Draft Thread Part 8: 4th pick !!!!

[ATLTimekeeper]

Didn't run the point but is expected to in the NBA.

"Played the 3 in the Italian league, but is expected to be a C in the NBA."

It gets back to Suggs having been a star high school quarterback. He has to see the entire field/court and instantly run through the various options in his head. Not worried.

Charlie Ward sucked in the NBA. Football's highly scripted, too.

[NotMyKawhi]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

[gbball]

I've gone from not seeing what the fuss is about Jalen Suggs to worrying that he might not be there when we pick. His mentality and drive are the things that stand out. Along with his quick thinking and pragmatic approach to the game. He looks like he'll find a way to succeed no matter what. And while he doesn't have elite tools to work with. He does have really good tools, so his size/athleticism won't hinder him in any way. He'll have to fine-tune his skills to really unlock his potential at the NBA level though.

A backcourt rotation of him Fred and Flynn would great to see. Another year of Lowry as a mentor would also be great.

I'd love to see what Flynn and Suggs would look like at the 1 & 2. That would be a great playmaking backcourt.

[HumbleRen]

I think it would be worthwhile to experiment with Suggs as primarily a scorer (or at least encourage that part more) while we let FVV slide back to a more passive role and also give more reps with Flynn running point and maybe small ball lineups with Trent and OG at the 3/4. Lots of shooting and Suggs gets freedom to really refine his ability to create for himself. I think his passing and vision is already elite and just telling him to run point and be a team guy doesn’t really grow him as an individual player

Agreed, I want him to be free to make mistakes and experiment.

We need him to be a scorer first.

[MavCarter]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

To be fair to suggs it probably has more to do with gonzangas system. If you watch that mark few interview posted a few pages back he says he didnt even want to recruit a top recruit like suggs. Seems very serious about the system being bigger than any one player. Now i haven't watched tape of suggs in hs so you could still be right but i wouldn't read too much into him being more passive in college

[NotMyKawhi]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

To be fair to suggs it probably has more to do with gonzangas system. If you watch that mark few interview posted a few pages back he says he didnt even want to recruit a top recruit like suggs. Seems very serious about the system being bigger than any one player. Now i haven't watched tape of suggs in hs so you could still be right but i wouldn't read too much into him being more passive in college

That's true, but it's still basketball. If it's natural for him to just want to fit in w other college players what's going to happen when he plays with NBA players? Same mentality? He does seem like a good teammate, just fit in and do your part kind of guy.


Kuminga seems like a guy who thinks he's the best player on the court every time he plays.

[DatHomieYouHaTe]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

To be fair to suggs it probably has more to do with gonzangas system. If you watch that mark few interview posted a few pages back he says he didnt even want to recruit a top recruit like suggs. Seems very serious about the system being bigger than any one player. Now i haven't watched tape of suggs in hs so you could still be right but i wouldn't read too much into him being more passive in college

That's true, but it's still basketball. If it's natural for him to just want to fit in w other college players what's going to happen when he plays with NBA players? Same mentality? He does seem like a good teammate, just fit in and do your part kind of guy.


Kuminga seems like a guy who thinks he's the best player on the court every time he plays.

they call that delusion

[Jerry Lucas]

I've gone from not seeing what the fuss is about Jalen Suggs to worrying that he might not be there when we pick. His mentality and drive are the things that stand out. Along with his quick thinking and pragmatic approach to the game. He looks like he'll find a way to succeed no matter what. And while he doesn't have elite tools to work with. He does have really good tools, so his size/athleticism won't hinder him in any way. He'll have to fine-tune his skills to really unlock his potential at the NBA level though.

A backcourt rotation of him Fred and Flynn would great to see. Another year of Lowry as a mentor would also be great.

I'd love to see what Flynn and Suggs would look like at the 1 & 2. That would be a great playmaking backcourt.

Honestly I think there's a 99% chance we're getting Suggs at this point assuming we don't trade up/trade down or anything like that. Green has reportedly received a draft promise according to a Cavs guy, with KPJ telling Green on his IG Live to not say too much. The top 4 order seems pretty much locked in at this point with the Cavs reportedly being very high on Mobley as well. The only uncertainty seems to be whether it will be 2 Green 3 Mobley or 2 Mobley 3 Green.

[FluLikeSymptoms]

Didn't run the point but is expected to in the NBA.

"Played the 3 in the Italian league, but is expected to be a C in the NBA."

It gets back to Suggs having been a star high school quarterback. He has to see the entire field/court and instantly run through the various options in his head. Not worried.

Charlie Ward sucked in the NBA. Football's highly scripted, too.

Ward went #26 in a 27-team first round and played 11 seasons. That’s a good outcome.

[ATLTimekeeper]

"Played the 3 in the Italian league, but is expected to be a C in the NBA."

It gets back to Suggs having been a star high school quarterback. He has to see the entire field/court and instantly run through the various options in his head. Not worried.

Charlie Ward sucked in the NBA. Football's highly scripted, too.

Ward went #26 in a 27-team first round and played 11 seasons. That’s a good outcome.

Career average 6/4. Football didn't give him an advantage on the court.

[nowayguy]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

Suggs took over as the lead scorer when he needed to. He wasn't supposed to be the volume shooter, that's very much intentional based on how Gonzaga chose to run their offense.

In the G-League, Kuminga is allowed to take those shots because the priority is to develop players and not to win games. kuminga is probably riding the bench if he's using the same shot selection at the next level.

[So Clutch]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

To be fair to suggs it probably has more to do with gonzangas system. If you watch that mark few interview posted a few pages back he says he didnt even want to recruit a top recruit like suggs. Seems very serious about the system being bigger than any one player. Now i haven't watched tape of suggs in hs so you could still be right but i wouldn't read too much into him being more passive in college

Definitely a system thing. Suggs took tons of big, late game shots in high school. He averaged 25 a game.


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[So Clutch]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

To be fair to suggs it probably has more to do with gonzangas system. If you watch that mark few interview posted a few pages back he says he didnt even want to recruit a top recruit like suggs. Seems very serious about the system being bigger than any one player. Now i haven't watched tape of suggs in hs so you could still be right but i wouldn't read too much into him being more passive in college

That's true, but it's still basketball. If it's natural for him to just want to fit in w other college players what's going to happen when he plays with NBA players? Same mentality? He does seem like a good teammate, just fit in and do your part kind of guy.


Kuminga seems like a guy who thinks he's the best player on the court every time he plays.

Except he isn’t even close to that.


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[HumbleRen]

I just hope Suggs is more Halliburton than he is Lonzo in his first year.

[Bruin]

That's better than Chris Paul, a HoF'er.

What do we think Suggs full potential looks like ?

A 23/7 player ?

It’s so hard to evaluate these prospects haha.

Ceiling I’d say 24-9-5 with great defense. Two way Superstar

No it isn’t. Prime CP3 was something else

And I’m not saying this is what I expect from Suggs. This is what his best case scenario is

Also CP3s impact was beyond numbers. Otherwise numbers like that aren’t too out of the ordinary anymore. Fox averaged 25-7-3 this year as a 23 year old and Trae Young averaged 25-9-4 as a 22 year old

Why can’t Suggs potentially do it in his prime?

[Pooper]

Suggs was taking stepback 3s when the defender was right in his face in Gonzaga. Even though I don't want too much of that in his rookie year, to say that he doesn't have alpha mentality in scoring is wrong.

[tecumseh18]

Charlie Ward sucked in the NBA. Football's highly scripted, too.

Ward went #26 in a 27-team first round and played 11 seasons. That’s a good outcome.

Career average 6/4. Football didn't give him an advantage on the court.

Oh, so we've given up on advanced stats and are looking a per game averages now? That's great - so much simpler for me.

Ward only averaged more than 30 mpg once in his career. Although the last pick in the first round, he was a starter in his prime, including the 1999 Finals. He was a consistently decent 3 point shooter (.364 for his career, peaking at .428 in 2003-2004). In two consecutive seasons over which he averaged nearly 30 mpg, he had ~5.5 apg. He seems to have a FVV statistical profile, also with a relatively low 2 point percentage. Fred's pretty good.

Ward had played college football for four years, plus one red shirt year, winning the Heismann in his last season. He was the first Heismann winner not to even be drafted in the NFL, let alone play. That's a lot of time that he wasn't playing basketball before he was drafted into the NBA the year he turned 24. At 6' 2", you have to be pretty skilled to play in the NBA. It's likely that he would have benefited from a great focus on basketball in his college career - the way Suggs did last season.

Not worried.

[Fast_Feets]

I've gone from not seeing what the fuss is about Jalen Suggs to worrying that he might not be there when we pick. His mentality and drive are the things that stand out. Along with his quick thinking and pragmatic approach to the game. He looks like he'll find a way to succeed no matter what. And while he doesn't have elite tools to work with. He does have really good tools, so his size/athleticism won't hinder him in any way. He'll have to fine-tune his skills to really unlock his potential at the NBA level though.

A backcourt rotation of him Fred and Flynn would great to see. Another year of Lowry as a mentor would also be great.

I'd love to see what Flynn and Suggs would look like at the 1 & 2. That would be a great playmaking backcourt.

His tools are more elite than FVV. Just need to see if his shooting is better.

He is more athletic, taller so he can get to his spots easier with less assistance. FVV MUST have a pick. He can't take ppl on one on one consistently.

I would just trade fred for more assets and let suggs / flynn play it out at the point.
Raps need an alpha scorer at the 2 and or 3.

OG is not an alpha scorer. His dribbling skills are too basic. Barnes looks like a slightly less awkward barns. Not worth a high pick. above 6 to 20 in the draft is logical.

I would not mind going for the gSW trade with pascal as Wiseman has alot of potential and Wiggins looks to be finally turning the page.

[DreamTeam09]

One advantage Kuminga has over Suggs is he's more alpha imo More willing to shoot. That can be bad or good. You do need that tho to be a superstar.

It's a huge part of it. You don't make the shots you don't take. Kuminga plays like he's the man.

How can you possibly think kuminga is the more alpha? Like what gave you that impression?

[tecumseh18]

I've gone from not seeing what the fuss is about Jalen Suggs to worrying that he might not be there when we pick. His mentality and drive are the things that stand out. Along with his quick thinking and pragmatic approach to the game. He looks like he'll find a way to succeed no matter what. And while he doesn't have elite tools to work with. He does have really good tools, so his size/athleticism won't hinder him in any way. He'll have to fine-tune his skills to really unlock his potential at the NBA level though.

A backcourt rotation of him Fred and Flynn would great to see. Another year of Lowry as a mentor would also be great.

I'd love to see what Flynn and Suggs would look like at the 1 & 2. That would be a great playmaking backcourt.

His tools are more elite than FVV. Just need to see if his shooting is better.

He is more athletic, taller so he can get to his spots easier with less assistance. FVV MUST have a pick. He can't take ppl on one on one consistently.

That's the most surprising thing about Suggs - he has those fast twitch muscles that can fake defenders out of their jockstraps.

I would just trade fred for more assets and let suggs / flynn play it out at the point.
Raps need an alpha scorer at the 2 and or 3.

Let's see what we have in Gary, first. Ideally, turn him into a trade asset, then trade up. If the Bulls don't get it together by the trade deadline, maybe LaVine will be available for a Fred/Gary package.

OG is not an alpha scorer. His dribbling skills are too basic.

OG showed tremendous growth last season, despite the short turnaround from the Bubble. Let's not write him off yet. My only concern is that continuing to treat Pascal as the #1 option will stunt OG's growth.