How would LeBron do in a Triangle Offense ?

[GSW Dynasty]

Since the Cavs have been struggling and are way too dependent on LeBron to make plays, I think the triangle would be a great fit...
The question is how and would LeBron be able do adapt?
We've seen what happened with David Blatt when he tried to institute an offense based on ball movement...

I'm not sure how comfortable he'd be in there, and he definitely prefers to have more of the court to himself, with maybe one screener to play with.

if the Cavs were to run the triangle with their current roster, the high post time would probably be split between Love and LeBron, with TT doing what Rodman often did, and spending most of his time on the weak side, near the basket, as the dump down guy. LeBron is just about an ideal player for the high post in that offense... and if they were smart about running it, they would probably make it a point to limit his time at the point position in the offense (so he had less opportunity to consider throwing up 3s).





 

[Mich3006]

He´s the alltime #2, I think he would be fine...

[MotownMadness]

How would the triangle do in a LeBron offense?

[Dr Aki]

he'd do just fine

[Mulhollanddrive]

His favourite shape is a polygon.

[lambchop]

he'd do just fine. The dude is a basketball savant he literally has been calling out opposing teams plays for years, his teammates just can't quite keep up, this isn't a knock on them or a lack of "help" these dudes are world class athletes but lebron is just on another level.

The triangle wouldnt help the cavs much. I'm curious to know whether they will play kinda like the celtics played last year and still play this year, where IT or now kyrie ran a lot of simple give and go semi pick and roll hand offs at the top with al horford. IT scored and created endlessly from there. The cavs could do the same kevin love, who is a good passer but better shooter than horford or of course they could do the same with bron and IT which would be like horford on steroids. I think they'd be ignorant not to run that at all.

[lambchop]

His favourite shape is a polygon.

lebron been about that triangle for years bra

[RightToCensor]

You're limiting him trying to confine his game into a system based offense. He's at his best when he has the ball at the top of the arc with shooters clearing out the paint.

[Lalouie]

Since the Cavs have been struggling and are way too dependent on LeBron to make plays, I think the triangle would be a great fit...
The question is how and would LeBron be able do adapt?
We've seen what happened with David Blatt when he tried to institute an offense based on ball movement...

I'm not sure how comfortable he'd be in there, and he definitely prefers to have more of the court to himself, with maybe one screener to play with.

if the Cavs were to run the triangle with their current roster, the high post time would probably be split between Love and LeBron, with TT doing what Rodman often did, and spending most of his time on the weak side, near the basket, as the dump down guy. LeBron is just about an ideal player for the high post in that offense... and if they were smart about running it, they would probably make it a point to limit his time at the point position in the offense (so he had less opportunity to consider throwing up 3s).





 

LeBron doesn't adapt.... End of story. Players adapt to him

[infintybeyond]

Pretty bad i think. Lebron isn't a good post player. He also isn't a good mid range player or off the ball. The Triangle needs a DOMINANT post scorer(MJ, Shaq, Kobe) for it to be championship worthy. At this stage in his career, that's asking too much. Plus, your taking him away from his greatest strength, the drive and kick.

[Tiesto_Lakers]

The triangle would be thrown in the trash.

[SamSepiol]

If you mean triangle with Lebron at the top of the key and shooters on both corner 3 point spots, then sure that triangle could work.

[RCM88x]

At this point it would probably be a tough transition, not only because of the change in playstyle but the fact that the triangle offense is a bit dated, especially in the pace and space era. He's for the most part let his scoring post game fall to the wayside and replace it with 3pt shooting off the dribble and passing to the 3pt line out of the post.

However if this were 2010 and the Heat were being coached by Phil in their first season I'm sure it would result in an ATG team.

Perhaps an updated version of the Triangle would work today, with more focus on the 3pt shot than mid-range shots. LeBron's probably the best cross court passer and one of the best post passer in the league, so it could probably work pretty well.

[GSW Dynasty]

At this point it would probably be a tough transition, not only because of the change in playstyle but the fact that the triangle offense is a bit dated, especially in the pace and space era. He's for the most part let his scoring post game fall to the wayside and replace it with 3pt shooting off the dribble and passing to the 3pt line out of the post.

However if this were 2010 and the Heat were being coached by Phil in their first season I'm sure it would result in an ATG team.

Perhaps an updated version of the Triangle would work today, with more focus on the 3pt shot than mid-range shots. LeBron's probably the best cross court passer and one of the best post passer in the league, so it could probably work pretty well.

The triangle isn't stifling, and doesn't limit assist opportunities for players. in fact, because it's a structure, as opposed to a 'set', 'system', etc, there are actually more potential points of attack out of the triangle than what most teams use. that's a big part of why they use it.
Just look at how well GSW plays, they implement a ton of triangle plays and thats why they are so good.
Every player has a defined role in the offence unlike the Cavs where it's all on LeBron to make plays.

The notion that you need a jumper to play in the triangle is a little overstated. That's not quite true for the three strongside players, but for the two weakside guys it's pertinent. That's why guys who aren't true PGs have thrived in it, but they've all been plus shooters. And there's a reason those PGs all played on the weakside. It means one of the possible double team or help defenders is going to be the opponent's PG. Making anything going to the basket easier. BJ Armstrong, John Paxson, Steve Kerr, Craig Hodges, Trent Tucker, Derek Fisher.

[G35]

http://grantland.com/features/chuck-klosterman-phil-jackson-tex-winter-death-triangle-offense/

When the Bulls ran this offense in the ’90s, the key adaptation Jackson made was moving Scottie Pippen to the top of the key and playing Jordan as a forward (in Los Angeles, he made a similar tweak with Lamar Odom and Bryant). But those players would have succeeded in any offense. The real advantage of the Triangle is what it does for players with less ability. Most NBA sets are static; they require perimeter players to create their own shot, usually off the dribble. The Triangle’s relentless off-the-ball movement allows standing jump shooters to contribute within their own preexisting skill set. This is why it worked so well for John Paxson and Steve Kerr, and even for guys like Sasha Vujacic and Luke Walton. You don’t need four or five athletic scorers to make the Triangle work. Two is plenty, because it amplifies the value of role players.

This is why Lebron's teams struggle is that Lebron's teammates are there to support Lebron.

In the triangle, the best players Jordan, Shaq, and Kobe were there to support the lesser talented teammates.

Many fans do not understand that. The best players help the weaker players, which in turn raises the level of the team. Those comments that say, "Lebron should have the ball where he is most comfortable and able to do what he does best." are completely dismissing role player contributions.

You can't complain about the support when you don't put them in positions to excel. They are not meant to excel...Lebron is meant to excel. Just look at this quote:

“When I look at Oklahoma City,” the anonymous coach said, “I see a team that is built to run the Triangle. They are so designed to run the Triangle that it’s almost a joke. Imagine them running a two-man game on the weak side with [Kevin] Durant and [Russell] Westbrook. Who the **** is gonna stop that?”

How can you ever get mad at any Thunder players not named Westbrook? How are they suppose to contribute?

Running the triangle would also eliminate Lebron's complaint about not having another facilitator on offense:

“When I came to the Bulls, Tex Winter and Johnny Bach were the assistants,” says Jackson. “I was relatively ignorant about NBA offensive systems. Well, maybe not ignorant. But certainly naïve. And Tex4 was a big proponent of his offense. At the time, we were running through a sequence of ineffective point guards. Kyle Macy. Sedale Threatt. Sam Vincent was brought in. Craig Hodges was there. But Tex would always argue that you didn’t need a great point guard to win in the NBA. This idea of the point guard dominating the ball is a relatively new idea in the game of basketball, really. … One of the things that’s pretty obvious [about my coaching career] is that I never had to fight to get a dominant point guard. Because once you do that, defenses can align themselves against that one guy. You can pressure the point guard high on the floor and move the ball away from whomever you want to shut down. That was always my defensive philosophy against people like Isiah Thomas and John Stockton.”

I also think that many people in the NBA do not want to run the triangle because it does take the ball out of your most exciting (and effective) players.

But there’s something else here that’s harder to quantify; there’s a prejudice against the Triangle that goes beyond its technical details. It’s almost as if some people want the Triangle to disappear.

“People will sometimes look at a team and say, ‘Those players won’t work in the Triangle. The Triangle won’t work here.’ And that’s so ridiculous,” Jackson says. “People just have this attitude about the Triangle, like it’s this pariah offense. That’s totally wrong. It just takes a little time.”

Furthermore, on a statistical note, players individual statistics are likely to suffer in the triangle offense and then people will perceive a player as a lesser force due to a decrease in cumulative stats......

[boomershadow]

Lebron doesn't need an offensive system. Lebron basically is an offensive system.

[GSW Dynasty]

http://grantland.com/features/chuck-klosterman-phil-jackson-tex-winter-death-triangle-offense/

When the Bulls ran this offense in the ’90s, the key adaptation Jackson made was moving Scottie Pippen to the top of the key and playing Jordan as a forward (in Los Angeles, he made a similar tweak with Lamar Odom and Bryant). But those players would have succeeded in any offense. The real advantage of the Triangle is what it does for players with less ability. Most NBA sets are static; they require perimeter players to create their own shot, usually off the dribble. The Triangle’s relentless off-the-ball movement allows standing jump shooters to contribute within their own preexisting skill set. This is why it worked so well for John Paxson and Steve Kerr, and even for guys like Sasha Vujacic and Luke Walton. You don’t need four or five athletic scorers to make the Triangle work. Two is plenty, because it amplifies the value of role players.

This is why Lebron's teams struggle is that Lebron's teammates are there to support Lebron.

In the triangle, the best players Jordan, Shaq, and Kobe were there to support the lesser talented teammates.

Many fans do not understand that. The best players help the weaker players, which in turn raises the level of the team. Those comments that say, "Lebron should have the ball where he is most comfortable and able to do what he does best." are completely dismissing role player contributions.

You can't complain about the support when you don't put them in positions to excel. They are not meant to excel...Lebron is meant to excel. Just look at this quote:

“When I look at Oklahoma City,” the anonymous coach said, “I see a team that is built to run the Triangle. They are so designed to run the Triangle that it’s almost a joke. Imagine them running a two-man game on the weak side with [Kevin] Durant and [Russell] Westbrook. Who the **** is gonna stop that?”

How can you ever get mad at any Thunder players not named Westbrook? How are they suppose to contribute?

Running the triangle would also eliminate Lebron's complaint about not having another facilitator on offense:

“When I came to the Bulls, Tex Winter and Johnny Bach were the assistants,” says Jackson. “I was relatively ignorant about NBA offensive systems. Well, maybe not ignorant. But certainly naïve. And Tex4 was a big proponent of his offense. At the time, we were running through a sequence of ineffective point guards. Kyle Macy. Sedale Threatt. Sam Vincent was brought in. Craig Hodges was there. But Tex would always argue that you didn’t need a great point guard to win in the NBA. This idea of the point guard dominating the ball is a relatively new idea in the game of basketball, really. … One of the things that’s pretty obvious [about my coaching career] is that I never had to fight to get a dominant point guard. Because once you do that, defenses can align themselves against that one guy. You can pressure the point guard high on the floor and move the ball away from whomever you want to shut down. That was always my defensive philosophy against people like Isiah Thomas and John Stockton.”

I also think that many people in the NBA do not want to run the triangle because it does take the ball out of your most exciting (and effective) players.

But there’s something else here that’s harder to quantify; there’s a prejudice against the Triangle that goes beyond its technical details. It’s almost as if some people want the Triangle to disappear.

“People will sometimes look at a team and say, ‘Those players won’t work in the Triangle. The Triangle won’t work here.’ And that’s so ridiculous,” Jackson says. “People just have this attitude about the Triangle, like it’s this pariah offense. That’s totally wrong. It just takes a little time.”

Furthermore, on a statistical note, players individual statistics are likely to suffer in the triangle offense and then people will perceive a player as a lesser force due to a decrease in cumulative stats......

[Statlanta]

ALl time greats would be great in any system. I will say that the success of Kerr/Pop and Phil Jackson's coaching tree shows that you probably can probably run bits and pieces of the system rather than the whole triangle today in my opinion

[Froob]

Well it’s the defense that’s the problem, so why would you look to make a major change on offense? When LeBron is surrounded with shooters they score a lot of points.

[andrewww]

Lebron doesn't need an offensive system. Lebron basically is an offensive system.

A system that continuously falls short against elite competition.