2012 NBA Draft - Part V

[payitforward]

which is better

drafting Trob and signing Eric Gordon

or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

The first is a bad idea. The second is an extremely good idea.

[payitforward]

Please explain to me what makes Beal better than Crawford? Crawford may be streaky and chuck, but at least he can create his own shot and shoot too. Both are slightly undersized.

I think Robinson is an over-achiever. Nothing wrong with that, but he has his professional limitations. He will be playing as a man among men now, instead of as a man among boys as a Jr. in college.

I'm leaning to drafting Barnes. He has legit size for his position, and can shoot. We already got creaters and defenders.

Higher basketball IQ, better rebounder, more athletic, better defender, better shooting mechanics (i.e. potentially a better shooter), better team player, etc.

Which of those have Beal proven on the NBA level? I'm not saying Crawford is better, I'm just saying is Beal going to be #3 or closer to a Crawford level player in the NBA.

Then compare Beal to Barnes, considering they play different positions. Especially since Barnes is closer to ideal size for his position, and a better athlete.

*Of course* he hasn't proven it on an NBA level! WTF? Crawford has proven on an NBA level that he is a terrible player. Awful. Oh so bad bad bad -- is there a way for me to say this more clearly: he stinks.

Barnes is a better athlete? Barnes isn't even a good athlete! He's stiff, he has no first step, he can't attack the basket or finish at the rim. Beal had some of the best numbers for a freshman guard that I've ever seen.

[Dat2U]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

What a terrible idea. Man. And what exactly makes Barnes such a good prospect? He had a bad sophomore year after a so-so freshman year. I don't think the guy will be a starter in the league. He does nothing at all but catch and shoot, and he doesn't do that all that well.

Well drafting Barnes may be a terrible idea but trading for a pick isn't. I don't think it's realistic but I'd love to come away with Beal & Waiters. Two of the best scorers in the draft. That would make us an incredibly dynamic team on the perimeter.

[payitforward]

Thanks Nate. That's what I'm looking for. An analysis, not a debate.

One way to make sure to get an analytic response is to do some analysis yourself. Comparing Beal to someone like Crawford is much more likely to get you a debate.

[sfam]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

What a terrible idea. Man. And what exactly makes Barnes such a good prospect? He had a bad sophomore year after a so-so freshman year. I don't think the guy will be a starter in the league. He does nothing at all but catch and shoot, and he doesn't do that all that well.

Well drafting Barnes may be a terrible idea but trading for a pick isn't. I don't think it's realistic but I'd love to come away with Beal & Waiters. Two of the best scorers in the draft. That would make us an incredibly dynamic team on the perimeter.

I think its far more realistic that we come away with a pick in the late teens to mid 20s. Those teams may not want another guaranteed contract on their books, so an early second round pick may be more valuable. I'd love being able to ditch Crawford, for instance, along with our seconds for a pick in the late teens.

[sfam]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

What a terrible idea. Man. And what exactly makes Barnes such a good prospect? He had a bad sophomore year after a so-so freshman year. I don't think the guy will be a starter in the league. He does nothing at all but catch and shoot, and he doesn't do that all that well.

Well drafting Barnes may be a terrible idea but trading for a pick isn't. I don't think it's realistic but I'd love to come away with Beal & Waiters. Two of the best scorers in the draft. That would make us an incredibly dynamic team on the perimeter.

Considering our gaping hole at SF, why would you want to draft two shooting guards? I would probably rather role the dice on Barnes over Waiters if I already had Beal.

[Dat2U]

Barnes is a better athlete? Barnes isn't even a good athlete! He's stiff, he has no first step, he can't attack the basket or finish at the rim. Beal had some of the best numbers for a freshman guard that I've ever seen.

Co-sign Barnes being a suspect athlete. He's got stiff hips and has a pedesterian first step. He may be an elite athlete going off combine numbers but he looked like 'just another guy' on the basketball court.

[Dat2U]

Well drafting Barnes may be a terrible idea but trading for a pick isn't. I don't think it's realistic but I'd love to come away with Beal & Waiters. Two of the best scorers in the draft. That would make us an incredibly dynamic team on the perimeter.

Considering our gaping hole at SF, why would you want to draft two shooting guards? I would probably rather role the dice on Barnes over Waiters if I already had Beal.

Because drafting for need doesn't work. There isn't a SF outside of MKG that I'd take in lottery and Barnes IMO is easily the most overrated prospect in the draft IMO. And Waiters is right now ranked 6th on my board.

In my scenario Beal would be the starting SG, Waiters would be 3rd guard and 6th man off the bench.

[DCZards]

Considering our gaping hole at SF, why would you want to draft two shooting guards? I would probably rather role the dice on Barnes over Waiters if I already had Beal.

Yeah, I'm taking Barnes with that second lottery pick if he's still on the board. When you look at his combine numbers and that sports science video featuring Barnes that someone posted a few days ago, it's obvious that he's much a better athlete than we've seen from him thus far. Like you, I think he'd be worth the gamble.

[7-Day Dray]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

What a terrible idea. Man. And what exactly makes Barnes such a good prospect? He had a bad sophomore year after a so-so freshman year. I don't think the guy will be a starter in the league. He does nothing at all but catch and shoot, and he doesn't do that all that well.

WRONG.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5dVMCRc1rg[/youtube]

In these highlights vs. VT, he was showing his fully arsenal a scoring moves. He's never going to be one to dance with the ball and shake-and-bake defenders but he does a good job of keeping his dribble low and has a decent set of moves i.e. jab step, stepback J that he'll use to create space at the next level.

[7-Day Dray]

Barnes is a better athlete? Barnes isn't even a good athlete! He's stiff, he has no first step, he can't attack the basket or finish at the rim. Beal had some of the best numbers for a freshman guard that I've ever seen.

Wrong again. Barnes has decent hops. You don't see stiffs getting putback dunks and finishing strong in traffic on occasion. And science disproves this notion: http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=7309828

And on the numbers, so are you saying Barnes numbers weren't impressive or a Fr.? Yeah, he started off slow (just like Beal), but he hit his stride late in the season and proved to be clutch in big moments.

[hands11]

Right. Why kill all cap flexibility to get Gordon when they can get Beal - who has a good shot to be just as good as Gordon?

Except Gordon has better athletic tools. Not saying that I'd offer the max for Gordon (even though I'd like to get him), but I'm not buying that there's a good chance that he becomes as good as Gordon.

But you like Drummonds

[hands11]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

That would be a really bad move.

I agree Barnes has been overly slammed but the kid has shown no grit. He has basically be acting like a pump. You know what it takes to add that to a person that doesn't have it ? A lot of ass whoopings. Some that is not a touch guy by his age isn't likely to become on any time soon.

Hard to teach killer instinct. That is why Barnes grades lower then he should.
Hard to teach smart and mature. Drummonds, Perry and Lamb.

Beal is the best choice. If not him, Robinson. But Robinson will likely be gone to Charlotte so we are back to Beal.

[7-Day Dray]

Right. Why kill all cap flexibility to get Gordon when they can get Beal - who has a good shot to be just as good as Gordon?

Except Gordon has better athletic tools. Not saying that I'd offer the max for Gordon (even though I'd like to get him), but I'm not buying that there's a good chance that he becomes as good as Gordon.

But you like Drummonds

What does that have to do with Gordon/Beal?

[Knighthonor]

Given portlands needs i really dont understand why we cant trade for the #6. Id offer booker, crawford and vesely. No way they say no. Beal/Barnes pairing.

What a terrible idea. Man. And what exactly makes Barnes such a good prospect? He had a bad sophomore year after a so-so freshman year. I don't think the guy will be a starter in the league. He does nothing at all but catch and shoot, and he doesn't do that all that well.

WRONG.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5dVMCRc1rg[/youtube]

In these highlights vs. VT, he was showing his fully arsenal a scoring moves. He's never going to be one to dance with the ball and shake-and-bake defenders but he does a good job of keeping his dribble low and has a decent set of moves i.e. jab step, stepback J that he'll use to create space at the next level.

wow I been wondering,,,whats wrong with him that many dont seem to like him?
I dont know much about him other than a few youtube videos and draft sites. whats that hidden issue many have with him?

can somebody explain?

[hands11]

which is better

drafting Trob and signing Eric Gordon

or drafting beal and signing Illysaova?

I'll take Door #2, Monte.

And twice on Sunday.

[closg00]

Why don't we draft DamIan Lallard?
http://t.co/r5KboUAh

[Earth2Ted]

I have to say I am really impressed with Beal's combine numbers. Going in, the guy was thought to be suspect in both height and athleticism- and then he busts out with an 11-7 max vertical reach. This puts him 4 inches above Gilbert Arenas, 2 inches above D-Wade, equal to Carmelo and Eric Gordon, and just an inch and a half below Blake Griffin and John Wall.

Maybe he's got a little higher ceiling than I thought.

[closg00]

Barnes is the real target, I am becoming more and more convinced.

Big week for the Wizards
While Charlotte continues to ponder what to do with the No. 2 pick, Washington has its murderer's row of prospects coming through this week as it analyzes options at No. 3. Kansas power forward Thomas Robinson worked out for the Wizards on Wednesday, followed by Florida shooting guard Bradley Beal on Thursday and Kentucky small forward Michael Kidd-Gilchrist on Friday. From what I can gather, it's a tight race at this spot that also includes North Carolina small forward Harrison Barnes.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/w ... z1xpCvOJkp

[long suffrin' boulez fan]

^
I don't see how you draw that conclusion. I'd love to see EG and Teddy take Barnes and Robinson to Dukes, then drive them around town in Limos. Make it as public as possible to bait Charlotte into taking one of them or Cleveland into trading....

Then draft Beal and be done with it.