Best defensive frontcourt we've had since...???

Wannabe MEP · Post #1 » by **Wannabe MEP** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 11:44 am

Our Frye-Gortat frontcourt is superb defensively. Frye-Lopez is doing really well, too. Even Warrick is starting to look better, playing alongside Gortat.

But I especially mean Frye-Gortat. The bigs on our go-to unit have plenty of length, tons of rebounding, good focus/effort, and excellent mobility for their size. They both play solid help-side D. They don't go to sleep/get lost out there. Gortat is phenomenal against the PnR, and Frye does really well too.

The No. 1 reason the Nash-Era Suns have never won a championship is because our defensive frontcourt has always hovered somewhere between mediocre and horrendous. When was the last time a team won an NBA championship without an elite defensive frontcourt??

DRK · Post #2 » by **DRK** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 12:15 pm

Since Amare and Marion at PF and C. 8-)

Haha, nah. I think Gortat is one of the top "true" centers the Suns have had. He does everything a center is supposed to do as a center, and Frye has been pretty good on defence and rebounding too this season. Frye's 3 point shooting is a huge bonus to us too.

YFZblu · Post #3 » by **YFZblu** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 1:07 pm

Need to get started on my GOATat signature.

schnakenpopanz · Post #4 » by **schnakenpopanz** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 3:23 pm

like i mentioned in the nets gamethread all the time we were a gortat type player away from being champions. and now we are a amre type player away from being champions. life is hard.

YFZblu · Post #5 » by **YFZblu** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 5:10 pm

Best defensive front court since Diaw/Thomas in 2006. The Suns were ranked 4th in defensive efficiency until Kurt Thomas went down in February of that season.

GOATat looms.

sunsfever68 · Post #6 » by **sunsfever68** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 8:39 pm

schnakenpopanz wrote:like i mentioned in the nets gamethread all the time we were a gortat type player away from being champions. and now we are a amre type player away from being champions. life is hard.

We really are. Man if we hadn't signed Childress and Warrick to those contracts that would've given us 10 mil right there. Even if we had made the move for Gortat and pietrus and carter, if Sarver really was hell bent on a championship and not so hell bent on saving money, we could've tried to shell out an additional 10 mil for Amare. Idk what our cap situation looks like and if that would've gone into the Luxury tax or whatever but a lineup of

Nash Brooks
Carter Dudley
Hill Pietrus
Amare Frye
Lopez Gortat

Gives me a gigantic stiffy in my pants

realsunsfan · Post #7 » by **realsunsfan** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 8:49 pm

sunsfever68 wrote:
schnakenpopanz wrote:like i mentioned in the nets gamethread all the time we were a gortat type player away from being champions. and now we are a amre type player away from being champions. life is hard.

We really are. Man if we hadn't signed Childress and Warrick to those contracts that would've given us 10 mil right there. Even if we had made the move for Gortat and pietrus and carter, if Sarver really was hell bent on a championship and not so hell bent on saving money, we could've tried to shell out an additional 10 mil for Amare. Idk what our cap situation looks like and if that would've gone into the Luxury tax or whatever but a lineup of

Nash Brooks
Carter Dudley
Hill Pietrus
Amare Frye
Lopez Gortat

Gives me a gigantic stiffy in my pants

When are you guys going to get it ??? It wasn't the amount we offered Amare, it was the gauranteed years, we only were going to gauranty three years then partial for the rest, which makes the statement above WRONG....

WTFsunsFTW · Post #8 » by **WTFsunsFTW** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 8:53 pm

What if we overpaid for Amare, still did the hedo-barbosa trade, and only did the Hedo/Clark for Gortat/Pietrus move?

Nash/Dragic
JRich/Dudley
Hill/Pietrus
Amare/Frye
Gortat/Lopez

zomgz

YFZblu · Post #9 » by **YFZblu** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 10:43 pm

Lots of fansterbation going on in this thread...

JasonDaPsycho · Post #10 » by **JasonDaPsycho** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 10:54 pm

Los Soles wrote:Our Lopez-Gortat frontcourt is superb defensively.

Corrected. Frye is still playing softer than hot butter.

schnakenpopanz · Post #11 » by **schnakenpopanz** » Wed Mar 2, 2011 11:03 pm

YFZblu wrote:Lots of fansterbation going on in this thread...

let us dream a bit

BurningHeart · Post #12 » by **BurningHeart** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 12:30 am

YFZblu wrote:Best defensive front court since Diaw/Thomas in 2006. The Suns were ranked 4th in defensive efficiency until Kurt Thomas went down in February of that season.

GOATat looms.

Ugh. That makes me so angry.

And all we freakin' hear, STILL, is that we never played D, and thats why we never won, and all this other CRAP.

Wannabe MEP · Post #13 » by **Wannabe MEP** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 12:37 am

Hey, you know what Diaw/Thomas was missing? STAT. You know why we've always been poor defensively?? STAT. You know who's gone now? STAT.

For a few dozen reasons, please let the Amare fansterbation die now. Thanks.

I'd rather have Gortat-Frye than any lineup that includes Stoudemire.

sunsfever68 · Post #14 » by **sunsfever68** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 12:37 am

To above poster who said I was wrong about sarver not wanting to shell out the money

3 years guaranteed and 2 years partially

vs

5 years guaranteed

means that the contract we offered him was less money guaranteed. Granted Idk if Amare is worth 20 mil a year honestly so I don't necessarily blame Sarver and he also didnt want to commit to a star who doesn't play defense or rebound like he should and be stuck in mediocrity for years to come as opposed to the process we're about to enter into where we bottom out and hopefully get some great lottery draft stars and rebuild like every successful eventually champion does.

But make no mistake this was about saving money. EVERYTHING is motivated by dollars and cents in professional sports. At least 98 percent of moves

impulsenine · Post #15 » by **impulsenine** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 12:46 am

sunsfever68 wrote:3 years guaranteed and 2 years partially vs 5 years guaranteed

But make no mistake this was about saving money.

It was partly about the money sure, but Amare's year off (and the sudden skyrocketing in defensive efficiency during that year) was a huge part of why he didn't get that 5-year contract.

BurningHeart · Post #16 » by **BurningHeart** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 12:59 am

Los Soles wrote:Hey, you know what Diaw/Thomas was missing? STAT. You know why we've always been poor defensively?? STAT. You know who's gone now? STAT.

For a few dozen reasons, please let the Amare fansterbation die now. Thanks.

I'd rather have Gortat-Frye than any lineup that includes Stoudemire.

If I recall correctly, we were Top 15 in opposing FG% from 04-05 til D'Antoni was fired.....

Rebounding was the issue. You wanna blame **** rebounding on Amare, sure. Don't act like we're a better team without Amare. The hole in our lineup is CLEAR.

YFZblu · Post #17 » by **YFZblu** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 2:57 am

BurningHeart wrote:
Los Soles wrote:Hey, you know what Diaw/Thomas was missing? STAT. You know why we've always been poor defensively?? STAT. You know who's gone now? STAT.

For a few dozen reasons, please let the Amare fansterbation die now. Thanks.

I'd rather have Gortat-Frye than any lineup that includes Stoudemire.

If I recall correctly, we were Top 15 in opposing FG% from 04-05 til D'Antoni was fired.....

Rebounding was the issue. You wanna blame **** rebounding on Amare, sure. Don't act like we're a better team without Amare. The hole in our lineup is CLEAR.

Well defensive rebounding is vital to ensure that a team completely finishes a defensive possession. Does no good to force a miss if the other team gets the offensive rebound. Amar'e was definitely the weak link on defense.

BurningHeart · Post #18 » by **BurningHeart** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 9:04 am

Yes, but to say we've been a poor defensive team is not being completely accurate.

Wannabe MEP · Post #19 » by **Wannabe MEP** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 11:33 am

BurningHeart wrote:Yes, but to say we've been a poor defensive team is not being completely accurate.

I agree that we weren't as bad defensively as people thought because our fast-paced, higher scoring games made it look like we were poorer defensively than we really were. If you evaluate our defense per possession instead of per game, we had some decent seasons.

However, we haven't been in the top 10 in defensive rating in a decade. I don't know that you can win a championship that way. Name the last team that won a championship that didn't have an elite defense anchored by an elite defensive frontcourt...

BurningHeart · Post #20 » by **BurningHeart** » Thu Mar 3, 2011 11:51 am

Los Soles wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:Yes, but to say we've been a poor defensive team is not being completely accurate.

I agree that we weren't as bad defensively as people thought because our fast-paced, higher scoring games made it look like we were poorer defensively than we really were. If you evaluate our defense per possession instead of per game, we had some decent seasons.

However, we haven't been in the top 10 in defensive rating in a decade. I don't know that you can win a championship that way. Name the last team that won a championship that didn't have an elite defense anchored by an elite defensive frontcourt...

There isn't, but I'm not sure there's a championship winner anchored by an elite go-to big-man either.

Gasol, Gasol, Garnett, Duncan, Shaq, Duncan, Rasheed Wallace....

Offense is just as important as defense. Shaq, Duncan, and Garnett were great defensive players too...Gasol and Wallace aren't exactly known for their defense as much as their offense but they were more than capable. We would have been more than fine if we had Amare + a dedicated defensive/rebounding guy a la Camby/prime Kurt, etc.

Oh well, water under the bridge.