Trade Shaq....

[AriesMar27]

it didnt work this season, it probably wont work this season.... so why not trade him?

shaq to denver for martin and nene....

the nuggets are going nowhere fast, both nene and martin have under performed, why not?

it would give the suns a more balanced roster and a nice bigman rotation, especially if they are trying to trade diaw for a draft pick... though the suns probably need more help on the perimeter than the post right now... bell and hill are not the answer at the 2 and 3.

[PHXfan85]

Shaq isn't going anywhere.

[nashill]

it didnt work this season, it probably wont work this season.... so why not trade him?

i like your logic...

[TASTIC]

A) No

B) Nene's contract

C) I hate Martin. nothing worse than watching a grown man spooge himself over a simple uncontested dunk (I'm talking to you too Mikki Moore)...he used to be amazing with Kidd in NJ though

D) I'd prefer Shaq than those two

E) Shaq is much more marketable

F) I'd HATE to think Marion would have been traded for that package

[chrice]

I still can't believe how much hate there is for Shaq. He did everything we wanted him to do in the playoffs. Made us a better rebounding team, reduced the amount of whoopass handed to us in the paint. Nene & Martin have big contracts, and are too injury proned. It would be a very bad idea to take on their contracts, as it we can basically kiss our capspace goodbye in 2010.

[The Diesel]

It's because Shaq sucked in the playoffs.

Duncan completely shut him down, the Hack-A-Shaq is a big reason why the Suns lost, and the Spurs exposed his awful pick and roll defense.

I was really disappointed in his play in the Playoffs considering how good he looked towards the end of the regular season.

The reason he's getting criticized is because the trade didn't work out (First round exit) and the fact that he was absolutely horrible in the Playoffs.

They should have kept Marion and THEN made a trade in the Summer...they never should have made that trade in the middle of the season.

[pidi]

But now we know what to expect from shaq and could react with trades we need to make right now.
it´s a process that´s going to be finalized this summer. with the talking of diaw & lb trades
we´re making the next steps to the ring, and with the signing of terry p. we have a coach who let´s his team play d. remember we won the first games with shaq by playing solid team d...

[eastsidecrossover]

they will keep him. I tihnk the hack a shaq thing will be addressed this offseason, and that will help us. I personally think he did exactly what he was expected to do. His numbers were what most were hoping it would be around. He made Amare better, helped on the boards, and we did not give as much offensive boards up. with the hack a shaq gone, things will be different, which is good in general for the game.

[AriesMar27]

i suggested it because the suns lack depth and it would also make them quicker and more athletic... i dont hate shaq but he wont be able to do much damage with the suns and their current lineup.... you can always bring in a third team to acquire a better wing player...

[TASTIC]

i suggested it because the suns lack depth and it would also make them quicker and more athletic... i dont hate shaq but he wont be able to do much damage with the suns and their current lineup.... you can always bring in a third team to acquire a better wing player...

Teams with that much cap space don't grow on trees...not to mention you dont think DEN has asked if ANYONE wants either of those guys and their albatross contracts? Nene has some upside I think, but at $10m per year? Pass....

[Frank Lee]

I was really disappointed in his play in the Playoffs considering how good he looked towards the end of the regular season.

The reason he's getting criticized is because the trade didn't work out (First round exit) and the fact that he was absolutely horrible in the Playoffs.

With this logic you might as well trade Nash too

[walkingart]

Goodbye cap space in 2010 and hello to a payroll of $61 million for 5 guys!

Thanks, but no thanks!

[chrice]

It's because Shaq sucked in the playoffs.

Duncan completely shut him down, the Hack-A-Shaq is a big reason why the Suns lost, and the Spurs exposed his awful pick and roll defense.

First of all, it wasn't just Shaq. Amare was by far our biggest choker. Diaw and Barbosa sucked as well. If we had Amare on Duncan, he probably would have played 15-20 minutes each game, because there's no way in hell he's been able to guard him without picking up stupid fouls. With Matrix, we might have had someone to put on Parker, but then there's no one to guard Duncan.

Yes, the Spurs Hack-A-Shaq'ed us. Shaq made enough of those free throws. Even before they went with the Hack-a-Shaq, our team was still in bad shape against San Antonio.

Yes, he doesn't have good pick and roll defense. What do you expect? He's a true center trying to guard Duncan out in the perimeter. He still did a better job on Duncan than Amare ever could. And it's not like we had an answer for Parker either. Blaming Shaq for not being able to guard Duncan/Parker pick and rolls is like every other team blaming their players for not being able to guard the Amare/Nash pick and roll.

If you're going to put them blame on Shaq, don't single him out. We didn't have anyone who could defend Parker or Ginobili. Amare was choked. Diaw/Barbosa didn't step up until it was too late. Fabricio Oberto for was killing us on the offensive boards. We were simply outcoached and outplayed.

[The Diesel]

Shaq made enough of his free-throws? His missed free-throws are a HUGE reason why the team lost the series.

I agree that Amare and Barbosa didn't play that well; Amare fell apart in the second half of Game 2 and Barbosa shot 0 for 7 in that game...two HUGE reasons why the team lost.

Diaw was great in Games 4 and 5 replacing Hill.

But Shaq was a huge disappointment; Gasol and Chandler did a better job on Duncan than he did and he was shut-down by the Spurs even though they never double-teamed him.

The only games he played well in were Games 2 and 4; he was terrible in all the others.

He is definitely not the only reason why the team lost, I agree. But he's the MAIN reason, in my opinion.

Other reasons?

- Hill's injury

- Barbosa's awful performance in Game 2 and Amare falling apart in the second half of that game after scoring 25 points in the first half.

- Amare leaving Finley wide-open to hit a 3 pointer to force OT in Game 1

- D'Antoni not fouling in Game 1 to prevent San Antonio from making a 3 pointer at the end of the game and not taking Shaq out when they were using Hack-A-Shaq

- Not starting Diaw earlier when it was clear from Game 1 that Hill wasn't 100%.

Many people were at fault, but Shaq is the main reason. He was brought in to beat the Spurs and to contain Duncan and he failed badly.

4-1 series defeat and Duncan outplayed him.

As I said, even Gasol and Chandler did a much better job against Duncan than Shaq did and now the team is stuck with him and his contract for another two years.

They should have kept Marion; Shaq will probably miss a lot of games next season, he's not the player he used to be, he's over-paid, and I don't know how he will respond to Porter.

If the team hired Larry Brown or Rick Carlisle, I think Shaq would have respected them, but I don't know about Porter.

And if Shaq doesn't listen to him, I don't know if Amare will because isn't Shaq supposed to be his mentor?

He was Amare's favorite player growing up and I'm worried that he might be a bad influence on Amare.

This trade was a huge mistake and I wish Shaq gave the Suns permission to trade him after he failed to deliver for the team.

Now D'Antoni is gone, Nash and Shaq didn't have good chemistry on the court, Barbosa seemed to blame him for the early exit in an interview...this team is a mess.

I still can't believe Kerr took such a huge risk in mid-season...

The team should explore trading him before it's too late...

[|||-Abaddon-|||]

From what I remember Shaq did a very good job on Tim Duncan. In fact, Tim's only productive moments in the series were when Amare had to cover Duncan.

How can you call yourself a Shaq fan? Dont you know this guy's game?
-Poor free throw shooting
-Lack of pick and roll defensive lateral skills

These are all lame-waad reasons to spite Shaq as to why the Suns lost the series. Guess what, four rings is all a person needs to bring up against your debate.

To top if off, we also completely avoided Shaq during the series, making him just a large mass in the paint to rebound. Shaq still has game, and he continually proved this during the season. He just has to barge his way to the net, and use his touch to get it in --- simple. He may be limited now, even though I dont believe it, but he still and always will be a 60% FG shooter, and he must be utilized on a consistent basis so that teams start realizing that he must be at the very least, doubled on consecutive possessions.

When you break it down, the Suns looks jumbled when they played the Spurs, they didnt do the correct things that the they did when they defeated the Spurs twice in the season. This team is omni-potent, and 1 to 15, a very well rounded offensive team. Pardon me, but I'd take SOLID, DEFENSIVE MINDED, and CONFIDENT players who arent scared to take big shots --- and MAKE THEM. These guys arent hard to find, they are the Derek Fishers, Robert Horry's (a few yeas ago), Shane Battiers of the league.

This team needs to get rid of the flux of players who cant seem to make big shots and seem to disapear, even in their defensive contributions, during big games. This also includes ridding this team of injury proned, and weak minded players who just seem to cave when scenarios reach their peaks. We seem to be full of chokers, but their is a difference between Jordan and Kobe: will, leadership and mental determination (we saw the finals...).

From our batch: Diaw, Hill, Bell and especially Barbosa and Stoudamire are typical players who play immature styles of basketball. They seem all boom in the season, but cant even make a jump shot when it counts (Garnett - cough). This team is full of chokers, albeit really talented ones...

This team has a good mix of young and old -- but this team needs a face lift, and we need proven vets to help fight and beat the best teams in the league. You take experience over inexperienced in any job, and this is why the Suns cant get over the hump, we need to aquire players who look at Tim Duncan, and think he is a piece of crap. We need proven players. We have the talent. We need to confidence to win. Once you've done it, you know what it takes. Shaq knows what it takes, and this why he has been acquired.

I fully expect us to be alot better next year, with a year under the belt and a coach who seems to have done pretty darn well in the past, but who also lacks that next level champion swagger.

[b-ball forever]

Shaq made enough of his free-throws? His missed free-throws are a HUGE reason why the team lost the series.

I agree that Amare and Barbosa didn't play that well; Amare fell apart in the second half of Game 2 and Barbosa shot 0 for 7 in that game...two HUGE reasons why the team lost.

Diaw was great in Games 4 and 5 replacing Hill.

But Shaq was a huge disappointment; Gasol and Chandler did a better job on Duncan than he did and he was shut-down by the Spurs even though they never double-teamed him.

The only games he played well in were Games 2 and 4; he was terrible in all the others.

He is definitely not the only reason why the team lost, I agree. But he's the MAIN reason, in my opinion.

Other reasons?

- Hill's injury

- Barbosa's awful performance in Game 2 and Amare falling apart in the second half of that game after scoring 25 points in the first half.

- Amare leaving Finley wide-open to hit a 3 pointer to force OT in Game 1

- D'Antoni not fouling in Game 1 to prevent San Antonio from making a 3 pointer at the end of the game and not taking Shaq out when they were using Hack-A-Shaq

- Not starting Diaw earlier when it was clear from Game 1 that Hill wasn't 100%.

Many people were at fault, but Shaq is the main reason. He was brought in to beat the Spurs and to contain Duncan and he failed badly.

4-1 series defeat and Duncan outplayed him.

As I said, even Gasol and Chandler did a much better job against Duncan than Shaq did and now the team is stuck with him and his contract for another two years.

They should have kept Marion; Shaq will probably miss a lot of games next season, he's not the player he used to be, he's over-paid, and I don't know how he will respond to Porter.

If the team hired Larry Brown or Rick Carlisle, I think Shaq would have respected them, but I don't know about Porter.

And if Shaq doesn't listen to him, I don't know if Amare will because isn't Shaq supposed to be his mentor?

He was Amare's favorite player growing up and I'm worried that he might be a bad influence on Amare.

This trade was a huge mistake and I wish Shaq gave the Suns permission to trade him after he failed to deliver for the team.

Now D'Antoni is gone, Nash and Shaq didn't have good chemistry on the court, Barbosa seemed to blame him for the early exit in an interview...this team is a mess.

I still can't believe Kerr took such a huge risk in mid-season...

The team should explore trading him before it's too late...

Exactly, good post (even more impressive to see u keeping it real since you're a big Shaq fan).
Except I don't think that Shaq will go drama queen w/ Terry Porter (tho I won't really be surprised if it does happen) , and I doubt Amare wud follow Shaq if he does wind up being a beyatch with the new coach.

The level of delusion some guys on this board reach regarding Shaq's playoffs performance is fuggin batshat hilarious. There are peeps who actually think that he did a good job!!! ZOMGWTF!

I mean seriously : "From what I remember Shaq did a very good job on Tim Duncan"
What series was that bozo watching? Shaq was focal weakness of the team on both ends of the court during this year's Spurs series.
The Spurs constantly murdered him off the pick n roll on one end, then on the other end they flat out killed our offensive flow (which is our major strength) by sending him to shoot up bricks @ the free throw line!

He was especially disapointing given that he was supposed to have been specifially brought in to deal with the bigger frontcourts of a few western conf teams in the playoffs... that's exactly what we ran into and he sucked.
The only guy who maybe did worse then Shaq in the postseason was Barbs, and when u factor in production as per contract, Shaq was dead last.

I'd love to trade O'Neal, but Isiah Thomas doesn't have a job in the NBA anymore, and we're the team that has Stevie Kerr, so there are no more GMs (Please Use More Appropriate Word) enuf to give us anything valuable enuf in return for Shaq out there anymore.

There are stuff I'm looking forward to for next year (I.E. : word has it we're actually keeping our draft pick this time, Amare keeping off team USA to work on certain aspects of his game... hopefully, Terry Porter's work with Barbs and Strawberry...), but Shaq def isn't one of the guys I've got high hopes on for next year.

Mike D'Antoni got the absolute max possible outta the current Shaq towards the end of the reg season (during which Shaq did an OKish job), but he's gone now.
I seriously doubt Terry Porter (who seems to like guards better) will be able to get that much production outta him. He'll be a year older and his performances with Miami pre- playing with D'Antoni were friggin scary, specially when u look at his contract...

[Frank Lee]

we need to aquire players who look at Tim Duncan, and think he is a piece of crap.

apparently we need delusional players too

[BurningHeart]

It's because Shaq sucked in the playoffs.

Duncan completely shut him down, the Hack-A-Shaq is a big reason why the Suns lost, and the Spurs exposed his awful pick and roll defense.

I was really disappointed in his play in the Playoffs considering how good he looked towards the end of the regular season.

The reason he's getting criticized is because the trade didn't work out (First round exit) and the fact that he was absolutely horrible in the Playoffs.

They should have kept Marion and THEN made a trade in the Summer...they never should have made that trade in the middle of the season.

Probably the first time I've ever agreed with you, but good post man. Shaq may have rebounded and been an inside presence, but the fact is that his inability to shoot FTs (which we knew going in, obviously) cost us. They slowed the game down with Hack-a-Shaq and he wasn't able to make them pay for it. It threw everyone off rhythm and out of sync.

[The Diesel]

apparently we need delusional players too

LOL!

His performances with Miami pre- playing with D'Antoni were friggin scary, specially when u look at his contract...

OK, I will defend Shaq here. The reason he was so bad in Miami this season was because he was very limited by injuries.

He was playing with a deep thigh-bruise which made him miss a few playoff games in 2005 and he was playing with a bad hip which he injured by diving for a loose ball when Miami was twenty games under .500 at one point.

Those facts should shut up the critics who accused him of quitting on the team.

Anyways, just look at how well he was moving when he came back from his injuries after the trade and look how much better he rebounded the ball.

He averaged 7 rebounds a game pre-trade, which increased to 10 rebounds a game after the trade.

Shaq was playing healthy, that's why he rebounded better and was moving much better after the trade.

Riley was the main reason Miami was so awful this year; his moves during the summer time were awful and I'm impressed that he actually acknowledged it.

- Letting Posey and Kapono leave

- Spending the MLE on Smush Parker (He's no longer on the team)

- Signing Luke Jackson and Penny Hardaway as free-agents (Both got released)

- Even the Antoine Walker/Ricky Davis trade didn't work out that well this season.

Let's not blame Shaq for everything that happened in Miami this season. Let's not forget that Riley went "scouting" at one point this season and the fact that he treated Shaq really badly a few times before the trade.

I was impressed by how well the team played towards the end of the season by winning 15 of their last 20 games and Shaq played pretty well towards the end of the season when Mike D started to use him better.

But Shaq was awful in the playoffs and he's only going to get worse...unfortunately.

[b-ball forever]

If Shaq was an athlete still in his prime with a track record of not showin up on boxscores as "DNP", then pulling out the injury card wud be a legit excuse.
But guess what? Shaq is an old guy with a big body that has a history of breaking up.
Injuries were 1 of the reasons that made him suck with the Heat, but it was no surprise that he got those injuries, and it's very likely that he'll go down again with us...

PS : And I don't give an ish bout who fu*ked up who with what where and when on last year's Heat team, F em, what matters is Shaq's recent track record (which includes health)... which leads to Shaq's projected production expectancy over the rest of his Suns' contract period... and it sure as hell doesn't look pretty