Orlando Magic Free Agency Guide (Cap Info UPDATED page 37)

[ezzzp]

This is true if we don't bring Fournier back.

So would you support S&Ting this summer in order to preserve that space?

Depends on the free agency acquisitions. If the Magic land a high calibre forward - I seriously doubt they resign him. If they don't, they might as well match him and trade him down the road (similar to Harris)...S&T in RFA don't return value.

RFAs can return value if the team wants to keep him. They don't if the team wants to let him go to begin with.

Bledsoe was a RFA that we couldn't get because PHX wanted a lot in return. If we wanted any of the RFAs next summer like Noel, Adams, Giannis, Gobert... it would take a lot to do a S&T. Same can be said for Fournier. ...and Rob has said everything right as far as saying he has intentions on bringing him back. That's market talk.

You can't match and trade a restricted free agent.

If a team matches an offer sheet and retains its free agent, then for one year they cannot trade him without his consent, and during that year cannot trade him at all to the team that signed him to the offer sheet. They also can't trade the player in a sign-and-trade transaction CBA FAQ

The Magic would have to work out a S&T without matching which means the trading team has all leverage, and why S&T on RFA never return value.

[Bensational]

I don't think any FA this summer not named Durant is good enough to propel a team to contending status.

So that's why I'm questioning the value in spending all our money on 2nd rate talent and limiting our window for acquiring legit championship talent. Or, what other options are available if we close the window on adding a superstar via free agency?

There are at best 3-5 players in the NBA that alone propel a team into contention. Acquiring one is a needle in a haystack, hail Mary pass.

In the meantime the 25 -27 other teams have to find alternate ways to compete. Sometimes chemistry and chance forge a really good player into a great one; or multiple really good ones combine for an effect greater than the sum of its parts; and those unexpected events propel a team into contention.

The Magic swung for option 1 by tanking but luck did not strike; thus they are part of the 25-27 teams looking for alternate ways to compete. The franchise can not afford to wait another 2-4 years for their core to reach their prime to find out if they are one of those franchise players.

Fortunately, one of the benefits of tanking and building through the draft is that it allows for the Magic to "create their own luck" and search for alternate ways to compete. Look at the Magic cap forecast:



Even in the highly unlikely scenario were all four key core players develop into max salary players, the Magic would still have enough cap space to pay for 1 to 2 max salaries in the first two years of those 4 year contracts and then would go over cap in the final two years

....and that's if all four core transform into max level players - which of course would be amazingly epic, but incredibly unlikely.

These are the following players that I think are good enough to start building around (in no particular order). Most, if not all, require another player of the same calibre, or they require multiple Tier 3 stars (Horford, Conley, Batum, etc) to propel a team into contention.

Godlike Elite Superstars:
Curry
LeBron
Durant?

Superstars:
Westbrook
Harden
Kawhi
P.George
C.Paul
Griffin
Lillard
LMA
Cousins

Aged Superstars:
Duncan
Dirk
Wade

Young Superstars:
Davis
Giannis?
KAT?
Porzingis?

Tier 2 Stars:
Draymond
Klay
Kyrie
Love
Bosh
Butler
M.Gasol
Wall

That's 27, so almost enough for every team to have a franchise player. Although most of those guys are spread out amongst the same teams.

So I think there are plenty of players a team could pursue over several years of free agency, without having to blow our cap space on Tier 3 players.

The team will only have to wait a maximum of 2 years to know if it has a player on the trajectory of joining those ranks. We should have a fair idea of Gordon's development next season, and Hezonja's the one after. That's not to say that they will peak by then, but we should at least start to see glimmers of superstar potential by that point, as long as we're giving them the opportunity to demonstrate that.

And our cap space is going to disappear quickly just by retaining our guys. Fournier will command north of $15M. Dipo will be north of $20M. Gordon and Elf are going to be anywhere from $12-$20M. Who knows where Hezonja ends up, but at that point Vuc is a FA, too, so his salary will probably double as well.

All that money spent, and possibly not a star in sight?

[Skin]

Then if Henny Crash and burns again in 2017 Free Agency, we can start talking about 2018, then 2019 and then 2020!

Hey, you're the one preaching patience on Gordon and Hezonja...

How convenient is it to tell us that we should chill out because they will hit their prime in 3 years AND at the same time tell us that WE NEED TO HIT IN FA NOW!

Just for your consistency sakes, maybe we should wait 3 years from now when Gordon and Hezonja are in their prime to strike in FA.

[Skin]

Depends on the free agency acquisitions. If the Magic land a high calibre forward - I seriously doubt they resign him. If they don't, they might as well match him and trade him down the road (similar to Harris)...S&T in RFA don't return value.

RFAs can return value if the team wants to keep him. They don't if the team wants to let him go to begin with.

Bledsoe was a RFA that we couldn't get because PHX wanted a lot in return. If we wanted any of the RFAs next summer like Noel, Adams, Giannis, Gobert... it would take a lot to do a S&T. Same can be said for Fournier. ...and Rob has said everything right as far as saying he has intentions on bringing him back. That's market talk.

You can't match and trade a restricted free agent.

If a team matches an offer sheet and retains its free agent, then for one year they cannot trade him without his consent, and during that year cannot trade him at all to the team that signed him to the offer sheet. They also can't trade the player in a sign-and-trade transaction CBA FAQ

The Magic would have to work out a S&T without matching which means the trading team has all leverage, and why S&T on RFA never return value.

That's not what I suggested. I understand that if we match, he's ours. Done deal. All we can do is trade later him like we did with Tobias.

But we can do a S&T. If someone wants Fournier and they want to prevent us from matching, then they will have to come up with an offer that is enticing enough.

When Ryno was a RFA, we did a S&T... but we didn't get a lot back because we didn't want to match the offer. If we did want to match, then NOR would've had to pony up more in order to get him.

[ezzzp]

Someone is going to pay Harrison Barnes and I really can't decide whether or not I would be pissed off if it were us. I know I wouldn't be thrilled but maybe I could be okay with it? I just can't decide. We just haven't seen enough of him. With Curry, Thompson, Draymond, Iggy and others Barnes has only been asked to be the #4 or 5 guy.

Can he be a legit #1 or 2?

If we keep Fournier, where does that put him and what does that mean for Dipo?

I don't see Barnes playing point-forward like Batum could.

I just don't know. You don't have to talk me out of signing Barnes but if anyone out there loves him I would like to hear why. I'm on the fence here.

I don't think he can be a #1 or #2; but he is a good player. I had compiled some info on Barnes earlier in this thread. Here you go:

Harrison Barnes
Restricted Free Agent: Eligible for the Jr. Max = $23m (25% of $92m Estimated Salary Cap)


Basketball-Reference

Barnes did well in the post but struggled attacking set defenses, especially recognizing the second line of help, often driving into crowds. This is still not a particularly strong area of the game for him; Barnes has a decent handle dribbling from side-to-side but does not attack with as much speed off the bounce when he does not have a live dribble, and has only so-so instincts passing out of dribble penetration.

Barnes is not the sort of player who can create for himself and others at this point, and he knew he was miscast in such a role, as he revealed to the Mercury News’s Marcus Thompson a couple of weeks ago. The combination of his limitations as a shot creator and the iffy talent around him resulted in Barnes shooting 27.8% in 97 shots in isolation and averaging only 0.62 points per possession on 97 pick-and-rolls, according to mysynergysports.com.

Basketball Breakdown

1-3 pick-and-rolls have also been used to get Barnes other chances to attack off the catch with a live dribble, aside from defenders running him off the three-point line. He has shot 47.8% on 38 drives so far this season, an improvement from his 38% inefficiency on 223 such attempts last season. 29.5% of his two-point baskets have been dunks, and Barnes has shot 76% at the rim overall, per basketball-reference.

Basketball Breakdown

His interior scoring has been complemented by improved outside shooting, also best explained by context....The release in his shot is not any noticeably quicker, but by playing more time with two of the league’s most respected shooters, Barnes has been open more often and his efficiency on long-range looks have increased as a result. According to NBA.com’s SportVU tracking technology, he is taking roughly 57% of his shots with no defender within four feet of him, an increase of 10% in comparison to last season. With no ball-handling responsibilities and playing alongside a bunch of high end passers, he is taking 38.1% of shots off the catch, and has hit his 48 such three-point attempts at a 43.8% clip. Barnes has taken only four three-point attempts off the bounce and only three with a defender within four feet of him. Maybe only Tony Allen could do poorly with such a recipe.

Basketball Breakdown

Barnes is an athlete with nice shooting touch. He doesn’t have the handle to consistently create off the dribble, well not in traffic against good defenses anyway. But he is better at that and he can finish. He has a nice jumper. He can run a fast break.

“It’s hard when you get the ball in an iso situation and you have a set defense in front of you,” Barnes said. “Very few players in the league can do that. You look at the best – Durant, Melo, those guys – look at what percentage they shoot. And that’s the best of the best, so you can imagine where I’m at. I’m like at 15, 20 percent on isos. To get me with the ball moving, getting me in different spots, playing off other people, that’s more of a strength for me right now. Going straight isos, that wasn’t a strength for me.”

http://blogs.mercurynews.com/thompson/2014/12/05/resurgence-harrison-barnes/


We know at a certain point Rob was interested:

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

[Bensational]

Great post. This superstar or bust mentality is getting old. Newsflash: None of the free agent superstars are going to be banging down our door to join our sub 500 franchise in either 2016 or 2017. If you are holding your breath for Durant this year or Curry, Westbrook, Griffin, CP3 or whoever next year, you are gonna pass out from oxygen deprivation. Get a clue people, this isn't 2k. And this whole notion of turning away Horford because he's not a Durant level superstar is so mental. We'd be lucky just to have him hear a pitch from us.

This is how championship teams are built though. You start by drafting a star, then you either sign or trade for another one (or two).

People who want Horford and think he will make any kind of significant difference are people who think small. All he's going to do is clog up $25M+ for 4 years, and maybe, maybe help us reach the 2nd round.

GSW
Draft - Curry, Klay, Dray
Sign - Iggy
Trade - Bogut

SAS
Draft - Duncan, Parker, Manu, Kawhi
Sign - LMA
Trade - ?

CLE
Draft - Kyrie
Sign - LeBron
Trade - Love

OKC
Draft - Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka
Sign - ?
Trade - Kanter

MIA (championship team)
Draft - Wade
Sign - LeBron, Bosh
Trade - ?

LAL (championship team)
Draft - Kobe, Bynum
Sign - ?
Trade - Gasol, Odom

BOS (championship team)
Draft - Pierce, Rondo
Sign - ?
Trade - Garnett, Allen

DAL (championship team)
Draft - Dirk
Sign - Kidd
Trade - Chandler

____________________________________________________

ORL
Draft - Oladipo, Payton, Gordon, Hezonja
Sign - ?
Trade - Vucevic, Fournier

[Skin]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

[ezzzp]

These are the following players that I think are good enough to start building around (in no particular order). Most, if not all, require another player of the same calibre, or they require multiple Tier 3 stars (Horford, Conley, Batum, etc) to propel a team into contention.

(edit see below)

That's 27, so almost enough for every team to have a franchise player. Although most of those guys are spread out amongst the same teams.

So I think there are plenty of players a team could pursue over several years of free agency, without having to blow our cap space on Tier 3 players.

The team will only have to wait a maximum of 2 years to know if it has a player on the trajectory of joining those ranks. We should have a fair idea of Gordon's development next season, and Hezonja's the one after. That's not to say that they will peak by then, but we should at least start to see glimmers of superstar potential by that point, as long as we're giving them the opportunity to demonstrate that.

And our cap space is going to disappear quickly just by retaining our guys. Fournier will command north of $15M. Dipo will be north of $20M. Gordon and Elf are going to be anywhere from $12-$20M. Who knows where Hezonja ends up, but at that point Vuc is a FA, too, so his salary will probably double as well.

All that money spent, and possibly not a star in sight?

Most of those players are under longterm contracts, or will almost certainly not leave their teams, or their teams won't let them leave (RFA's) or are old or are facing serious injury issues.

Godlike Elite Superstars:
Curry
LeBron
Durant

Superstars:
Westbrook
Harden
Kawhi
P.George
C.Paul
Griffin
Lillard
LMA
Cousins

Aged Superstars:
Duncan
Dirk
Wade

Young Superstars:
Davis
Giannis?
KAT?
Porzingis?

Tier 2 Stars:
Draymond
Klay
Kyrie
Love
Bosh
Butler
M.Gasol
Wall

I see 4 that might be available via free agency over the next two summers and they are incredible long shots for a small market team without an all-star...

...and I see 4 that might be available for trade. Which of course would almost definitely at minimum cost the Magic at least one their best core (EP, Hezonja, Oladipo or Gordon).

[MagicFan101]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

Here is a crazy (or maybe not so crazy?) question. Would you rather we sign Barnes or re-sign Fournier? Barnes is a more traditional SF which alows us to start Dipo at SG for a strong offense-defense combo. Fournier is better suited to play SG with Dipo likely being our 6th man.

I guess it depends who else we can get. To be honest, I think I would really like to see us sign Barnes and Whiteside... move on from Fournier and perhaps trade Vuc.

Elf, CJ
Dipo, Mario
Barnes, Mario
Gordon, Illy / Smith
Whiteside, Dedmon

This could be a strong team if one of the young guys takes a leap forward.

[Skin]

Great post. This superstar or bust mentality is getting old. Newsflash: None of the free agent superstars are going to be banging down our door to join our sub 500 franchise in either 2016 or 2017. If you are holding your breath for Durant this year or Curry, Westbrook, Griffin, CP3 or whoever next year, you are gonna pass out from oxygen deprivation. Get a clue people, this isn't 2k. And this whole notion of turning away Horford because he's not a Durant level superstar is so mental. We'd be lucky just to have him hear a pitch from us.

This is how championship teams are built though. You start by drafting a star, then you either sign or trade for another one (or two).

People who want Horford and think he will make any kind of significant difference are people who think small. All he's going to do is clog up $25M+ for 4 years, and maybe, maybe help us reach the 2nd round.

GSW
Draft - Curry, Klay, Dray
Sign - Iggy
Trade - Bogut

SAS
Draft - Duncan, Parker, Manu, Kawhi
Sign - LMA
Trade - ?

CLE
Draft - Kyrie
Sign - LeBron
Trade - Love

OKC
Draft - Durant, Westbrook, Ibaka
Sign - ?
Trade - Kanter

MIA (championship team)
Draft - Wade
Sign - LeBron, Bosh
Trade - ?

LAL (championship team)
Draft - Kobe, Bynum
Sign - ?
Trade - Gasol, Odom

BOS (championship team)
Draft - Pierce, Rondo
Sign - ?
Trade - Garnett, Allen

DAL (championship team)
Draft - Dirk
Sign - Kidd
Trade - Chandler

____________________________________________________

ORL
Draft - Oladipo, Payton, Gordon, Hezonja
Sign - ?
Trade - Vucevic, Fournier

Brilliant.

This is why we need to focus on developing our talent. Benching them, signing guys who will play over them (Batum, Barnes, Fournier) is a bad vision/philosophy. Just like resigning Tobias was bad philosophy. All we got out of that were expirings while we gave him valuable minutes that could've went towards development. We should've traded Tobias at the 2015 trade deadline when his value was highest. Teams would've acquired his RFA status. We should've traded Fournier at the last deadline. For the same reasons. It takes quickly identifying who to build around and making very bold decisions that aren't easy. Especially when you have a HC who wants to "win now" at all costs.

If we traded Harris at the deadline in 2015 and Fournier got those minutes instead of him, and produced the same as he has this season, how many think we still would've drafted Hezonja? It's an interesting thought. Going into the season, Fournier was universally thought of as purely a bench guy. It was all about Oladipo, Harris, Gordon, Hezonja... with Fournier a guy who would benefit most from the Harkless trade. Even CJ Watson was arguably thought of as a bigger fish in the pond. But Fournier surpassed expectations early and never relinquished. If we knew then, what we know now... maybe we're sitting here with WCS or Myles Turner.

Unless, we are acquiring a star, there's no way we should be making moves that would diminish minutes for Oladipo, Hezonja and Gordon. Right now, those are the 3 guys we have our best chance with at becoming stars who could attract other stars to play with them. I'm really hoping Oladipo will be able to be that caliber of player by next summer. If so, 2017 FA could be AWESOME. Being able to sign 2 max FAs and go over the cap to sign Oladipo? Now we're cookin'!

[axl_c_cool]

I would bet that after Durant and Horford Hennigan will go after Barnes, resign Fournier, and draft a rim protector Chriss. We would be almost 10 deep in legitimate starters today and 10 deep in future starters and still hold room for a max player next summer if the numbers are done right

Payton/Jennings
Oladipo/Hezonja
Barnes/Fournier
Gordon/Chriss
Horford/Vucevic


Barnes would spread the floor hopefully with Oladipo's continued improvement and Payton and Gordon also becoming acceptable shooters we have a nice small ball lineup

The 2nd unit Vucevic has Chriss next to him for rim protection, Fournier pick and roll, and Hezonja to space the floor.

Those are 2 balanced lineups and something I'd expect to see and something that would work. Every night a different unit can beat a team in a different way


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

[ezzzp]

You can't match and trade a restricted free agent.

If a team matches an offer sheet and retains its free agent, then for one year they cannot trade him without his consent, and during that year cannot trade him at all to the team that signed him to the offer sheet. They also can't trade the player in a sign-and-trade transaction CBA FAQ

The Magic would have to work out a S&T without matching which means the trading team has all leverage, and why S&T on RFA never return value.

That's not what I suggested. I understand that if we match, he's ours. Done deal. All we can do is trade later him like we did with Tobias.

But we can do a S&T. If someone wants Fournier and they want to prevent us from matching, then they will have to come up with an offer that is enticing enough.

When Ryno was a RFA, we did a S&T... but we didn't get a lot back because we didn't want to match the offer. If we did want to match, then NOR would've had to pony up more in order to get him.

That would entail the Magic take on salary...so not only do the contracts have to match, the offer to the Magic would have to something the team actually wanted...what do you think are the chances of both those criteria to be met? Almost never, which is why rarely are there S&T for RFA's. Don't take my word for it, go back and look for a RFA S&T deal...you'll see that its rare and when it does happen its a Ryan Anderson for Gustavo Ayon and cap space type deal.

[Bensational]

These are the following players that I think are good enough to start building around (in no particular order). Most, if not all, require another player of the same calibre, or they require multiple Tier 3 stars (Horford, Conley, Batum, etc) to propel a team into contention.

(edit see below)

That's 27, so almost enough for every team to have a franchise player. Although most of those guys are spread out amongst the same teams.

So I think there are plenty of players a team could pursue over several years of free agency, without having to blow our cap space on Tier 3 players.

The team will only have to wait a maximum of 2 years to know if it has a player on the trajectory of joining those ranks. We should have a fair idea of Gordon's development next season, and Hezonja's the one after. That's not to say that they will peak by then, but we should at least start to see glimmers of superstar potential by that point, as long as we're giving them the opportunity to demonstrate that.

And our cap space is going to disappear quickly just by retaining our guys. Fournier will command north of $15M. Dipo will be north of $20M. Gordon and Elf are going to be anywhere from $12-$20M. Who knows where Hezonja ends up, but at that point Vuc is a FA, too, so his salary will probably double as well.

All that money spent, and possibly not a star in sight?

Most of those players are under longterm contracts, or will almost certainly not leave their teams, or their teams won't let them leave (RFA's) or are old or are facing serious injury issues.

Godlike Elite Superstars:
Curry
LeBron
Durant

Superstars:
Westbrook
Harden
Kawhi
P.George
C.Paul
Griffin
Lillard
LMA
Cousins

Aged Superstars:
Duncan
Dirk
Wade

Young Superstars:
Davis
Giannis?
KAT?
Porzingis?

Tier 2 Stars:
Draymond
Klay
Kyrie
Love
Bosh
Butler
M.Gasol
Wall

I see 4 that might be available via free agency over the next two summers and they are incredible long shots for a small market team without an all-star...

...and I see 4 that might be available for trade. Which of course would almost definitely at minimum cost the Magic at least one their best core (EP, Hezonja, Oladipo or Gordon).

I think Harden and George may also be in the mix if their teams haven't added quality support by that time, and if we can offer the chance to partner AND have a team stacked with youth at the same time.

I agree about the trade options. At some point that's the kind of player we will have to consolidate our assets for. And they might be enough of an allure for another star to join in the future.

[Skin]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

Here is a crazy (or maybe not so crazy?) question. Would you rather we sign Barnes or re-sign Fournier? Barnes is a more traditional SF which alows us to start Dipo at SG for a strong offense-defense combo. Fournier is better suited to play SG with Dipo likely being our 6th man.

I guess it depends who else we can get. To be honest, I think I would really like to see us sign Barnes and Whiteside... move on from Fournier and perhaps trade Vuc.

Elf, CJ
Dipo, Mario
Barnes, Mario
Gordon, Illy / Smith
Whiteside, Dedmon

This could be a strong team if one of the young guys takes a leap forward.

I'm perfectly content signing neither. I would prefer a S&T for Fournier, even if it's just draft picks.

I'd open the way to allow Hezonja to start with Skiles having no alternative.

Side note: I see you have Whiteside there, but I don't see him coming based on that roster. Where is Vuc?

--------

Now if we traded Vuc / OIadipo or Hezonja / Payton or something for a PG like Kyrie... who then attracted Whiteside...

Then I could see Barnes being a good get as our 3rd option. ...and I'd bring back Fournier to boot.

Irving / Oladipo or Hezonja / Barnes / Gordon / Whiteside

--------

[Skin]

You can't match and trade a restricted free agent.



The Magic would have to work out a S&T without matching which means the trading team has all leverage, and why S&T on RFA never return value.

That's not what I suggested. I understand that if we match, he's ours. Done deal. All we can do is trade later him like we did with Tobias.

But we can do a S&T. If someone wants Fournier and they want to prevent us from matching, then they will have to come up with an offer that is enticing enough.

When Ryno was a RFA, we did a S&T... but we didn't get a lot back because we didn't want to match the offer. If we did want to match, then NOR would've had to pony up more in order to get him.

That would entail the Magic take on salary...so not only do the contracts have to match, the offer to the Magic would have to something the team actually wanted...what do you think are the chances of both those criteria to be met? Almost never, which is why rarely are there S&T for RFA's. Don't take my word for it, go back and look for a RFA S&T deal...you'll see that its rare and when it does happen its a Ryan Anderson for Gustavo Ayon and cap space type deal.

Which is why I have said that a S&T of Fournier for draft picks is fine by me. I'd do it for a mid 1st this year. BOS would probably jump at that chance with how many they have.

[ezzzp]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

Ai yai yai! If you ever learn how to read at a basic elementary school level you would see that the statement says "at a certain point RH was interested."

...and btw Fournier is not a SF and is a free agent
...and Harkless and Harris were moved because RH did not think they were the answer at SF, I agree
...and Mario Hezonja has shown nothing to earn the starting SF role. He might in a year or two, but that is not now and there is no guarantee he ever will.

[ezzzp]

That's not what I suggested. I understand that if we match, he's ours. Done deal. All we can do is trade later him like we did with Tobias.

But we can do a S&T. If someone wants Fournier and they want to prevent us from matching, then they will have to come up with an offer that is enticing enough.

When Ryno was a RFA, we did a S&T... but we didn't get a lot back because we didn't want to match the offer. If we did want to match, then NOR would've had to pony up more in order to get him.

That would entail the Magic take on salary...so not only do the contracts have to match, the offer to the Magic would have to something the team actually wanted...what do you think are the chances of both those criteria to be met? Almost never, which is why rarely are there S&T for RFA's. Don't take my word for it, go back and look for a RFA S&T deal...you'll see that its rare and when it does happen its a Ryan Anderson for Gustavo Ayon and cap space type deal.

Which is why I have said that a S&T of Fournier for draft picks is fine by me. I'd do it for a mid 1st this year. BOS would probably jump at that chance with how many they have.

A starting caliber player who just had a break out year for a mid 1st?! Yikes, thank god you aren't RH

[Skin]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/ricbucher/status/485904923708518400[/tweet]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

Ai yai yai! If you ever learn how to read at a basic elementary school level you would see that the statement says "at a certain point RH was interested."

...and btw Fournier is not a SF and is a free agent
...and Harkless and Harris were moved because RH did not think they were the answer at SF, I agree
...and Mario Hezonja has shown nothing to earn the starting SF role. He might in a year or two, but that is not now and there is no guarantee he ever will.

C'mon now, you wanted to suggest that Henny could still be interested in Barnes. Don't back track now.

[Skin]

That would entail the Magic take on salary...so not only do the contracts have to match, the offer to the Magic would have to something the team actually wanted...what do you think are the chances of both those criteria to be met? Almost never, which is why rarely are there S&T for RFA's. Don't take my word for it, go back and look for a RFA S&T deal...you'll see that its rare and when it does happen its a Ryan Anderson for Gustavo Ayon and cap space type deal.

Which is why I have said that a S&T of Fournier for draft picks is fine by me. I'd do it for a mid 1st this year. BOS would probably jump at that chance with how many they have.

A starting caliber player who just had a break out year for a mid 1st?! Yikes, thank god you aren't RH

Would you consider that less or more than what we got for Tobias Harris?

[ezzzp]

Since Jul 2014 we have since traded for Evan Fournier (who we can go over the cap to sign) and we have added Mario Hezonja and Aaron Gordon with two consecutive Top 5 picks.

In addition, we cleared room at SF by trading away Harkless and Harris. Why would Hennigan still be thinking about adding Barnes?

I admire your effort though.

*Ric Bucher no less! ai yai yai*

Ai yai yai! If you ever learn how to read at a basic elementary school level you would see that the statement says "at a certain point RH was interested."

...and btw Fournier is not a SF and is a free agent
...and Harkless and Harris were moved because RH did not think they were the answer at SF, I agree
...and Mario Hezonja has shown nothing to earn the starting SF role. He might in a year or two, but that is not now and there is no guarantee he ever will.

C'mon now, you wanted to suggest that Henny could still be interested in Barnes. Don't back track now.

Uh, no I didn't. Magicfan101 asked the board about Barnes; I replied to him with a description post of Barnes I had posted a few months ago. I left Bucher's tweet in because it showed that Rob Hennigan at a certain point was interested in him. As in, at one point in his stint as Magic GM Rob Hennigan had an interest in Harrison Barnes.

...did you even read the quotes I posted? none of them are particularly flattering and point out his weaknesses...

You would think that after commenting on my earlier post, one in which I detailed who I wanted RH to pursue in FA - which did not include Harrison Barnes anywhere, that you would be able to put two and two together.