Olajuwon on the '97 & '98 Jazz

Post #1 » by **Reeko** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:19 am

Let's say that Hakeem was a free agent in at the end of the '95-'96 season and signed with the Jazz. How dominant would a big three of Stockton, Malone, and Olajuwon have been? Assuming health and good chemistry between the three stars, would that team have beaten the Bulls in those years? And yes Hornacek is still on the team.

-G- · Post #2 » by **-G-** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:21 am

Yes, they would've beaten the Bulls. Definitely in '97. I'd say '98 as well.

Clipsz 4 Life · Post #3 » by **Tim Lehrbach** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:45 am

I'm just here for JB's answer.

Catchall · Post #4 » by **Catchall** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:04 am

Uh, yeah. A team with Stockton, Malone, Olajuwon and Hornacek would be great. Why stop there though? We'll take Drexler too.

LKN · Post #5 » by **LKN** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:10 am

They would very likely win in 1997... Hakeem was still quite good that year.

In 1998 Hakeem only played half the season and was awful in the playoffs... so that's more iffy.

Catchall · Post #6 » by **Catchall** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:12 am

LKN wrote:They would very likely win in 1997... Hakeem was still quite good that year.

In 1998 Hakeem only played half the season and was awful in the playoffs... so that's more iffy.

All he'd have to do is be better than Greg Ostertag though.

LKN · Post #7 » by **LKN** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:13 am

Catchall wrote:
LKN wrote:They would very likely win in 1997... Hakeem was still quite good that year.

In 1998 Hakeem only played half the season and was awful in the playoffs... so that's more iffy.

All he'd have to do is be better than Greg Ostertag though.

HA - that's a good point

Post #8 » by **Reeko** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:27 am

Catchall wrote:Uh, yeah. A team with Stockton, Malone, Olajuwon and Hornacek would be great. Why stop there though? We'll take Drexler too.

I'm trying to think of what it would look like if a player had done in the 90's what Durant just did with Golden State. The best I could come up with was this scenario of Hakeem joining Malone, arguably the 2nd and 3rd best players in the NBA at the time.

LKN · Post #9 » by **LKN** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:30 am

Reeko wrote:
Catchall wrote:Uh, yeah. A team with Stockton, Malone, Olajuwon and Hornacek would be great. Why stop there though? We'll take Drexler too.

I'm trying to think of what it would look like if a player had done in the 90's what Durant just did with Golden State. The best I could come up with was this scenario of Hakeem joining Malone, arguably the 2nd and 3rd best players in the NBA at the time.

Well - Imagine if he signed in 1997 with a team coming off a 72 win season... and the Bulls weakest position was center too ... lol

NPZ · Post #10 » by **NPZ** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:12 am

Reeko wrote:Let's say that Hakeem was a free agent in at the end of the '95-'96 season and signed with the Jazz.

Even for a hypothetical, this is too implausible and Utah fans would agree. Rony Seikaly refused to go there, much less Hak. How bout the caveat that we went thru a wormhole to a Bizarro NBA where SLC was a popular destination for star FAs?

But say this happened, the Jazz would finally have a C who could punish Seattle in the paint, a soft spot for them. What was weird about the late 90s is the Lakers could beat the Sonics, the Sonics could beat the Jazz, Jazz could beat the Lakers. Seattle gave Utah a hard time, especially at SEA. The Jazz beat the Lakers w/o Hakeem pretty handily, but with him, would that have disrupted them from utilizing their strongest suits as much as they would've liked? (the pick n roll, obv, Lakers could never and will never be able to guard that thing). Having seen those series, trust, I'd like to see if Hakeem would've been diminishing returns for them. Say what you will about Ostertag, but he did a decent job of just putting his lard onto Shaq's shape and keeping it there.

Post #11 » by **Reeko** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:17 am

LKN wrote:
Reeko wrote:
Catchall wrote:Uh, yeah. A team with Stockton, Malone, Olajuwon and Hornacek would be great. Why stop there though? We'll take Drexler too.

I'm trying to think of what it would look like if a player had done in the 90's what Durant just did with Golden State. The best I could come up with was this scenario of Hakeem joining Malone, arguably the 2nd and 3rd best players in the NBA at the time.

Well - Imagine if he signed in 1997 with a team coming off a 72 win season... and the Bulls weakest position was center too ... lol

Yeah I thought about that, but Jordan was still the best player at that time. Durant was the 2nd or 3rd best player in the league joining the 2nd or 3rd best player's team in Curry with Golden State. That's why I made it the Jazz.

gh123 · Post #12 » by **gh123** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:19 am

You don't need to add Hakeem. You just switch Malone for him and Jazz beat Bulls every time. Hakeem was a much much better PO performer than Malone.

Post #13 » by **Reeko** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:20 am

NPZ wrote:
Reeko wrote:Let's say that Hakeem was a free agent in at the end of the '95-'96 season and signed with the Jazz.

Even for a hypothetical, this is too implausible and Utah fans would agree. Rony Seikaly refused to go there, much less Hak. How bout the caveat that we went thru a wormhole to a Bizarro NBA where SLC was a popular destination for star FAs?

But say this happened, the Jazz would finally have a C who could punish Seattle in the paint, a soft spot for them. What was weird about the late 90s is the Lakers could beat the Sonics, the Sonics could beat the Jazz, Jazz could beat the Lakers. Seattle gave Utah a hard time, especially at SEA. The Jazz beat the Lakers w/o Hakeem pretty handily, but with him, would that have disrupted them from utilizing their strongest suits as much as they would've liked (the pick n roll, obv, Lakers could never and will never be able to guard that thing). Having seen those series, trust, I'd like to see if Hakeem would've been diminishing returns for them. Say what you will about Ostertag, but he did a decent job of just putting his lard onto Shaq's shape and keeping it there.

It's not a question of if it would actually happen. I just want to see if people feel that the collection of talent in Utah + Hakeem would be able to beat the Bulls.

NPZ · Post #14 » by **NPZ** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 3:28 am

Reeko wrote:
NPZ wrote:
Reeko wrote:Let's say that Hakeem was a free agent in at the end of the '95-'96 season and signed with the Jazz.

Even for a hypothetical, this is too implausible and Utah fans would agree. Rony Seikaly refused to go there, much less Hak. How bout the caveat that we went thru a wormhole to a Bizarro NBA where SLC was a popular destination for star FAs?

But say this happened, the Jazz would finally have a C who could punish Seattle in the paint, a soft spot for them. What was weird about the late 90s is the Lakers could beat the Sonics, the Sonics could beat the Jazz, Jazz could beat the Lakers. Seattle gave Utah a hard time, especially at SEA. The Jazz beat the Lakers w/o Hakeem pretty handily, but with him, would that have disrupted them from utilizing their strongest suits as much as they would've liked (the pick n roll, obv, Lakers could never and will never be able to guard that thing). Having seen those series, trust, I'd like to see if Hakeem would've been diminishing returns for them. Say what you will about Ostertag, but he did a decent job of just putting his lard onto Shaq's shape and keeping it there.

It's not a question of if it would actually happen. I just want to see if people feel that the collection of talent in Utah + Hakeem would be able to beat the Bulls.

I got it, trust, just being facetious. I think the Jazz would've gone 7 w/ Chicago in either 97 or 98. Whether they pull out those close games they lost, especially the ones at Utah, I dunno. They had hardships winning games at Chicago and scored 54 in one L. You had the time Malone missed the critical FTs and Mike promptly hit the game winner. I watched that live, that was brutal. Starting off a series in Gm1 with something like that is demoralizing. Then in the 98 closer, he stripped Malone before hitting the GW. Moments like that are often the difference between two good teams and one winning or losing and the Jazz were snakebit w/ Malone in the role of having the ball half the time. I think they would've had to feature Hakeem a great deal to make it work. Malone was a team player and willing and able to subjugate his game, which I saw him do in spades at age 40 in LA. His post D was damn good against both KG and Timmy, which would've given Hakeem leeway.

Ultimately, no one can say definitively who wins a 7 gm series, but I'd be more than willing to argue that the Jazz would've taken them to the max if not actually win one. One time if at all is my feel. I don't think anything was beating the 96 Bulls, too dominant. But by 97, Pippen had back issues. The Hornacek/Bryon Russell matchups against Jordan were just brutal tho. That's where they got killed the worst, so you have to remember you're not "fixing" that issue (as much as anyone could fix the Jordan problem). Horny was a scrappy player and overachieved a ton to be a pro even when he was young, but that's a big height and/or athleticism gap at G w/ him and aging Stockton (Stock microfracture surgery in 97/8) against Harper/Jordan/guardish Kukoc and then Kerr who was a deadeye (look at all the "looks" the Bulls had at 1-3). A word for Harp, LA had him in 2000 and trust me when I say he was nails then, too. Hit a GW in the 7 gm Port series. And when you're up against Mike who could shove a defender by the ass like he did sans call, that's a tough road to hoe. I think if Utah with Hak wins one, it's in 97. Bulls got taken to 7 by Indiana in 98, they weren't invincible even in 97. They simply had one of the top defenses, the GOAT closer and Pippen and Rodman who got them boards by the gross. No rebounds, no rings. --Pat Riley. Phil was a better coach than Sloan, too. In-series adjustments were his forte. All the Bulls' varied looks and abilities were blended seamlessly and they all accepted their roles.

Final point, when it came down to the clutch, back then fans were NOT surprised by the Jazz/Malone choking like he/they did, and they were not surprised when Jordan killed them in those same scenarios. It was expected, actually. My advice to Sloan is give Hakeem the ball in those situations and GTFO the way.

JordansBulls · Post #15 » by **JordansBulls** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:18 am

Changes entire team for them. Doesn't move the needle, although a bit closer series.

HoopsterJones · Post #16 » by **HoopsterJones** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:34 am

What if Shaq signed with the Bulls in the summer of 96?

GreatWhiteStiff · Post #17 » by **GreatWhiteStiff** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 4:57 am

How dominant would a big three of Stockton, Malone, and Olajuwon have been?

Yes.

balrog27 · Post #18 » by **balrog27** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 6:20 am

gh123 wrote:You don't need to add Hakeem. You just switch Malone for him and Jazz beat Bulls every time. Hakeem was a much much better PO performer than Malone.

you know they talking about end of career hakeem right? This was a time with no Duncan, Malone was unanimously agreed to be the best PF of all time at the time, and people are arguing he might be the best player in one of those years.

Balllin · Post #19 » by **Balllin** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:55 am

Lol a black Muslim as the franchise player for a team in Utah. You couldn't make this up.

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Hardaway2step · Post #20 » by **Hardaway2step** » Sat Sep 21, 2019 8:46 am

If I remember correctly (I am getting old) Olajuwan did so well because he was surrounded by shooters and excellent passers. The Rockets were a threat all over the court and it frustrated other teams badly.
The jazz were nothing like the Rockets. They would have had to change up the entire team to get the most out of Hakeem.
But yeah the Jazz's BIGGEST issue in especially the late 90's was a weak center position. I mean it was BAD for them! So even Hakeem at minimal participation maybe would have put the Jazz on top