Trade Targets (postcript on yesterday-other teams)

Licensed to Il · Post #4021 » by **Licensed to Il** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:54 pm

Ruzious, Henson is absolutely a better player (right now). But I think Kanter is a better prospect (with better defensive effort and more unselfish offense he could be an impact big).

I don't want it to seem like I think Kanter is a sure thing. Just the kind of young and underdeveloped big that teams never give up on early. Utah is about too, because of Goebert and Favors. I hope we are at least kicking the tires. If we decide he can't play Kidd's trapping defense or will never improve at moving the ball, I won't shed any tears. I'm just pointing out this is a rare opportunity.

KqWIN · Post #4022 » by **KqWIN** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 3:57 pm

The longer this drags out, the more I realize that his trade value is very low. Ersan for Kanter straight up might be a thing now.

BUCKSFORLIFE · Post #4023 » by **BUCKSFORLIFE** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:00 pm

Villanoeyebrows wrote:Ruzious, Henson is absolutely a better player (right now). But I think Kanter is a better prospect (with better defensive effort and more unselfish offense he could be an impact big).

I don't want it to seem like I think Kanter is a sure thing. Just the kind of young and underdeveloped big that teams never give up on early. Utah is about too, because of Goebert and Favors. I hope we are at least kicking the tires. If we decide he can't play Kidd's trapping defense or will never improve at moving the ball, I won't shed any tears. I'm just pointing out this is a rare opportunity.

So let's say we trade for him. He plays so, so for the rest of the season. He doesn't shine but he doesn't suck either. Then comes next year and some team offers him 8-10 million or more as a restricted free agent. Then what do we do? We wont know at that time if the risk is worth the reward. At the same time we will have given up some kind of asset to bring him here. It's just a big headache and not worth the risk. He apparently doesn't like to play defense or pass the ball. He also is willing to go public to demand a trade. Does not say much about his character. Looks like a me first kind of guy. This is not the kind of Big Man we should be looking for in my humble opinion.

mlloyd10 · Post #4024 » by **mlloyd10** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:00 pm

Matches Malone wrote:JOB/Ilyasova/Clips 1st for Stauskas/Thompson

Mentioned that last night - Get with it

ackypoo · Post #4025 » by **ackypoo** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:01 pm

KqWIN wrote:The longer this drags out, the more I realize that his trade value is very low. Ersan for Kanter straight up might be a thing now.

not a chance, but i really like the idea.

SkilesTheLimit · Post #4026 » by **SkilesTheLimit** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:02 pm

KqWIN wrote:The longer this drags out, the more I realize that his trade value is very low. Ersan for Kanter straight up might be a thing now.

Do you have inside knowledge of a pending deal of Kanter to MIL or is this all speculation?

Post #4027 » by **ReasonablySober** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:06 pm

Ruzious wrote:
Villanoeyebrows wrote:I like DH34Fan's proposal of Henson and the Clip's first for Kanter. That sounds rich on our end, but that Clips pick will likely be very average, and (though underwhelming to this point) young, mobile, bigs that can shoot don't ever come cheap. Kidd likes to run stuff where Zaza is screening and passing out of the high post, and Kanter has the range to really excel in that role. Obviously he is a terrible passer as of right now. So a lot of incentive for a move like this is to acquire versatile talent which you hope you can develop.

Henson's a better player, imo. His per minute stats are better, and he's a better defender.

Agreed.

We're giving up the pick, the more useful young talent and the one with another year on their contract to figure out if an extension is worth it.

If anything Utah should be the team giving up another asset in a Kanter/Henson deal.

KqWIN · Post #4028 » by **KqWIN** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:07 pm

ackypoo wrote:
KqWIN wrote:The longer this drags out, the more I realize that his trade value is very low. Ersan for Kanter straight up might be a thing now.

not a chance, but i really like the idea.

Not a chance on which side? If the Jazz can come away with a vet who they can count on to play 20 minutes I think they say yes. Kanter is not going to be part of our future. Ersan is a good fit for what Quin wants to do on offense.

raferfenix · Post #4029 » by **raferfenix** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:08 pm

Taking a risk on Kanter by giving up some manner of assets is one thing.

But that risk is exacerbated by how he is a RFA in the same summer where we at least appear poised to lock down new deals for Knight, Middleton and probably Dudley too.

I'd be very careful about what we offer for Kanter in trades as well in dollars if a deal goes down. If he isn't a great fit it could go very bad for us.

raferfenix · Post #4030 » by **raferfenix** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:11 pm

KqWIN wrote:Not a chance on which side? If the Jazz can come away with a vet who they can count on to play 20 minutes I think they say yes. Kanter is not going to be part of our future. Ersan is a good fit for what Quin wants to do on offense.

I want to believe this could happen but have a hard time seeing anyone counting on Ersan for anything after all his injuries.

ampd · Post #4031 » by **ampd** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:14 pm

raferfenix wrote:Taking a risk on Kanter by giving up some manner of assets is one thing.

But that risk is exacerbated by how he is a RFA in the same summer where we at least appear poised to lock down new deals for Knight, Middleton and probably Dudley too.

I'd be very careful about what we offer for Kanter in trades as well in dollars if a deal goes down. If he isn't a great fit it could go very bad for us.

locking those 3 in for 30 million is a risk no doubt. I actually think Knight and Middleton are the kind of high character guys that are very unlikely to dog it after getting paid. Kanter I don't know. Paying Henson big money gives me nightmares

Newz · Post #4032 » by **Newz** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:14 pm

ReasonablySober wrote:
Ruzious wrote:
Villanoeyebrows wrote:I like DH34Fan's proposal of Henson and the Clip's first for Kanter. That sounds rich on our end, but that Clips pick will likely be very average, and (though underwhelming to this point) young, mobile, bigs that can shoot don't ever come cheap. Kidd likes to run stuff where Zaza is screening and passing out of the high post, and Kanter has the range to really excel in that role. Obviously he is a terrible passer as of right now. So a lot of incentive for a move like this is to acquire versatile talent which you hope you can develop.

Henson's a better player, imo. His per minute stats are better, and he's a better defender.

Agreed.

We're giving up the pick, the more useful young talent and the one with another year on their contract to figure out if an extension is worth it.

If anything Utah should be the team giving up another asset in a Kanter/Henson deal.

Henson is two years older than Kanter. You guys should probably factor that in as well when it comes to production.

I just don't think either of them are all that great. I don't think Henson or Kanter is going to be a major difference maker going forward, so I'd probably just keep Henson as opposed to dealing for Kanter.

Shaffty · Post #4033 » by **Shaffty** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:15 pm

I actually think we shouldn't make any trades. I'd rather have Henson and Middleton than most of the other guys out there. Just ride with your guys and hope we become the Hawks, with a HOF in Giannis

Treebeard · Post #4034 » by **Treebeard** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:17 pm

Has anyone proposed an odds of any trade happening vs no trades poll? Or, what's the likelihood of any specific players being traded before the deadline?

Matches Malone · Post #4035 » by **Matches Malone** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:17 pm

mlloyd10 wrote:
Matches Malone wrote:JOB/Ilyasova/Clips 1st for Stauskas/Thompson

Mentioned that last night - Get with it

You post trades every other second. How am I suppose to keep up? lol

SkilesTheLimit · Post #4036 » by **SkilesTheLimit** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:18 pm

ampd wrote:
raferfenix wrote:Taking a risk on Kanter by giving up some manner of assets is one thing.

But that risk is exacerbated by how he is a RFA in the same summer where we at least appear poised to lock down new deals for Knight, Middleton and probably Dudley too.

I'd be very careful about what we offer for Kanter in trades as well in dollars if a deal goes down. If he isn't a great fit it could go very bad for us.

Paying Henson big money gives me nightmares

I would not give Henson a big extension. He's had 4 head coaches and the only time he's gotten consistent minutes is when the starting C was out for personal reasons/injury.

There's got to be a reason why. Plus, he has no offensive game and frankly, I dislike him defensively too as he gets thrown around too much in the post and doesn't rebound very well.

M-C-G · Post #4037 » by **M-C-G** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:20 pm

mlloyd10 wrote:
M-C-G wrote:Looking at WT,

Suns - too many guards need scoring and rebounding big man
Jazz - unhappy big man that scores and rebounds

Kanter/Burke for Ennis/Plumlee/Green??

Dont see how that help either - Suns will get another guard that needs minutes

Llyod, totally disagree. Burke hasn't done anything to really suggest he deserves minutes, any more than JOB (unless Burke has picked it up as late)...He is in the deal as a cheap controllable asset.

We already know PHX has been shopping Green and Plumlee, the Ennis<>Burke swap just adds some extra incentive for Utah to do the deal.

tski1972 · Post #4038 » by **tski1972** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:22 pm

curious what the board thinks of Kosta Koufos. He's an unrestricted FA after the season and I can't see Memphis being able to keep him if they pay Gasol. While older than Kanter, I think he'd fit into what the Bucks are doing better than Kanter would.

I'd rather wait to sign him after the season then trade for Kanter.

ampd · Post #4039 » by **ampd** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:25 pm

Shaffty wrote:I actually think we shouldn't make any trades. I'd rather have Henson and Middleton than most of the other guys out there. Just ride with your guys and hope we become the Hawks, with a HOF in Giannis

I just want someone who can rebound. They don't have to be a big target.

ackypoo · Post #4040 » by **ackypoo** » Thu Feb 12, 2015 4:26 pm

KqWIN wrote:
ackypoo wrote:
KqWIN wrote:The longer this drags out, the more I realize that his trade value is very low. Ersan for Kanter straight up might be a thing now.

not a chance, but i really like the idea.

Not a chance on which side? If the Jazz can come away with a vet who they can count on to play 20 minutes I think they say yes. Kanter is not going to be part of our future. Ersan is a good fit for what Quin wants to do on offense.

i dont see the jazz taking ersan, solely, without asking for other assets back. and at that point i dont see the bucks doing that.

i think kanter will go somewhere, just not milwaukee.

i dont think kanter is any happier in milwaukee, but i think hed be a good fit, and straight up for ersan, i think its a pretty no risk move.