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richi_v25 wrote:

basketballRob wrote:I'm happy Vuc got a double double

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I miss Vuc, after all our all-star centers leaving it was nice to see he was sad to be moved. Hopefully we can bring him back on a friendly contract to finish out his career in Orlando.

Ffs. The loser emotions are running high tonight.

Rainwater wrote:

richi_v25 wrote:

DiplomaticMagic wrote:I hope we're able to resign Goga. Hes a huge addition to the roster.

European players are usually pretty loyal but i wouldn't blame him one bit for choosing money since he's playing for minimum. He's made over $15 million in his career so he could choose where he's familiar and happy (plus no state tax or snow) over $$$.

I don’t see Goga coming back. He should get money somewhere else where he is not third string. And it would be foolish for the Magic to pay for third center when they have needs on the perimeter.

You can not POSSIBLY be serious right now. WE NEED A DEFENSIVE CENTER! WE NEED ONE! Goga should be starting over that absolute fraud of a player in WCJ, who has not once made a winning play in his life. Yet Goga comes in and makes like 10 winning plays down the stretch and completely changes the game.

hoooo boy there is some delusion going on here.

The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

I’m keeping Goga and WCJ for 2 more seasons. Let’s add Conley and Monk and say bye to Fultz and Harris.

Hopefully Conley can give Black more and more opportunities.

The secret is playing against our former core.

3-0 against Vuc
2-0 against Fournier
2-0 against AG

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

If Paolo is 1 and Franz at 3, which spots are Goga and Fultz?



Wendell is 4 or 2 with Goga out.

SOUL wrote:The secret is playing against our former core.

3-0 against Vuc
2-0 against Fournier
2-0 against AG

The avengers?

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

WCJ is also just more experienced. I do love what Goga does but he makes some really dumb plays and fouls. Made some really dumb ones late in 4th. Not holding it against him he is young. But Wendell is more polished and experienced though Goga he has more size than Wendell. I do love Mo but he might have to sit more. Then again sometimes when Ingles doesn’t have it we need his offense in second unit. We have 3 good options.

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

I'm just glad that Mosely is keeping the Goga option open. I'd like to see him play on that second unit more.

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cedric76 wrote:

SOUL wrote:

MagicMatic wrote:
Why? Because the Bulls were worse?

No, because half of you have agendas and are player fans who only want to win when they're in.

Cole made important shots in the OT.

Goga actually got subbed in for WCJ.

Isaac plays most of the 4th + OT...

Still whiners.

I agree, this whining mentality is exhausting.

Too much crying on this board

I'd say 75% of the whiny posts are about whining by "people" and "others" and "some on here" . I hear Reddit is nothing but rainbows - without any interest in critical analysis. This is RealGM. I kind of think the idea is for informed fans to pick things apart, for good or bad.

I'm not saying there isn't a fair amount of trolling...but that's the other 25%

basketballRob wrote:

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

I'm just glad that Mosely is keeping the Goga option open. I'd like to see him play on that second unit more.

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I have to give credit...whether or not Goga is getting PT, he's always up and cheering on the bench. He seems like a happy supportive guy. A good teammate.

Skybox wrote:I'd say 75% of the whiny posts are about whining by "people" and "others" and "some on here" . I hear Reddit is nothing but rainbows - without any interest in critical analysis. This is RealGM. I kind of think the idea is for informed fans to pick things apart, for good or bad.

I'm not saying there isn't a fair amount of trolling...but that's the other 25%

Reddit is either doomposting after a loss or 100% rainbows after a win, because those posters only show up after a loss.

However, there's a lot more agenda posting here.. "I need to see Suggs, Black, Goga, AB, insert (x) player in this game or else this win sucks" .. we literally had basically the lineup everybody has wanted forever (outside of Suggs for Cole) to close the game and had a very nice comeback, and there was massive negativity.

I'm just gonna call it like I see it. People can call me a wet sock for actually wanting people to enjoy these wins, but I'm also the same dude that has made a "venting thread" during our last rebuild, same guy who was clamoring for every rookie to get minutes during our rebuild when we were playing lazy vets, who actively wanted to tank to play younger players...

You would not think this team has won 5 out of 6 games by reading these boards. It's one thing to complain actively during the GT, another when it continues in every **** thread I click and after wins. It gets tiring.

p0peye wrote:

Knightro wrote:The Carter/Goga debate goes deeper than just those two.

You can’t really replace Carter in the SL and continue to start Fultz as Goga and Fultz want to occupy the same space a lot of the time.

For his warts, Carter has shot the ball very well and provides much needed spacing when he’s out there with Fultz.

If you replace him with Goga, then you have 2 non distance shooters out there instead of just 1, which makes that much more difficult for guys to create off the dribble.

If Paolo is 1 and Franz at 3, which spots are Goga and Fultz?



Wendell is 4 or 2 with Goga out.

Fultz playing best at the dunker's spot (5) is an atrocity...but that doesn't necessarily mean I want my C out at spot 2, pump faking. WCJ and Goga are both good, neither is just right, imo. Maybe WCJ would be better with 2nd unit, where his offensive versatility wouldn't overlap so much with Franz & Paolo. Not that it's a big problem, it's just a bit of a waste. WCJ is definitely a starter-quality 5 (or 4 on another team) but I still don't love the fit....

Isaac, Paolo, Franz, Suggs, a PG who can score from the perimeter...honestly, I like Franz at PG with the lengthy "death lineups" we've seen recently.

Goga, WCJ, Houstan, Cole, Ingles

SOUL wrote:

Skybox wrote:I'd say 75% of the whiny posts are about whining by "people" and "others" and "some on here" . I hear Reddit is nothing but rainbows - without any interest in critical analysis. This is RealGM. I kind of think the idea is for informed fans to pick things apart, for good or bad.

I'm not saying there isn't a fair amount of trolling...but that's the other 25%

Reddit is either doomposting after a loss or 100% rainbows after a win, because those posters only show up after a loss.

However, there's a lot more agenda posting here.. "I need to see Suggs, Black, Goga, AB, insert (x) player in this game or else this win sucks" .. we literally had basically the lineup everybody has wanted forever (outside of Suggs for Cole) to close the game and had a very nice comeback, and there was massive negativity.

I'm just gonna call it like I see it. People can call me a wet sock for actually wanting people to enjoy these wins, but I'm also the same dude that has made a "venting thread" during our last rebuild, same guy who was clamoring for every rookie to get minutes during our rebuild when we were playing lazy vets, who actively wanted to tank to play younger players...

You would not think this team has won 5 out of 6 games by reading these boards. It's one thing to complain actively during the GT, another when it continues in every **** thread I click and after wins. It gets tiring.

Quit whining, you wet sock

Just kidding, you're not wrong. Maybe it's my own look at life but I find myself more annoyed by blind rationalizing and defending of things in the face of evidence than I do with thoughtful criticism. I can definitely change my mind on things and I like new angles thrown at me on players, trades, etc... There's certainly a balance point that makes this a miserable or enjoyable discourse.

People confuse being happy with wins and being critical of how we get those wins.

You can use more critical thinking outside of the result.

Good job the Magic won against the Bulls at home.

The end of the game was a train wreck starting at the last 3 minutes in the fourth and the entire OT. It was a perfect representation of why this squads ceiling is capped as constructed. There is nobody to run anything. Everything was an iso contested jumper or drive into traffic hoping someone was down low for a rebound. Offense was hot garbage.

Luckily Mosely had Cole and Goga in the game instead of Fultz and Carter (yeah the two guys that should have been moved).

Sorry not sorry if that’s considered “whining” because you can’t think outside of win or loss column results. And no, that has nothing to do with which player I wanted to see and when. Moselys lineup change was fine. He’s just incapable of running offensive sets because he lacks the roster to do it.

Skybox wrote:Quit whining, you wet sock

Just kidding, you're not wrong. Maybe it's my own look at life but I find myself more annoyed by blind rationalizing and defending of things in the face of evidence than I do with thoughtful criticism. I can definitely change my mind on things and I like new angles thrown at me on players, trades, etc... There's certainly a balance point that makes this a miserable or enjoyable discourse.

If I can notice a difference in pepe taking it chill this year (and obv he still has his gripes with the FO, we all do), I just feel like there's a time and a place where all of that can be discussed/debated/vented and is already with some thoughtful debates.. which is basically every other thread on this board. I'm strictly saying after wins and fun games where we competed and played a lot of guys we wanted to see out there, it just felt weirdly "off" in terms of like, wins now compared to earlier on in the season.. and it's because it's not involving specific players as much. Like I understand it but the NBA is a VERY long season filled with diff chapters and roles where people have to step up, fill in, take a step back, etc. It's never hunky dory with every guy improving at the same time, and often there's so many human factors that people don't factor in to any of their wants or criticisms, and it's like we have so many people hyperfocused on so many little things they want personally that it feels dirty to just enjoy wins. Maybe I'd feel that way if I knew we were stuck with specific guys on this team, but everyone I'm "meh" on is either expiring or can be traded because of their contract being fine.

And trust me, I've had my problems over the years with cedric always being too much of a homer (:D) or basketballRob making wild statements in terms of our players or how good our team is, so I try to strike a balance and challenge my own thoughts as well.. I can understand the rationale for things without agreeing with it but also not making it my personality as much as I did 10 years ago as a poster

I've said before that we are a more talented team with kelle and Dell playing but are they the best fit? You look at it on paper and you should say "of course".....but should the fact that we went on long winning streaks both last and this year completely without them? Or was it just other guys playing above their station and it doesn't correlate?

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SOUL wrote:

Skybox wrote:Quit whining, you wet sock

Just kidding, you're not wrong. Maybe it's my own look at life but I find myself more annoyed by blind rationalizing and defending of things in the face of evidence than I do with thoughtful criticism. I can definitely change my mind on things and I like new angles thrown at me on players, trades, etc... There's certainly a balance point that makes this a miserable or enjoyable discourse.

If I can notice a difference in pepe taking it chill this year (and obv he still has his gripes with the FO, we all do), I just feel like there's a time and a place where all of that can be discussed/debated/vented and is already with some thoughtful debates.. which is basically every other thread on this board. I'm strictly saying after wins and fun games where we competed and played a lot of guys we wanted to see out there, it just felt weirdly "off" in terms of like, wins now compared to earlier on in the season.. and it's because it's not involving specific players as much. Like I understand it but the NBA is a VERY long season filled with diff chapters and roles where people have to step up, fill in, take a step back, etc. It's never hunky dory with every guy improving at the same time, and often there's so many human factors that people don't factor in to any of their wants or criticisms, and it's like we have so many people hyperfocused on so many little things they want personally that it feels dirty to just enjoy wins. Maybe I'd feel that way if I knew we were stuck with specific guys on this team, but everyone I'm "meh" on is either expiring or can be traded because of their contract being fine.

And trust me, I've had my problems over the years with cedric always being too much of a homer (:D) or basketballRob making wild statements in terms of our players or how good our team is, so I try to strike a balance and challenge my own thoughts as well.. I can understand the rationale for things without agreeing with it but also not making it my personality as much as I did 10 years ago as a poster

yep...good post!

I'm so excited that our team has progressed...but, as a fan, I'm aiming higher. "If we had just added... (this guy)", we'd really be in the thick of it. I want to be blowing out teams on the decline rather than squeaking out glorious wins. Our 3pt shooting is so glaringly bad...if we had made the league AVERAGE last night, the game is never in question.

It's kind of like the husband/wife dynamic - you tell me a problem and my brain immediately goes to fixing it....even if she just wanted to vent.

I don't hate this team or any of the players...it's kind of like how a youth coach is tougher on the players that really matter to him and that have a lot more in them.

MagicMatic wrote:Sorry not sorry if that’s considered “whining” because you can’t think outside of win or loss column results.

I don't mean this in a personal attack sort of way, but this seems pretty dismissive if you're talking about me, considering we've advocated for the same things plenty of times in the past. I feel like too many of y'all mistake me rationalizing certain decisions or explaining the reasoning for it as co-signing them, and I know you and others aren't that dense when it comes to being able to parse words that I'm trying to say.

Me saying Goga being a UFA contract/not a great floor spacer ≠ preferring WCJ over him
Me saying WCJ isn't the "worst player ever", has a good contract, or scapegoating him all the time ≠ wanting him to stay.
Me saying Black and Jett will make the team worse short-term ≠ Thinking they are busts or won't be a big part of the team in the future.
Me saying players should be held accountable more for their own play ≠ Thinking Mose is unfallible, but I consume a lot of basketball and watch other games, teams, every single coaching criticism is the same and it makes me giggle because it's like there are no good coaches according to fans.

Etc.

Even my criticism of "whining" doesn't mean enjoy the team and have no issues with it, just as a natural thing, if I won a video game with my friends and they spent the entire next 20 minutes complaining about it, eventually I'd be like "okay, let's move on..." sort of feel. After a loss? Of course I expect it. But maybe it's just me. I also know that's how the internet kinda is right now - I can watch a piece of content and not enjoy a show or movie but I'm not going out of my way trying to rip it in every platform, I'll either not care enough to post about it or go to a specific thread to vent.

Between here, reddit, IG, Twitter, FB, there just seems to be a current trend of negativity or complaining that sort of reaches an apex at some point between trolls, sports bettors, and people who are miserable with their life, mixed with people who are genuinely concerned about their team (and I would actually put 90% of posters here in that part, which is good lol) and I can stomach it when we're a **** team, but every single thread having it is a bit much lately. I get that we have expectations, but even this year most people thought we'd be 39-47 wins, which we're right on cue with.

To be honest, I found the last few minutes of regulation and the OT really funny, both teams were so bad offensively outside of grabbing offensive boards that I couldn't help but laugh. Horrible shot after horrible shot and no ball movement whatsoever. We got the win somehow but it wasn't pretty at all. Franz's points, especially his 3s in the fourth, and Isaac's defense and offensive boards were the key for the win. Good to see Cole looking better and making some big shots.

At least Mosley seems to have figured out that we are better closing games without Fultz. And it's usually pretty easy to see when Wendell has a bad game, it shows in his body language, so it might be a good idea to sit him more often when his body language gets all negative.