better this team via free agency or trade. I do hold confidence in McMully's penchant for roster shuffling and am conceding the route of a patient approach to get through this wacky spending spree. But you don't build half a team then quit by touting the future. We have a good core and some possible stars in the making... However, the sun is setting on Bleds time here, has all but set on Chandler, Tucker, Duds, and Barbs.... it just seems like more should/could be done for this season. And yeah, that would mean signing some old guy who can actually play PF, or trading for a up and comer. (see, even I have hope, though it might not fit into the youther agenda)

(go easy on this one Nav... you have already bombed away your load for the weekend)