BOS - MIN .. some "Out of the Box" thinking

shrink · Post #1 » by **shrink** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 2:37 pm

There's some interest over on the BOS board for McCants for a deal like this:

Giddens + O'Bryant + Cassell for McCants

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=871147&p=18286707#p18286707

.. but most BOS fans don't think its enough. I tend to agree, particularly since this deal requires us to cut two players to create roster spots for the deal.

BOS is certainly hurting for some bench depth this year, and I've been giving them a lot of thought since I saw a desperate Celtics fan wonder how much they could get for Rondo. I can't imagine he'd ever be traded, but neither will we see a trade of the Big Three coming off a championship, and BOS doesn't have players like Posey, PJ Brown and a healthier Cassell to back them up. BOS problem is that we bankrupted them in the KG deal, and they have little of value left to trade to get the help they need.

I poured over their potential assets (D-Leaguers Giddens, Bill Walker, and the other players from the "Little 11"), and didn't see much to work with. The contracts are tiny, but the players they need have bigger contracts. However, they do have a 2010 pick. The general chorus is "it can't be traded!" and that's right -- almost. It can be traded to one team .. us .. if we send back their 2009 pick. The 2010 has more value with the added uncertainy and age of the Big Three, and we don't have any pressing need to cash a 2009 BOS pick as well. Here's my offer:

BOS GETS: McCants + Ollie (vet min) + BOS 2009 1st

MIN GETS: Giddens + Bill Walker + O'Bryant + BOS 2010 1st

FOR MIN: We may lose more games without Ollie and perhaps McCants, but we get assets we can use in the future. Giddens and Walker may even get a chance to get out of the D-League on our rebuilding team. I wouldn't mind taking a look at POB either, and he'd be happy to be home. But the best piece is delaying the BOS pick a year.

FOR BOS: They get some bench help they desperately need, in exchange for future assets that won't help them now. They hope for big thigns out of McCants, and being reunited with KG may help him. I can't imagine he'd have a big head on that team. Kevin Ollie's been playing great, and provides vet skill and has play-off experience getting the ball to superstars. They get their pick back, in case it falls apart. They also create a roster spot to add a vet-min free agent big man.

john2jer · Post #2 » by **john2jer** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 3:49 pm

I think we'd have to tell Cassell to not even bother buying a plane ticket in the first scenario.

I like the 2nd trade a lot. McCants can't get off the bench and we're losing him for nothing at the end of the season. Ollie, while nice, he's hurting our draft pick. Might as well take a look at those three, plus pushing the Boston pick back a year saves our cap in 2009 making free agent signings easier, plus that 2010 pick will be a better pick than the 2009 as the team gets older.

On a sidenote, the guy who coached me in basketball as a kid, and got me into coaching as I got older, actually was a volunteer assistant varsity coach for Blaine when POB was there. POB was pretty easy to push around back then, and didn't always work as hard as you'd hope someone with his height would. He just took the easy stuff instead of trying to dominate games.

shrink · Post #3 » by **shrink** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:01 pm

john2jer wrote: I like the 2nd trade a lot. McCants can't get off the bench and we're losing him for nothing at the end of the season. Ollie, while nice, he's hurting our draft pick. Might as well take a look at those three, plus pushing the Boston pick back a year saves our cap in 2009 making free agent signings easier, plus that 2010 pick will be a better pick than the 2009 as the team gets older.

I hadn't even considered that! Good thinking!

I tossed it up on the BOS board ..

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=871621&p=18287137#p18287137

.. and early responses have been polite but slightly negative. I think Bill Walker might become the sticking point. I'm not sure I'd do the deal without him, though any of these #30-40 picks is a longshot. Would you guys do it with Big Baby instead of Walker or Giddens? There's more discussion over in that thread, if you want to read it.

WallyWorld · Post #4 » by **WallyWorld** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 4:51 pm

Yeah I think we are going to have to push one of our picks back this year for cap purposes. This certainly does that.

McCants certainly would do well with KG again. I like that possibility. However, it seems Boston's bench only looks reasonable in the backcourt with House and Allen back there. Maybe a similar deal structured around Craig Smith?

A nice way to get some more prospects, but id rather move Shaddy for an expiring/pick (see: GG deal last year).

And not to mention, trading with Boston again?? I think its time to find someone new.

Good suggestion though, keep em up.

Wingman · Post #5 » by **Wingman** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:17 pm

I'd like to get Bill Walker, but I hate Big Baby. I also don't want to help the Celtics any more than we already have.

slinky · Post #6 » by **slinky** » Fri Jan 16, 2009 7:35 pm

I am willing to help out any team that gives us a deal.

I also dont think the celtics want another undersized played like smith. They already have powe and huge baby.

I like either deal. At this point in the wolves maturation process, I say bring in as many different young guys as possible give them a chance to fit in whether thats giddens, walker, POB, etc. If they dont work out we move on. Its a low risk, high reward situation.

And it wont happen for myriad of reasons but if cassell wants to come back here for a couple months, I wouldnt complain too loud, regardless of past discretions, he's a smart vet PG, that has stated his willingness to coach in the future, he might be an asset to a young team...or than again a distraction...

4ho5ive · Post #7 » by **4ho5ive** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:29 am

The only thing I want from Cassell is to teach Foye the "grande huevos" dance after a big 3. Other than that, he isnt needed.

Kevin_Love_42 · Post #8 » by **Kevin_Love_42** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 12:46 am

4ho5ive wrote:The only thing I want from Cassell is to teach Foye the "grande huevos" dance after a big 3. Other than that, he isnt needed.

lmao

zauchary · Post #9 » by **zauchary** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:00 am

Bill Walker is looking really nice in the d-league right now, shooting 55% from the field and 40% from the tri stripe. i think it might take a little more to pry one of there promising young studs away, but who knows. i think walker could really be a player some day and would be a nice addition to the team.

the other day he went 10-12 from the field and 5-5 from the line, scoring 26 points and pulling seven rebounds.

skorff26 · Post #10 » by **skorff26** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 1:16 am

shrink wrote:There's some interest over on the BOS board for McCants for a deal like this:

Giddens + O'Bryant + Cassell for McCants

viewtopic.php?f=8&t=871147&p=18286707#p18286707

.. but most BOS fans don't think its enough. I tend to agree, particularly since this deal requires us to cut two players to create roster spots for the deal.

I like this trade especially if they would send us some cash over to cut a player or two (maybe 1 million for buyouts)
As for buyouts on our team, I would hope we would bite the bullet and get rid of collins, and as for the other one maybe booth or ollie

shrink · Post #11 » by **shrink** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:14 pm

Thanks for your comments, guys. Would you guys still sign off on the deal if BOS sent cash instead of Giddens?

McCants + Ollie (vet min) + 2009 BOS 1st for Bill Walker + POB + Cassell + BOS 2010 1st + $2 mil

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &cash=16:2

MIN uses the cash to buy out Booth and Cassell, and Sam I Am stays on in BOS on as a coach. I think cash is going to help appease Glen Taylor when he has to buy out a "free" Booth. Walker gets a little playing time here, and we give POB a look as well, though I expect little. We have to use our 15th roster spot to find a back-up PG in free agency. The 2010 pick > 2009 pick, and delaying it helps us financially and with roster spots. It costs us wins later in the season, but we get some assets for the future.

Also, would you still do the deal if we got Giddens instead of Bill Walker?

skorff26 · Post #12 » by **skorff26** » Sat Jan 17, 2009 3:57 pm

shrink wrote:Thanks for your comments, guys. Would you guys still sign off on the deal if BOS sent cash instead of Giddens?

McCants + Ollie (vet min) + 2009 BOS 1st for Bill Walker + POB + Cassell + BOS 2010 1st + $2 mil

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/features/t ... &cash=16:2

MIN uses the cash to buy out Booth and Cassell, and Sam I Am stays on in BOS on as a coach. I think cash is going to help appease Glen Taylor when he has to buy out a "free" Booth. Walker gets a little playing time here, and we give POB a look as well, though I expect little. We have to use our 15th roster spot to find a back-up PG in free agency. The 2010 pick > 2009 pick, and delaying it helps us financially and with roster spots. It costs us wins later in the season, but we get some assets for the future.

Also, would you still do the deal if we got Giddens instead of Bill Walker?

I like both of giddens and walker, so either would be fine with me.

And I think if we could get cash and one of those 2 guys, then it would be a solid deal for us.

TrentTuckerForever · Post #13 » by **TrentTuckerForever** » Sun Jan 18, 2009 3:57 pm

I'd do the 2nd deal, but I'm sure Boston wouldn't. The Wolves' priorities should be PG and C; any other deals should be to get something for nothing (like the Carney/1st deal last summer.) Walker for McCants fits squarely in that category, at least for the Wolves.