Scottie Pippen or Gary Payton?

StateOfThunder · Post #1 » by **StateOfThunder** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:09 pm

Who do you have ranked higher in your all-time rankings list? I'm going with Pippen but I'm curious to know what you guys think.

jojo4341 · Post #2 » by **jojo4341** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:16 pm

Both have an argument for being the best perimeter defender of all time, but Pippen was still the more versatile player overall. So I'd go with Pippen as well.

The Infamous1 · Post #3 » by **The Infamous1** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:24 pm

Payton because he was number one option

TheXFactor · Post #4 » by **TheXFactor** » Thu Jun 14, 2012 11:59 pm

Pippen.

Narigo · Post #5 » by **Narigo** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:19 am

Pippen

kasino · Post #6 » by **kasino** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:23 am

Pippen

what makes Payton a 1st option?

DirtyDez · Post #7 » by **DirtyDez** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 12:49 am

I've seen people say Payton was incredibly overrated and underrated but he had a 10 year prime of 21/8/5 with elite D. I'd probably take the Glove but would be thrilled with either. Pretty good question.

ahonui06 · Post #8 » by **ahonui06** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:00 am

DirtyDez wrote:I've seen people say Payton was incredibly overrated and underrated but he had a 10 year prime of 21/8/5 with elite D. I'd probably take the Glove but would be thrilled with either. Pretty good question.

StateOfThunder · Post #9 » by **StateOfThunder** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:55 am

The Infamous1 wrote:Payton because he was number one option

Wasn't Kemp the first option in 1996? Or are you referring to the post Kemp days? They weren't particularly successful though.

therealbig3 · Post #10 » by **therealbig3** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 6:12 am

I take Pippen by a little bit, but it's pretty close.

I have Payton around top 30, and Pippen around top 25.

JordansBulls · Post #11 » by **JordansBulls** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 1:44 pm

These guys are pretty much the same players. Payton is to PG's what Pippen is to SF's. Both guys great defenders, both guys inconsistent as scorers and both guys inconsistent as shooters from the outside. I think Pippen rates higher career wise due to titles, however Payton did lead his team to 6-7 years in a row of 55+ wins. It is amazing because many say Payton was overrated when he did that.

ThunderDan9 · Post #12 » by **ThunderDan9** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 3:50 pm

It's really close, and is a good comparison.

I think, Payton peaked a bit higher... he was the better first option I would say.

Not Bias · Post #13 » by **Not Bias** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:14 pm

Pippen for me, more versatile defender

Post #14 » by **penbeast0** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 5:39 pm

StateOfThunder wrote:
The Infamous1 wrote:Payton because he was number one option

Wasn't Kemp the first option in 1996? Or are you referring to the post Kemp days? They weren't particularly successful though.

Their peak years together were 95-97 (94 was Payton's first year scoring much . . . 16ppg and Kemp was #1 that year on the team. In those years, Payton scored over 20ppg in 95 and 97, a mark Kemp never reached in Seattle; Kemp did score 19.6ppg to Payton's 19.3 in 96 (and in 95, Detlef Schrempf who was #3 the other years scored more than Kemp too).

So yes, I'd say that during the prime Payton/Kemp years he was considered the first option for what that's worth.

StateOfThunder · Post #15 » by **StateOfThunder** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 8:29 pm

penbeast0 wrote:
Their peak years together were 95-97 (94 was Payton's first year scoring much . . . 16ppg and Kemp was #1 that year on the team. In those years, Payton scored over 20ppg in 95 and 97, a mark Kemp never reached in Seattle; Kemp did score 19.6ppg to Payton's 19.3 in 96 (and in 95, Detlef Schrempf who was #3 the other years scored more than Kemp too).

So yes, I'd say that during the prime Payton/Kemp years he was considered the first option for what that's worth.

I was specifically referring to 1996 though, their most successful season. I think overall Payton might have been the #1 option but the year they made it to the finals, Kemp was. Could it mean that Kemp was the catalyst of the team and the leader of the team?

Who do you got in this comparison though?

Post #16 » by **Texas Chuck** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 9:14 pm

I love Payton but we are talking about Scottie Pippen here people.

Ginobili · Post #17 » by **Ginobili** » Fri Jun 15, 2012 11:56 pm

StateOfThunder wrote:
penbeast0 wrote:
Their peak years together were 95-97 (94 was Payton's first year scoring much . . . 16ppg and Kemp was #1 that year on the team. In those years, Payton scored over 20ppg in 95 and 97, a mark Kemp never reached in Seattle; Kemp did score 19.6ppg to Payton's 19.3 in 96 (and in 95, Detlef Schrempf who was #3 the other years scored more than Kemp too).

So yes, I'd say that during the prime Payton/Kemp years he was considered the first option for what that's worth.

I was specifically referring to 1996 though, their most successful season. I think overall Payton might have been the #1 option but the year they made it to the finals, Kemp was. Could it mean that Kemp was the catalyst of the team and the leader of the team?

Who do you got in this comparison though?

Payton was the first option in 1996 or any year from 1994 onwards despite scoring less or a bit less than Kemp all those years. Just like Stoudemire wasnt the first option from 2005 to 2010 on those Suns teams.

People often confuse too much the term "first option" and "first scorer". Not always the first scorer of your team is your first option, in fact, there has been tons of examples of this situation not being true.

Payton was the clear leader of those teams.

HeartBreakKid · Post #18 » by **HeartBreakKid** » Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:43 am

^Totally agree with Ginobli. Being the "first option" usually refers to scoring, which doesn't mean you're the best player. Payton was the best player on the Sonics, no question.

I'd take Payton over Scottie. Defense it is close to a wash, though Scottie is more useful since he can guard 2-4 while Gary can only guard 1-2.

Offense, I like Gary better as a scorer, and slightly better as a playmaker. Gary also had more of a hungry and killer attitude than Scottie.

GSP · Post #19 » by **GSP** » Sat Jun 16, 2012 1:48 am

I actually only have one spot separating the two and its Pippen just barely tho.

StateOfThunder · Post #20 » by **StateOfThunder** » Sun Jun 17, 2012 12:43 am

HeartBreakKid wrote:^Totally agree with Ginobli. Being the "first option" usually refers to scoring, which doesn't mean you're the best player. Payton was the best player on the Sonics, no question.

I'd take Payton over Scottie. Defense it is close to a wash, though Scottie is more useful since he can guard 2-4 while Gary can only guard 1-2.

Offense, I like Gary better as a scorer, and slightly better as a playmaker. Gary also had more of a hungry and killer attitude than Scottie.

Even though Payton averaged more assists during their prime years, Pippen was probably the better facilitator. Payton was kind of a ball-hog/ball-stopper type player while Pippen absolutely was not.