NJN-PDX

[roy7]

blazers incoming-jason kidd

blazers outgoing-martell,raef,jack

would you do this?

i think we should although it would be tough to give up martell.

[Norm2953]

This has been discussed on the trade board and a number of
regulars on this board are for this deal.

The Nets are not going to get FMV for Kidd and he wants out. They
need to rebuild and would prefer expiring contracts, young players
and draft picks instead of high priced veterans. Unless they
accept Raef, I can't see the Blazers being able to pull off any Kidd
deal for non of our young core is available. I could live with a
JJ, Webster and Raef deal and could see Sergio or Blake being
in this deal in place of JJ if they feel a need for a PG to replace
Kidd. A big plus is Kidd's contract would expire next season when
we would presumably want to have major cap space to sign
free agents.

[TBpup]

Giving up on Martell would be tough since we would only be 'renting' Kidd for a season and a half.

LaFrentz, Frye, Jack and Green works....through in the max money allowed and a 2nd round pick. Kidd is certainly the best player by far but only for a short time. The Nets will get similar cap relief while having much younger players with more options. It does help Portland in the very short term and is a multi-player deal which Portland needs with Rudy and picks coming.

It would limit some of the flexability Portland would have because in a year+, Kidd would be worthless where Frye, Jack, Martell etc would have much more value.

[Billy]

Very tough to get rid of Martell even though Kidd is a heck of a prize. It would be nice to substitute some pieces in for Martell.

[cucad8]

I think a bigger question is, would NJ. I understand they aren't going to get full value for Kidd, so it isn't a question of value, but Martell is a 2/3. They have Carter and Jeferson there. Will they move Kidd in a deal where the main piece coming back is on the bench? If they were able to move Carter, I would think maybe, but who wants the last 4 years of Carter's deal right now?

[Wizenheimer]

I believe portland will have to make some decisions on their SF rotation this summer. Adding Oden and Fernandez is going to really squeeze the minutes on the frontline. There simply won't be enough to go around.

So if portland decides they must keep Jones then Martell becomes a little more expendable.

Martell is also a 3rd year player so if his contract isn't extended this summer, then his cap-hold will be 11.3 million in that 2009 off-season when portland may be exercising that cap-space option.

In that context, trading for Kidd would be justified. He'd certainly improve portland over the course of the next season and a half. I seriously doubt NJ would consider this and apparently Kidd is denying he wants to be traded.

And of course, this trade would see portland trade assets for a short-term gain, which may not serve the long term interests.

[mojomarc]

If we could get Kidd in a deal like this, it would be hard to not do it. Roy learning from Kidd for the next year or so would be extremely valuable. I think, though, that rather than giving up Martell I'd rather give up James Jones if at all possible.

[cucad8]

The other concern, I suppose, is if we got rid of Martell, and Jones went down, we are all of a sudden looking at Miles as our starting SF. Yikes. I like Jones in the role that he is in. Once he starts getting 30+ minutes, his knee could act up, and lead us dreadfully thin. Or, it owuld require starting Outlaw,and leaving our 2nd unit void of a scorer. Still, I think getting a talent like Kidd is something you obviously look at.

[Effigy]

I'd love to see this happen. I think Kidd definately gets us into the playoffs, I think he'd get the most out of Oden and Aldridge. I think he's the perfect guy to have Roy learn from. Any of the pgs are expendable. Giving up Martel hurts but we still have Jones, we'll get Rudy next year, we'd still be a good 3 point shooting team.

It is interesting to me that nobody's mentioned Frye instead of Martel. I think I'd rather keep Frye because we need bigs, but still, I'm suprised his name didn't come up.

[Wizenheimer]

I posted this trade in a response to the same notion on the trade board. It's almost certainly too big a trade and would threaten that vaunted chemistry:

Portland Trade Breakdown

Change in Team Outlook: +4.5 ppg, +2.9 rpg, and +7.4 apg.

Incoming Players
Malik Allen
6-10 PF from Villanova
5.7 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 0.6 apg in 16.7 minutes
Bostjan Nachbar
6-9 PF from Slovenia (Foreign)
9.5 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.9 apg in 20.9 minutes
Jason Kidd
6-4 PG from California
11.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 10.4 apg in 37.3 minutes

Outgoing Players
Sergio Rodriguez
6-3 PG from Spain (Foreign)
3.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 9.8 minutes
Channing Frye
6-11 C from Arizona
6.8 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 18.1 minutes
Martell Webster
6-7 SG from Seattle Prep (HS)
10.4 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 28.3 minutes
Raef LaFrentz
6-11 PF / C from Kansas
1.8 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.2 apg in 7.4 minutes

New Jersey Trade Breakdown

Change in Team Outlook: -4.5 ppg, -2.9 rpg, and -7.4 apg.
Incoming Players
Sergio Rodriguez
6-3 PG from Spain (Foreign)
3.0 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 1.9 apg in 9.8 minutes
Channing Frye
6-11 C from Arizona
6.8 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 0.9 apg in 18.1 minutes
Martell Webster
6-7 SG from Seattle Prep (HS)
10.4 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 1.5 apg in 28.3 minutes
Raef LaFrentz
6-11 PF / C from Kansas
1.8 ppg, 1.7 rpg, 0.2 apg in 7.4 minutes

Outgoing Players
Malik Allen
6-10 PF from Villanova
5.7 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 0.6 apg in 16.7 minutes
Bostjan Nachbar
6-9 PF from Slovenia (Foreign)
9.5 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 0.9 apg in 20.9 minutes
Jason Kidd
6-4 PG from California
11.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg, 10.4 apg in 37.3 minutes

obviously, many here would prefer to send out Jack instead of Sergio and some would prefer Jones instead of Webster.

That's fine, they plug in and the salaries still work.

And in a way, Nachbar would be a better replacement for Jones then for Webster.

I just thought that with Kidd and Blake, sergio would never see the floor while jack could still play some at SG.

Allen is something of a banger, and could replace Frye, although isn't the threat to shoot the mid-range like Frye is.

And all 3 contracts coming in fit that cap-space plan.

I'm sure everybody will hate it...I think it would make portland an interesting team though.

[Yadadimean]

porbably wouldn't do it. Kidd is a great player. Probably amongst the best ever, but lets face it. He's old and chances are he wouldn't resign with us and if he did, it wouldnt be for long due to his age. If it could be pulled off for Miles, Blake and a couple 2nd rounders I'd do it in a heartbeat, but NJ wouldn't do it.

[Norm2953]

The problem is not whether Portland would go for it but whether NJ
could get a better offer. My guess is a team like the Lakers will offer
up something better.

I sincerely doubt Portland could get Kidd for JJ, Martell and Raef.
Most likely NJ would ask for Raef, Martell, Rudi, Sergio and draft
choices and that would end the conversation. I seem to remember
all of the arguments we had over trading Zach to NJ and with KP's
hot reputation, teams would be leery of wanting to help Portland.

[BlackMamba]

well, maybe the blazers have a better chance at getting him as a FA than in a trade that would only maybe be for 1 year and then he could leave.

but, it would be awesome to have him.

[d-train]

blazers incoming-jason kidd

blazers outgoing-martell,raef,jack

would you do this?

i think we should although it would be tough to give up martell.

No, but here is a counter offer I'm pretty sure you will like. The reason for the modification to your proposal is to dump the last 2 years of Przybilla's contract. Joel isn't overpaid but Blazers will only consider this trade if it helps their summer of 2009 plan.

Jason Kidd
Jason Collins
Darrell Armstrong

>>for

Jarrett Jack
Martell Webster
Joel Przybilla
Raef LaFrentz

[PDXKnight]

I'd give up martell for Jason Kidd in a second. Martell is showing promise but let's face it, he'll never contribute to the Blazers as Jason kidd would for the time he'd be here. Granted, he would probably be a two year rental but he'd make us a lock for the playoffs for the two years that he'd play here and would bring a lot of cap relief when he becomes a FA. I like martell but for the cost of Martell, Jack, and LaFrentz, he'd be the perfect mentor for Roy and would give this team another playmaker.

[a_sensei]

I think 2008 J.Kidd is being overvalued. Although he still has many of the skills (passing/rebounding) that made him a superstar there are some issues that would make him a poor fit. He is shooting 37% from the field, turns the ball over an awful lot, and his team has been underachieving in the East. My biggest issue is that he would dominate the ball and Roy is a lot less effective when playing with guys that dominate the ball. Roy is the leader and controls the game, and if we bring in guys they need to be able to play off him. Remember when SAR for Kidd was a done deal, on the front page of the Oregonian, those were the good days!

[d-train]

The trade I suggested above is good by itself but is also a compliment to the proposed trade with the Bucks. The Bucks and Nets trade together would add Redd and Kidd to the Blazers and be neutral or positive to Blazers summer plans in 2009. Kidd can be resigned in 2009 to a 1-year veteran

[Spykes]

The problem is not whether Portland would go for it but whether NJ
could get a better offer. My guess is a team like the Lakers will offer
up something better.

I sincerely doubt Portland could get Kidd for JJ, Martell and Raef.
Most likely NJ would ask for Raef, Martell, Rudi, Sergio and draft
choices and that would end the conversation. I seem to remember
all of the arguments we had over trading Zach to NJ and with KP's
hot reputation, teams would be leery of wanting to help Portland.

The problem with any deal involving the Lakers now is that the Nets have to take back Radmonvic's contract to match salaries. That'll be a deal killer for the Nets.

[d-train]

There are not many teams that can swing a trade for Kidd and his contract. Blazers can offer good young players and Raef LaFrentz contract with only 2 more years.

[Spykes]

There are not many teams that can swing a trade for Kidd and his contract. Blazers can offer good young players and Raef LaFrentz contract with only 2 more years.

It's true. Of the teams I've seen interested in Kidd, the offers always have some sort of hitch to them...

*Orlando fans think they have a good shot at him because they have a lot of expiring contracts to add along with Redick and Nelson.

Heres the hitch: Even with all of Orlando's expiring contracts (3 of them) and Redick and Nelson, the Magic still have to add in more to the deal to get it done. Nelson just signed a long contract extension, so I believe he is BYC (even though the Trade Checker doesn't say it is). Regardless, I don't see the Net's wanting to take on Nelson's contract that runs through 2012/2013. Also, the logistics of making this deal work are pretty daunting. It would have to be a 5 for 1 deal because those expiring contracts are so small compared to what Kidd makes.

*The Lakers want Kidd by using Kwame's expiring contract and Javaris Crittenton or Farmar.

The hitch?: In order to make contracts match, the Nets have to take on Vladimir Radmanovic's contract. That's going to be an automatic deal killer.

*Dallas has really been wanting Kidd for awhile now. Their reported offer right now is George, Diop and Draft Picks, while having to add in Stackhouse for salary.

The problem?: This deal, as stated in the article, is still nowhere near matching from a salary standpoint. Also, with George just signing a 1 year deal, which means he has to agree to be traded. Something tells me George wouldn't be really excited about being sent from a Western Conference powerhouse to a rebuilding Eastern team. On top of all that, they still need to add in a ton of stuff to match salaries. Plus, all of the big contracts the Mavs have are longer than Kidd's deal.

*Next there's the Cavs. LeBron and Kidd played during the Olympics and LeBron would love to have Kidd playing alongside him in Cleveland. Unlike the other teams mentioned up to this point, they have some decent sized contracts that aren't longer than Kidd's deal. Whatever deal happens between Cleveland and NJ, it'll have to be... at a minimum... a 4 for 1 player deal. Outside of that, the Cavs should have a pretty decent shot at him. Better than most teams I'd say.

*Finally, there is the Nuggets. If Denver is willing to give up Camby, a deal could be done pretty quickly. Camby and Najera for Kidd works under the trade checker.

The problem?: This deal really leaves the Nuggets thin at C. With Nene being such a questionmark right now, the Nets certainly wouldn't take him in a trade and I don't see the Nuggets wanting to move Camby and hope Nene can come back this year. Not to mention Karl views Camby as being more important to the Nuggets success than either Melo or AI. I think the Nuggets might view Camby as being more important than Kidd. And without Camby, any reasonable Kidd to Denver deal falls apart.