Running a 4/5 pick-and-roll?

[J the Drafter]

Rashard Lewis' greatest strength is that he's quicker than most of his defenders. I have to wonder how effective he could be if he were used in isos and PnR's. The Magic do have that screen followed by a catch-and-shoot, and I've heard how he used to bother the Pistons with his scoring. I'd be willing to bet that if the Magic ran a pick-and-roll between Lewis and Howard properly, at least some opposing bigs would get pretty confused trying to defend that play. It might even throw our championship rivals for a loop. That is presupposing that Rashard can run the play without turning the ball over, and that he's able to score or find the open man.

[Rican_MagicFan]

I was also thinking about this the other day when i was playing 2k10, I did it and it worked. Its only a game but the strategy in my opinion will actually work since rashard will blow by his slow defenders.

[x-]

That is presupposing that Rashard can run the play without turning the ball over, and that he's able to score or find the open man.

Which is a lot to ask for somebody who has no handles and tunnel vision of the dribble.

[tiderulz]

That is presupposing that Rashard can run the play without turning the ball over, and that he's able to score or find the open man.

Which is a lot to ask for somebody who has no handles and tunnel vision of the dribble.

he did pretty well in Seattle. People often forget how much he would go to the basket as a SF in Seattle. They just see him now in Orlando, the 3 pt shooting PF SVG has turned him into.

[KingRobb02]

That is presupposing that Rashard can run the play without turning the ball over, and that he's able to score or find the open man.

Which is a lot to ask for somebody who has no handles and tunnel vision of the dribble.

he did pretty well in Seattle. People often forget how much he would go to the basket as a SF in Seattle. They just see him now in Orlando, the 3 pt shooting PF SVG has turned him into.

I watched him in Seattle and he didn't do much handling. I can remember his younger days amazing me because he was a 6'10" guy with unlimited range and a decent post game that I expected to get better as he bulked up (which never really happened). The only driving he did was to set up that runner that he used to have.He's never really been asked to be a distributor though.

[x-]

That's not true. Rashard never was good at creating for others of the dribble and he sure never had good handles either.

If you watch 'old' Sonics games/highlights, you'll see that Rashard scored either on catch&shoots, post-ups, iso's or going to the basket, using either his jap-step or the created defensive roations to go by his man, using ~3-4 dribbles at the most.
He never was asked to handle the ball, because he simply isn't very good at it.

[tiderulz]

I didnt say he created for others. I just remember him going at the basket. I meant that he had some handling with the ball to be able to not lose it all the time.

[MickaelPietrus]

Rashard just doesn't have good handles. And thats probably why Turk was considered as the Magic's MVP in 2009 while Dwight has foul trouble.

[Bucksfans1and2]

He has the same problem Michael Redd has. When he drives he drives with his head down, whether this is because he's looking at the ball or it helps him somehow it prevents him from finding the open man, in this case Dwight.

[Jamaicankid21]

Rashard is a good scorer.. His best strength on offense is not his speed advantage on PFs.. His best advantage on offense is posting up SFs, Iosing vs Sfs, and be able to shoot OVER the defender. Rashard has had problems with longer, and taller defenders.

[Birth of the Cool]

I don't like this idea at all.

In a 4/5 pnr that leaves Shard as the ball handler/decision maker which is BAD news.
Like others have said, Shard doesn't have a great handle, he also mainly drives only right, and he has subpar passing skills (easily the worst passing rating of the starters last year & one of the worst of the whole team - I believe only Pietrus & Gortat had worse passing rating last year).

Can you imagine a guy like that making the right decisions on pnr's, or being able to split pnr's or avoid defenders jumping out on the pnr's...it would be a dribbling mess of Pietrus type proportions.

Shard should have 3 main moves:
1. Stand at the perimeter to stretch out the 4 and give Dwight more room to operate in the low block, & to let Shard jack up 3pts all day long.
2. Left Low Block (please use this more SVG...)
3. Iso at the top of the 3pt line

If Shard is involved in any PnR it should be 4/2 with Vince, with Shard as the pick/screen player. Of all the starters Vince seemed to connect best with Shard in the PnR - Shard had tons of wide open looks on the top of the key (left side) pnr with Vince where he would roll off the screen to the left baseline for open J's (he just missed a lot last year).

Starting Unit PnR should be:
1. Nelson / Dwight
2. Vince / Dwight
3. Vince / Shard
4. Nelson / Vince

Not sure how Q-Rich's pnr game is. I just know the dude plays big & has a big caboose & therefore has some legit post game. Gortat seems to be pretty good at the screen & roll - makes himself available a lot.

[tiderulz]

^^Same with Paul Pierce now. He relies on the pump fakes because he cant blow by anyone anymore and taller players dont have to fall for his fakes.

[Just Plain Mark]

I don't think a 4/5 p-n-r would be very effective, but I do wonder why the Magic don't use Lewis more like the Blazers use L. Aldridge and run pick and rolls with Lewis on either elbow. If the NBA.com hot spot site is correct, Lewis took 14 shots the whole year from either elbow (and made 50%).

I know that putting Lewis at the elbow clogs the lane a little, but I think the trade off (a much higher efficiency shot for Lewis) would be worth it.

[Blue_and_Whte]

Like most have said, Lewis does not have the handles to be the primary ball handler in PnR situations, and I have yet to see him "blow by" anyone. Vince/Lew were pretty effective and Jameer/VC and Jameer/Lew are good PnR duos. So is Gortat and JJ, those guys connect pretty well together.
Lewis is very deciving, he looks fast and athletic but he isn't, he SHOULD be blowing by PF's that close out on him at the 3pt line but he doesn't do it often enough and he isnt as effective finishing at the rim like you'd expect, he throws up those damn floaters when he should be trying to dunk the damn thing.

Like Birth of Cool said, SVG should start playing Shard at the 3 more and post him up, thats where his strength is and that imo is the easiest way for him to get into a rythm. OT but imo the same goes for VC.

[SolidSnake008]

I don't think a 4/5 p-n-r would be very effective, but I do wonder why the Magic don't use Lewis more like the Blazers use L. Aldridge and run pick and rolls with Lewis on either elbow. If the NBA.com hot spot site is correct, Lewis took 14 shots the whole year from either elbow (and made 50%).

I know that putting Lewis at the elbow clogs the lane a little, but I think the trade off (a much higher efficiency shot for Lewis) would be worth it.

Agree.....Stan just doesn't use the Mid-range enough....it can be very effective when the 3ball isn't falling

[Blue_and_Whte]

I was also thinking about this the other day when i was playing 2k10, I did it and it worked. Its only a game but the strategy in my opinion will actually work since rashard will blow by his slow defenders.

Aye dios mio

[LBPTarHeel27]

P&R with Bass & Gortat = Magic Dynasty. That is the 4-5 P&R we need to use.

[craig01]

You can't just assign 2 positional numbers and run a pick and roll.

There has to be a threat of execution by either penetration, using an effective screen for a shot, or the give back to the pick setter.

Using Howard so often is fairly one dimensional.....but he often times does take the defense with him after setting the screen....I, for one, have been asking for a long time to using other combinations, 1-2, 1-4, 2-4, etc.

[GameOver25]

You can't just assign 2 positional numbers and run a pick and roll.

There has to be a threat of execution by either penetration, using an effective screen for a shot, or the give back to the pick setter.

Using Howard so often is fairly one dimensional.....but he often times does take the defense with him after setting the screen....I, for one, have been asking for a long time to using other combinations, 1-2, 1-4, 2-4, etc.

Stan needs to be more creative on offense. Hopefully he understands we need to be more versatile this year.

[SolidSnake008]

here is a nice article breaking down the Magic's offense.....Along with Video

http://www.orlandopinstripedpost.com/20 ... s-down-the