Idiosyncratic wrote:eyriq wrote:Idiosyncratic wrote:I actually think pepe kind of explains this best. Our bench dominated the Ingles year when we looked really good. Our starters were young so they were credited as super up and coming because of that, but we've just never actually been that good. Franz was our +/- leader that year and the next 4 highest were bench players. Suggs who we apparently can't function without his energy was just +45 for that year ( and +3 last year).
Franz has been like the one really good piece and no one else has proven anything. And even he has looked slow this year. We just probably aren't that good and went all in with a core that isn't that good. IDK I'm feeling very negative.
You're convinced by an argument that attributes our success to Joe Ingles? You are better than this.
Not Ingles himself. But the bench carried us in 23/24, that is a fact. The young core got too much credit for that season. Franz has always been the one starter rating out highly. Then we went in on a non superstar player knowing that, just because the East is weak and maybe we can hope West team is hurt in finals if we get there? I was trying to cope with Bane trade, but it just doesn't feel that great.
And I still think we can be fine this year, but just thinking bigger picture, not sure we are better off.
We had 7 players who finished with positive net points (pushing us above .500 as zero net points is .500). Let's group them by "Starter" vs. "Bench" (based on their primary role that season).
Starter vs. Bench: Net Points Credit
Positive-Rated Starters
Franz Wagner: +92
Wendell Carter Jr.: +32
Jalen Suggs: +18
STARTER TOTAL: +142
Positive-Rated Bench
Jonathan Isaac: +76
Moe Wagner: +65
Goga Bitadze: +35
Joe Ingles: +3
BENCH TOTAL: +179
I see where you're coming from, but I think that "bench carried us" narrative is the wrong way to look at it.
The team's total net points was +158, but it came from +291 Defense canceling out a -73 Offense. That elite defensive identity is set by the core.
Franz (+92): You're right, he's the proven two-way star (+46 Off / +46 Def).
Suggs (+18): This is a win. It confirms he's an All-Defense specialist (+36 Def) who is also a net positive. That's a perfect core piece.
Paolo (-4): This is the "cost" of a 21-yr-old All-Star carrying our entire offense (-34 Off). The real story is his +30 Defense rating. He bought in instead of coasting.
We won 47 games while our offense was awful and our #1 option was still developing. That 47-win season should be our FLOOR, not our ceiling.
The Bane trade just fixed our single biggest problem (that -73 offense). We're building on a proven foundation.
