Official Raptors 2011 NBA Draft Thread Part 9

[Truthrising]

My guess on how the management would rate the players would be:
1. Knight
2. Valenciunas
3. Kanter

I'll be fine with whoever they pick.

I think we might like Biyombo too, considering all of BC's talk about the lack of a defensive, rebounding presence that can protect the basket, and how our most glaring weakness is at C. But yeah I think barring a trade, we're definitely going to walk away with one of those 4 guys on draft night.

Agreed, Assuming all 3 players are taken I would definately take a flyer on Biyombo

[Ackshun]

every week or so, i dwell on how terrible this draft truly is. (this is my assessment. you do not have to agree with any of it)

Bismack - averaging 6 rpg in a Spanish league, shooting below 50% from the charity stripe, and had 45 turnovers in 14 games for his former team.

Brandon Knight - Putting up an assist/turnover ratio of 1/.76 doesn't do much for me. If he was a profilic scorer, than sure, but I don't see that either.

Jonas - Buyout situation

Kemba - Another score-first point guard who isn't that efficient scoring it. With major minutes these past two seasons, he's shot 40% and 42% respectively.

Enes Kanter - Gone when we select. The second best NBA player in the draft.

Kawhi Leonard - 3 bench press reps at the combine. Uses his size often (evidence with 10rpg), but does this translate at the next level? Doesn't have any sort of explosiveness to warrant a high pick.

Jan Vesely - not strong enough to play down low Not sure how I feel about his handles/hands, to play out on the perimeter. Probably a lot of upside here but with a big gamble.

Marcus Morris - is Marcus Morris.

Jimmer Fredette - I question if he has point guard handles.

--

Feeling that players in our range have little upside, I would trade the pick for 2 later picks, perhaps Houston (#14 and #23) or Charlotte (#9 and #19).

Players I do like - Chris Singleton, Norris Cole, David Lighty, Marshon Brooks, Nikola Vucevic, and Iman Shumpert.

----

Basically, Kyrie or die tryin'

[Kevin Willis]

Pretty accurate Ackshun.

Does anyone know how workouts went yesterday?

[bloojoo]

every week or so, i dwell on how terrible this draft truly is. (this is my assessment. you do not have to agree with any of it)

Bismack - averaging 6 rpg in a Spanish league, shooting below 50% from the charity stripe, and had 45 turnovers in 14 games for his former team.

Brandon Knight - Putting up an assist/turnover ratio of 1/.76 doesn't do much for me. If he was a profilic scorer, than sure, but I don't see that either.

Jonas - Buyout situation

Kemba - Another score-first point guard who isn't that efficient scoring it. With major minutes these past two seasons, he's shot 40% and 42% respectively.

Enes Kanter - Gone when we select. The second best NBA player in the draft.

Kawhi Leonard - 3 bench press reps at the combine. Uses his size often (evidence with 10rpg), but does this translate at the next level? Doesn't have any sort of explosiveness to warrant a high pick.

Jan Vesely - not strong enough to play down low Not sure how I feel about his handles/hands, to play out on the perimeter. Probably a lot of upside here but with a big gamble.

Marcus Morris - is Marcus Morris.

Jimmer Fredette - I question if he has point guard handles.

--

Feeling that players in our range have little upside, I would trade the pick for 2 later picks, perhaps Houston (#14 and #23) or Charlotte (#9 and #19).

Players I do like - Chris Singleton, Norris Cole, David Lighty, Marshon Brooks, Nikola Vucevic, and Iman Shumpert.

----

Basically, Kyrie or die tryin'

Biyombo - In Fuenlabrada he averaged 6.4ppg 5.1rpg and 2.3bpg 55% FT and 1.6 TO in 17 MPG!!! is it not fair to say that he has improved since playing for Illescas?

Knight- I kind of agree. He's not as prolific of a scorer that he's made out to be. TO prone/Bad decision making.

Kemba - Again he scored because he was the only real scoring threat the Huskies had other than Freshman Jeremy Lamb. And what did that get him? only the national championship. He's a much better playmaker than people realize. Size will always be an issue though.

Enes Kanter - Hasn't played against real competition for a long time so he's a big question mark.

Kawhi Leonard - its pointless to puch any stock in bench press when evaluating wing players. Just look at Kevin Durant and Joey Graham and tell me which one is a superstar and which one is a scrub.

Vesely - agreed. no handles no shot. his value is purely based on upside.

Fredette - more importantly is he still effective without the ball in his hands or without the green light to jack up 30ft pull up jumpers in transition? defense is also a serious issue as he doesn't play D at all.

again this is only my opinion so you are welcome to disagree.

[demarderozanftw]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mu96EoByub8&feature=channel_video_title[/youtube]

[T_Biggums]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mu96EoByub8&feature=channel_video_title[/youtube]

Flame away if you want but he looks like a Bargnani clone at the defensive end. Absolutely no intensity, slaps at the ball when trying to rebound, doesn't elevate at all.

[ty123]

Kanter seems not interested in playing defense.

[Kevin Willis]

Kanter does more complicated things than defense.

[5DOM]

I'm now convinced that we won't pick Kanter. He's not a good fit next to Bargs and BC doesn't want that. BC repeatedly mentioned defense and shot blocking, and I doubt Kanter provides them

[Indeed]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mu96EoByub8&feature=channel_video_title[/youtube]

Man defense - not so good, not staying close enough nor use his body to his man make tough shots (didn't challenge any shot). Maybe he wasn't putting the effort yet.

Rebounding - he seems to be good at this. Saw him got out rebounded in a zone, which makes sense, because a zone is harder to know who you should box out. And he wasn't putting the effort to boxout neither, but higher competition will force him to do those things.

Rotation - it is hard to tell since they are playing zone. Bargnani can do all those rotation in the zone, so it doesn't tell you much. However, he doesn't show his shot blocking skill, nor lower his stance to guard the switched man. Maybe he wasn't putting the effort yet.


Conclusion - a little concern, but as they are playing zone, it is hard to tell. Lack the shot blocking or lane intimation. Defense is very similar to Bargnani, a little hesitated, and didn't lower his stance on switch (maybe he was tired like Bargnani?). However, the rebounding would be an upgrade.

[bboyskinnylegs]

Kanter looks like a bigger version of Kevin Love.

[T_Biggums]

Kanter looks like a bigger version of Kevin Love.

Are you going on what saw in this video?

[bboyskinnylegs]

Kanter looks like a bigger version of Kevin Love.

Are you going on what saw in this video?

based on all the footage I've seen of him (including this defensive footage). Love is a pretty terrible defender too, but has a solid offensive game and is a great rebounder. Enes could still be the best player available, and is certainly an upgrade over Bargnani, but I have doubts as to whether he would be our longterm solution at C. That said, these videos are from when he was 16-17, so it's not like he can't improve on defense (although you would hope he might look better against high schoolers), I just don't see the kind of defensive mindset I'd want from a C in the limited video we've seen of him.

[5DOM]

If we are only basing this on the defensive footage, I wouldn't be surprised if he's worse than Bargnani at D. At least Bargnani can play man-to-man D fairly well. This guy doesn't even move.

[T_Biggums]

Kanter looks like a bigger version of Kevin Love.

Are you going on what saw in this video?

based on all the footage I've seen of him (including this defensive footage). Love is a pretty terrible defender too, but has a solid offensive game and is a great rebounder. Enes could still be the best player available, and is certainly an upgrade over Bargnani, but I have doubts as to whether he would be our longterm solution at C. That said, these videos are from when he was 16-17, so it's not like he can't improve on defense (although you would hope he might look better against high schoolers), I just don't see the kind of defensive mindset I'd want from a C in the limited video we've seen of him.

Kevin Love is leagues better than Enes at defending. The fact that he's such a great rebounder is evidence of that. He may not be the best man defender but he never gets bodied out of position nor does he allow his man to establish good position in the block. He's not a lane intimidator but he has good defensive fundamentals that make him adequate.

Enes doesn't even look like he knows what to do when the ball is in the air. He is caught watching and in turn allows his man to get great positioning for rebounds

[Blazing_royale]

alright its settle. we don't want Kanter.

[Indeed]

Are you going on what saw in this video?

based on all the footage I've seen of him (including this defensive footage). Love is a pretty terrible defender too, but has a solid offensive game and is a great rebounder. Enes could still be the best player available, and is certainly an upgrade over Bargnani, but I have doubts as to whether he would be our longterm solution at C. That said, these videos are from when he was 16-17, so it's not like he can't improve on defense (although you would hope he might look better against high schoolers), I just don't see the kind of defensive mindset I'd want from a C in the limited video we've seen of him.

Kevin Love is leagues better than Enes at defending. The fact that he's such a great rebounder is evidence of that. He may not be the best man defender but he never gets bodied out of position nor does he allow his man to establish good position in the block. He's not a lane intimidator but he has good defensive fundamentals that make him adequate.

Enes doesn't even look like he knows what to do when the ball is in the air. He is caught watching and in turn allows his man to get great positioning for rebounds

Indeed, Love is more athletic. However, Kanter can defend center (I believe he can), so he can be more versatile. Neither of them able to defend perimeter bigs effectively, but they can defend average PF/C in the paint.

[Indeed]

Kanter looks like a bigger version of Kevin Love.

Are you going on what saw in this video?

based on all the footage I've seen of him (including this defensive footage). Love is a pretty terrible defender too, but has a solid offensive game and is a great rebounder. Enes could still be the best player available, and is certainly an upgrade over Bargnani, but I have doubts as to whether he would be our longterm solution at C. That said, these videos are from when he was 16-17, so it's not like he can't improve on defense (although you would hope he might look better against high schoolers), I just don't see the kind of defensive mindset I'd want from a C in the limited video we've seen of him.

I don't think it is an upgrade over Bargnani.
Bargnani is quicker and more athletic than Kanter (man defense, man to man blocks).
On the offensive end, you are missing a big who can play on the perimeter, and able to shoot the ball really well.

I think you will see more rebounding, more plays in the paint, and slightly more hustling, but in terms of effectiveness, I think it would be the same having either Bargnani or Kanter. We still lack a shot blocker and someone agile/mobile enough to cover for ground.

[Rhettmatic]

Fran Fraschilla has a breakdown of Valanciunas here:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?nam ... id=6640483

He says his best case is Pau Gasol, but emphasizes that it's his best case.

[FluLikeSymptoms]

Fran Fraschilla has a breakdown of Valanciunas here:

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/blog?nam ... id=6640483

He says his best case is Pau Gasol, but emphasizes that it's his best case.

Which Pao Gasol? Con cojones or sin cojones?