Falk: MJ didn't want to draft Kwame

Post #1 » by **pineappleheadindc** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:36 pm

...MJ supposedly wanted Elton Brand (which many on this board wanted as well).

Any thoughts about whether or not Falk is on the up-and-up?

link

Post #2 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:37 pm

Beat me to it by 10 seconds, lol.

It's interesting and plausible... but is it true?

EDIT: Also, at what point did MJ decide he wanted to make his return to the game?

Also, check this quote from MJ himself, from a little while ago:

"It's a gamble," Jordan said. "Even with Kwame Brown. If we don't take Kwame Brown at No. 1, he's going at 2. No matter how you look at it, everybody had him on their radar as being the top pick. We just so happened to be the top pick and we chose him. It didn't pan out and we take the brunt of that. We understand that. It's the risk that you take."

That's from here. That's from February 10th.

Induveca · Post #3 » by **Induveca** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:41 pm

pineappleheadindc wrote:...MJ supposedly wanted Elton Brand (which many on this board wanted as well).

Any thoughts about whether or not Falk is on the up-and-up?

link

Considering Abe's history I believe this 100%, especially the ticket sales part. Abe used MJ for ticket sales then booted him at the end of his playing days.........

Makes sense to me, also makes sense MJ would want Brand instead in a trade (I remember those rumors). Doesn't absolve MJ of the Stackhouse trade.......but makes some sense.

Post #4 » by **pineappleheadindc** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:41 pm

Good question.

Also: If true, could this be why MJ was so "mean" to Kwame?

Post #5 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:42 pm

pineappleheadindc wrote:Good question.

Also: If true, could this be why MJ was so "mean" to Kwame?

If you were dealing with a raw HS rookie instead of a 20/10 big man who could defend while making your last push for the playoffs, wouldn't you be a little resentful?

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #6 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:46 pm

And beat me by about 9 minutes.

All I will say is MJ the GM isn't looking too shabby right now with Diaw, Bell, Radmanovic, and Diop all acquired in trades, and DJ Augustin from the draft. Larry Brown is happy with them. They have won six straight games and are within 1/2 game of the 8th seed.

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/teams/cha

Bobcats Team Report Mar 10, 2009

This playoff race business is getting serious.

The Bobcats won their sixth straight Saturday, setting a team record and topping the New York Knicks to close to within a game of the eighth and final playoff spot in the Eastern Conference.

The difference in the team is its offense. The Bobcats are averaging 102 points and shooting over 50 percent in their last seven games. Saturday they shot 54 percent, and all five starters reached double figures.

Post #7 » by **pineappleheadindc** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:50 pm

tsherkin wrote:
pineappleheadindc wrote:Good question.

Also: If true, could this be why MJ was so "mean" to Kwame?

If you were dealing with a raw HS rookie instead of a 20/10 big man who could defend while making your last push for the playoffs, wouldn't you be a little resentful?

Yup. I'd be big resentful.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #8 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:50 pm

Induveca wrote:
pineappleheadindc wrote:...MJ supposedly wanted Elton Brand (which many on this board wanted as well).

Any thoughts about whether or not Falk is on the up-and-up?

link

Considering Abe's history I believe this 100%, especially the ticket sales part. Abe used MJ for ticket sales then booted him at the end of his playing days.........

Makes sense to me, also makes sense MJ would want Brand instead in a trade (I remember those rumors). Doesn't absolve MJ of the Stackhouse trade.......but makes some sense.

Seems like perfectly good karma to me that after Abe made all that money off of MJ (the same guy who traded Juwan's huge contract and who attracted all the attention and marketing sales to DC, as well as who brought in a high-level, albeit lackey, coach) only to have resentful Pollin kick him out of town; that MJ would be end up the one with the better team, better coach, and better GM.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #9 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:53 pm

My comment about the better GM is directed at Grunfeld for the state of the cap and for Tapscott's interim run.

The more I think about Cleveland's offer of Szczerbiak's expiring deal for Jamison, in light of this season and the money on the table for Arenas, the more I think Grunfeld has made some egregious mistakes.

Post #10 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:56 pm

I'm leery about talking MJ up after Charlotte because Larry Brown is long-known to play GM when he coaches a team. He's got the credibility, the influence (name power, even his results with Detroit), all that stuff, so it's a little difficult to want to play up MJ's move with LA (the Morrison-for-Radman trade) and the Suns trade (Richardson and Dudley for Diaw and Bell) but it does look like he's doing a pretty decent job over there.

It'd be nice to believe this, but it's kind of sad if it's true, because Pollin becomes even more of a... let's go with "fool" so I avoid characterizing him any other way and he actually screwed himself out of 2 years worth of playoff profits to do it.

Donkey McDonkerton · Post #11 » by **Donkey McDonkerton** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:57 pm

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
Induveca wrote:
pineappleheadindc wrote:...MJ supposedly wanted Elton Brand (which many on this board wanted as well).

Any thoughts about whether or not Falk is on the up-and-up?

link

Considering Abe's history I believe this 100%, especially the ticket sales part. Abe used MJ for ticket sales then booted him at the end of his playing days.........

Makes sense to me, also makes sense MJ would want Brand instead in a trade (I remember those rumors). Doesn't absolve MJ of the Stackhouse trade.......but makes some sense.

Seems like perfectly good karma to me that after Abe made all that money off of MJ (the same guy who traded Juwan's huge contract and who attracted all the attention and marketing sales to DC, as well as who brought in a high-level, albeit lackey, coach) only to have resentful Pollin kick him out of town; that MJ would be end up the one with the better team, better coach, and better GM.

franch1se · Post #12 » by **franch1se** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 9:58 pm

What about Adam Morrison? Jordan got Radmanovic for Morrison, so he basically turned the 3rd pick in the 2006 draft into Radmanovic. I'm assuming that the Morrison pick was Jordan's decision. Its possible that Bernie Bickerstaff (I think he was president of the Bobcats), made that call since Jordan just joined the Bobcats if I remember correctly.

I think its plausible that Abe forced Jordan to take Kwame, but why would Jordan continue to take the hit for it years later even after he was fired? I didn't see the interview where Jordan talks about Kwame and how everyone had him #1, but it sounds like Jordan took full responsibility for the pick. Which seems weird to me cuz I don't think its in Jordan's nature to be THAT loyal to Abe since I'm sure Jordan felt wronged by Abe for firing him. From that perspective it seems like Falk's comments aren't complete truthful either because I can't see Jordan taking full responsibility for the pick if it really was Abe's pick and not Jordan's.

Post #13 » by **tsherkin** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:04 pm

With Morrison's value depressed to nothing but the value of his contract, that was a decent trade. The selection of Morrison has to be epic-fail, but wasn't that his first draft when taking over the team? Did he even have time to prepare in that draft? I think that one was Bickerstaff.

Post #14 » by **LyricalRico** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:08 pm

franch1se wrote:I think its plausible that Abe forced Jordan to take Kwame, but why would Jordan continue to take the hit for it years later even after he was fired? I didn't see the interview where Jordan talks about Kwame and how everyone had him #1, but it sounds like Jordan took full responsibility for the pick. Which seems weird to me cuz I don't think its in Jordan's nature to be THAT loyal to Abe since I'm sure Jordan felt wronged by Abe for firing him. From that perspective it seems like Falk's comments aren't complete truthful either because I can't see Jordan taking full responsibility for the pick if it really was Abe's pick and not Jordan's.

I don't recall MJ ever throwing anybody under the bus in the media, not even Abe when he got the boot out of DC. Heck, he would cover his mouth with his jersey when talking to officials during games. MJ has always had respect for the game and for the league. I would absolutely expect him to keep any venom he may have had for Abe (more likely La Sooz) forcing his hand on the Kwame pick out of the media.

go'stags · Post #15 » by **go'stags** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:39 pm

Why would I believe anything David Falk says? Especially after all these years, and that MJ quote that Tsherkin posted.

Just Falk trying to get his name out there again, so he can get some power back.

Point to Abe's history all you want, but wasn't he always trading young for old? C-Webb for Richmond? Wallace for Austin? Rasheed for Strickland? This doesnt fall in line with that at all.

I call BS.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #16 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:41 pm

Donkey McDonkerton wrote:
Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
Seems like perfectly good karma to me that after Abe made all that money off of MJ (the same guy who traded Juwan's huge contract and who attracted all the attention and marketing sales to DC, as well as who brought in a high-level, albeit lackey, coach) only to have resentful Pollin kick him out of town; that MJ would be end up the one with the better team, better coach, and better GM.

1. Donk, the Bobcats have twice as many wins. Thus, the better team.
2. Donk, the Bobcats have Larry Brown and the Wizards have Ed Tapscott, with millions still owed to Eddie Jordan. Thus, the Bobcats have the better coach.
3. Donk, the Bobcats don't have salary cap concerns and only 15 wins. They don't extend players like Pecherov and NEVER play them. They don't start Mike James and play him signicantly more minutes than first round pick Nick Young. They don't start Songaila (who I do like as a reserve) at C ahead of Blatche (who was the starter prior to an injury) and play Darius twice as many minutes as Javale McGee. I blame the GM because he put Tapscott in there. Thus, the Bobcats have the better GM.

Points 1, 2, and 3 back up what I said about team, coach, and GM.

I don't get the :nonono:

go'stags · Post #17 » by **go'stags** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:46 pm

Well, next year when the Wizards finish way ahead of the Bobcats, with more promise for the future, you might look at things a little difefrently IMO.

My take is when both Arenas and Haywood went out, so did any hopes we had for this year. I think EG felt the same way. So im not taking too much from this season, hence why I dont watch the games very often when I know it will lead to irrational thoughts.

Thats for another thread though.

Chocolate City Jordanaire · Post #18 » by **Chocolate City Jordanaire** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:52 pm

go'stags wrote:Well, next year when the Wizards finish way ahead of the Bobcats, with more promise for the future, you might look at things a little difefrently IMO.

My take is when both Arenas and Haywood went out, so did any hopes we had for this year. I think EG felt the same way. So im not taking too much from this season, hence why I dont watch the games very often when I know it will lead to irrational thoughts.

Thats for another thread though.

It would be irrational for me to comment on things I'm not watching.

I look at what I'm seeing this season and it's pretty disgusting. Jamison and Butler are each playing upwards of 38 minutes a game. The team's getting crushed most nights. Occasionally, a really bad team like Minnesota appears on the radar and the Wizards win. Once, Obama came to Verizon and that was the best game I've seen all year (besides maybe a win over NJ or one win over GS). Otherwise, this team has STUNK this season.

go'stags, I won't at all be surprised if NEXT YEAR the Wizards have a better record than the Bobcats. With Haywood and Arenas and a decent coach, that could very easily happen.

However, right now, I'd say Grunfeld's got a 15-win team and he's got a de-motivator of a coach who's pandering to the egos of guys who want minutes and who don't play good defense, while at the same time they and the coach throw young players under the bus.

I hate the Wizards season. Strong words. Maybe a touch irrational. But nonetheless exactly how I feel.

go'stags · Post #19 » by **go'stags** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 10:59 pm

That is exactly why I dont watch them, because chances are I would hate them too.

My advice would be to take nothing from this year, other than the development of Dmac and the promise of Mcgee. You can throw Critt in there too.

Losing makes everything ugly.

fishercob · Post #20 » by **fishercob** » Tue Mar 10, 2009 11:16 pm

Back to the issue at hand, I think Falk's comments are complete and utter horse shxt.

Really? We're supposed to believe that MJ was forced in to take Kwame Brown over Elton Brand because of ticket sales???? Come see the charisma-less high school project! That's a much better way to sell tickets than the guy who starred for a national powerhouse that's on TV all the time here and has a huge alumni base in DC.

MJ didn't want to take Kwame in 2001 and yet it takes eight years for the truth to come out about what MJ really wanted to do? Riiiiiiiiiiiight.

Jordan was the greatest player of my lifetime, maybe all time. But he's been a terrible executive and is regarded by many as a crappy human being (wife cheating, caddie abusing, etc., etc.). I'm glad Abe sent his arrogant ass out the door. He's doing a hell of a job in Charlotte.