Official Trade Thread Part XLVI

[nate33]

Whooaaah -- I'd do that trade in a minute! But they are NOT trading Dereck Lively, who looks like an absolutely terrific young player.

Yeah, I can't figure out a trade that makes sense.

The core would be Kuzma for Hardaway and a FRP. But that's not enough for Kuzma, and it leaves us very lopsided with about 19 shooting guards and only Deni at PF. They could throw in Josh Green to try and bring the value in line, but that's yet another SG.

What if we gave them Jordan Poole in exchange for Grant Williams? Eh. As much as I'd like to unload Poole, we're going to have enough trouble as it is getting up to the salary floor. If we dump Poole we're just going to have to overpay some free agent anyhow.

The 1st, Grant Williams, we eat Holmes's contract and maybe try to rehab him in return for Kuzma is the best I can come up with. Add an OMax, Hardy, or Green thrown in for our equivalent bottom of benchers (Delon Wright, Anthony Gill, etc.) in some fashion if you can work it but that would be the bones of it. The 1st would be top 4 protected.

If that's all we're getting, I'd probably keep Kuzma and be patient. Next year, when everyone's cap number is 10% higher while Kuzma is $2M cheaper, there will be opportunities to trade him for an equivalent package or better.

[payitforward]

...What if it were Jaquez instead?

There’s zero chance they give up Jaquez.

I know....

...They wouldn’t trade him for Bilal.

Non-relevant, but I just looked up the two guys' birthdates -- amazing to realize that Jaquez is fully three & a half years older than Bilal!!

[Wizardspride]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

[TGW]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

The losing would be tolerable if the team played the right way. Like the Spurs under Pop are clearly tanking, but they still play disciplined basketball. The Wizards is just Poole and Kuz jacking up shots and allowing opposting teams to score at will.

[Frichuela]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

The losing would be tolerable if the team played the right way. Like the Spurs under Pop are clearly tanking, but they still play disciplined basketball. The Wizards is just Poole and Kuz jacking up shots and allowing opposting teams to score at will.

Amen! And for that we desperately need i) a new head coach and ii) hopefully trade Kuzma for draft capital.

[payitforward]

The core would be Kuzma for Hardaway and a FRP. But that's not enough for Kuzma, and it leaves us very lopsided with about 19 shooting guards and only Deni at PF. They could throw in Josh Green to try and bring the value in line, but that's yet another SG....

In itself, I don't know whether that matters given how early we are in the rebuilding process. & I don't see Josh Green as a throw in, btw. Already a very good player (& only 3 months older than Jaime Jaquez! ).

...What if we gave them Jordan Poole in exchange for Grant Williams? Eh. As much as I'd like to unload Poole, we're going to have enough trouble as it is getting up to the salary floor. If we dump Poole we're just going to have to overpay some free agent anyhow.

True -- but, that could be short-term. The biggest problem w/ Poole is that we are locked in for so long.

[mhd]

I feel like the most obvious and workable landing place for a Tyus trade is Miami. Miami has announced they wish to move Lowry and it's starting to get a little ugly. Lowry has already removed the Heat from his IG bio.

The trade that I'd like to see is Tyus + Delon for Lowry + Jovic + MIA 2027 FRP. I'm okay with top 12 protection on that pick if the pick rolls over to the following year. If they want the pick rights to be extinguished if they don't convey (to maintain Stepien Rule flexibility), then I'd insist on no more than top 4 protection.

Not only does this upgrade Miami's backcourt, but it save them a whopping 9.8M in salary which nearly gets them out of the luxury tax. It will save them something like $30M in salary and tax payments.

Nice thinking Nate, but Miami just got Rozier for Lowry+future first. I think Rozier has more value as he is signed for another year so Miami isn't losing anyone they traded Lowry for.

If we are moving Tyus, then the Orlando offer of Fultz+future Denver first is probably the floor of what we can expect.

[TGW]

Sorry guys. No Tyus to Miami.

Read on Twitter

[payitforward]

The losing would be tolerable if the team played the right way. Like the Spurs under Pop are clearly tanking, but they still play disciplined basketball. The Wizards is just Poole and Kuz jacking up shots and allowing opposting teams to score at will.

Presumably, therefore, you are thinking that if Poole & Kuzma were on the Spurs, they'd play differently.

Without proceeding immediately to a debate, consider the following: if you (or I or any other fan) are able to see that Jordan Poole's bad play is a function of Wes's bad coaching, then we would expect to see a lot of trade interest in Jordan Poole. Wouldn't the FO pros around the league be looking to pick him up in some kind of a bargain deal?

As to Jordan "jacking up shots," truth is he's shooting less this year than he did last year!

I'm not defending the guy; he's been awful. I just don't see any evidence that it's Wes's fault.

[pcbothwel]

Sorry guys. No Tyus to Miami.

Read on Twitter

Good... Just do the Tyus/Gaff for Fultz/WCJ/2024 1st trade and be done with it.
The value is right, but we also need to showcase Poole. Fultz doesnt shoot and plays defense, so he helps Poole & Kispert

[DCZards]

PIF, I believe Poole and Kuz would HAVE to play differently if they were with the Spurs under Pop…or Miami under Spo.

I don’t think Wes Jr. truly holds Poole and Kuz accountable for some of their careless and selfish play. That wouldn’t happen with Pop and Spo. (Although Wes will occasionally bench Poole late in games when he’s not playing well.)

And l’m not a Wes hater….nor do I have a problem with Kuz’s play most nights.

[badinage]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

The losing would be tolerable if the team played the right way. Like the Spurs under Pop are clearly tanking, but they still play disciplined basketball. The Wizards is just Poole and Kuz jacking up shots and allowing opposting teams to score at will.

Yes yes yes.

And — they don’t dive on the floor. They don’t dive into the stands. They don’t fight. There’s no scrap.

To be asked to watch basketball that isn’t fluid and full of passing and movement AND from a team that doesn’t hustle and act desperate … it’s a lot. It’s too much.

Every possession, they should be scrapping.

And every game, they should be doing unorthodox things — pressing full-court for extended stretches, junking up the game, running strange looks, etc. If you’re going to lose, might as well learn some things, might as well innovate, might as well depart from the script.

Instead we get boring-ness. A lack of imagination. And worse: a pretense that we’re an actual, competing team, complete with a coach who “doesn’t get too high, doesn’t get too low.” Yawn. Shoot me.

[Dark Faze]

Eh, I wouldn't gas up the Spurs. They have Tre Jones, Zach Collins, Wemby, Vassell, and Keldon Johnson and yet only have 8 wins. I would call that underachieving regardless of opinions of their play being more fundamentally sound than ours.

[Dark Faze]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

We'll be lucky if we have a strong young core by 2028, which doesn't necessarily equate to a winning season. Look at San Antonio who has a few players in their core already in place.

We're going to be back for a long time.

[Wizardspride]

Bigger problem than that is how weak the top of the draft is this year. We will have to get lucky or hard tank next year again to get that sure thing or else risk being stuck in that fighting for the playin spot. I'm fine with winning 10 game all year, I'm not fine with still having a losing record in 2028.

Yeah, I can't sit through another season like this.

We'll be lucky if we have a strong young core by 2028, which doesn't necessarily equate to a winning season. Look at San Antonio who has a few players in their core already in place.

We're going to be back for a long time.

And that's what I'm scared of.

Unlike football for example, basketball is too dependent on the random bounce of ping pong balls.

[nate33]

Sorry guys. No Tyus to Miami.

Read on Twitter

This sucks. I thought Miami would probably put together the best package for Tyus.

[nate33]

If we are moving Tyus, then the Orlando offer of Fultz+future Denver first is probably the floor of what we can expect.

I’m not convinced Orlando would offer that. I think the best we get is two second round picks. Orlando has cap room this summer, so Bird rights on Tyus aren’t an incentive.

[Frichuela]

Per reports, IND refused to trade Jarace Walker for Siakam. However, given how weak the upcoming draft looks, particularly for wings/forward, I wonder if there still a chance to trade Kuzma to IND for Walker+Hield and then direct Hield+other assets to get a first from ORL. In summary:

WAS gets Walker+Harris+Fultz+ORL 24 1st
IND gets Kuzma
ORL gets Tyus Jones+Hield

For IND, Kuzma will slot between the 3 and the 4, with a starting line up of Haliburton/Nesmith or Mathurin/Kuzma/Siakam/Turner. This should be a competitive team in the playoffs with room to grow and improve from their backcourt. Kuzma descending contract should help IND pay Siakam next season and Haliburton down the line.

For us, let's use our 24 1st and ORL 1st to draft the best available guard and center, where talent the upcoming draft looks better vs. wings/forwards. Alternatively, we could ask ORL for their 25 or 26 1st instead of their 24 1st.

[penbeast0]

If IND wouldn't trade Walker in a Siakam deal, why would they trade him for Kuzma, at least until they have Pascal signed long term?

[Kanyewest]

If IND wouldn't trade Walker in a Siakam deal, why would they trade him for Kuzma, at least until they have Pascal signed long term?

Kuzma at least is at least under contract. Plus the Pacers have to give up something to get something. Although yeah that offer seems like too much especially giving up on Hield.