2021-22 Season Discussion and Speculation

[BobbieL]

Have to dump with picks, bad optics but only way Sarver gets out of paying $80m in tax.

Stretching doesn't save anything really as you have to pay them and the replacement and over more years and since no salary actually got cut there's a clog in salary in 2 years so the luxury tax is highest when we need to replace Paul and then we can't it's like bad tetris just get rid of the bad row asap and avoid pile up errors.

How do we know Sarver won't pay the luxury tax?

has he ever said it. he has a minority owner would like $3b -- that guy can afford the lux tax himself.

and again, you do not sign Shamet or trade for Craig in a bubble

[bwgood77]

Have to dump with picks, bad optics but only way Sarver gets out of paying $80m in tax.

Stretching doesn't save anything really as you have to pay them and the replacement and over more years and since no salary actually got cut there's a clog in salary in 2 years so the luxury tax is highest when we need to replace Paul and then we can't it's like bad tetris just get rid of the bad row asap and avoid pile up errors.

How do we know Sarver won't pay the luxury tax?

has he ever said it. he has a minority owner would like $3b -- that guy can afford the lux tax himself.

and again, you do not sign Shamet or trade for Craig in a bubble

He will pay it, but will he really want to go up from $30 or $40 million in tax to $60 to $70 or $80 to keep players like Craig, Saric, and potentially a couple others? Especially when we may want to user our tax MLE?

[BobbieL]

Have to dump with picks, bad optics but only way Sarver gets out of paying $80m in tax.

Stretching doesn't save anything really as you have to pay them and the replacement and over more years and since no salary actually got cut there's a clog in salary in 2 years so the luxury tax is highest when we need to replace Paul and then we can't it's like bad tetris just get rid of the bad row asap and avoid pile up errors.

How do we know Sarver won't pay the luxury tax?

has he ever said it. he has a minority owner would like $3b -- that guy can afford the lux tax himself.

and again, you do not sign Shamet or trade for Craig in a bubble

He will pay it, but will he really want to go up from $30 or $40 million in tax to $60 to $70 or $80 to keep players like Craig, Saric, and potentially a couple others? Especially when we may want to user our tax MLE?

Why the Shamet signing never made sense unless they have plans to use the contract to trade for another player

[bwgood77]

How do we know Sarver won't pay the luxury tax?

has he ever said it. he has a minority owner would like $3b -- that guy can afford the lux tax himself.

and again, you do not sign Shamet or trade for Craig in a bubble

He will pay it, but will he really want to go up from $30 or $40 million in tax to $60 to $70 or $80 to keep players like Craig, Saric, and potentially a couple others? Especially when we may want to user our tax MLE?

Why the Shamet signing never made sense unless they have plans to use the contract to trade for another player

You wouldn't give him that big of contract to trade him. We probably expected a very good year and though he could raise his value higher than that and wanted to lock him in with an extension, but it was a terrible move.

[TeamTragic]

I have noticed that this team along with others in the NBA have a major issue. That issue being whether to build a regular season team or a playoff team.

We could really use Saric right now but honestly we should be more consistent in the playoffs. I understand that Willie Green bailed but I just wonder why we didn't keep him.

I don't want to dwell on the past but at this point I think this team is fine but Monty has dropped off. I really think that we need to upgrade the coaching staff in the offseason.

How do we make this team better? What needs the most improvement?

[Mulhollanddrive]

We are an extremely good team but I don't think we've ever had the highest ceiling, if the opposition has the best player it requires everything else running smoothly, which is a credit to us for being so consistant bar a few weeks.

[lilfishi22]

I have noticed that this team along with others in the NBA have a major issue. That issue being whether to build a regular season team or a playoff team.

We could really use Saric right now but honestly we should be more consistent in the playoffs. I understand that Willie Green bailed but I just wonder why we didn't keep him.

I don't want to dwell on the past but at this point I think this team is fine but Monty has dropped off. I really think that we need to upgrade the coaching staff in the offseason.

How do we make this team better? What needs the most improvement?

I don't think Monty has "fallen off" or that Willie Green is that missing piece on our coaching staff. I think Monty is pretty much who always has been since taking over the Suns. His habit of not calling timeouts until too late, stubbornness in making changes or poor rotations has always been there. I think he's a really solid coach, a great regular season coach but in the playoffs, I don't necessarily think he has proven to be elite.

I think what we are seeing is talent winning through rather than immense coaching. If we looked at our run to the Finals last year, we had the talent advantage all the way up until the Finals. I think coach Malone is a great coach but he just lacked the depth of talent that we had. Vogel is a so-so coach imo and after AD went down, the Lakers just didn't have the talent to take us on. The Clippers were the only team that had the superior coach and lesser talent which really pushed us in the West and forced Monty to get into a real coaching battle. The Bucks last year were the only team we faced that had the superior talent imo and were just a match up nightmare for us. If we played 21 games against them, I don't necessarily think that there was much we could've done to win that series.

But if you analysed this year's team so far, neither the Mavs nor the Pelicans had the superior depth of talent even when Book went down. They made us work because they had coaches who adjusted successfully and enough to push us. Kidd imo isn't some elite coach but like the getting chased by a bear analogy, you don't have to be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to not be the slowest. I think in G1/2, we just had the better talent, the better game plan and Kidd has now adjusted, two games in a row and we've seen very little from Monty. Again, it's the late timeout calls, the stubbornness and poor rotations which have always been there which led us to where we are now. Likewise we beat the Pels because we had more talent and more experience, not necessarily because Monty outcoached Willie.

How do we make this team better? A lot of it is on Monty. I mean, every player individually has the responsibility to make themselves better basketball players and do things on the court to help us win but as a team, it's on Monty to elevate and empower our guys to play to their strengths. Why do we see games where Ayton has almost no impact, Bridges taking single digit shots, CamJo playing only 20min or Holiday/Biz playing only garbage minutes? It's all on Monty to set the team/players up for success. Not everything we try HAS to work but you have to try to see if it works. If something doesn't work then we need to adjust and Monty has historically only done so when he's in desperation mode. That's what we saw in the Pels series imo and that's what I EXPECT to see in G5

[bwgood77]

I have noticed that this team along with others in the NBA have a major issue. That issue being whether to build a regular season team or a playoff team.

We could really use Saric right now but honestly we should be more consistent in the playoffs. I understand that Willie Green bailed but I just wonder why we didn't keep him.

I don't want to dwell on the past but at this point I think this team is fine but Monty has dropped off. I really think that we need to upgrade the coaching staff in the offseason.

How do we make this team better? What needs the most improvement?

I don't think Monty has "fallen off" or that Willie Green is that missing piece on our coaching staff. I think Monty is pretty much who always has been since taking over the Suns. His habit of not calling timeouts until too late, stubbornness in making changes or poor rotations has always been there. I think he's a really solid coach, a great regular season coach but in the playoffs, I don't necessarily think he has proven to be elite.

I think what we are seeing is talent winning through rather than immense coaching. If we looked at our run to the Finals last year, we had the talent advantage all the way up until the Finals. I think coach Malone is a great coach but he just lacked the depth of talent that we had. Vogel is a so-so coach imo and after AD went down, the Lakers just didn't have the talent to take us on. The Clippers were the only team that had the superior coach and lesser talent which really pushed us in the West and forced Monty to get into a real coaching battle. The Bucks last year were the only team we faced that had the superior talent imo and were just a match up nightmare for us. If we played 21 games against them, I don't necessarily think that there was much we could've done to win that series.

But if you analysed this year's team so far, neither the Mavs nor the Pelicans had the superior depth of talent even when Book went down. They made us work because they had coaches who adjusted successfully and enough to push us. Kidd imo isn't some elite coach but like the getting chased by a bear analogy, you don't have to be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to not be the slowest. I think in G1/2, we just had the better talent, the better game plan and Kidd has now adjusted, two games in a row and we've seen very little from Monty. Again, it's the late timeout calls, the stubbornness and poor rotations which have always been there which led us to where we are now. Likewise we beat the Pels because we had more talent and more experience, not necessarily because Monty outcoached Willie.

How do we make this team better? A lot of it is on Monty. I mean, every player individually has the responsibility to make themselves better basketball players and do things on the court to help us win but as a team, it's on Monty to elevate and empower our guys to play to their strengths. Why do we see games where Ayton has almost no impact, Bridges taking single digit shots, CamJo playing only 20min or Holiday/Biz playing only garbage minutes? It's all on Monty to set the team/players up for success. Not everything we try HAS to work but you have to try to see if it works. If something doesn't work then we need to adjust and Monty has historically only done so when he's in desperation mode. That's what we saw in the Pels series imo and that's what I EXPECT to see in G5

In the first series we forgot how to shoot, and Book was out for a bit...though others did step up outside of Paul's bad game 4.

In this series, in the first game turnovers killed us. Between Paul and Book they had 12. No one played particularly well outside of Crowder.

Then this game was mainly lost due to Dallas' insane 3 pt shooting. We need to make it tougher for them to hit 3s, staying on shooters. But we also again had a lot of turnovers. Booker, Ayton, Crowder all had 4.

Then of course Paul fouling out didn't help, but I think even if we have Paul and limit turnovers we couldn't have overcome their shooting.

We need better defense on the perimeter and better shot distribution overall. And to limit the turnovers. Payne has not played well but I don't really think Holiday or even Payton who was brought up are our saviors. Monty should call timeouts faster when they go on runs, but at the same time, we should either not allow runs or the players could call timeouts as well to regroup.

It really comes down to limiting their 3 pt shooting and cutting down the turnovers. Both Paul and Book had 9 turnovers each in the last two games. That's ridiculous. Others had bad turnovers too.

We really need to cut out the sloppiness.

This is much more to blame than Monty or Holiday not playing or whatever. I would like to see Holiday if we need to play 9 guys or whatever, but I might shorten the rotation to 7 guys, with a small dose of an 8th backup guard. Not sure why Shamet rarely shoots either. What exactly is he there for if he isn't going to shoot?

[lilfishi22]

I have noticed that this team along with others in the NBA have a major issue. That issue being whether to build a regular season team or a playoff team.

We could really use Saric right now but honestly we should be more consistent in the playoffs. I understand that Willie Green bailed but I just wonder why we didn't keep him.

I don't want to dwell on the past but at this point I think this team is fine but Monty has dropped off. I really think that we need to upgrade the coaching staff in the offseason.

How do we make this team better? What needs the most improvement?

I don't think Monty has "fallen off" or that Willie Green is that missing piece on our coaching staff. I think Monty is pretty much who always has been since taking over the Suns. His habit of not calling timeouts until too late, stubbornness in making changes or poor rotations has always been there. I think he's a really solid coach, a great regular season coach but in the playoffs, I don't necessarily think he has proven to be elite.

I think what we are seeing is talent winning through rather than immense coaching. If we looked at our run to the Finals last year, we had the talent advantage all the way up until the Finals. I think coach Malone is a great coach but he just lacked the depth of talent that we had. Vogel is a so-so coach imo and after AD went down, the Lakers just didn't have the talent to take us on. The Clippers were the only team that had the superior coach and lesser talent which really pushed us in the West and forced Monty to get into a real coaching battle. The Bucks last year were the only team we faced that had the superior talent imo and were just a match up nightmare for us. If we played 21 games against them, I don't necessarily think that there was much we could've done to win that series.

But if you analysed this year's team so far, neither the Mavs nor the Pelicans had the superior depth of talent even when Book went down. They made us work because they had coaches who adjusted successfully and enough to push us. Kidd imo isn't some elite coach but like the getting chased by a bear analogy, you don't have to be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to not be the slowest. I think in G1/2, we just had the better talent, the better game plan and Kidd has now adjusted, two games in a row and we've seen very little from Monty. Again, it's the late timeout calls, the stubbornness and poor rotations which have always been there which led us to where we are now. Likewise we beat the Pels because we had more talent and more experience, not necessarily because Monty outcoached Willie.

How do we make this team better? A lot of it is on Monty. I mean, every player individually has the responsibility to make themselves better basketball players and do things on the court to help us win but as a team, it's on Monty to elevate and empower our guys to play to their strengths. Why do we see games where Ayton has almost no impact, Bridges taking single digit shots, CamJo playing only 20min or Holiday/Biz playing only garbage minutes? It's all on Monty to set the team/players up for success. Not everything we try HAS to work but you have to try to see if it works. If something doesn't work then we need to adjust and Monty has historically only done so when he's in desperation mode. That's what we saw in the Pels series imo and that's what I EXPECT to see in G5

In the first series we forgot how to shoot, and Book was out for a bit...though others did step up outside of Paul's bad game 4.

In this series, in the first game turnovers killed us. Between Paul and Book they had 12. No one played particularly well outside of Crowder.

Then this game was mainly lost due to Dallas' insane 3 pt shooting. We need to make it tougher for them to hit 3s, staying on shooters. But we also again had a lot of turnovers. Booker, Ayton, Crowder all had 4.

Then of course Paul fouling out didn't help, but I think even if we have Paul and limit turnovers we couldn't have overcome their shooting.

We need better defense on the perimeter and better shot distribution overall. And to limit the turnovers. Payne has not played well but I don't really think Holiday or even Payton who was brought up are our saviors. Monty should call timeouts faster when they go on runs, but at the same time, we should either not allow runs or the players could call timeouts as well to regroup.

It really comes down to limiting their 3 pt shooting and cutting down the turnovers. Both Paul and Book had 9 turnovers each in the last two games. That's ridiculous. Others had bad turnovers too.

We really need to cut out the sloppiness.

This is much more to blame than Monty or Holiday not playing or whatever. I would like to see Holiday if we need to play 9 guys or whatever, but I might shorten the rotation to 7 guys, with a small dose of an 8th backup guard. Not sure why Shamet rarely shoots either. What exactly is he there for if he isn't going to shoot?

If we were to give credit to one person for preparing us to destroy the Mavs in the first two games, only to get destroyed in not too dissimilar fashion in the following two, you have to put it on the head of the team which is Monty. We lost for various reasons throughout the first and second series but there's a common theme. Payne has totally sucked aside from maybe one game and a couple of decent stretches but Holiday gets no meaningful burn. McGee has struggled against the Mav's small ball and isn't doing enough to make up for it on the offensive end. I didn't think he was particularly good either in the Pels series going up against the Pel's bigs so that's two series where he's struggled against the small ball and the big man bully ball. Yet we barely got to see Biz even though he is an entirely viable option against both teams. And I don't know what's going on with the Suns but all of a sudden, we can't handle the Mavs defense? Paul suddenly doesn't know how to take care of the ball and committing dumb fouls (refs were **** but he can't put himself in those 50/50 situations)? Oh and all of a sudden, we don't know how defensive rotations work to close out on shooters? Like what's going on? There's innately special about about the Mavs offense outside of Luka who we found ways to contain yet they are finding, making and we are conceding these 3's which we should be defending well.

When our defense looked this bad at defending the 3, it isn't just one guy or two guys, it's a scheme and adjustment issue and that's on Monty's remit

[TeamTragic]

I don't think Monty has "fallen off" or that Willie Green is that missing piece on our coaching staff. I think Monty is pretty much who always has been since taking over the Suns. His habit of not calling timeouts until too late, stubbornness in making changes or poor rotations has always been there. I think he's a really solid coach, a great regular season coach but in the playoffs, I don't necessarily think he has proven to be elite.

I think what we are seeing is talent winning through rather than immense coaching. If we looked at our run to the Finals last year, we had the talent advantage all the way up until the Finals. I think coach Malone is a great coach but he just lacked the depth of talent that we had. Vogel is a so-so coach imo and after AD went down, the Lakers just didn't have the talent to take us on. The Clippers were the only team that had the superior coach and lesser talent which really pushed us in the West and forced Monty to get into a real coaching battle. The Bucks last year were the only team we faced that had the superior talent imo and were just a match up nightmare for us. If we played 21 games against them, I don't necessarily think that there was much we could've done to win that series.

But if you analysed this year's team so far, neither the Mavs nor the Pelicans had the superior depth of talent even when Book went down. They made us work because they had coaches who adjusted successfully and enough to push us. Kidd imo isn't some elite coach but like the getting chased by a bear analogy, you don't have to be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to not be the slowest. I think in G1/2, we just had the better talent, the better game plan and Kidd has now adjusted, two games in a row and we've seen very little from Monty. Again, it's the late timeout calls, the stubbornness and poor rotations which have always been there which led us to where we are now. Likewise we beat the Pels because we had more talent and more experience, not necessarily because Monty outcoached Willie.

How do we make this team better? A lot of it is on Monty. I mean, every player individually has the responsibility to make themselves better basketball players and do things on the court to help us win but as a team, it's on Monty to elevate and empower our guys to play to their strengths. Why do we see games where Ayton has almost no impact, Bridges taking single digit shots, CamJo playing only 20min or Holiday/Biz playing only garbage minutes? It's all on Monty to set the team/players up for success. Not everything we try HAS to work but you have to try to see if it works. If something doesn't work then we need to adjust and Monty has historically only done so when he's in desperation mode. That's what we saw in the Pels series imo and that's what I EXPECT to see in G5

In the first series we forgot how to shoot, and Book was out for a bit...though others did step up outside of Paul's bad game 4.

In this series, in the first game turnovers killed us. Between Paul and Book they had 12. No one played particularly well outside of Crowder.

Then this game was mainly lost due to Dallas' insane 3 pt shooting. We need to make it tougher for them to hit 3s, staying on shooters. But we also again had a lot of turnovers. Booker, Ayton, Crowder all had 4.

Then of course Paul fouling out didn't help, but I think even if we have Paul and limit turnovers we couldn't have overcome their shooting.

We need better defense on the perimeter and better shot distribution overall. And to limit the turnovers. Payne has not played well but I don't really think Holiday or even Payton who was brought up are our saviors. Monty should call timeouts faster when they go on runs, but at the same time, we should either not allow runs or the players could call timeouts as well to regroup.

It really comes down to limiting their 3 pt shooting and cutting down the turnovers. Both Paul and Book had 9 turnovers each in the last two games. That's ridiculous. Others had bad turnovers too.

We really need to cut out the sloppiness.

This is much more to blame than Monty or Holiday not playing or whatever. I would like to see Holiday if we need to play 9 guys or whatever, but I might shorten the rotation to 7 guys, with a small dose of an 8th backup guard. Not sure why Shamet rarely shoots either. What exactly is he there for if he isn't going to shoot?

If we were to give credit to one person for preparing us to destroy the Mavs in the first two games, only to get destroyed in not too dissimilar fashion in the following two, you have to put it on the head of the team which is Monty. We lost for various reasons throughout the first and second series but there's a common theme. Payne has totally sucked aside from maybe one game and a couple of decent stretches but Holiday gets no meaningful burn. McGee has struggled against the Mav's small ball and isn't doing enough to make up for it on the offensive end. I didn't think he was particularly good either in the Pels series going up against the Pel's bigs so that's two series where he's struggled against the small ball and the big man bully ball. Yet we barely got to see Biz even though he is an entirely viable option against both teams. And I don't know what's going on with the Suns but all of a sudden, we can't handle the Mavs defense? Paul suddenly doesn't know how to take care of the ball and committing dumb fouls (refs were **** but he can't put himself in those 50/50 situations)? Oh and all of a sudden, we don't know how defensive rotations work to close out on shooters? Like what's going on? There's innately special about about the Mavs offense outside of Luka who we found ways to contain yet they are finding, making and we are conceding these 3's which we should be defending well.

When our defense looked this bad at defending the 3, it isn't just one guy or two guys, it's a scheme and adjustment issue and that's on Monty's remit

An incoherent and confusing message from Monty because these lineups are **** trash.

I feel like a broken record about Payne therefore I'm going to put zero energy into my argument just like Monty puts zero thought into his lineups.

This is madness and at this point the team is not buying into his rotations.

[bwoolf2]

I don't think Monty has "fallen off" or that Willie Green is that missing piece on our coaching staff. I think Monty is pretty much who always has been since taking over the Suns. His habit of not calling timeouts until too late, stubbornness in making changes or poor rotations has always been there. I think he's a really solid coach, a great regular season coach but in the playoffs, I don't necessarily think he has proven to be elite.

I think what we are seeing is talent winning through rather than immense coaching. If we looked at our run to the Finals last year, we had the talent advantage all the way up until the Finals. I think coach Malone is a great coach but he just lacked the depth of talent that we had. Vogel is a so-so coach imo and after AD went down, the Lakers just didn't have the talent to take us on. The Clippers were the only team that had the superior coach and lesser talent which really pushed us in the West and forced Monty to get into a real coaching battle. The Bucks last year were the only team we faced that had the superior talent imo and were just a match up nightmare for us. If we played 21 games against them, I don't necessarily think that there was much we could've done to win that series.

But if you analysed this year's team so far, neither the Mavs nor the Pelicans had the superior depth of talent even when Book went down. They made us work because they had coaches who adjusted successfully and enough to push us. Kidd imo isn't some elite coach but like the getting chased by a bear analogy, you don't have to be the fastest runner to survive, you just have to not be the slowest. I think in G1/2, we just had the better talent, the better game plan and Kidd has now adjusted, two games in a row and we've seen very little from Monty. Again, it's the late timeout calls, the stubbornness and poor rotations which have always been there which led us to where we are now. Likewise we beat the Pels because we had more talent and more experience, not necessarily because Monty outcoached Willie.

How do we make this team better? A lot of it is on Monty. I mean, every player individually has the responsibility to make themselves better basketball players and do things on the court to help us win but as a team, it's on Monty to elevate and empower our guys to play to their strengths. Why do we see games where Ayton has almost no impact, Bridges taking single digit shots, CamJo playing only 20min or Holiday/Biz playing only garbage minutes? It's all on Monty to set the team/players up for success. Not everything we try HAS to work but you have to try to see if it works. If something doesn't work then we need to adjust and Monty has historically only done so when he's in desperation mode. That's what we saw in the Pels series imo and that's what I EXPECT to see in G5

In the first series we forgot how to shoot, and Book was out for a bit...though others did step up outside of Paul's bad game 4.

In this series, in the first game turnovers killed us. Between Paul and Book they had 12. No one played particularly well outside of Crowder.

Then this game was mainly lost due to Dallas' insane 3 pt shooting. We need to make it tougher for them to hit 3s, staying on shooters. But we also again had a lot of turnovers. Booker, Ayton, Crowder all had 4.

Then of course Paul fouling out didn't help, but I think even if we have Paul and limit turnovers we couldn't have overcome their shooting.

We need better defense on the perimeter and better shot distribution overall. And to limit the turnovers. Payne has not played well but I don't really think Holiday or even Payton who was brought up are our saviors. Monty should call timeouts faster when they go on runs, but at the same time, we should either not allow runs or the players could call timeouts as well to regroup.

It really comes down to limiting their 3 pt shooting and cutting down the turnovers. Both Paul and Book had 9 turnovers each in the last two games. That's ridiculous. Others had bad turnovers too.

We really need to cut out the sloppiness.

This is much more to blame than Monty or Holiday not playing or whatever. I would like to see Holiday if we need to play 9 guys or whatever, but I might shorten the rotation to 7 guys, with a small dose of an 8th backup guard. Not sure why Shamet rarely shoots either. What exactly is he there for if he isn't going to shoot?

If we were to give credit to one person for preparing us to destroy the Mavs in the first two games, only to get destroyed in not too dissimilar fashion in the following two, you have to put it on the head of the team which is Monty. We lost for various reasons throughout the first and second series but there's a common theme. Payne has totally sucked aside from maybe one game and a couple of decent stretches but Holiday gets no meaningful burn. McGee has struggled against the Mav's small ball and isn't doing enough to make up for it on the offensive end. I didn't think he was particularly good either in the Pels series going up against the Pel's bigs so that's two series where he's struggled against the small ball and the big man bully ball. Yet we barely got to see Biz even though he is an entirely viable option against both teams. And I don't know what's going on with the Suns but all of a sudden, we can't handle the Mavs defense? Paul suddenly doesn't know how to take care of the ball and committing dumb fouls (refs were **** but he can't put himself in those 50/50 situations)? Oh and all of a sudden, we don't know how defensive rotations work to close out on shooters? Like what's going on? There's innately special about about the Mavs offense outside of Luka who we found ways to contain yet they are finding, making and we are conceding these 3's which we should be defending well.

When our defense looked this bad at defending the 3, it isn't just one guy or two guys, it's a scheme and adjustment issue and that's on Monty's remit

One of the adjustments the mavs made particularly on Cp3 is they know he is passive offensively until the 4th quarter so they are playing him to pass and he is turning it over in kind, you can't put up 2 shot attempts 1st halves when you are as good as he is he has to be more aggressive throughout the game or he will continue with the turnovers.

[lilfishi22]

In the first series we forgot how to shoot, and Book was out for a bit...though others did step up outside of Paul's bad game 4.

In this series, in the first game turnovers killed us. Between Paul and Book they had 12. No one played particularly well outside of Crowder.

Then this game was mainly lost due to Dallas' insane 3 pt shooting. We need to make it tougher for them to hit 3s, staying on shooters. But we also again had a lot of turnovers. Booker, Ayton, Crowder all had 4.

Then of course Paul fouling out didn't help, but I think even if we have Paul and limit turnovers we couldn't have overcome their shooting.

We need better defense on the perimeter and better shot distribution overall. And to limit the turnovers. Payne has not played well but I don't really think Holiday or even Payton who was brought up are our saviors. Monty should call timeouts faster when they go on runs, but at the same time, we should either not allow runs or the players could call timeouts as well to regroup.

It really comes down to limiting their 3 pt shooting and cutting down the turnovers. Both Paul and Book had 9 turnovers each in the last two games. That's ridiculous. Others had bad turnovers too.

We really need to cut out the sloppiness.

This is much more to blame than Monty or Holiday not playing or whatever. I would like to see Holiday if we need to play 9 guys or whatever, but I might shorten the rotation to 7 guys, with a small dose of an 8th backup guard. Not sure why Shamet rarely shoots either. What exactly is he there for if he isn't going to shoot?

If we were to give credit to one person for preparing us to destroy the Mavs in the first two games, only to get destroyed in not too dissimilar fashion in the following two, you have to put it on the head of the team which is Monty. We lost for various reasons throughout the first and second series but there's a common theme. Payne has totally sucked aside from maybe one game and a couple of decent stretches but Holiday gets no meaningful burn. McGee has struggled against the Mav's small ball and isn't doing enough to make up for it on the offensive end. I didn't think he was particularly good either in the Pels series going up against the Pel's bigs so that's two series where he's struggled against the small ball and the big man bully ball. Yet we barely got to see Biz even though he is an entirely viable option against both teams. And I don't know what's going on with the Suns but all of a sudden, we can't handle the Mavs defense? Paul suddenly doesn't know how to take care of the ball and committing dumb fouls (refs were **** but he can't put himself in those 50/50 situations)? Oh and all of a sudden, we don't know how defensive rotations work to close out on shooters? Like what's going on? There's innately special about about the Mavs offense outside of Luka who we found ways to contain yet they are finding, making and we are conceding these 3's which we should be defending well.

When our defense looked this bad at defending the 3, it isn't just one guy or two guys, it's a scheme and adjustment issue and that's on Monty's remit

One of the adjustments the mavs made particularly on Cp3 is they know he is passive offensively until the 4th quarter so they are playing him to pass and he is turning it over in kind, you can't put up 2 shot attempts 1st halves when you are as good as he is he has to be more aggressive throughout the game or he will continue with the turnovers.

That's a great adjustment I didn't actually notice and makes a lot of sense. It is disappointing he doesn't more evenly spread out his shot attempts. In the regular season, it's a totally fine strategy but in the playoffs, he has to do more. I know it's CP3, I know it's how he plays at this stage of his career but I also know he still can do it since he did it in the first series. If he's not making them pay when they are playing off him then we're really playing 4 on 8 out there for 3.5 quarters

[Ghost of Kleine]

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[Funky Tut]

I think it’s hilarious we have owned Dallas in the regular season, take a big 2-0 lead on them, now all the sudden the officiating has gotten weird and now Dallas can hang with us despite not being able to previously ? And it’s not because Jason Kidd is a genius, the NBA is getting sloppy and I’m so glad to see people in sports media call them out.

[lilfishi22]

I think I speak for the majority when I say I'd rather refs miss a lot of calls (on both sides) than refs calling every foul, having an impact on the game, the product and becoming a "narrative" of a game.

[cberry78]

I think I speak for the majority when I say I'd rather refs miss a lot of calls (on both sides) than refs calling every foul, having an impact on the game, the product and becoming a "narrative" of a game.

Which side of the call does a moving screen fall on?

[bwgood77]

I'd rather they allow physical play and only call fouls when there is stuff like they'd consider a flagrant or super obvious foul that is without question.

I think any foul that was very close to going one way or the other, say a charge vs a block that is close, just shouldn't be called.

Of course you don't want players totally taking advantage of this to an extreme like Bill Laimbeer did or anything, but within reason. All these touch fouls are ridiculous.

I also don't understand why Paul would even risk trying to bait someone else into a foul when he's in foul trouble. Why does he care so much about doing that? Why do so many players? Book used to do it a lot, but he's gotten a lot better. Bridges, Ayton, Cam, etc, never do stuff like that and I respect their games because of it.

I respect CP3 overall greatly but why run in front of Brunson..why not just play ball?

[lilfishi22]

I think I speak for the majority when I say I'd rather refs miss a lot of calls (on both sides) than refs calling every foul, having an impact on the game, the product and becoming a "narrative" of a game.

Which side of the call does a moving screen fall on?

No call

[lilfishi22]

I'd rather they allow physical play and only call fouls when there is stuff like they'd consider a flagrant or super obvious foul that is without question.

I think any foul that was very close to going one way or the other, say a charge vs a block that is close, just shouldn't be called.

Of course you don't want players totally taking advantage of this to an extreme like Bill Laimbeer did or anything, but within reason. All these touch fouls are ridiculous.

I also don't understand why Paul would even risk trying to bait someone else into a foul when he's in foul trouble. Why does he care so much about doing that? Why do so many players? Book used to do it a lot, but he's gotten a lot better. Bridges, Ayton, Cam, etc, never do stuff like that and I respect their games because of it.

I respect CP3 overall greatly but why run in front of Brunson..why not just play ball?

Putting the CP3 hat on and trying to come up with what he might be thinking, IMO it could have been a momentum changing call. We were down 12 to start the 3rd, we got to within 7 and that contact would be called in favor of the ball handler probably 80%+ of the time. We know CP3 is all about gaming the game and if he could extract some advantage from a normally no foul situation taking the ball up the court, then he would go for it.

[bwgood77]

I had been looking for anything from Zach Lowe during the playoffs, and finally checking again just found one on the Suns facing the Mavs, though it is a few days old...

Spoiler:

There is something about facing the same opponent over and over in the NBA that breeds annoyance and contempt. It might lead to post-victory gloating that can be taken either as unsavory or tongue-in-cheek fun, depending on your perspective.

After a messy and exciting six-game conquest of the Utah Jazz in the first round, Dallas Mavericks coach Jason Kidd could not resist needling Hassan Whiteside and Rudy Gobert -- perhaps shoveling the last bit of dirt on the Gobert-Donovan Mitchell partnership.

In discussing the challenges of defending the Phoenix Suns' offense -- essentially tied for No. 3 in points per possession during the regular season -- Kidd noted all the different ways the Suns can score.

"This isn't Gobert or Whiteside," Kidd told a scrum of reporters. "These guys can put the ball in the basket."

(While we're here: It is a remarkable achievement of shot-making and turnover avoidance that the Suns ranked so highly in offense given their old-school shot selection and general statistical tendencies. Phoenix ranked dead last in shots at the rim and 25th in 3-point attempts. Yeah, we know that: They are midrange deities. They also ranked 29th in free throw rate and 21st in offensive rebounding, meaning they got no freebies and very few second chances. They were a first-shot, only-shot offense, and almost a league-high 42% of those shots were midrangers. To sniff the No. 1 spot in total offense with that overall profile in the year of our basketball gods 2022 is a triumph in efficiency bordering on the impossible.)

Kidd was ribbing, but he was also onto something.

For the second straight season, a team fresh off eliminating the Jazz by going supersmall -- with five shooters and several ball handlers on the floor at once -- was about to run into Deandre Ayton. Last season, it was the LA Clippers in the Western Conference finals; Ayton averaged 18 points and 14 rebounds on 69% shooting in Phoenix's six-game victory.

Now, it's the Mavs' turn. Ayton proved Kidd prophetic in Game 1 of these conference semifinals, flipping in 25 points on 12-of-20 shooting -- continuing perhaps the best and most consequential scoring run of his career.

With Devin Booker out for Games 3, 4, and 5 of the Suns' first-round series against the No. 8 seed New Orleans Pelicans, Phoenix needed more from Ayton -- needed him to be more like the high-volume post scorer and jump-shooter he might have envisioned himself as when Phoenix selected him No. 1 overall (over the Mavs' Luka Doncic, among others) in 2018.

Part of Ayton's appeal was the breadth of his skill on offense. He could turn into whatever kind of center he and (most pointedly) the Suns wanted him to be: pick-and-pop 3-point gunner; elbow passing ace; pick-and-roll rim runner; post-up hub; or some combination of all those, able to emphasize whatever element his team needed at any moment.

Chris Paul's arrival in Ayton's third season settled the matter: Ayton would become a high-volume screen setter, rolling hard to the rim over and over after setting brick wall picks for Paul and Booker. Sometimes Ayton would get the ball for alley-oops, layups, and soft-touch floaters. But his main job was to free Paul and Booker for midrange looks, and draw in the defense -- unlocking open 3s for Phoenix's spot-up threats.

Ayton bought in, subsuming any ambitions of ball-dominant scoring in the name of winning. He refocused on defense, transforming himself almost completely on that end in two short seasons -- improving more between Year 1 and Year 3 than almost any big man in recent memory.

But he never lost his ball skills -- never stopped working on turnaround jumpers, push shots, jump hooks, catching and turning against switches. Any team hoping to win four playoff series needs to shape-shift -- to tap into scoring methods beyond its foundational identity. Some opponents would require the Suns to once again ask more of Ayton.

The Clippers provided the first major high-stakes test in last season's conference finals. They tried to mimic their anti-Jazz game plan: Play five perimeter guys, switch everything on defense, drag Ayton out of the paint on the other end, and drive and kick the Suns into submission. The Clippers understood the risks. They also knew switching on defense was the best and probably only way of neutering Phoenix's pick-and-roll game; Booker and Paul wouldn't be able to walk into long 2s the way they can against dropback centers.

As the Clippers feared, they discovered two major differences between the ecosystems in Utah and Phoenix: Ayton could punish switches in ways Gobert seemingly could not, and the Suns had enough confidence in Ayton to throw him the ball. (Gobert's defense has not really been the problem against supersmall, 5-out opponents. The real issue has been Utah's leaky perimeter defense, and Gobert's inability to hurt small-ball lineups on the other end -- aside from the occasional offensive rebound.)

Kidd probably didn't need any reminders of Ayton's skill. In those three games Booker missed against New Orleans, Ayton averaged 23 points on 68% shooting. He made difficult shots -- face-up jumpers in isolation, fadeaways in the post, burrowing jump hooks. He made other difficult shots look easy, including those pogo-stick floaters in the paint on pick-and-rolls. In the playoffs, Ayton has hit 60% of long 2s and 66% from floater range, per Cleaning The Glass.

The Suns might not have survived that series with a league-average center in Ayton's place. Paul and Booker might make Bismack Biyombo look good in the regular season, but take one of those stars away against a dialed-in playoff defense and the gap between Ayton and Joe Center suddenly feels like a Grand Canyon-sized chasm. Phoenix is plus-21 in 119 postseason minutes when Paul and Ayton are on the floor without Booker; they logged only 266 such minutes in the entire regular season.

For the season, Phoenix scored 1.13 points per possession when Ayton shot out of a post-up or dished to a teammate who fired -- 11th among 82 players with at least 50 post touches, per Second Spectrum.