Who do you think will be the better long term player? (Poll)

Post #1 » by **bwgood77** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 2:12 am

TJ Warren or Archie Goodwin?

Post #2 » by **lilfishi22** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:03 am

I'd argue for Warren since he seems like a guy who can score a quiet 10-15 points every night without plays drawn for him and won't give up much on the defensive end either so he'll be in the NBA for a long time. But Goodwin's talent and potential would put him in the top 7 SG's in the league if he can turn that talent and potential into a productive product. If not, then he probably would be a journeyman the rest of his career but the good thing is, he has all the time in the world.

Cutter · Post #3 » by **Cutter** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 3:22 am

I voted Warren.

Archie has too many things to fix like jump shot and not playing out of control so much.

He will improve over the years but I think between the two Warren will be more impactful.

Revived · Post #4 » by **Revived** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 4:48 am

I'm biased cause I love Goodwin so I'm picking him.

Imo one good way to judge superstars is their ability to draw fouls. Goodwin has that ability.

His first step is just ridiculous quick.

Warren surprised me so far. He plays within the flow of the offense so I think he'll be good too. A shame he got hurt.

Marz11 · Post #5 » by **Marz11** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 5:19 am

I think Warren might struggle against the big, athletic NBA defences who won't allow him to get off his little flip shots and to me he almost plays in slow motion. Having said that, if he can develop a consistent 3 he will be fine as it will open up space for him.. His positioning is top class though.

Archie needs court time to work it out and he will be great. Kind of like what Green had to go through last season until he was shown what to do, where to stand etc etc..

phrazbit · Post #6 » by **phrazbit** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:23 pm

I voted Warren. He has a lower ceiling than Goodwin but a much much higher floor. I feel pretty confident in Warren's ability to be a very solid rotation player in the league, while Goodwin's future is much more dubious. Goodwin has all the raw talent to be a complete stud, but if he does not improve his decision making then he will find himself in Greece or Russia in a few years... and a lot of dudes never really have that light come on.

thamadkant · Post #7 » by **thamadkant** » Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:40 pm

Goodwin has a much higher ceiling...
Warren as a higher floor...

As Phrazbit mentioned.... Which I agree with.

I've said since drafting Goodwin.... You need to develop him correctly, as in set him straight as early as possible.
His defense, attitude to the game from what I've seen proves that he is a quick learner, which bodes well for him.

His jump shot is still far from reliable, but it's one of those skills that doesn't improve from bad to good in a season/off season turn around.
You always have to consider... He is 19... And would be playing his 3rd season in college next year as a 19 year old... He is young.... So young.
I think he gets it...
He will only get consistent minutes if he proves he can be reliable as a defender, and he has been a pest defender and have displayed consistent improvement.
He plays wild out there (summer league) primarily because I think he is trying to beat his opponents purely on his physical abilities. But he has proven he can score a lot of points under NBA conditions.

Warren is older, has had benefit of more college basketball experience. And looks to be more mature minded already. Mentally he is probably already ahead of Goodwin.
But physically, I think his lack of elite athleticism, ability to penetrate, or shooting will prevent him from being a being more than a role player.
Don't get me wrong.. If he can improve quickly on any of those traits, he can be a key player.

The problem with developing in the suns system is that they are PG biased...
Even Goodwin has been relegated to slashing and cutting and receiving the ball. I am yet to see him get a ISO play at top and have the team set screens for him to allow him to create as a ball handler.
Warren will also be forced to be a catch and shoot, slash guy...

Even Len's post game will be limited a he won't get much opportunity catching/getting the ball in position...

Suns have their "Wade" and "Lebron" in Dragic and Bledsoe... They need catch and shoot guys around them because they handle the ball so much. And that will affect Goodwin and Warren's success and development as suns players.