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Pg81 wrote:

70sFan wrote:

Pg81 wrote:
LeBron was the primary ball handler for his team, MJ was not so not a good comparison.

Of course, but that's why comparing raw apg numbers is also unfair. They had different roles on their teams.

Pace or possession adjusted is not any better either doubly true when you compare two players from eras which are over 20 years apart. Pace does not affect superstars much in terms of scoring, it affects role players much more.
Jordan is a better scorer than LeBron I doubt anyone apart from some LeBron stans dispute that. LeBron provides a lot in other eras than MJ though.

bmurph128 wrote:

GhosDini wrote:The thing Lebron fans will slowly have to come to terms with is the fact that this is not a real championship. Sure, it will be called one and recognized as such by the media and NBA. But whenever this goat conversation comes up people arent going to respect this title at least the way they do others.

People say there are no asterisks. People also say not all titles are equal. In the grand scheme of things this just might be the lowest quality championship in NBA history.

That's fine. What LeBron can hang his hat on is the fact that we obliterated the West on a neutral court when he and the Lakers would have had home court advantage

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GhosDini wrote:

bmurph128 wrote:

GhosDini wrote:The thing Lebron fans will slowly have to come to terms with is the fact that this is not a real championship. Sure, it will be called one and recognized as such by the media and NBA. But whenever this goat conversation comes up people arent going to respect this title at least the way they do others.

People say there are no asterisks. People also say not all titles are equal. In the grand scheme of things this just might be the lowest quality championship in NBA history.

That's fine. What LeBron can hang his hat on is the fact that we obliterated the West on a neutral court when he and the Lakers would have had home court advantage

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Lol. Everyone was injured, out of shape, and not even wanting to be there. But take what you can get I guess.

Alize wrote:

GhosDini wrote:

bmurph128 wrote:That's fine. What LeBron can hang his hat on is the fact that we obliterated the West on a neutral court when he and the Lakers would have had home court advantage

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Lol. Everyone was injured, out of shape, and not even wanting to be there. But take what you can get I guess.

Sure. Give me out of shape Denver Nuggets over anything Jordan beat.

Alize wrote:

GhosDini wrote:

bmurph128 wrote:That's fine. What LeBron can hang his hat on is the fact that we obliterated the West on a neutral court when he and the Lakers would have had home court advantage

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using RealGM mobile app

Lol. Everyone was injured, out of shape, and not even wanting to be there. But take what you can get I guess.

Sure. Give me out of shape Denver Nuggets over anything Jordan beat.

ThePersianFreak wrote:To me the absolute peak of LeBron is higher than Jordan (Last 3 games against GSW in 2016 is the highest level of basketball from an individual that i've ever seen). That's because of LeBron's versatility on defense and the way he anchored the D and was the main rim protector for the Cavs. MJ had better defensive career and overall i put him ahead of LeBron defensively, but the ceiling of LeBron is higher defensively and that showed during those Finals. But 3-5 games is a very small sample size and overall i think Jordan had the higher peak (albeit very close to LeBron and Shaq) over the course of a single season. Jordan was a tad more consistent during his prime but LeBron's prime is soooooooo long. Overall i think their Peak/Prime is comparable but the fact that LeBron's prime is almost 14 years gives him the edge.
So, in a vacuume i think their colse to each other.
Then there's the individual and team accolades, Jordan is better here, 2 more rings while being the best player and 1 more regular season MVP. I don't value these type of accolades that high, but when you're comparing 2 players that are so close to each other, you can use these as tiebreakers.
Right now i have Jordan and LeBron as 1a and 1b. If LeBron has another 2 seasons of superstar play and wins another ring as the best player on his team, i can put him ahead of Jordan.

Of course these are all my opinions and im the kinda guy who values peak/prime more that longivity. That's why i have Shaq at number 7 on my list (Jordan, Bron, Kareem, Magic, Russell,Duncan, Shaq). Of course if you value longivity more, Kareem and Duncan have their cases. If you value defense and leadership more, Bill Russell has his case and ... .

Jkam31 wrote:

ThePersianFreak wrote:To me the absolute peak of LeBron is higher than Jordan (Last 3 games against GSW in 2016 is the highest level of basketball from an individual that i've ever seen). That's because of LeBron's versatility on defense and the way he anchored the D and was the main rim protector for the Cavs. MJ had better defensive career and overall i put him ahead of LeBron defensively, but the ceiling of LeBron is higher defensively and that showed during those Finals. But 3-5 games is a very small sample size and overall i think Jordan had the higher peak (albeit very close to LeBron and Shaq) over the course of a single season. Jordan was a tad more consistent during his prime but LeBron's prime is soooooooo long. Overall i think their Peak/Prime is comparable but the fact that LeBron's prime is almost 14 years gives him the edge.
So, in a vacuume i think their colse to each other.
Then there's the individual and team accolades, Jordan is better here, 2 more rings while being the best player and 1 more regular season MVP. I don't value these type of accolades that high, but when you're comparing 2 players that are so close to each other, you can use these as tiebreakers.
Right now i have Jordan and LeBron as 1a and 1b. If LeBron has another 2 seasons of superstar play and wins another ring as the best player on his team, i can put him ahead of Jordan.

Of course these are all my opinions and im the kinda guy who values peak/prime more that longivity. That's why i have Shaq at number 7 on my list (Jordan, Bron, Kareem, Magic, Russell,Duncan, Shaq). Of course if you value longivity more, Kareem and Duncan have their cases. If you value defense and leadership more, Bill Russell has his case and ... .

How when Kyrie was just as good as him in that finals series Oh nevermind it’s al lebron ignore me

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

homecourtloss wrote:

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

2016 faced “crippled and unhealthy team.” That seems real objective

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

homecourtloss wrote:

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

2012 “Young.” Yeah, they were, but literally more talent than any team Jordan played in the finals. That team also had a +6.44 SRS and would be +9.15 the very next year (GOAT level SRS) but were derailed by injuries.

2014 “Aging Spurs.” OK. Aging is bad, young is bad. I guess playing 35 year old Stockton and Malone is ok, though.

2016 faced “crippled and unhealthy team.” That seems real objective

Out of their 16 Finals’ opponents, LeBron faced the 6 best and probably at least the 7 or 8 of the 10 best.

homecourtloss wrote:

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

2012 “Young.” Yeah, they were, but literally more talent than any team Jordan played in the finals. That team also had a +6.44 SRS and would be +9.15 the very next year (GOAT level SRS) but were derailed by injuries.

2014 “Aging Spurs.” OK. Aging is bad, young is bad. I guess playing 35 year old Stockton and Malone is ok, though.

2016 faced “crippled and unhealthy team.” That seems real objective

Out of their 16 Finals’ opponents, LeBron faced the 6 best and probably at least the 7 or 8 of the 10 best.

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

OdomFan wrote:

homecourtloss wrote:

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

2012 “Young.” Yeah, they were, but literally more talent than any team Jordan played in the finals. That team also had a +6.44 SRS and would be +9.15 the very next year (GOAT level SRS) but were derailed by injuries.

2014 “Aging Spurs.” OK. Aging is bad, young is bad. I guess playing 35 year old Stockton and Malone is ok, though.

2016 faced “crippled and unhealthy team.” That seems real objective

Out of their 16 Finals’ opponents, LeBron faced the 6 best and probably at least the 7 or 8 of the 10 best.

You'd guess right considering Michael Jordan was also 34-35 in that 97 and 98 Finals series. Lebron on the other hand was much younger than the aged Spurs players being brought up here.

Lol at the 2012 Thunder being better than every finals opponent Jordan face. Just another example of ignorant incorrect hot takes.

OdomFan wrote:

homecourtloss wrote:

Drygon wrote:Here's context in all of LeBron's' 9 NBA Finals appearances (2007-2018)...

2012 “Young.” Yeah, they were, but literally more talent than any team Jordan played in the finals. That team also had a +6.44 SRS and would be +9.15 the very next year (GOAT level SRS) but were derailed by injuries.

2014 “Aging Spurs.” OK. Aging is bad, young is bad. I guess playing 35 year old Stockton and Malone is ok, though.

2016 faced “crippled and unhealthy team.” That seems real objective

Out of their 16 Finals’ opponents, LeBron faced the 6 best and probably at least the 7 or 8 of the 10 best.

You'd guess right considering Michael Jordan was also 34-35 in that 97 and 98 Finals series. Lebron on the other hand was much younger than the aged Spurs players being brought up here.

Lol at the 2012 Thunder being better than every finals opponent Jordan face. Just another example of ignorant incorrect hot takes.