Love in town to "see what it's like"

[MaxwellSmart]

I'm not worried---I think this is a bit of damage control--after the Weekend went viral.

I think the deal could still be set---Wolves just might be asking for a little more.
Hopefully, the Wolves won't take another offer, before coming back and letting Danny beat it.

Pretty sure Danny/Love and his agent are all on board with this thing--now they gotta convince Minny.

[Dreamcast]

I still dont get this ? If Minny decide to keep Love he will walk away in the summer and they get nothing ?

If they trade him to some small market team and if he doesn't want to resign then what ? Lose-lose if you ask me. Why cant Love just say he wants Boston and thats it ? Why is he keeping his mouth shut ? Force a trade to Boston period. But Love is also being quiet here which tells me he is also exploring other teams as well.

Some of you forgot something but Love or Melo will make Rondo stay here. Why do you think Ainge is going nuts to get a star player ? He knows Rondo wont stay thats why he is not rushing to sign a new deal. Pretty much telling danny: show me what you got oR Im out of here. if we lose Rondo next summer I will jump off tobin bridge

[FingerRoll]

That's not really true, though. THere are several teams that COULD outbid Boston. Yes we have a lot of picks (most of which only have theoretical value), but teams could offer up tangible talent for Love.

As much as everyone is excited, this is a long way from being over. Jackie MacMullen shot down the absurd idea that Boston was close to nabbing Love + Melo. Her sources say that the Wolves aren't happy with Ainge's offer and she doubted Boston would land Love.

Yeah, perhaps Ainge is lowballing the Wolves with hopes of raising his offer down the line, but who knows. I think it's silly to definitively say "The Warriors aren't parting with Klay THompson in a deal" or "The Rockets aren't parting with Parsons in a deal" or "Love wouldn't play in Cleveland if they offered the #1 pick". We don't actually know that. I say Boston has a good shot, but I still think it's more likely we don't get Love.

Look, Jackie Mac is a great journalist and has a shrewd understanding of the game. That being said, when a team source discusses trade scenarios with a journalist there is a HUGE incentive to provide information that benefits the team providing the information. Teams often use the media to push their agenda. So, just because a team source states something, does not mean that it is the gospel.

I'm sure MIN is not thrilled with BOS offer 3 weeks before the draft. They want more and they are trying to create a market through mis-information and leaks - hence the myriad of leaked rumors surrounding Love recently. You have to play teams off of one another to try and force their respective hands and up the ante. I'm sure Jackie's source conveyed dissatisfaction and didn't sound optimistic about BOS chances of landing Love - which is EXACTLY the type of sentiment you want to send to a HoF journalist with deep ties to Boston after "the weekend" just occured - this is damage control 101. Notice how both WOJ and Jackie both had dish immediately following the media frenzy.

Eh. If Jackie has sources, it's within Boston. IF she says that the Wolves aren't interested in what Ainge is offering, I doubt it's coming from the Timberwolves. It's probably coming from someone in Boston who says, "All this hype about Love is overblown... we aren't anywhere close on a deal"... that's not to say there isn't gamemanship in what is leaked to the media... but there's also a chance that when she says it's doubtful it happens... it's because it's doubtful it happens.

To reiterate, as much as we can sit here and say "aint nobody gonna beat Boston's assets!", it's not really true. We're basing this on speculation and unsubstantiated rumors.

No disrespect but I stopped reading here. You're completely off base. The assets of an NBA franchise are public information. It's very easy to go offer to offer and determine who has the best and most out there. Before last weekend everyone agreed that Danny had set us up perfectly for another run like 2007. Now it's "love to boston is far from a slam dunk." All the doubters, pessimists, and anti Celtic people come out the woodwork.

Today Sam Amick tweets sac has the best offer right now for love. Last time I checked the 6th pick in the draft is more valuable than the 8th. That's a fact. No one is speculating as to which pick is better. Why would the wolves take a back seat to two teams ahead of them in the draft (meaning most likely no ramdle or vonleh$? You have to realize that draft pick is the center of the deal. Minny is hoping that turns into their next superstar - it's the biggest chip on the table. I call BS. Then tweet says Ben mclemore is included. The only thing of note that Ben mclemore did all season was end up on a lebron poster. We know our counter to that is olynyk or Sullinger.



Again, being objective, we'll compare assets. One should be obvious to you. Each players stats for last season.

X: 13p 8r 1a (.43/.25/.77)

Y: 8p 5r 1a (.46/.35/.81)

Z: 8p 2r 1a (.37/.32/.80)

Looking at the numbers it's easy to see which asset is clearly the least valuable: Z.

X and Y put up better numbers and Y Is more efficient while X is more productive.

Z is Ben Mclemore. X and Y are celtics players I listed before.

So far...the celtics are 2/2 for offering a better "starting point" package.

If more assets are needed, I know I don't have to take you through that. Danny can go pick for pick with the kings and they lose every time.

If that's the best offer I don't see how danny doesn't beat that with a five minute phone call. As they say "I'll make him an offer he can't refuse." Bill Simmons proposal of four 1st rounders (both the 6th and 17th this year)+(both from 2015) + sully+bass+bogans is the godfather offer and no one can beat that.

Edit: kings have the rights to former Celtic Jason the jet terry who also, coincidentally, ended up on a lebron poster. He may tip the scales in their favor.

https://vine.co/v/MHnivFFat2Y

[PaulGaston]

Look, Jackie Mac is a great journalist and has a shrewd understanding of the game. That being said, when a team source discusses trade scenarios with a journalist there is a HUGE incentive to provide information that benefits the team providing the information. Teams often use the media to push their agenda. So, just because a team source states something, does not mean that it is the gospel.

I'm sure MIN is not thrilled with BOS offer 3 weeks before the draft. They want more and they are trying to create a market through mis-information and leaks - hence the myriad of leaked rumors surrounding Love recently. You have to play teams off of one another to try and force their respective hands and up the ante. I'm sure Jackie's source conveyed dissatisfaction and didn't sound optimistic about BOS chances of landing Love - which is EXACTLY the type of sentiment you want to send to a HoF journalist with deep ties to Boston after "the weekend" just occured - this is damage control 101. Notice how both WOJ and Jackie both had dish immediately following the media frenzy.

Eh. If Jackie has sources, it's within Boston. IF she says that the Wolves aren't interested in what Ainge is offering, I doubt it's coming from the Timberwolves. It's probably coming from someone in Boston who says, "All this hype about Love is overblown... we aren't anywhere close on a deal"... that's not to say there isn't gamemanship in what is leaked to the media... but there's also a chance that when she says it's doubtful it happens... it's because it's doubtful it happens.

To reiterate, as much as we can sit here and say "aint nobody gonna beat Boston's assets!", it's not really true. We're basing this on speculation and unsubstantiated rumors.

No disrespect but I stopped reading here. You're completely off base. The assets of an NBA franchise are public information.

No disrespect, I stopped reading here.

It's nice that you have some assumption about what teams are offering and what is "best", but

#1 - You don't ACTUALLY know what Boston or any other team is offering

#2 - It's entirely subjective beyond the pick itself.

I agree that the #6 pick is better than the #8 pick. Fine. But if the Warriors offer up a package around Lee and Klay Thompson, it's not up to you to decide that #6 + Sully + future picks is a "better" offer.

We don't know what is being offered. Maybe Ainge isn't even offering the #6. Maybe he's offering Sully + middling future picks that likely will fall into the late 1st round. Who are you to say if that's more valuable than a Houston offer of Terrence Jones + middling future picks that likely will fall in the late 1st round? Outside of Boston fandom, the perception of JOnes trade value is about even with Sully. Basically the same age/production without the back issues. But what if Houston is also including Chandler Parsons? It's not definitive that the #6 has more trade value than Parsons. What if Houston also intends to include a 1st rounder they have coming from a potential Asik trade? #6 + #17 + Sully ... or Parsons, Jones, and future 1sts? It starts to get even. What if Houston intends to include James Harden ?

We don't know what's going on behind the scenes. We can only speculate. I do agree that if Boston puts together a package of #6 + #17 + Sully + Oly + Green + filler + 2015 Clippers + 2016 Brooklyn + 2018 Brooklyn ... it would be hard to theoretically top that quantity of assets. But perhaps Houston looks at that package and decides, "First of all, Green sucks. Second of all, we don't like anyone at #6 or #17. Third of all, Sully and Oly are long-term role players. Forth of all, the clips pick is garbage. Lastly, we're not trading our superstar on a gamble that those Brooklyn picks 2-4 years from end up being key pieces..." Maybe they look at that package and decide there isn't a single key building block in the entire lot. Ben McLemore alone arguably has more trade value than any single one of those pieces (aside from maybe the #6)... there's some folks who look at his struggles his rookie year, chaulk it up to youth, and still think he's a potential star.

These are just random examples. There are teams we have heard about, but there are several other teams that could make compelling offers. If Philly calls up tomorrow offering a package around the #3 pick... and Love decides he's willing to opt-in to play with MKW and Nerlens Noel... don't freak out simply because you didn't see some sports writers predict it beforehand. I mean, we were a bottom 5 team this year. We have our binkies like Oly and Sully and it's natural for homers to overestimate the trade value of their binkies. But understand that almost every team in this league has binkies of their own that arguably have more trade value. What if the Wolves are very intrigued by the potential of someone like Otto Porter (#3 pick last year and didn't really get an opportunity to play)... perhaps the Wizards are putting together a competitive package. If they bite the bullet and offer up Beal, forget about it... game over. Point is... if Sota is discussing potential Kevin Love trades, i'd guess they are discussing it with far more teams than we are hearing about right now.

I think Boston has a shot, but it's far from over. I suspect a lot of Celtic fans will be "shocked" and disappointed if they see Love traded for a package from a team like Chicago or the Suns. I figure there's 28 teams in this league other than Boston who would like to land Kevin Love... a large chunk that will be making offers... and very likely a handful that Love is willing to opt-in for... and maybe a few that have competitive offers. A best, I'd say we are one of the Top 5 most likely destinations if Sota actually trades him.

[ILC]

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/bre ... e-get-love

http://www.csnne.com/boston-celtics/why ... ople-think

[London2Boston]

Of course the Wolves are in no rush. Love's value will peak on draft night and they are going to explore all options...I really have a hard time seeing how the Kings are leading though.

[BfB]

Eh. If Jackie has sources, it's within Boston. IF she says that the Wolves aren't interested in what Ainge is offering, I doubt it's coming from the Timberwolves. It's probably coming from someone in Boston who says, "All this hype about Love is overblown... we aren't anywhere close on a deal"... that's not to say there isn't gamemanship in what is leaked to the media... but there's also a chance that when she says it's doubtful it happens... it's because it's doubtful it happens.

To reiterate, as much as we can sit here and say "aint nobody gonna beat Boston's assets!", it's not really true. We're basing this on speculation and unsubstantiated rumors.

No disrespect but I stopped reading here. You're completely off base. The assets of an NBA franchise are public information.

No disrespect, I stopped reading here.

It's nice that you have some assumption about what teams are offering and what is "best", but

#1 - You don't ACTUALLY know what Boston or any other team is offering

#2 - It's entirely subjective beyond the pick itself.

I agree that the #6 pick is better than the #8 pick. Fine. But if the Warriors offer up a package around Lee and Klay Thompson, it's not up to you to decide that #6 + Sully + future picks is a "better" offer.

We don't know what is being offered. Maybe Ainge isn't even offering the #6. Maybe he's offering Sully + middling future picks that likely will fall into the late 1st round. Who are you to say if that's more valuable than a Houston offer of Terrence Jones + middling future picks that likely will fall in the late 1st round? Outside of Boston fandom, the perception of JOnes trade value is about even with Sully. Basically the same age/production without the back issues. But what if Houston is also including Chandler Parsons? It's not definitive that the #6 has more trade value than Parsons. What if Houston also intends to include a 1st rounder they have coming from a potential Asik trade? #6 + #17 + Sully ... or Parsons, Jones, and future 1sts? It starts to get even. What if Houston intends to include James Harden ?

We don't know what's going on behind the scenes. We can only speculate. I do agree that if Boston puts together a package of #6 + #17 + Sully + Oly + Green + filler + 2015 Clippers + 2016 Brooklyn + 2018 Brooklyn ... it would be hard to theoretically top that quantity of assets. But perhaps Houston looks at that package and decides, "First of all, Green sucks. Second of all, we don't like anyone at #6 or #17. Third of all, Sully and Oly are long-term role players. Forth of all, the clips pick is garbage. Lastly, we're not trading our superstar on a gamble that those Brooklyn picks 2-4 years from end up being key pieces..." Maybe they look at that package and decide there isn't a single key building block in the entire lot. Ben McLemore alone arguably has more trade value than any single one of those pieces (aside from maybe the #6)... there's some folks who look at his struggles his rookie year, chaulk it up to youth, and still think he's a potential star.

These are just random examples. There are teams we have heard about, but there are several other teams that could make compelling offers. If Philly calls up tomorrow offering a package around the #3 pick... and Love decides he's willing to opt-in to play with MKW and Nerlens Noel... don't freak out simply because you didn't see some sports writers predict it beforehand. I mean, we were a bottom 5 team this year. We have our binkies like Oly and Sully and it's natural for homers to overestimate the trade value of their binkies. But understand that almost every team in this league has binkies of their own that arguably have more trade value. What if the Wolves are very intrigued by the potential of someone like Otto Porter (#3 pick last year and didn't really get an opportunity to play)... perhaps the Wizards are putting together a competitive package. If they bite the bullet and offer up Beal, forget about it... game over. Point is... if Sota is discussing potential Kevin Love trades, i'd guess they are discussing it with far more teams than we are hearing about right now.

I think Boston has a shot, but it's far from over. I suspect a lot of Celtic fans will be "shocked" and disappointed if they see Love traded for a package from a team like Chicago or the Suns. I figure there's 28 teams in this league other than Boston who would like to land Kevin Love... a large chunk that will be making offers... and very likely a handful that Love is willing to opt-in for... and maybe a few that have competitive offers. A best, I'd say we are one of the Top 5 most likely destinations if Sota actually trades him.

There are a lot of variables we don't know - the biggest one being what MIN is actually looking to accomplish. My understanding is that they aren't looking to "rebuild" from ground zero. they are a defensive makeover away from being a playoff team, which is something that their owner certainly would like. That franchise needs to establish some relevance, not worry about "cap space" and long term youth movements.

MIN was almost a playoff team last year, save for terrible luck in single possessions games down the stretch. They made a nice little push at the close of the season when Gorgui Dieng started playing center. My guess is that MIN would want to get enough "upside" assets to have room for growth while still maintaining a competitive base to help the team's youth grow faster and actually have a product the fans can enjoy.

If CHI was willing to give up Butler, Gibson, Mirotic, and the 16 and 19 pick for Love/Brewer, lets say. That would be a damn tough act to follow. Butler projects as a high level role player, but he is young. Mirotic has a high ceiling, potentially, as an established star in Europe. The 16/19 picks are in a deep draft, while Gibson gives them some tenacity at the 4 and allows MIN to run a 3 big man rotation with Pek being bolstered by two defensive big men. Mirotic is a "chip" they can use to determine which 3 bigs they keep and which they can use for subsequent moves.

Now, we have no idea if CHI is willing to part with that much for Love, but it is plausible considering they already have Noah and Rose in tow. We have to see how Rose comes back, but its a decent gambit on CHI's part because they'd have the 1/2 scoring punch and the defense to at least pose as a viable contender.

This scenario would also, most likely, interest Love - which is the MOST important part of all of these trade scenarios. Regardless of what team's may say, there is absolutely no way any team will trade the farm for Kevin Love if he makes it clear he won't resign. You lose your job for something like that.

I don't see HOU as a major player in this equation. MIN already has a center in Pek, they'll need to lean on him offensively this year with Love gone, and he can handle that load - huge plus from that position. They need a defensive compliment at the 4 - Dieng could start in a "twin towers" type scenario for them, worst case scenario. HOU has the criminally underrated Terrence Jones to offer, which is nice. But they are lotto pick poor and DO NOT have the other assets at their disposal. Asik/Lin are expensive expirings, but neither plays a position of need for MIN, with Pek being more important than ever offensively.

Chandler Parsons would be a major get for MIN...unfortunately people are forgetting that he's got some say in where he goes pretty soon as well. If he's dissatisfied with MIN he can take the QO and ride out two season's to free agency. If he had two more years left before RFA, it'd be a bit different, but MIN would have to show a lot in one year for him to risk them matching an offer sheet and keeping him stuck there for 4 years.

Look - this still comes down to Kevin Love and where he pushes his weight. Despite all the misinformation going around, "the weekend" was very much a power play by his agent to check out a team that's high on his list. We've seen enough "super team" superstar collusion over the past 5-6 years to understand that forming these alliances is a major deal to these guys. I'd say that Love's "short list" would be BOS/CHI/HOU, in that order, based on a number of factors - eastern conference being primary.

I personally put BOS as the favorite, depending on what they're willing to give up relative to what CHI is willing to give up. The risk with CHI is that Derrick Rose is no longer capable of being that MVP 1st option level player. No a huge risk to Love, since he could simply "kick the tires" and then take off in a year, but it must factor into the equation. BOS has superstar one in place, with Rondo. He's the distributor that scoring stars love to play for and everyone has seen his playoff resume.

BOS front office has a recent track history of building a championship team, which is also HUGE. There is peace of mind that comes with that, for NBA players. Ainge hasn't lost any credibility built from the KG/PP era yet. This matters. Through his agent, Love knows that BOS takes care of their superstars, win or lose. CHI does NOT have that same reputation. Ainge also has the cap space coming up next summer. Any trade for Love, if done correctly, will still leave a "max slot" open for them to use. I'm positive Ainge has let it be known to all interested parties - through Rondo, Love's agent, and other back channels - what the "grand plan" is and how it could work logistically. These guys aren't operating on "faith" they are weighing the chess pieces.

The only thing that is uncertain right now is what MIN will do. There is certainly enough incentive for BOS to use as leverage and get Love/Melo to "collude" with Rondo and try and put pressure on MIN. Again, this is not some uncommon occurrence. If these three wish to play together - and there is plenty of bread crumbs over the past 12 months to suggest so - they can narrow the field of "contenders" for their services. It doesn't mean it's a "done deal" because they can't hold ALL of the cards. But they can certainly tip the scales of probability heavily in their favor, if they so wish.

Pure speculation on my part, but I would not at all be surprised to see BOS utilize Melo as leverage against MIN, if this thing drags out. Melo has his "opt-in" decision coming up, and if he and Rondo are as tight as rumor suggests, it would not be exceptionally difficult for Melo to tell Phil that he's got two choices - walk or trade - which we've covered here before. BOS can get far enough under the cap to offset enough of Melo's 23 million to make a trade work. If Melo "colludes" on this, I can definitely see Jackson cutting his losses if he can acquire the 2014 #17, PHI psuedo 1st, and a top 10 protected BKN 1st.

Getting two out of three of the superstars together would create a lot of leverage for getting Love to "collude" heavily - even against CHI/HOU as BOS would be the only one among the three who could would have the cap room to sign 3rd superstar Love outright in 2015 while still having the #6 pick, Sullinger, Olynyk, and Bradley still on the roster for upside. This creates incentive for Love as well, since he'd be well-aware that BOS had the room for the 3rd Superstar and the ability to remain financially flexible to acquire him for a couple of seasons while he'd be "all in" with what HOU and CHI had leftover - creates huge incentive for Love to "walk" or limit trade field to BOS.

If CHI ups the ante for a Love trade and HOU ups the ante for a Melo trade, BOS best bet is to lean heavily on the Rondo/Love/Melo synergy to solidify their desire to play together. This is a "super team" arms race between these three, imo. The key to winning this poker game is not in the trade packages alone. It's in the sales-pitches - you're creating vision as much as anything else.

[The_Ghost_of_JB]

Looks like the search for the Wolves head coaching job is over as Saunders is just doing it himself.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/23 ... -Of-Wolves

[Afam]

Originally found this via the Celticsblog.

Celtics point guard Rajon Rondo appeared on Good Morning America Thursday morning to preview the NBA Finals. In addition, Rondo took questions from fans via GMA's Instagram account.

One of the more notable answers came in response to a question about the offseason. Rondo sounded like a man who knew something was afoot.

"Hopefully this summer we're going to make some big changes," said Rondo. "Get the ball rolling and get back to the Finals pretty soon. I know Danny Ainge is doing his job, and I'm going to go out every summer and do my job and get better."


http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball ... me_bi.html

[Afam]

someone feel free to embed the video to show.

[LobCityRondo2KG]

http://bostonherald.com/sports/celtics_ ... ove_advice

[15th overall]

Fantastic read, Bill. Great post.

[Berkcelt]

Is Mirotic comparable to the sixth pick in terms of value?

[ILC]

Originally found this via the Celticsblog.

Celtics point guard Rajon Rondo appeared on Good Morning America Thursday morning to preview the NBA Finals. In addition, Rondo took questions from fans via GMA's Instagram account.

One of the more notable answers came in response to a question about the offseason. Rondo sounded like a man who knew something was afoot.

"Hopefully this summer we're going to make some big changes," said Rondo. "Get the ball rolling and get back to the Finals pretty soon. I know Danny Ainge is doing his job, and I'm going to go out every summer and do my job and get better."


http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball ... me_bi.html

Yeah, what else was he doing in The Big Apple?

[Afam]

Originally found this via the Celticsblog.

Celtics point guard Rajon Rondo appeared on Good Morning America Thursday morning to preview the NBA Finals. In addition, Rondo took questions from fans via GMA's Instagram account.

One of the more notable answers came in response to a question about the offseason. Rondo sounded like a man who knew something was afoot.

"Hopefully this summer we're going to make some big changes," said Rondo. "Get the ball rolling and get back to the Finals pretty soon. I know Danny Ainge is doing his job, and I'm going to go out every summer and do my job and get better."

[http://www.boston.com/sports/basketball/celtics/extras/celtics_blog/2014/06/rajon_rondo_hopefully_this_summer_were_going_to_make_some_bi.html

Yeah, what else was he doing in The Big Apple?

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=ron ... tedIndex=0

[lon3lytoaster]

Of course the Wolves are in no rush. Love's value will peak on draft night and they are going to explore all options...I really have a hard time seeing how the Kings are leading though.

Sure. There are all sorts of reason to trade Love, or even trade for Love before the draft.

I actually don't really want to trade for Love before draft night. If we traded 6 & 17 prior, we'd be credited as moving out of this draft, this makes us much less flexible in future trades.

If we wait until draft night and make the picks for Minnesota, we obviously get credited as making the picks, thus keeping us just a bit, or a lot more flexible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Afam]

Get it Done Danny.

[Afam]

All right. We're being trolled by one dude on two accounts. Done with this discussion.

So Dreamcast and Rich Homie are the same poster ? .

[12buckets]

I looked up Jimmy Butler today. He averaged 13.7 points on over 38 minutes per game. Shot less than 40% overall, and less than 30% from 3. When his teams leading scorer went down (twice), he took backseats to Nate Robinson and DJ Augustin, respectively. He did just make the "All Defense 2nd team" though. He's good, but he's not a star, and I'm real surprised anyones treating him like one.

Avery Bradley responded to his team losing it's leading scorer by stepping up and increasing his scoring by over 5 ppg, while shooting over 40% from 3pt range. He also made the All Defense 2nd team, just one season. He's also a year younger, with one year more NBA experience.

I don't think Avery Bradley is necessarily as good as Jimmy Butler (mostly because of height), but I don't think he's much far below too. I also don't think Butler will ever be much better than an above-average role player in the NBA (how much higher than an "in his prime Tony Allen" can his ceiling be, really??). The position he defends so well (2 guard) is not currently loaded up with offensive threats like it used to be either, and is currently occupied by a very capable/well compensated player (Martin) who might be the best player on the team if Love does get traded. I don't think Kevin Love will be traded for a package built around a poor shooting, offensively passive, defensive role player. I also don't think Gibson is better than Sully, even before including age and salary. This Mirotik guy would have to be one HELL of a prospect, that Minnesota is singularly focused on acquiring, for me to think the Bulls package beats our package (whatever that package ends up being.)

I feel very bad for Flip. The offseason he needs to trade his star, is the offseason that none of the good enough teams have enough assets to pull it off. At least McHale got to choose between a couple quality packages before settling on the Celtics.

[Dreamcast]

Let me ask you something guys. What happens if we don't get Love or Melo or any big name. What happens if we remain the same team with minor tweaks and also end up a lottery team next year ? Then what ? Ugh...