In a draft: Chris Paul vs Kawhi Leonard

[durantbird]

Both are signed up in a draft in the beginning of their careers. You are building a team from zero. Who are you picking?

[GeorgeMarcus]

I'm on the fence but going with Kawhi because he offers a bit more flexibility in team building

[70sFan]

I don't know how anybody can take Kawhi to be honest.

[Colbinii]

Chris Paul.

You get 8 years of MVP-level play from 2008-2015, and most importantly they are consecutive seasons with 1 major injury season [2010] and a few other seasons with random injuries [Unsure how we should account for random, minor injuries CP3 had throughout his prime as I believe doing some load-management would help most, if not all of those injuries, as he has gone on to have a GOAT-level longevity career for a PG].

Then, the next 3 seasons [2016, 2017 and 2018] you get All-NBA+ level play for 3 additional years. That amounts to 11 years where you are getting a player who can win you a playoff series and a handful of seasons in there where he can be the best player in a later-round playoff series.

The big thing for Kawhi I am seeing here is this:

I'm on the fence but going with Kawhi because he offers a bit more flexibility in team building

But wait, didn't CP3 play with a cast of solid role players in NOP and did exceptionally well?
Then, CP3 went on to play with a star big man and did exceptionally well in Los Angeles.
Then, CP3 went on to play with a 40%+ Usage PG in James Harden and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 played on a young, rebuilding team and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to another young re-building team with a budding scoring guard and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to a 10-year old dynasty where the best player is a PG and he out +/- the best +/- player of the past decade in Curry.

But yeah, the tiny bit more flexibility in team building--whatever flexibility that actually is--is the deciding factor here?

[GeorgeMarcus]

Chris Paul.

You get 8 years of MVP-level play from 2008-2015, and most importantly they are consecutive seasons with 1 major injury season [2010] and a few other seasons with random injuries [Unsure how we should account for random, minor injuries CP3 had throughout his prime as I believe doing some load-management would help most, if not all of those injuries, as he has gone on to have a GOAT-level longevity career for a PG].

Then, the next 3 seasons [2016, 2017 and 2018] you get All-NBA+ level play for 3 additional years. That amounts to 11 years where you are getting a player who can win you a playoff series and a handful of seasons in there where he can be the best player in a later-round playoff series.

The big thing for Kawhi I am seeing here is this:

I'm on the fence but going with Kawhi because he offers a bit more flexibility in team building

But wait, didn't CP3 play with a cast of solid role players in NOP and did exceptionally well?
Then, CP3 went on to play with a star big man and did exceptionally well in Los Angeles.
Then, CP3 went on to play with a 40%+ Usage PG in James Harden and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 played on a young, rebuilding team and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to another young re-building team with a budding scoring guard and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to a 10-year old dynasty where the best player is a PG and he out +/- the best +/- player of the past decade in Curry.

But yeah, the tiny bit more flexibility in team building--whatever flexibility that actually is--is the deciding factor here?

Both guys in their respective positions are generally seamless fits. The "problem" with flexibility relative to Kawhi is that Paul is a 6 foot pure point guard while Kawhi is a super switchable 6'7'' wing. If we are talking about building a team from scratch then yeah, that matters.

[Colbinii]

Chris Paul.

You get 8 years of MVP-level play from 2008-2015, and most importantly they are consecutive seasons with 1 major injury season [2010] and a few other seasons with random injuries [Unsure how we should account for random, minor injuries CP3 had throughout his prime as I believe doing some load-management would help most, if not all of those injuries, as he has gone on to have a GOAT-level longevity career for a PG].

Then, the next 3 seasons [2016, 2017 and 2018] you get All-NBA+ level play for 3 additional years. That amounts to 11 years where you are getting a player who can win you a playoff series and a handful of seasons in there where he can be the best player in a later-round playoff series.

The big thing for Kawhi I am seeing here is this:

I'm on the fence but going with Kawhi because he offers a bit more flexibility in team building

But wait, didn't CP3 play with a cast of solid role players in NOP and did exceptionally well?
Then, CP3 went on to play with a star big man and did exceptionally well in Los Angeles.
Then, CP3 went on to play with a 40%+ Usage PG in James Harden and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 played on a young, rebuilding team and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to another young re-building team with a budding scoring guard and did exceptionally well.
Then, CP3 went to a 10-year old dynasty where the best player is a PG and he out +/- the best +/- player of the past decade in Curry.

But yeah, the tiny bit more flexibility in team building--whatever flexibility that actually is--is the deciding factor here?

Both guys in their respective positions are generally seamless fits. The "problem" with flexibility relative to Kawhi is that Paul is a 6 foot pure point guard while Kawhi is a super switchable 6'7'' wing. If we are talking about building a team from scratch then yeah, that matters.

If all else equal--yes, but we are both capable of deciding between these two players with all the data points we have rather than devolving to "Wing vs Guard".

[EmpireFalls]

Kawhi because he will get injured very often which will allow me to strategically tank for high first round picks and build the roster cheaply.

[DCasey91]

Kawhi put simply he has shown to be a number one on a winning team and did so in remarkable fashion.

CP3 is one of my favourite players but he has flaws

Both can be injury prone

So better off picking the guy that is more valuable on the equity scale.

[iggymcfrack]

Chris Paul has played 70 or more games 9 times in his career. Kawhi has done it twice. Enough said.

[DCasey91]

Chris Paul has played 70 or more games 9 times in his career. Kawhi has done it twice. Enough said.

Kawhi has won Finals MVP, a championship as best player on team doing the closest MJ comp we’ve seen since Wade in 06

CP3 got injured when he had his best chance at the thing

Both have big impact markers, one is 6”6 and change, strong as a brick wall and puts it in the hoop when it needs to be.

Don’t get me wrong CP3 is fantastic but he does sack the risk for control on his own playstyle.

It’s Kawhi

[dygaction]

Kawhi is healthier in playoffs while CP3 is healthier in the regular seasons. Kawhi also has a higher ceiling, so him for me.

[dygaction]

Kawhi because he will get injured very often which will allow me to strategically tank for high first round picks and build the roster cheaply.

CP3 will magically get hurt in the playoffs so your season is wasted and pick is low value.

[dygaction]

Chris Paul has played 70 or more games 9 times in his career. Kawhi has done it twice. Enough said.

So you are saying it is an easy choice if one is asked to pick a more durable regular season player

[70sFan]

Kawhi is healthier in playoffs while CP3 is healthier in the regular seasons. Kawhi also has a higher ceiling, so him for me.

The same Kawhi who had his last healthy postseason in 2020?

[dygaction]

Kawhi is healthier in playoffs while CP3 is healthier in the regular seasons. Kawhi also has a higher ceiling, so him for me.

The same Kawhi who had his last healthy postseason in 2020?

Don't focus on what they could not achieve when they were injured, look at what they achieved when they were healthy, on the big stage.

[sp6r=underrated]

Chris Paul has played 70 or more games 9 times in his career. Kawhi has done it twice. Enough said.

Kawhi has won Finals MVP, a championship as best player on team doing the closest MJ comp we’ve seen since Wade in 06

The advance stats do not support at all the idea the 2014 Spurs were a 1 man campaign.

[70sFan]

Kawhi is healthier in playoffs while CP3 is healthier in the regular seasons. Kawhi also has a higher ceiling, so him for me.

The same Kawhi who had his last healthy postseason in 2020?

Don't focus on what they could not achieve when they were injured, look at what they achieved when they were healthy, on the big stage.

Paul still has more healthy postseason runs, he just never won the title.

[Dutchball97]

The same Kawhi who had his last healthy postseason in 2020?

Don't focus on what they could not achieve when they were injured, look at what they achieved when they were healthy, on the big stage.

Paul still has more healthy postseason runs, he just never won the title.

Which is a pretty major thing to consider when choosing someone to build around. Now I don't really buy into the narrative Paul is a play-off choker but I can't with 100% confidence say he'd be able to lead a team to a title as the clear best player like Kawhi did in 2019.

[70sFan]

Don't focus on what they could not achieve when they were injured, look at what they achieved when they were healthy, on the big stage.

Paul still has more healthy postseason runs, he just never won the title.

Which is a pretty major thing to consider when choosing someone to build around. Now I don't really buy into the narrative Paul is a play-off choker but I can't with 100% confidence say he'd be able to lead a team to a title as the clear best player like Kawhi did in 2019.

Prime Paul also never played with comparable supporting cast to Toronto, so I don't think it's a very compelling argument.

Do you think it's not possible to win the title with someone like Oscar Robertson as your best player? He never did that after all.

[Dutchball97]

Paul still has more healthy postseason runs, he just never won the title.

Which is a pretty major thing to consider when choosing someone to build around. Now I don't really buy into the narrative Paul is a play-off choker but I can't with 100% confidence say he'd be able to lead a team to a title as the clear best player like Kawhi did in 2019.

Prime Paul also never played with comparable supporting cast to Toronto, so I don't think it's a very compelling argument.

Do you think it's not possible to win the title with someone like Oscar Robertson as your best player? He never did that after all.

What are we counting as prime Paul because I definitely see the Lob City Clippers as comparably talented to the 2019 Raptors. I'm also not saying it's impossible for Paul to lead a team to a title just because he never did, I just personally don't think it'd be very likely for him to do it. It's not even about Paul himself as much as we've never seen a player of CP3's archetype (6 foot tall floor general) even come particularly close to leading a team to a title. Nash couldn't do it and he has a legit argument as the most impactful offensive player ever, Stockton couldn't do it despite his unmatched consistency for well over a decade, I just don't see why Paul would be the one to break that narrative.