Bucks News, Trade Ideas, Transactions - No Politics

StickeeFingaz · Post #1421 » by **StickeeFingaz** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 9:26 pm

VooDoo7 wrote:Jrue ain't going nowhere.

He has spoken.

skones · Post #1422 » by **skones** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:14 pm

paulpressey25 wrote:
skones wrote:I repeat. So so so SO stupid to sign Jrue to sign a long term extension right now.

So you want to let him get to free agency, and risk losing him for nothing?

Was not a fan of that trade, but at this point we're all in. He's still a borderline all-star player. We just have to pay up.

Sunk. Cost. Fallacy.

You want to throw the boat at a team that doesn't look like they can win anything at current? No, you don't have to pay up.

ShootingtheJ · Post #1423 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:42 pm

skones wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:
skones wrote:I repeat. So so so SO stupid to sign Jrue to sign a long term extension right now.

So you want to let him get to free agency, and risk losing him for nothing?

Was not a fan of that trade, but at this point we're all in. He's still a borderline all-star player. We just have to pay up.

Sunk. Cost. Fallacy.

You want to throw the boat at a team that doesn't look like they can win anything at current? No, you don't have to pay up.

He's a trade asset the second he's resigned, and we gain nothing by letting him walk. We still wouldn't have cap space, because Giannis and Middleton have huge, well deserved, contracts.

I could care less if whether we picked Jrue up on waivers or traded 3 firsts for him, he's a terrific player and asset. He'll be resigned, he's not going anywhere.

raferfenix · Post #1424 » by **raferfenix** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:55 pm

slos wrote:The fascination in Porzingis or Oladipo comes with the buy low status they currently have. You love it if one of these guys come to Milwaukee without touching our Jrue/Donte/Midds/Giannis core taking into account the limited assets we have left.

Idk if we could get Porzingis or Oladipo without putting Donte on the market.

Not saying we should trade him mind you. But we have such limited assets otherwise that it’s hard for me to see us making a major acquisition this season without Donte going out.

BroncoBuck · Post #1425 » by **BroncoBuck** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 10:58 pm

Damn, I was thinking a Luke Kornet for Torrey Craig deal could be a possibility, but the Bucks would be over by 50 grand.

DingleJerry · Post #1426 » by **DingleJerry** » Sat Feb 27, 2021 11:32 pm

ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:
So you want to let him get to free agency, and risk losing him for nothing?

Was not a fan of that trade, but at this point we're all in. He's still a borderline all-star player. We just have to pay up.

Sunk. Cost. Fallacy.

You want to throw the boat at a team that doesn't look like they can win anything at current? No, you don't have to pay up.

He's a trade asset the second he's resigned, and we gain nothing by letting him walk. We still wouldn't have cap space, because Giannis and Middleton have huge, well deserved, contracts.

I could care less if whether we picked Jrue up on waivers or traded 3 firsts for him, he's a terrific player and asset. He'll be resigned, he's not going anywhere.

Right, we don't have a choice but to sign him. I agree in general in that I don't think he's the fit to make the title happen. But he has to be signed so we can use him in the trade for the guy who does fit better. Example, Jrue + whatever for Beal. You can't give up that salary slot as we won't have the room to sign anyone with KM/Giannis contracts. Obviously I'd be a lot happier at 4/100 than for 130, but that's just not gonna happen in today's nba. It's not unlike the Brogdon mistake. They did a good job replacing him last year and the team was probably about equally as good, but just couldn't give up that player/contract to save a few bucks.

Basically, my guess is our last chance at getting a title team in the next 5 years will be a 2022 offseason trade of KM or Jrue for a different PG type star, whoever that might be. Or if that person doesn't come available we might just sit here kicking ourselves for 2019 for the next 20 years.

skones · Post #1427 » by **skones** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 12:35 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
paulpressey25 wrote:
So you want to let him get to free agency, and risk losing him for nothing?

Was not a fan of that trade, but at this point we're all in. He's still a borderline all-star player. We just have to pay up.

Sunk. Cost. Fallacy.

You want to throw the boat at a team that doesn't look like they can win anything at current? No, you don't have to pay up.

He's a trade asset the second he's resigned,

He's not. The second he's resigned teams will say, "That's a lot of money for a guy who's 31."

slappyg · Post #1428 » by **slappyg** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:01 am

Would love to get Lonzo on this team, was hoping we would when his value was lower. His 3 point shot is looking much better and his passing and bbiq would be a very nice complement to Giannis and Khris.

ShootingtheJ · Post #1429 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:15 am

skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
Sunk. Cost. Fallacy.

You want to throw the boat at a team that doesn't look like they can win anything at current? No, you don't have to pay up.

He's a trade asset the second he's resigned,

He's not. The second he's resigned teams will say, "That's a lot of money for a guy who's 31."

The net of the Chris Paul trade was 2- 1sts and 2- 2nds, and he was 35.

skones · Post #1430 » by **skones** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:24 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
He's a trade asset the second he's resigned,

He's not. The second he's resigned teams will say, "That's a lot of money for a guy who's 31."

The net of the Chris Paul trade was 2- 1sts and 2- 2nds, and he was 35.

I don't know why I need to say this, but Jrue Holiday isn't Chris Paul and he didn't have 4 years left on his deal. Need I remind you that Houston had to attach two firsts and two swaps just to downgrade to Russell Westbrook?

Khris Middleton had negative value on his new deal until he demonstrated he made a leap forward. Tobias Harris had negative value on his new deal. Jrue Holiday will be the same.

All The Bucks · Post #1431 » by **All The Bucks** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:47 am

Likely back tomorrow...

Read on Twitter

ShootingtheJ · Post #1432 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:49 am

skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
He's not. The second he's resigned teams will say, "That's a lot of money for a guy who's 31."

The net of the Chris Paul trade was 2- 1sts and 2- 2nds, and he was 35.

I don't know why I need to say this, but Jrue Holiday isn't Chris Paul and he didn't have 4 years left on his deal. Need I remind you that Houston had to attach two firsts and two swaps just to downgrade to Russell Westbrook?

Khris Middleton had negative value on his new deal until he demonstrated he made a leap forward. Tobias Harris had negative value on his new deal. Jrue Holiday will be the same.

Nothing you said here was true. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Houston thought Westbrook was better. KM and TB were never negative value.

skones · Post #1433 » by **skones** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 1:59 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
The net of the Chris Paul trade was 2- 1sts and 2- 2nds, and he was 35.

I don't know why I need to say this, but Jrue Holiday isn't Chris Paul and he didn't have 4 years left on his deal. Need I remind you that Houston had to attach two firsts and two swaps just to downgrade to Russell Westbrook?

Khris Middleton had negative value on his new deal until he demonstrated he made a leap forward. Tobias Harris had negative value on his new deal. Jrue Holiday will be the same.

Nothing you said here was true. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Houston thought Westbrook was better. KM and TB were never negative value.

No, everything I said was true. I legitimately lol'd at Jrue is better than Paul. Go ahead and take a peek at the Middleton and Harris deal threads on the GB and Trade Board.

ShootingtheJ · Post #1434 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:03 am

skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
I don't know why I need to say this, but Jrue Holiday isn't Chris Paul and he didn't have 4 years left on his deal. Need I remind you that Houston had to attach two firsts and two swaps just to downgrade to Russell Westbrook?

Khris Middleton had negative value on his new deal until he demonstrated he made a leap forward. Tobias Harris had negative value on his new deal. Jrue Holiday will be the same.

Nothing you said here was true. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Houston thought Westbrook was better. KM and TB were never negative value.

No, everything I said was true. I legitimately lol'd at Jrue is better than Paul. Go ahead and take a peek at the Middleton and Harris deal threads on the GB and Trade Board.

I don't need to look at what's said on trade board, that proves nothing, history does. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Just because you laugh doesn't mean you're right.

DingleJerry · Post #1435 » by **DingleJerry** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:06 am

I would probably agree a lot of teams will pause at Jrue's contract when we get to trade time. But a lot depends on how he plays. He won't be traded until 2022 at the earliest. Keep in mind at that point it'll be down to 3 years left (for sake of this convo assume the 4 yr 130ish deal he can sign now). Yes he'll be a year older but as long as he's healthy and plays normal next year he'll have only 3 left on his deal. While it might be too much money to be ideal, it's pretty much the norm for the NBA at this point. So, maybe 'asset' might be the wrong word but as long as he doesn't get hurt 3/95ish left for a 32 yr old borderline AS is fine. The key here is that you have to have the contract to trade, we have no choice, there would be no other route to a 3rd star unless you snag one with a late 1st for 2nd rd pick. They have no choice.

Get to the 5 year max though and I grit my teeth. But conversely, it's tough to say it's negative deal the minute he signs as presumably multiple teams would be offering the 4 year max.

Of course if they go two more years with him being healthy/fine then you're down to just 2 years left, which obviously isn't too tough to trade either. Bigger problem actually probably still comes down to we have no add-ons/sweeteners to improve him to a better fit/star.

skones · Post #1436 » by **skones** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:08 am

ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
Nothing you said here was true. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Houston thought Westbrook was better. KM and TB were never negative value.

No, everything I said was true. I legitimately lol'd at Jrue is better than Paul. Go ahead and take a peek at the Middleton and Harris deal threads on the GB and Trade Board.

I don't need to look at what's said on trade board, that proves nothing, history does. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Just because you laugh doesn't mean you're right.

Right, so you have a consensus opinion on these deals being negative, but they "don't matter." I again LOL'ed, all caps this time, at Jrue is better than Paul. It's hilarious you keep saying, "defense matters" like Chris Paul hasn't been named to 9 NBA All Defense teams in his career. You're painting him as some slouch on that end of the floor when he is certainly not. Chris Paul is world's better on the offensive end of the floor. Jrue is merely better on the defensive end.

Chris Paul at 35 years old, has Phoenix winning on a +20 win pace over last year. He legitimately wins wherever he goes, I don't know how you can possibly argue that Jrue Holiday is better, but here you are, and it's a joke.

MVP2110 · Post #1437 » by **MVP2110** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:08 am

If Jrue was a free agent how many teams would be offering him a max deal. Same with when Khris was a free agent. If that answer is more than just us then that immediately means the deal isn't negative value

ShootingtheJ · Post #1438 » by **ShootingtheJ** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:15 am

skones wrote:
ShootingtheJ wrote:
skones wrote:
No, everything I said was true. I legitimately lol'd at Jrue is better than Paul. Go ahead and take a peek at the Middleton and Harris deal threads on the GB and Trade Board.

I don't need to look at what's said on trade board, that proves nothing, history does. Jrue is better than Paul, defense matters. Just because you laugh doesn't mean you're right.

Right, so you have a consensus opinion on these deals being negative, but they "don't matter." I again LOL'ed, all caps this time, at Jrue is better than Paul. It's hilarious you keep saying, "defense matters" like Chris Paul hasn't been named to 9 NBA All Defense teams in his career. You're painting him as some slouch on that end of the floor when he is certainly not. Chris Paul is world's better on the offensive end of the floor. Jrue is merely better on the defensive end.

Chris Paul at 35 years old, has Phoenix winning on a +20 win pace over last year. He legitimately wins wherever he goes, I don't know how you can possibly argue that Jrue Holiday is better, but here you are, and it's a joke.

Dude, did Boston offer 3 firsts for Paul? Did Denver make a monster offer? At this point in there careers, Jrue is better.

DingleJerry · Post #1439 » by **DingleJerry** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:17 am

Not sure if that's a totally correct way to look at it. You have to remember he's 6ish years younger(and team acquiring is planning to sign/keep), that's a factor in terms of trade value which doesn't make it purely about who's better right now. I know if I was playing 1 playoff game today I'd take Paul. Generally speaking though, I'd say their ballpark the same level/tier at this point.

RRyder823 · Post #1440 » by **RRyder823** » Sun Feb 28, 2021 2:50 am

MVP2110 wrote:If Jrue was a free agent how many teams would be offering him a max deal. Same with when Khris was a free agent. If that answer is more than just us then that immediately means the deal isn't negative value

Stop useing logic. That kinda talk has no place in this discussion

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