The Official Scotty B Sucks Thread

AFM · Post #1 » by **AFM** » Fri Oct 28, 2016 5:15 am

Listen, I know it's way early, but this thread is inevitable, so might as well get it out of the way.

Stolen from BF:

MikeTheKid · Post #2 » by **MikeTheKid** » Fri Oct 28, 2016 7:04 pm

Already AFM, welp he is playing Thornton right now so thread on

tontoz · Post #3 » by **tontoz** » Fri Oct 28, 2016 7:36 pm

Too soon but I do believe that people who seem to think SB is some kind of savior that will make Beal into an All-Star...make Wall get to the line more....and so on and on are going to be disappointed.

I definitely don't get Thornton over Sato.

payitforward · Post #4 » by **payitforward** » Fri Oct 28, 2016 8:01 pm

Agreed. In fact, giving Sato the opportunity to play and develop is one of the most important things the Wizards need to do this season. Thornton has no future; what's the point of giving him minutes?

He was certainly worth the vet minimum contract we gave him; the idea that you can rely on that kind of guy to be your primary backup at the 2??? That's a different story!

edit: there's no reason to think Brooks will be an especially good coach. But, if you give a coach the tools Ernie has given Brooks this off season, he isn't going to look good I don't care who he is.

Sluggerface · Post #5 » by **Sluggerface** » Sat Oct 29, 2016 7:44 pm

Read on Twitter

TGW · Post #6 » by **TGW** » Sun Oct 30, 2016 4:36 am

I was one of the few people who felt the brooks hiring was lazy and uninspiring. His offense was unimaginative in okc, and I thought he had the benefit of two of the best offensive players in the league basically carrying the team during his tenure.

I won't be surprised if he fails here.

AFM · Post #7 » by **AFM** » Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:31 am

TGW wrote:I was one of the few people who felt the brooks hiring was lazy and uninspiring. His offense was unimaginative in okc, and I thought he had the benefit of two of the best offensive players in the league basically carrying the team during his tenure.

I won't be surprised if he fails here.

I don't disagree with you TGW. He doesn't have a track record of being a good coach. That's the truth. He led an OKC team to a good record with two top 5 players. Big whoop.
We overpaid big time, which thankfully doesn't really matter. But our record will be as good as our talent, which is to say, not good.

payitforward · Post #8 » by **payitforward** » Sun Oct 30, 2016 2:00 pm

AFM wrote:... our record will be as good as our talent....

Yup. As is true of any and every team. I wish people would understand this and that there is no such thing as a rabbit-in-the-hat coach.

A great coach, one of the very very few in the history of the league who can actually make a measurable difference, may be worth a couple of wins a season. That's about as far as it goes.

We have marginal talent on our squad. This off-season we added 6 guys from whom nothing positive should be expected (Burke, Nicholson, Smith, House, Ochefu & McClellan), 1 guy from whom maybe we should expect something once he has a chance to adjust to the NBA game (Sato), & 1 very good FA Center in Mahinmi.

These guys were added to a team that wasn't good to begin with. Since we started 19-6 (powered by Rasual Butler's brief Superman imitation), the Washington Wizards have gone 68-71 in the regular season.

That's not good, but we'd better get used to it. We traded a piece of our future for Morris, a below average NBA PF with personal problems. We rewarded an unproductive young guy with $125m.

Right now we have exactly two young players from whom we should confidently expect improvement: Porter and Oubre. We have a very good NBA C, whom most fans somewhat underrate, & we have a very good PG whom most fans would like to see as something he isn't -- an elite player, a star.

There's no coach on the planet going to turn all that into a good team, sorry.

80sballboy · Post #9 » by **80sballboy** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 1:15 pm

It's just two games, but I'm not impressed. The Sato thing probably wouldn't mean 2-0 but even though Thornton was passable on Sunday after a horrible opener, he's not getting better sitting on the pine. When you talk about spacing and lack of ball movement and the second-best passer on your team (no doubt) is on the bench, that explains it some. Burke is a little like Sessions. Not as tall or as quick, a better shooter, but he doesn't set people up and like Sesh, doesn't defend well.

But I go back to last night where he let Wall do the ISO on the entire team thing we've seen here about 150 times over the years. You are paid $7 million a year not to sit there an watch the same garbage. You are supposed to draw up a play and while I know that the result would probably be the same, at least get a good shot. Porter was 0-5 from 3-point range, Beal was dreadful but if you call TO, you get Thornton out there as another shooter or even Burke. Brooks doesn't have many options but you have to use and be creative with what you have.

The other issue is defense. He preached nothing but D in the offseason and we can't defend the 3 and the guards don't stop penetration. Not just saying Gasol last night. Tough for any big to guard another 7-0 big who is also tremendous down low. But wide open 3s from Carter, Conley and basically anybody else who just sat there for hours in the corner or elbow.

Oh, and Wall and Keef picked up techs last night. Keef was about to get thrown out and if it wasn't for an assistant holding him back, he would have. I thought the head coach is supposed to take for his players and maybe make a point by getting a tech because the officiating was awful in the first half. John should have gotten a tech. Guys were tackling him and there were no calls.

But if our leader doesn't pick up a flagrant foul up 8 that led to 5 Memphis points late in the game, we're probably not talking about this on the this thread.

gtn130 · Post #10 » by **gtn130** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 1:59 pm

The bench lineups are a disaster. Burke + Thornton should never be a thing. Brooks should be staggering Wall and Beal as much as he can.

gtn130 · Post #11 » by **gtn130** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:07 pm

payitforward wrote:
AFM wrote:... our record will be as good as our talent....

Yup. As is true of any and every team. I wish people would understand this and that there is no such thing as a rabbit-in-the-hat coach.

A great coach, one of the very very few in the history of the league who can actually make a measurable difference, may be worth a couple of wins a season. That's about as far as it goes.

This is obviously not true, but I think we've had this argument before.

Mark Jackson had Draymond Green riding the bench in favor of David Lee. Steve Kerr reversing that is worth how many wins alone?

Post #12 » by **Ruzious** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 2:32 pm

More specific to our situation, I've said all along that I doubt Brooks is +/- more than 1 game difference from Wittman. I certainly haven't seen anything to change that - though I'm not sure Wittman was ever able to lose 12-0 in an OT before we threw up a garbage 3 - after blowing a late game 8 point lead.

With those completely wiiiiiiide open 3's by Gasol, there's no question coaching can make a difference on any given game. But most coaches are virtually the same throughout a season.

80sballboy · Post #13 » by **80sballboy** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 6:41 pm

gtn130 wrote:The bench lineups are a disaster. Burke + Thornton should never be a thing. Brooks should be staggering Wall and Beal as much as he can.

That's great except that Wall is coming off double knee surgery and is supposed to play around 32mpg. He's still not 100% in shape. Do you really want an injury-prone Beal to play 40mpg every night? What a CF this team is.

gtn130 · Post #14 » by **gtn130** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 7:21 pm

80sballboy wrote:
gtn130 wrote:The bench lineups are a disaster. Burke + Thornton should never be a thing. Brooks should be staggering Wall and Beal as much as he can.

That's great except that Wall is coming off double knee surgery and is supposed to play around 32mpg. He's still not 100% in shape. Do you really want an injury-prone Beal to play 40mpg every night? What a CF this team is.

lol staggering Wall and Beal would not increase their minutes

Post #15 » by **montestewart** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:18 pm

gtn130 wrote:
80sballboy wrote:
gtn130 wrote:The bench lineups are a disaster. Burke + Thornton should never be a thing. Brooks should be staggering Wall and Beal as much as he can.

That's great except that Wall is coming off double knee surgery and is supposed to play around 32mpg. He's still not 100% in shape. Do you really want an injury-prone Beal to play 40mpg every night? What a CF this team is.

lol staggering Wall and Beal would not increase their minutes

I go along with preventing the Burke/Thornton backcourt whenever possible, and staggering starters' minutes is a good approach, but lousy backups and frequently lousy and minutes restricted starters combine to severely limit a coach's options.

gtn130 · Post #16 » by **gtn130** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 8:37 pm

montestewart wrote:
gtn130 wrote:
80sballboy wrote:
That's great except that Wall is coming off double knee surgery and is supposed to play around 32mpg. He's still not 100% in shape. Do you really want an injury-prone Beal to play 40mpg every night? What a CF this team is.

lol staggering Wall and Beal would not increase their minutes

I go along with preventing the Burke/Thornton backcourt whenever possible, and staggering starters' minutes is a good approach, but lousy backups and frequently lousy and minutes restricted starters combine to severely limit a coach's options.

Yeah, the roster itself is certainly a problem, but if we're super worried about overplaying Wall/Beal then Sato remains an option. Staggering our back court is a viable option that shouldn't have an impact on minutes for starters.

Burke
Thornton
Oubre
Smith
Nicholson

That's a terrible lineup and the Wizards' 2nd most used right now. The back court can guard ~nobody. And who in that lineup is efficient at creating offense for others? Burke is bad on both ends and a lot boils down to that, and if we simply switch Burke for Wall, that lineup is probably a lot more respectable. All that said, how many coaches still use full bench units? Doc Rivers comes to mind and that's about it. Staggering is the norm in today's NBA.

lastemp3ror · Post #17 » by **lastemp3ror** » Mon Oct 31, 2016 9:00 pm

Here is something to think about it. This league is all about looking for a "Big 3". At one point in time Brooks had Westbrook, Durant and Harden on his team. Each of those players are probably the second best players in the league in their respective positions right now. Harden could even be the best SG in the league. They also had Ibaka who is better than half the starting PF's in the league. With all that being said, Brooks didn't win one single championship. I think having those three players for a few years, not winning a championship is a let down, and I can see why he got fired. Brooks doesn't have one super star here in DC, when he had 3 in OKC.

One could argue that Harden wasn't a superstar back then, but he was also coming off the bench and if Brooks had him starting, maybe he would of had a larger impact for the team.

I know it is early into the season, but I am not going to be shocked if this team misses the playoffs again.

payitforward · Post #18 » by **payitforward** » Tue Nov 1, 2016 2:16 am

gtn130 wrote:
payitforward wrote:
AFM wrote:... our record will be as good as our talent....

Yup. As is true of any and every team. I wish people would understand this and that there is no such thing as a rabbit-in-the-hat coach.

A great coach, one of the very very few in the history of the league who can actually make a measurable difference, may be worth a couple of wins a season. That's about as far as it goes.

This is obviously not true, but I think we've had this argument before.

Mark Jackson had Draymond Green riding the bench in favor of David Lee. Steve Kerr reversing that is worth how many wins alone?

Sorry, but it's what the data shows. It's what every analysis shows. Coaches make very little difference in the NBA. Your having a cherry picked story doesn't mean anything really.

But, it's true that I could have been clearer. A great coach, one of those very few, will certainly be worth more, possibly a lot more than "a couple of wins a season", as I wrote, over a terrible coach. Over an average coach is what I meant. Mark Jackson was a pretty terrible coach.

gtn130 · Post #19 » by **gtn130** » Tue Nov 1, 2016 4:52 am

payitforward wrote:
gtn130 wrote:
payitforward wrote:Yup. As is true of any and every team. I wish people would understand this and that there is no such thing as a rabbit-in-the-hat coach.

A great coach, one of the very very few in the history of the league who can actually make a measurable difference, may be worth a couple of wins a season. That's about as far as it goes.

This is obviously not true, but I think we've had this argument before.

Mark Jackson had Draymond Green riding the bench in favor of David Lee. Steve Kerr reversing that is worth how many wins alone?

Sorry, but it's what the data shows. It's what every analysis shows. Coaches make very little difference in the NBA. Your having a cherry picked story doesn't mean anything really.

But, it's true that I could have been clearer. A great coach, one of those very few, will certainly be worth more, possibly a lot more than "a couple of wins a season", as I wrote, over a terrible coach. Over an average coach is what I meant. Mark Jackson was a pretty terrible coach.

So it sounds like you're acknowledging that Kerr had a massive impact on GSW. I guess he must be one of the greatest coaches of all time in your mind, and he's so great of a coach that he should be omitted from the countless studies and copious amounts of DATA that you're referring to that you don't share.

long suffrin' boulez fan · Post #20 » by **long suffrin' boulez fan** » Tue Nov 1, 2016 11:29 pm

Those who think coaches make minimal difference likely have never coached and have never played for a great coach.

From finding ways to inspire players to train and perform their best, to motivating them to take care of their bodies, to putting them in spots where they can succeed, coaches shape the clay. Of course great players make great teams... but often, players become great in large measure from coaching.

IMO, Scotty B has thus far been everything Thunder fans ultimately came to feel meh about. Good guy, takes care of his players, but overly reliant on his skilled players improvising. His lack of game management cost us the Grizz game.

Our offense stalled even before the fateful 5 point play. In fact, letting an exhausted Wall play hero ball led to lack of court balance and the Vince Carter break out.

I felt it slipping. He needed a time out to regroup. A couple of decent possessions and buckets at that point would have sealed the deal.