Philadelphia - Portland - Toronto

Village Idiot · Post #1 » by **Village Idiot** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:18 pm

Philadelphia trades:

Ben Simmons

Philadelphia receives:

Pascal Siakam

The Sixers get a talented two-way player who should be able to fit well next to Harris at the other forward spot and move on from the Ben Simmons drama

Portland trades:

CJ McCollum
Jusuf Nurkic

Portland receives:

Ben Simmons
Chris Boucher

Portland needs to shake things up. They take a gamble on Simmons game, mental health and ability to slot in at center. Boucher should be a decent back-up forward

Toronto trades:

Pascal Siakam
Chris Boucher

Toronto receives:

CJ McCollum
Jusuf Nurkic

Toronto addresses its needs and clears up the log-jam at forward where Barnes and Banton have looked really promising and OG is a stud who is probably trying to do too much offensively. McCollum provides a go to scorer who can also hit the 3 and create his own shot moving FVV back to a 6th man role. Nurkic provides a decent defensive and rebounding center who sets really good screens.

Post #2 » by **Texas Chuck** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:22 pm

Toronto would just take Simmons if Philly would do this. Portland wouldn't be in this deal.

JRoy · Post #3 » by **JRoy** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:48 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:Toronto would just take Simmons if Philly would do this. Portland wouldn't be in this deal.

Love it for POR.

Not sure TOR would want Simmons all that much with the promising start Mr Barnes has had. TOR is getting about 80% of Simmons on a rookie deal.

Post #4 » by **Texas Chuck** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 9:54 pm

JRoy wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:Toronto would just take Simmons if Philly would do this. Portland wouldn't be in this deal.

Love it for POR.

Not sure TOR would want Simmons all that much with the promising start Mr Barnes has had. TOR is getting about 80% of Simmons on a rookie deal.

If their other choice is CJ, they would take Simmons. Simmons comes in and plays the rest of the year for them and if they decide they want to build around Barnes instead they trade Simmons again for more than CJ/Nurkic.

Just doesn't make any sense for Toronto to ever take the Portland offer over the Philly one.

JRoy · Post #5 » by **JRoy** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:01 pm

Texas Chuck wrote:
JRoy wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:Toronto would just take Simmons if Philly would do this. Portland wouldn't be in this deal.

Love it for POR.

Not sure TOR would want Simmons all that much with the promising start Mr Barnes has had. TOR is getting about 80% of Simmons on a rookie deal.

If their other choice is CJ, they would take Simmons. Simmons comes in and plays the rest of the year for them and if they decide they want to build around Barnes instead they trade Simmons again for more than CJ/Nurkic.

Just doesn't make any sense for Toronto to ever take the Portland offer over the Philly one.

PHI probably gets too good a deal here considering the drama.

Could see TOR taking the deal if the pieces from the 3rd team are a better fit than YSBS.

Can’t see POR adding much more to this deal, but maybe another team would be a better choice for third team.

MN?

GutUNC · Post #6 » by **GutUNC** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:14 pm

McCollum just doesn't carry the value to keep Portland in this trade. Chuck is on the money here.

And while SIakam does, he's really not a match with PHL because both he and Harris should be at the 4.

Godaddycurse · Post #7 » by **Godaddycurse** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 10:36 pm

Not interested in swapping siakam for either of the other teams packages tbh

PhillyNj · Post #8 » by **PhillyNj** » Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:56 pm

JRoy wrote:
Texas Chuck wrote:
JRoy wrote:
Love it for POR.

Not sure TOR would want Simmons all that much with the promising start Mr Barnes has had. TOR is getting about 80% of Simmons on a rookie deal.

If their other choice is CJ, they would take Simmons. Simmons comes in and plays the rest of the year for them and if they decide they want to build around Barnes instead they trade Simmons again for more than CJ/Nurkic.

Just doesn't make any sense for Toronto to ever take the Portland offer over the Philly one.

PHI probably gets too good a deal here considering the drama.

Could see TOR taking the deal if the pieces from the 3rd team are a better fit than YSBS.

Can’t see POR adding much more to this deal, but maybe another team would be a better choice for third team.

MN?

Siakem is not enough for Philly better be 2 frp’s headed there way too.

JRoy · Post #9 » by **JRoy** » Mon Nov 15, 2021 1:25 am

If you think any team is tacking on 2 FRP to a player like Siakam to get Simmons we have radically different opinions about his trade value.

dalton749 · Post #10 » by **dalton749** » Mon Nov 15, 2021 4:16 am

JRoy wrote:If you think any team is tacking on 2 FRP to a player like Siakam to get Simmons we have radically different opinions about his trade value.

Yea it’ll never happen. One guy is playing, the other isn’t. No way picks go out as well.

Blazers20 · Post #11 » by **Blazers20** » Mon Nov 15, 2021 6:30 am

PHI: Dame
TOR: CJ-Nurkic
POR: Ben-Maxey-Thybulle-Drummond-Siakam- Boucher

Philly gets their guy.

Raps get 2 good pieces to add to Fred-Scottie-OG.

Blazers start their rebuild.

Post #12 » by **zimpy27** » Mon Nov 15, 2021 8:23 am

Blazers20 wrote:PHI: Dame
TOR: CJ-Nurkic
POR: Ben-Maxey-Thybulle-Drummond-Siakam- Boucher

Philly gets their guy.

Raps get 2 good pieces to add to Fred-Scottie-OG.

Blazers start their rebuild.

Can't see Philly giving up that much value for Dame.

Blazers20 · Post #13 » by **Blazers20** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:05 am

If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

axeman23 · Post #14 » by **axeman23** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:36 am

Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

Ben Simmons is an All-NBA/All-Defensive player. Philly should definitely ADD value to the Simmons/Lillard swap, but probably more along the lines of Maxey OR Thybulle, plus a future pick or 2? Or just swap in Seth Curry for Maxy/Thybulle, and add 2 1sts? I would imagine Seth would be a little redundant/wasted with Lillard incoming, and Portland could use the shooting from a player more in "win-now mode... Am i off here? Maybe... :dontknow:

JRoy · Post #15 » by **JRoy** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:08 am

axeman23 wrote:
Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

Ben Simmons is an All-NBA/All-Defensive player. Philly should definitely ADD value to the Simmons/Lillard swap, but probably more along the lines of Maxey OR Thybulle, plus a future pick or 2? Or just swap in Seth Curry for Maxy/Thybulle, and add 2 1sts? I would imagine Seth would be a little redundant/wasted with Lillard incoming, and Portland could use the shooting from a player more in "win-now mode... Am i off here? Maybe...

Simmons doesn’t pull Lillard.

stormi · Post #16 » by **stormi** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:16 am

Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

I don't think he does. Especially considering how analytics oriented he is.

Dame (and CJ) has been awful in terms of 3 year playoff-LEBRON cumulative stats per his career.

One of the worst defenders in the sport that's also a non-elite playmaker.

Not sure why Portland fans think a James Harden-esque package is coming for a regular season chucker that's well below the gamebreaking levels James Harden has been for the better part of a decade.

Bruin · Post #17 » by **Bruin** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:48 am

Aside from the fact that the trade doesn’t really move any needles for the Raptors, CJ is basically the opposite of the type of player we’re building our identity towards. We prioritize size and defense, which CJ provides neither of

Nurk is solid but he’s not really anything special and again doesn’t move any needles for us.

If we were to trade Pascal I’d prefer younger prospects/picks rather than a a guy who’s older than Pascal

JRoy · Post #18 » by **JRoy** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:52 am

stormi wrote:
Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

I don't think he does. Especially considering how analytics oriented he is.

Dame (and CJ) has been awful in terms of 3 year playoff-LEBRON cumulative stats per his career.

One of the worst defenders in the sport that's also a non-elite playmaker.

Not sure why Portland fans think a James Harden-esque package is coming for a regular season chucker that's well below the gamebreaking levels James Harden has been for the better part of a decade.

Lillard is a better closer than Harden and PHI doesn’t have that.

babyjax13 · Post #19 » by **babyjax13** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 6:12 am

stormi wrote:
Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

I don't think he does. Especially considering how analytics oriented he is.

Dame (and CJ) has been awful in terms of 3 year playoff-LEBRON cumulative stats per his career.

One of the worst defenders in the sport that's also a non-elite playmaker.

Not sure why Portland fans think a James Harden-esque package is coming for a regular season chucker that's well below the gamebreaking levels James Harden has been for the better part of a decade.

These values are still on fairly small samples that are more vulnerable to impact by opposing team matchups and the tactical game we see more in the playoffs.

I'm really not buying this as a good metric considering Portland's situation. Lillard is expected to be EVERYTHING and when you are (the last two seasons) consistently a low-seed with a very predictable game (because your offense is mostly just two players) and you are playing an inordinate amount of minutes, the metrics aren't going to tease out your individual impact on the game.

axeman23 · Post #20 » by **axeman23** » Wed Nov 17, 2021 7:07 am

JRoy wrote:
axeman23 wrote:
Blazers20 wrote:If Morey believes Dame is the key piece to a championship he pulls the trigger. All NBA player increases Philly chances of winning a championship.

Ben Simmons is an All-NBA/All-Defensive player. Philly should definitely ADD value to the Simmons/Lillard swap, but probably more along the lines of Maxey OR Thybulle, plus a future pick or 2? Or just swap in Seth Curry for Maxy/Thybulle, and add 2 1sts? I would imagine Seth would be a little redundant/wasted with Lillard incoming, and Portland could use the shooting from a player more in "win-now mode... Am i off here? Maybe...

Simmons doesn’t pull Lillard.

I think everyone agrees it is "Simmons PLUS value". It just depends on what that extra value IS, and if Philly is willing or even able, to provide that. I was simply countering the "Lillard is an All-NBA player", as if Simmons was not...