3rd time's a charm?: Cle vs Orl 10/29

[SD2042]

Our core guys have known nothing but losing except ibaka. Biz had a taste last year but not enough. We need a legit go to guy right now but if we can live up to the potential on d we will be a team to watch out for.

Offense is a talent.
Defense is grit and grind hard work.

Just like the Grizzlies

[Optimus_Steel]

How many 3-on-1 fastbreaks does Fournier have to ruin before people realize the guy is a selfish dick head. Last year was the same thing but we assumed it was to get paid. He's talented but I'd rather have a less talented player that'll move the god damn ball if Evan won't do it.

We are a bad fast breaking team regardless of who. When Dipo was here he messed plenty. Elf has trouble on the fast break. Even Gordon. Idk why but overall we are a terrible fast break team. Guess we lack the smarts.

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[MagicStarwipe]

He made 1 big shot. It doesn't matter how much he scores, the guy is simply a net negative. He was passing better tonight though and he still had plenty of boneheaded, selfish plays.

He needs to be selfish. This team is bad at scoring and he is our best perimeter scorer.

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This line of thinking needs to stop and is so faulty that I'm not going to address it fully, but no, you don't play like an asshat because you're the team's best scorer. You take smart and efficient shots. You play within the team. Anybody will live with him missing if he does that instead of not passing on fast breaks or looking off open players continuously.

Agree. It's just such a horrible way of looking at the game. Selfish basketball is NEVER good, it NEVER wins games and it's NEVER something that should be advocated. Unless the guy doing it is Jordan or Kobe, you don't stand a chance.

[doct3r dr3]

blowout moral victory

[Magic_Johnny12]

For some odd reason I think we make a strong push for Hayward at the deadline

I don't think we have anything the Jazz would want for Hayward.

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

[VFX]

The Harris trade looks real bad now given what they need now...

Believe me when I say that I want Harris back but I don't remember winning a Cavs game with Harris on the team.

It has to do with complimenting each other...

You saw what got us back in the game? It was a stretch line-up that featured Jeff Green at PF...

You essentially traded a guy who did what Jeff Green did in that run but is much better.

This team can't run a "Big" defense anymore and Gordon is surely not going to be the 3 for more than spot minutes either. Vucevic will definitely be benched or you balance it out with Hezonja at the 3 to open up the floor.

After watching this game its apparent that a lot of this will change as the first 2 3/4 games what Hennigan or whoever tried to implement was not working.

Right exactly...
Except I'd rather have a starter now and a decent deep bench( that can play multiple positions) than have Vuc rotating between Ibaka and Biz... No thanks to that. Find a wing somewhere Hennigan.

[RickB-Orlando]

I will say this, Vogel actually is experimenting unlike Skiles (and leaves guys in long enough to make mistakes or look good). Things are becoming clearer.

This.

I suspect the first ten games - if not more - will be about Vogel figuring out what works and what doesn't.

[Def Swami]

For some odd reason I think we make a strong push for Hayward at the deadline

I don't think we have anything the Jazz would want for Hayward.

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

PHX - Vucevic
Utah - Knight + Fournier
Orlando - Hayward
is what I came up with off the top

[Magic_Johnny12]

For some odd reason I think we make a strong push for Hayward at the deadline

Hawyward isn't going anywhere...

Gobert
Favors
Hayward
Hood
Hill


will be a championship caliber team in a season or two...

Don't hold your breath.

They said the same exact thing two seasons ago. Favors looks like he's damaged goods and reports indicate Hayward is one step out the door already.
I don't believe their current core will make it out the west.

[Magic_Johnny12]

I don't think we have anything the Jazz would want for Hayward.

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

PHX - Vucevic
Utah - Knight + Fournier
Orlando - Hayward
is what I came up with off the top

I hate to break it to yah, but Fournier isn't going anywhere bud.

[MagicStarwipe]

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

PHX - Vucevic
Utah - Knight + Fournier
Orlando - Hayward
is what I came up with off the top

I hate to break it to yah, but Fournier isn't going anywhere bud.

Depends who you can get for him. I could potentially see them letting him go for Hayward.

[bigpimpatl]

For some odd reason I think we make a strong push for Hayward at the deadline

I don't think we have anything the Jazz would want for Hayward.

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

Did you ever stop and ask yourself why you would trade Jae Crowder for Nikola Vucevic? Critical thinking.

[OrlandO]

The key to this game by the box score is turnovers.... 21 vs 9. Nearly EVERY other team stat was a win for us. Crazy

Big gap in turnovers, but I'd say the biggest key was 3pt defense (made worse by our own 3pt struggles).

1st half
Cavs 8/19 3pt
cavs 4 turnovers / magic 10 turnovers
Cavs outscore us by 17

2nd half
Cavs 3/18 3pt (0 made until last 3 minutes)
cavs 5 turnovers / magic 11 turnovers
Magic outscore Cavs by 11

They blew us out with 3 pointers early then they held us off late by nailing multiple 3s within minutes.

[SOUL]

And reports indicate Hayward is one step out the door already.

There are no "reports" ... it's just Ryen Russillo saying some crap. He's their best player and they don't have enough wing depth to even contemplate moving him unless it was for an equal or better wing, which in that case, they'd have to move Exum or somebody else as well.

[MagicStarwipe]

7 offensive rebounds for Biz. That's big time.

[j-ragg]

7 offensive rebounds for Biz. That's big time.

He was awesome for us. If only he could make some damn free throws.

[NEM]

To Orlando:
Hayward

To Houston:
Vucevic

To Utah:
Ariza

Utah may need some more incentive, maybe rights to a player or a pick, but I think it could get done.

Payton/augustin
Fournier/hezonja
Hayward/hezonja/green
Gordon/green/Ibaka
Ibaka/biyombo

[Magic_Johnny12]

I don't think we have anything the Jazz would want for Hayward.

Then you involve a third party, we have plenty of assets to make a trade feasible just got to do your homework prior.

We definitely need to go small. Ibaka at center and Gordon at the 4 with Biyombo being the first big off the bench.

Boston - Vucevic
Orlando- Hayward
Utah - Crowder

Picks will be involved.

(9 man rotation)

Payton - Augustine
Fournier - Hezonja
Hayward - Green
Gordon
Ibaka - Biyombo

Did you ever stop and ask yourself why you would trade Jae Crowder for Nikola Vucevic? Critical thinking.

Go to their boards or even the TT boards and you'll see where I gathered my critical thinking from bud. First off they just drafted with the #3 pick a wing that is more than capable of filling and developing into Crowders role. They desperately in need of a solid consistent rebounder and some C fans have already brought up Vuc as a target so it's not as far fetched as you make it seem. Like I said picks would have to be involved.

[Magic_Johnny12]

And reports indicate Hayward is one step out the door already.

There are no "reports" ... it's just Ryen Russillo saying some crap. He's their best player and they don't have enough wing depth to even contemplate moving him unless it was for an equal or better wing, which in that case, they'd have to move Exum or somebody else as well.

Exum/Johnson/Ingles/Burkes/Hood?

[RexRyan]

I hate to break it to yah, but Fournier isn't going anywhere bud.

I wonder if that's the same thing people were saying after Henny forked out all that money on Harris last year. Rob's going to need another scapegoat. Evan's the most logical choice.