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2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread

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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#921 » by Sunsdeuce » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:07 pm

SF88 wrote:
carey wrote:I'm not sure Monroe fits in with what we have going on right now. I'm confident Hornacek could adjust our offense so that he can play a role, but do you want to see our team slow down some? I'm enjoying the fast break renaissance.

Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense.

I think if our goal, in the next 2-3 years is to win in the playoffs and become a contender, we need a big man that can consistently get us about 20 pts a game and rebound at a high level.

If you have to pay the max for that, then you do it. It's what's needed.


Bingo. With the exception of the Heat. Every team thats won a championship have had a quality Big.
Lakers: Shaq, Pau, Bynum, etc etc etc etc
Bulls: Horace Grant, Rodman (averaged 15.5 rbs with the bulls)
Spurs: Duncan
Mavs: Chandler, Dirk
Pistons: Wallace, Wallace, Rodman
Rockets: Hakeem
Boston: Garnett, Parish, Mchale, and more

Heat: Bosh doesnt count. LOL
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#922 » by carey » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:28 pm

SF88 wrote:Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense..


I hate, hate when people pull the "slow down in the playoffs" card. So, you think they should abandon what has them winning right now as soon as they get to the playoffs? How successful are they going to be playing a style different from the one they've been playing all year. What the good teams do is play like they've played all year. If you're talking about revamping their style totally for the season and the playoffs, that's one thing. But the whole, "lets get a player just for when they slow it down in the playoffs" thing really bugs me.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#923 » by jcsunsfan » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:36 pm

Sunsdeuce wrote:
SF88 wrote:
carey wrote:I'm not sure Monroe fits in with what we have going on right now. I'm confident Hornacek could adjust our offense so that he can play a role, but do you want to see our team slow down some? I'm enjoying the fast break renaissance.

Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense.

I think if our goal, in the next 2-3 years is to win in the playoffs and become a contender, we need a big man that can consistently get us about 20 pts a game and rebound at a high level.

If you have to pay the max for that, then you do it. It's what's needed.


Bingo. With the exception of the Heat. Every team thats won a championship have had a quality Big.
Lakers: Shaq, Pau, Bynum, etc etc etc etc
Bulls: Horace Grant, Rodman (averaged 15.5 rbs with the bulls)
Spurs: Duncan
Mavs: Chandler, Dirk
Pistons: Wallace, Wallace, Rodman
Rockets: Hakeem
Boston: Garnett, Parish, Mchale, and more

Heat: Bosh doesnt count. LOL


The team without the quality big was the Bulls with Grant. As for the Heat, well, LeBron is bigger than Rodman was. Picking nits, I know.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#924 » by Sunsdeuce » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:05 am

jcsunsfan wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
SF88 wrote:Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense.

I think if our goal, in the next 2-3 years is to win in the playoffs and become a contender, we need a big man that can consistently get us about 20 pts a game and rebound at a high level.

If you have to pay the max for that, then you do it. It's what's needed.


Bingo. With the exception of the Heat. Every team thats won a championship have had a quality Big.
Lakers: Shaq, Pau, Bynum, etc etc etc etc
Bulls: Horace Grant, Rodman (averaged 15.5 rbs with the bulls)
Spurs: Duncan
Mavs: Chandler, Dirk
Pistons: Wallace, Wallace, Rodman
Rockets: Hakeem
Boston: Garnett, Parish, Mchale, and more

Heat: Bosh doesnt count. LOL


The team without the quality big was the Bulls with Grant. As for the Heat, well, LeBron is bigger than Rodman was. Picking nits, I know.


Horace Grant with Bulls during championships 91-94:
Points per game: 14.5 Rebounds per game 10.5

Thats not to shaby. I would say that is above average/quality. I would take that in a heart beat. As for lebron being bigger than Rodman, Lebron could only dream of rebounding like a real man(no way in hell lebron would come close to getting 15 rebounds a game much less then 10 a game), and Lebron is bigger then rodman by one inch but cant get half the rebounds. Im nit picking too. lol
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#925 » by thamadkant » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:09 am

Sunsdeuce wrote:
SF88 wrote:
carey wrote:I'm not sure Monroe fits in with what we have going on right now. I'm confident Hornacek could adjust our offense so that he can play a role, but do you want to see our team slow down some? I'm enjoying the fast break renaissance.

Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense.

I think if our goal, in the next 2-3 years is to win in the playoffs and become a contender, we need a big man that can consistently get us about 20 pts a game and rebound at a high level.

If you have to pay the max for that, then you do it. It's what's needed.


Bingo. With the exception of the Heat. Every team thats won a championship have had a quality Big.
Lakers: Shaq, Pau, Bynum, etc etc etc etc
Bulls: Horace Grant, Rodman (averaged 15.5 rbs with the bulls)
Spurs: Duncan
Mavs: Chandler, Dirk
Pistons: Wallace, Wallace, Rodman
Rockets: Hakeem
Boston: Garnett, Parish, Mchale, and more

Heat: Bosh doesnt count. LOL



But Bosh does count... He cannot be left alone or he would dominate... He was a 20/10 big.. Just saying.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#926 » by thamadkant » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:10 am

I'm glad McD reitirated the "build a championship" mantra and not a 8th seed fodder.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#927 » by Sunsdeuce » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:12 am

carey wrote:
SF88 wrote:Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense..


I hate, hate when people pull the "slow down in the playoffs" card. So, you think they should abandon what has them winning right now as soon as they get to the playoffs? How successful are they going to be playing a style different from the one they've been playing all year. What the good teams do is play like they've played all year. If you're talking about revamping their style totally for the season and the playoffs, that's one thing. But the whole, "lets get a player just for when they slow it down in the playoffs" thing really bugs me.


I totally agree with what you are saying but we all know that for whatever reason officating is different in the playoffs. They let fouls go more often. Its one of my biggest complaints about the NBA. Why is officating different from the playoffs to the regular season? Total lack of consistency. Its one of the reasons that basketball went from my first love to football now only recently being my first love. Its just year after year bad officating and stupid Superstar calls. A foul should be a foul regardless of who it is. I think its crazy that you barely tap a lebron, kobe, or whatever superstar then its a foul. But they are allowed to mug someone and its called great defense. Zero consistency.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#928 » by DirtyDez » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:13 am

Trading into the top 3-5 will be close to impossible but we could package picks to move up in the top-10 IMO. McD himself said we're not drafting four rookies. Besides our rotation is 8-9 deep and that's not including Len yet.
fromthetop321 wrote:I got Lebron number 1, he is also leading defensive player of the year. Curry's game still reminds me of Jeremy Lin to much.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#929 » by Sunsdeuce » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:13 am

1UPZ wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
SF88 wrote:Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense.

I think if our goal, in the next 2-3 years is to win in the playoffs and become a contender, we need a big man that can consistently get us about 20 pts a game and rebound at a high level.

If you have to pay the max for that, then you do it. It's what's needed.


Bingo. With the exception of the Heat. Every team thats won a championship have had a quality Big.
Lakers: Shaq, Pau, Bynum, etc etc etc etc
Bulls: Horace Grant, Rodman (averaged 15.5 rbs with the bulls)
Spurs: Duncan
Mavs: Chandler, Dirk
Pistons: Wallace, Wallace, Rodman
Rockets: Hakeem
Boston: Garnett, Parish, Mchale, and more

Heat: Bosh doesnt count. LOL



But Bosh does count... He cannot be left alone or he would dominate... He was a 20/10 big.. Just saying.

I know, i was just kidding.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#930 » by thamadkant » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:25 am

DirtyDez wrote:Trading into the top 3-5 will be close to impossible but we could package picks to move up in the top-10 IMO. McD himself said we're not drafting four rookies. Besides our rotation is 8-9 deep and that's not including Len yet.



There are options.
1. Trade multiple to go up
2. Trade for future picks, teams without picks this year.
3. Trade for star... Which was the plan at the start (Love, Horford, Aldridge)
But unlikely now since due to those teams playing well or due to injury.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#931 » by thamadkant » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:29 am

Knicks would probably trade an unprotected future pick for a first rounder this year.
Brooklyn too!!

Teams who messed up and underperformed and need pieces to develop.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#932 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jan 14, 2014 12:43 am

DirtyDez wrote:Trading into the top 3-5 will be close to impossible but we could package picks to move up in the top-10 IMO. McD himself said we're not drafting four rookies. Besides our rotation is 8-9 deep and that's not including Len yet.


He didn't say we are not drafting four rookies. He said we might not. I know I'm splitting hairs, but I don't think he is adamantly opposed to using four picks, especially in this draft. I could see us moving up, but there is probably a good chance we can get guys we like at our spots.

There is probably less than a 50/50 chance we get all four picks anyway. I think the Wiz pick is about a 75% probability and Minnesota is probably about 50%.

“I think one of the things that’s important for people to realize is that we may not draft four players even if we have four picks,” McDonough told NBA.com. “Our preference would probably be to maybe package a few of them. We’re obviously all looking for stars and we feel like we can put together a package as good, if not better, than any other team in the league if and when a star becomes available. That’s kind of generally what we’ve wanted to do, not only with our draft-pick situation but also with the cap space that we’ve acquired.”


http://hangtime.blogs.nba.com/2013/12/1 ... 014-draft/
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#933 » by Revived » Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:42 am

carey wrote:
SF88 wrote:Their going to have to "slow down some" in the playoffs. Can't keep winning in a 7 game series by just running all the time...you gotta have something that's at least reminiscent of a half court offense..


I hate, hate when people pull the "slow down in the playoffs" card. So, you think they should abandon what has them winning right now as soon as they get to the playoffs? How successful are they going to be playing a style different from the one they've been playing all year. What the good teams do is play like they've played all year. If you're talking about revamping their style totally for the season and the playoffs, that's one thing. But the whole, "lets get a player just for when they slow it down in the playoffs" thing really bugs me.

Everything slows down in the playoffs. Its not by choice, it just happens. Running and gunning is cute and fun but it doesn't lead to playoff wins.

If you wanna win in the playoffs, you have to play effectively in the half court.

I remember last year in playoffs, Chris Webber and others on Inside the NBA all agreed that the biggest reason the Warriors couldn't make it further in the playoffs is cause Lee got hurt and they had no half court offense or a person to dump to the ball to in the half court. Charles Barkley always says this as the biggest reason why the Clippers haven't won the West despite having CP3 and Griffin...cause they excel in fast break but struggled in half court.

Fast breaking should be seen as a compliment to a half court offense. If fast breaking is your only way to score points, you will NEVER EVER win a title. Its not my opinion, its just the truth.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#934 » by carey » Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:16 am

Sunsdeuce wrote: I totally agree with what you are saying but we all know that for whatever reason officating is different in the playoffs. They let fouls go more often. Its one of my biggest complaints about the NBA. Why is officating different from the playoffs to the regular season? Total lack of consistency. Its one of the reasons that basketball went from my first love to football now only recently being my first love. Its just year after year bad officating and stupid Superstar calls. A foul should be a foul regardless of who it is. I think its crazy that you barely tap a lebron, kobe, or whatever superstar then its a foul. But they are allowed to mug someone and its called great defense. Zero consistency.


The NFL officiating this year has been worse than the NBA. Did you know that across the board they have called 25% less penalties per game in the playoffs than the regular season? It's the same exact thing as the NBA. Swallow the whistle when it matters most. It's disgusting.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#935 » by Revived » Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:22 am

I don't propose trades often here but I'm bored so why the hell not

Suns trade: Morris twins, Indiana 1st round pick, Minnesota 1st round pick and Alex Len
Suns get: Monroe, Gibson

Bulls trade: Taj Gibson
Bulls get: Morris twins

Pistons trade: Greg Monroe
Pistons get: Len, Indaian and Minny 1st round picks

Bulls get some depth and shed salary at the same time. Allows them to go after some bigger fish to pair with Rose. Thibs can maybe fix the Morris bros?

Pistons get a rookie big man with potential and 2 first round picks. They replace Monroe with someone younger and someone on a longer contract.

Suns get a good low post scoring big man in Monroe and a good shot blocker that can protect the rim and hit jumpers if needed in Gibson.

Bledsoe/Barbosa
Dragic/Goodwin
Tucker/Green
Gibson/Frye
Monroe/Plumlee

This isn't just "trading away Len for the sake of trading away Len", this is to make the team better. If trading Len is what it takes to make the team, then you gotta do it.

Plus we would have really good depth too with Frye and Plumlee both coming off the bench to provide energy.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#936 » by Qwigglez » Tue Jan 14, 2014 5:34 am

Trading away Len makes the team better this year. The following years, I'm not so certain. Len is a promising prospect that I'm not willing to give up this soon. I'm not a fan of an undersized Gibson or an undersized Monroe at center. That team is a first round playoff exit for years to come.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#937 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:06 am

That's pretty awful SF88. The Pistons are not going to be trading for Len with Drummond around.

Also, it's pretty clear from your post that you don't think the team needs people that can stretch the floor. With two penetrating pgs, if we went with strictly traditional low post big guys without that ability, it would likely kill our ball movement and offense, and the guards couldn't penetrate with two bigs in the middle at all times.

This is one reason I like Adreian Payne...he can play like Monroe like you want, but can also step out and hit the three.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#938 » by Revived » Tue Jan 14, 2014 8:07 am

bwgood77 wrote:That's pretty awful SF88. The Pistons are not going to be trading for Len with Drummond around.

Also, it's pretty clear from your post that you don't think the team needs people that can stretch the floor. With two penetrating pgs, if we went with strictly traditional low post big guys without that ability, it would likely kill our ball movement and offense, and the guards couldn't penetrate with two bigs in the middle at all times.

This is one reason I like Adreian Payne...he can play like Monroe like you want, but can also step out and hit the three.

Yea but Deroit needs a backup C which they don't have. Plus they can develop Len and then trade him as an asset for something else they want. Or they can run a Len-Drummond lineup once Len expands his range a little...Coro actually mentioned this at the beginning of the season as a possibility with Len and Plumlee if Len can expand his range.

Gibson can hit jump shot. I hate this theory that we have to have shooters all over the place. So I guess if we had the chance to get LMA, or KG, Amare or Duncan in their primes, we would turn it down since they aren't 3pt chuckers right?

As long as they can jump a long jumper at a pretty high level, we will be fine. They don't all have to be 3pt chuckers like Frye.

And both our guards aren't penetrating at the same time. One of them is cause they are playing with only one ball. When Bledsoe is penetrating he can kick it to Dragic if Goran is open and Dragic is well capable of knocking down that open 3. Bledsoe is improving in this regard too.

I don't know anything about Payne but I will look into him either later tonight or sometime tomorrow. Watching Netflix now and I'm just posting while its buffering. But if anything, I I think I may have developed a hatred for 3pt chucking big men after this season. I do not want another one to join Kieff and Frye.

And I appreciate your response. Don't think for a second that I'm attacking you cause I'm not. I'm just tired of hearing from various posters that "we need to have 3pt chuckers all over the floor at every possible position". We can play like a traditional team if we just have a guy that can knock down a jumper. Will it stretch the floor a little less? Yes but he can also be a guy that we can dump the ball to and that can go score for us when this JUMP SHOOTING team is having a cold day like it has the past couple of games.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#939 » by bwgood77 » Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:06 pm

SF88 wrote:
bwgood77 wrote:That's pretty awful SF88. The Pistons are not going to be trading for Len with Drummond around.

Also, it's pretty clear from your post that you don't think the team needs people that can stretch the floor. With two penetrating pgs, if we went with strictly traditional low post big guys without that ability, it would likely kill our ball movement and offense, and the guards couldn't penetrate with two bigs in the middle at all times.

This is one reason I like Adreian Payne...he can play like Monroe like you want, but can also step out and hit the three.

Yea but Deroit needs a backup C which they don't have. Plus they can develop Len and then trade him as an asset for something else they want. Or they can run a Len-Drummond lineup once Len expands his range a little...Coro actually mentioned this at the beginning of the season as a possibility with Len and Plumlee if Len can expand his range.

Gibson can hit jump shot. I hate this theory that we have to have shooters all over the place. So I guess if we had the chance to get LMA, or KG, Amare or Duncan in their primes, we would turn it down since they aren't 3pt chuckers right?

As long as they can jump a long jumper at a pretty high level, we will be fine. They don't all have to be 3pt chuckers like Frye.

And both our guards aren't penetrating at the same time. One of them is cause they are playing with only one ball. When Bledsoe is penetrating he can kick it to Dragic if Goran is open and Dragic is well capable of knocking down that open 3. Bledsoe is improving in this regard too.

I don't know anything about Payne but I will look into him either later tonight or sometime tomorrow. Watching Netflix now and I'm just posting while its buffering. But if anything, I I think I may have developed a hatred for 3pt chucking big men after this season. I do not want another one to join Kieff and Frye.

And I appreciate your response. Don't think for a second that I'm attacking you cause I'm not. I'm just tired of hearing from various posters that "we need to have 3pt chuckers all over the floor at every possible position". We can play like a traditional team if we just have a guy that can knock down a jumper. Will it stretch the floor a little less? Yes but he can also be a guy that we can dump the ball to and that can go score for us when this JUMP SHOOTING team is having a cold day like it has the past couple of games.


I don't mind someone with a low post game, as long as they can hit a jumper, but this would have to go for the center too. We can't really have opposing big sitting near the basket if Dragic or Bledsoe are going to drive much. These guys really should be able to guard perimeter bigs too since most of the elite teams now play with small ball fours (Miami usually plays most effectively with LeBron at 4 an Bosh at 5 and SA with TD at 5 with shooters and OKC with Durant at 4 and Ibaka at 5)..this is when those teams kill people...sure they have Haslem, Splitter and Perkins/Adams as well but the point is, we need some more athletes that can guard hybrid 3/4s while also being able to shoot...if they can post up as well, great. The Bulls and Grizz' style work fine until they meet Miami or SA/OKC.
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Re: 2014 Official Suns Free Agent/Trade/Transaction Thread 

Post#940 » by Ring_Wanted » Tue Jan 14, 2014 4:01 pm

"we need to have 3pt chuckers all over the floor at every possible position"


wat

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