Page 35 of 100

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:13 am
by VFX
pepe1991 wrote:If Banchero will play basketball in NBA like Randle is doing this year, i want no part of him. Overgrown, self proclaimed ballhandler who is clear ballstopper, despite averaging lot of APG.
There is some mix of more ballhandling ability of Boozer, later Griffin versions, Randle without passing in Banchero, but i'm not really thrilled about any of those imaginary comparisons. But if you look how most scouts are doing scouting, and how nba teams draft, he will end up going 1# because he is 6'10 guy who can attack off the dribble and make pullups. Wet dream of every scout.

With Jabari Smith it is very simple, people just overthink it. It's Aldrige with better outside shot, but without post moves. Or Lauri Markannen with better defense. I'm not really sold on idea that Jabari will be elite offensive player in NBA. Rather your typical 15 points- 8 reobunds, +36% for 3 guy. He isn't very versitale scorer. It's mostly pick&pop, ballswing for catch&shoot, garbage points and transition.
Evan Ringer's huge article about him comes to conclusion it's probably the best to develop Jabari into elite 3 and D player, rather have him dribble ball in inefficient way for team.
For sake of argument, Ringer coparisons were Jonathan Bender, Danny Granger, Tobias Harris & Lewis.


I think Jabari is probably the best out of the top 3 bigs.
That being said, I’m just not entirely sure between the 3 of them that their profiles warrant unquestionable elite nba upside.

Jabari has the stretch 4 archetype and Paolo is more of a modern Boozer/David West. I don’t think he’s a ball stopper insofar as Duke just doesn’t have the scoring options on the floor as reliable as Banchero.

Neither of those comparisons to me scream “primary #1 option” in what many consider to be a somewhat solid draft at the top. Chet is just a boom or bust prospect. Hate to say it but I’m kind of hoping there are some late risers in this draft and that these guys aren’t a completely forgone conclusion.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:19 am
by zaymon
Top 3 is so underwhelming this year. Only player who processes the game at high level is Holmgren but he will get murdered against centers. He could flourish as a forward but he is not as agile as Mobley. It could work with WCJ but thats hell of a risk for top pick.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:00 am
by Petre1978
MagicMatic wrote:
Viper1500 wrote:I am hoping for a top 2 pick, I'd be happy with either of Jabari or Banchero. Chet is clearly the biggest boom or bust in the draft.


I’m on the same page as far as bigs go…

IF they are considered BPA by all metrics it’s between the two of them.

Other than that, I’d rather take a swing on a guard or dark horse. Orlando has enough athletes with defensive upside. They need a skilled scorer at all levels to put next to Suggs and Wagner.

Which player would you take a swing on?

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 12:13 pm
by zaymon
Anyone else likes him in the top 10 ? Good length, footwork and body control. Reminds me of RJ Hampton a little. Less athletic but can use it. He doesnt shoot well from 3, but he can score on the move from midrange. Maybe range expands ?


Watch on YouTube

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:16 pm
by tiderulz
zaymon wrote:Anyone else likes him in the top 10 ? Good length, footwork and body control. Reminds me of RJ Hampton a little. Less athletic but can use it. He doesnt shoot well from 3, but he can score on the move from midrange. Maybe range expands ?


i would be very worried about comparing a player to RJ and top-10 pick in the same sentence. Unless some serious development happens, RJ will be lucky to finish his full rookie deal with options

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:44 pm
by Xatticus
zaymon wrote:Anyone else likes him in the top 10 ? Good length, footwork and body control. Reminds me of RJ Hampton a little. Less athletic but can use it. He doesnt shoot well from 3, but he can score on the move from midrange. Maybe range expands ?



He has an NBA body. He has solid strength and athleticism. He looks like an NBA player. He doesn't have the game though. He is raw. If I'm going for someone of that type, I'd take Kendall Brown over him. I can't imagine he'd be in my top 10.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:46 pm
by zaymon
tiderulz wrote:
zaymon wrote:Anyone else likes him in the top 10 ? Good length, footwork and body control. Reminds me of RJ Hampton a little. Less athletic but can use it. He doesnt shoot well from 3, but he can score on the move from midrange. Maybe range expands ?


i would be very worried about comparing a player to RJ and top-10 pick in the same sentence. Unless some serious development happens, RJ will be lucky to finish his full rookie deal with options


I think he is a lot better than Hampton. They are both shaky shooters, athletic, have some passing upside. Other than that Marjon knows how to play winning basketball and has good control over his body while Hampton does some random things on the court. Their 2p% is 39 vs 68. I dont think it all translates to the nba for Beauchamp becouse he shoots a lot of midrangers but his moves are fluid, he has some deception and can go all the way to the rim. Hampton moves akwardly and you almost always know what he will do next.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:57 pm
by VFX
Petre1978 wrote:
MagicMatic wrote:
Viper1500 wrote:I am hoping for a top 2 pick, I'd be happy with either of Jabari or Banchero. Chet is clearly the biggest boom or bust in the draft.


I’m on the same page as far as bigs go…

IF they are considered BPA by all metrics it’s between the two of them.

Other than that, I’d rather take a swing on a guard or dark horse. Orlando has enough athletes with defensive upside. They need a skilled scorer at all levels to put next to Suggs and Wagner.

Which player would you take a swing on?


Mathurin, Griffin, Brown, Davis, and Ivey as far as late January early February goes.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 1:57 pm
by tiderulz
zaymon wrote:
tiderulz wrote:
zaymon wrote:Anyone else likes him in the top 10 ? Good length, footwork and body control. Reminds me of RJ Hampton a little. Less athletic but can use it. He doesnt shoot well from 3, but he can score on the move from midrange. Maybe range expands ?


i would be very worried about comparing a player to RJ and top-10 pick in the same sentence. Unless some serious development happens, RJ will be lucky to finish his full rookie deal with options


I think he is a lot better than Hampton. They are both shaky shooters, athletic, have some passing upside. Other than that Marjon knows how to play winning basketball and has good control over his body while Hampton does some random things on the court. Their 2p% is 39 vs 68. I dont think it all translates to the nba for Beauchamp becouse he shoots a lot of midrangers but his moves are fluid, he has some deception and can go all the way to the rim. Hampton moves akwardly and you almost always know what he will do next.

ok. i cant say ive seen him play at all. I just didnt like the RJ comparison because RJ just isnt a good player and looking back, should not have gone in the 1st round.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 2:41 pm
by Petre1978

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 2:45 pm
by jonbob17
RookieStar wrote:
6'9 ( supposedly ) and 260... unless he has elite hops I don't think he is gonna get that much rebounds in the nba. If we are gonna talk.about behemoths for our backup.bigs, why not.koffi? Almost same except 2 inches taller and shoots better?

I personally think this kind of C isn't feasible to the league and especially us. BUT i have been wrong before so who knows.


I went back and found his prep write up from The Stepien, when they still were actively covering prep and college players. FWIW they had him ranked 7th in his class coming into college (2020 nba draft class)

"Tshiebwe is MAYBE the single most dominant player in all of high school basketball right now. Some of the players ranked above him come close and of course the guy ranked number one overall has a good case for that title, but Tshiebwe is right up there. He plays with the strength and physicality of someone 10 years his senior. Not only is he a great finisher with his power game, he is also fairly agile, runs the floor like a huge guard and has exceptional defensive instincts as both a rim protector and help defender in other capacities, constantly getting in passing lanes, causing deflections and otherwise creating events and inserting himself into defensive sequences. There is certainly no defensive player that is more impactful than Tshiebwe at the high school level right now, and he is the rare player that is able to make a substantial impact as a rebounder. Tshiebwe’s official age is still unknown to me at the time of me writing this. Being born as little as six months apart could be a relatively important factor for prospects at this early stage of their development, and I’m well aware of the exact age of every prospect on this ranking outside Tshiebwe. However, outside of that nontrivial question mark, Tshiebwe has all the things you’d like from a modern day center prospect. I suppose his height measurement isn’t ideal at 6-foot-9 or 6-foot-10, but with his length, explosive leaping, instincts and general ferocity, it’s something I’m willing to overlook."


Outside of Embiid, Jokic, and Gobert who are all max guys and worth the $, seems like the nba is gravitating towards smaller guys at the 5 that don't cost quite as much and work really hard. Robert Williams-type

The motor is the interesting part. He's having one of the most dominant rebounding seasons in college basketball history. Nobody has averaged 15 rebounds a game in college since 1980. 24% offensive rebound rate, the highest rate since they started tracking it.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 3:26 pm
by tiderulz
jonbob17 wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
6'9 ( supposedly ) and 260... unless he has elite hops I don't think he is gonna get that much rebounds in the nba. If we are gonna talk.about behemoths for our backup.bigs, why not.koffi? Almost same except 2 inches taller and shoots better?

I personally think this kind of C isn't feasible to the league and especially us. BUT i have been wrong before so who knows.


I went back and found his prep write up from The Stepien, when they still were actively covering prep and college players. FWIW they had him ranked 7th in his class coming into college (2020 nba draft class)

"Tshiebwe is MAYBE the single most dominant player in all of high school basketball right now. Some of the players ranked above him come close and of course the guy ranked number one overall has a good case for that title, but Tshiebwe is right up there. He plays with the strength and physicality of someone 10 years his senior. Not only is he a great finisher with his power game, he is also fairly agile, runs the floor like a huge guard and has exceptional defensive instincts as both a rim protector and help defender in other capacities, constantly getting in passing lanes, causing deflections and otherwise creating events and inserting himself into defensive sequences. There is certainly no defensive player that is more impactful than Tshiebwe at the high school level right now, and he is the rare player that is able to make a substantial impact as a rebounder. Tshiebwe’s official age is still unknown to me at the time of me writing this. Being born as little as six months apart could be a relatively important factor for prospects at this early stage of their development, and I’m well aware of the exact age of every prospect on this ranking outside Tshiebwe. However, outside of that nontrivial question mark, Tshiebwe has all the things you’d like from a modern day center prospect. I suppose his height measurement isn’t ideal at 6-foot-9 or 6-foot-10, but with his length, explosive leaping, instincts and general ferocity, it’s something I’m willing to overlook."


Outside of Embiid, Jokic, and Gobert who are all max guys and worth the $, seems like the nba is gravitating towards smaller guys at the 5 that don't cost quite as much and work really hard. Robert Williams-type

The motor is the interesting part. He's having one of the most dominant rebounding seasons in college basketball history. Nobody has averaged 15 rebounds a game in college since 1980. 24% offensive rebound rate, the highest rate since they started tracking it.

is Gobert really a max guy and worth it? i dont remember Utah doing much with him until they got Mitchell.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 4:05 pm
by OrlChamps2030
Knightro wrote:
OrlChamps2030 wrote:I’ll concede it’s not a great comparison, as one is a hybrid PF and one is a true wing but I think there’s some similarities in how they score. A lot of iso work in the high post. And Banchero looks like an even better passer than Tatum

Jabari is my #1 prospect but not totally sure I see the Tatum comparison. Either way, he looks like a juiced up Rashard/Jaren Jackson hybrid.. a textbook modern PF.

I’d be happy with either guy


I like your Jabari comparison. A little mix of Jaren Jackson and Rashard Lewis makes a lot of sense to me.

I'm trying to figure out a good one for Banchero. There's a little end of the Clippers run, beginning of the Pistons run Blake Griffin in there. There's a little current Julius Randle in there. Dare I say there's even some Knicks era Carmelo in there?

They're both good in different ways.


For some reason, I’ve been seeing healthy Pistons Blake Griffin for a little while now.. definitely see some Randle/Knicks Melo too

pepe1991 wrote:If Banchero will play basketball in NBA like Randle is doing this year, i want no part of him. Overgrown, self proclaimed ballhandler who is clear ballstopper, despite averaging lot of APG.
There is some mix of more ballhandling ability of Boozer, later Griffin versions, Randle without passing in Banchero, but i'm not really thrilled about any of those imaginary comparisons. But if you look how most scouts are doing scouting, and how nba teams draft, he will end up going 1# because he is 6'10 guy who can attack off the dribble and make pullups. Wet dream of every scout.


I don’t want to nitpick but I feel like I still see this everywhere.. why do some still consider Banchero a bad passer? He actually looks like a plus passer already.. maybe even one of the better passing PFs to come out in a while

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:44 pm
by Knightro
OrlChamps2030 wrote:I don’t want to nitpick but I feel like I still see this everywhere.. why do some still consider Banchero a bad passer? He actually looks like a plus passer already.. maybe even one of the better passing PFs to come out in a while


I'm with you. Banchero at age 19 is showing the kind of passing that it took Randle like 3-4 years to really even start to develop and like 6-7 until it was a legitimate high end skill.

Randle in college only had 57 assists total in 1233 minutes. Banchero already has 48 in just 557 minutes.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:55 pm
by basketballRob
The one thing I like about Banchero is his size. I hate having a soft, physically intimidated team. Plus he'd probably fit alongside one of Isaac, Chuma, or Wagner.

Sent from my SM-G950U using RealGM Forums mobile app

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 5:56 pm
by jonbob17
tiderulz wrote:is Gobert really a max guy and worth it? i dont remember Utah doing much with him until they got Mitchell.


Yah, probably. It's hard to argue against what he does. He's extremely tough against opponents perimeter players. Actually can get beat against good centers. The offense he does produce is at a really high efficiency, 73% true shooting this year 67% career. I think we have learned that he is a bigger part of the offense that originally thought.

Looking at all the advanced metrics like win shares and Plus Minus he is amongst the league leaders year in and year out.

I would have never have offered close to that much money to any center not named Jokic/Embiid at the time, but I think so far he has proved the doubters, including myself, wrong. I do think Utah will run into trouble building a winner as both Mitchell and Gobert's contracts continue to escalate, but for now they are still in the window for a championship, I'd argue the 2nd best team in the West, sort of hit the skids a bit recently with Gobert and others out.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:06 pm
by Xatticus
tiderulz wrote:
jonbob17 wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
6'9 ( supposedly ) and 260... unless he has elite hops I don't think he is gonna get that much rebounds in the nba. If we are gonna talk.about behemoths for our backup.bigs, why not.koffi? Almost same except 2 inches taller and shoots better?

I personally think this kind of C isn't feasible to the league and especially us. BUT i have been wrong before so who knows.


I went back and found his prep write up from The Stepien, when they still were actively covering prep and college players. FWIW they had him ranked 7th in his class coming into college (2020 nba draft class)

"Tshiebwe is MAYBE the single most dominant player in all of high school basketball right now. Some of the players ranked above him come close and of course the guy ranked number one overall has a good case for that title, but Tshiebwe is right up there. He plays with the strength and physicality of someone 10 years his senior. Not only is he a great finisher with his power game, he is also fairly agile, runs the floor like a huge guard and has exceptional defensive instincts as both a rim protector and help defender in other capacities, constantly getting in passing lanes, causing deflections and otherwise creating events and inserting himself into defensive sequences. There is certainly no defensive player that is more impactful than Tshiebwe at the high school level right now, and he is the rare player that is able to make a substantial impact as a rebounder. Tshiebwe’s official age is still unknown to me at the time of me writing this. Being born as little as six months apart could be a relatively important factor for prospects at this early stage of their development, and I’m well aware of the exact age of every prospect on this ranking outside Tshiebwe. However, outside of that nontrivial question mark, Tshiebwe has all the things you’d like from a modern day center prospect. I suppose his height measurement isn’t ideal at 6-foot-9 or 6-foot-10, but with his length, explosive leaping, instincts and general ferocity, it’s something I’m willing to overlook."


Outside of Embiid, Jokic, and Gobert who are all max guys and worth the $, seems like the nba is gravitating towards smaller guys at the 5 that don't cost quite as much and work really hard. Robert Williams-type

The motor is the interesting part. He's having one of the most dominant rebounding seasons in college basketball history. Nobody has averaged 15 rebounds a game in college since 1980. 24% offensive rebound rate, the highest rate since they started tracking it.

is Gobert really a max guy and worth it? i dont remember Utah doing much with him until they got Mitchell.


Yes. Gobert is Utah’s star. It isn’t Mitchell. Gobert’s on/off splits have been terrific for a long time. Mitchell’s haven’t.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:08 pm
by Xatticus
OrlChamps2030 wrote:
Knightro wrote:
OrlChamps2030 wrote:I’ll concede it’s not a great comparison, as one is a hybrid PF and one is a true wing but I think there’s some similarities in how they score. A lot of iso work in the high post. And Banchero looks like an even better passer than Tatum

Jabari is my #1 prospect but not totally sure I see the Tatum comparison. Either way, he looks like a juiced up Rashard/Jaren Jackson hybrid.. a textbook modern PF.

I’d be happy with either guy


I like your Jabari comparison. A little mix of Jaren Jackson and Rashard Lewis makes a lot of sense to me.

I'm trying to figure out a good one for Banchero. There's a little end of the Clippers run, beginning of the Pistons run Blake Griffin in there. There's a little current Julius Randle in there. Dare I say there's even some Knicks era Carmelo in there?

They're both good in different ways.


For some reason, I’ve been seeing healthy Pistons Blake Griffin for a little while now.. definitely see some Randle/Knicks Melo too

pepe1991 wrote:If Banchero will play basketball in NBA like Randle is doing this year, i want no part of him. Overgrown, self proclaimed ballhandler who is clear ballstopper, despite averaging lot of APG.
There is some mix of more ballhandling ability of Boozer, later Griffin versions, Randle without passing in Banchero, but i'm not really thrilled about any of those imaginary comparisons. But if you look how most scouts are doing scouting, and how nba teams draft, he will end up going 1# because he is 6'10 guy who can attack off the dribble and make pullups. Wet dream of every scout.


I don’t want to nitpick but I feel like I still see this everywhere.. why do some still consider Banchero a bad passer? He actually looks like a plus passer already.. maybe even one of the better passing PFs to come out in a while


If by “healthy” you mean old and healthy Blake Griffin… then sure. He isn’t close to what a young Blake Griffin was as an athlete. I think this is where much of the concern comes in.

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 6:18 pm
by OrlChamps2030
Xatticus wrote: If by “healthy” you mean old and healthy Blake Griffin… then sure. He isn’t close to what a young Blake Griffin was as an athlete. I think this is where much of the concern comes in.


I agree Banchero is no where close to young Blake Griffin as an athlete.. that’s why we’re referencing Detroit Blake Griffin. Mainly his first full season there when he was healthy and still cared about basketball

Re: The 2022 NBA Draft Thread

Posted: Tue Jan 25, 2022 8:09 pm
by RookieStar
jonbob17 wrote:
RookieStar wrote:
6'9 ( supposedly ) and 260... unless he has elite hops I don't think he is gonna get that much rebounds in the nba. If we are gonna talk.about behemoths for our backup.bigs, why not.koffi? Almost same except 2 inches taller and shoots better?

I personally think this kind of C isn't feasible to the league and especially us. BUT i have been wrong before so who knows.


I went back and found his prep write up from The Stepien, when they still were actively covering prep and college players. FWIW they had him ranked 7th in his class coming into college (2020 nba draft class)

"Tshiebwe is MAYBE the single most dominant player in all of high school basketball right now. Some of the players ranked above him come close and of course the guy ranked number one overall has a good case for that title, but Tshiebwe is right up there. He plays with the strength and physicality of someone 10 years his senior. Not only is he a great finisher with his power game, he is also fairly agile, runs the floor like a huge guard and has exceptional defensive instincts as both a rim protector and help defender in other capacities, constantly getting in passing lanes, causing deflections and otherwise creating events and inserting himself into defensive sequences. There is certainly no defensive player that is more impactful than Tshiebwe at the high school level right now, and he is the rare player that is able to make a substantial impact as a rebounder. Tshiebwe’s official age is still unknown to me at the time of me writing this. Being born as little as six months apart could be a relatively important factor for prospects at this early stage of their development, and I’m well aware of the exact age of every prospect on this ranking outside Tshiebwe. However, outside of that nontrivial question mark, Tshiebwe has all the things you’d like from a modern day center prospect. I suppose his height measurement isn’t ideal at 6-foot-9 or 6-foot-10, but with his length, explosive leaping, instincts and general ferocity, it’s something I’m willing to overlook."


Outside of Embiid, Jokic, and Gobert who are all max guys and worth the $, seems like the nba is gravitating towards smaller guys at the 5 that don't cost quite as much and work really hard. Robert Williams-type

The motor is the interesting part. He's having one of the most dominant rebounding seasons in college basketball history. Nobody has averaged 15 rebounds a game in college since 1980. 24% offensive rebound rate, the highest rate since they started tracking it.


Jaffro? Capella? AD? JV? Adams? KAT? Ayton? Vuc?

They aren't really small.... in fact, no one of them is shorter than6'10

But yeah we are talking about backup or backup of the backup aka 3rd BIG off the bench. I agree that it should be a C but I don't like the C archetype of a Biyombo/Birch. I prefer more my backup C to be a scoring type especially with all the defensive wings/guards we have already.