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My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas

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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#61 » by Drake_02 » Wed May 9, 2012 3:36 pm

CPT wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:
sanity wrote:Schneider is still an option... perhaps even Luongo, but I think its obvious the Canucks will deal 1 of them. If I"m the Leafs, I'd deal anyone on the roster for a legit #1 goalie. Thomas I'd also like. Given the way Burke constructed this roster from the blue-line out, we need actual goaltending before we can really worry about our scoring/forwards situation.

Luongo has to much of a cap hit, for to long of a time, and that will handicap this team. Kind of like Komisarek, Lombardi,Connolly and Armstrong.


Except he has elite ability for his position, which none of those guys have.

He may never get back to his old form, but last year he was still in the top half of starters in GAA and SV%.

I'd take a shot at him if the price is right.

His stats were so great because he was on a great team. If he was on the leafs, I think he would only be able to get 35 wins.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#62 » by whysoserious » Wed May 9, 2012 4:57 pm

Drake_02 wrote:His stats were so great because he was on a great team. If he was on the leafs, I think he would only be able to get 35 wins.


The Leafs won 35 games this year with Reimer and Monster. Luongo is a significant upgrade over those two. Goaltending is not the only issue with this team but please don't make it like Luongo had nothing to do with Vancouver's success. He was a key part of their success over the years. The guy get's too much blame for Vancouver not winning a Cup.

He is inifinitely better than Reimer and Monster.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#63 » by Drake_02 » Wed May 9, 2012 7:23 pm

whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:His stats were so great because he was on a great team. If he was on the leafs, I think he would only be able to get 35 wins.


The Leafs won 35 games this year with Reimer and Monster. Luongo is a significant upgrade over those two. Goaltending is not the only issue with this team but please don't make it like Luongo had nothing to do with Vancouver's success. He was a key part of their success over the years. The guy get's too much blame for Vancouver not winning a Cup.

He is inifinitely better than Reimer and Monster.

I guarantee that next year Luongo only gets 35 wins. His career is on the decline. He's been getting less games, so If he were to come to Toronto this guy is going to play 60 games, and IMO he can't handle that.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#64 » by whysoserious » Wed May 9, 2012 7:58 pm

Drake_02 wrote:I guarantee that next year Luongo only gets 35 wins. His career is on the decline. He's been getting less games, so If he were to come to Toronto this guy is going to play 60 games, and IMO he can't handle that.


And combined Monster and Reimer and Scrivens got us 35 wins. So clearly he's better. There's no indication he's playing less games, the guy is 33, not 39 or 40.

Is he on the decline? Sure, but he's still hands down way better than anything we have and with him this team is a playoff team.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#65 » by Drake_02 » Wed May 9, 2012 8:40 pm

whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:I guarantee that next year Luongo only gets 35 wins. His career is on the decline. He's been getting less games, so If he were to come to Toronto this guy is going to play 60 games, and IMO he can't handle that.


And combined Monster and Reimer and Scrivens got us 35 wins. So clearly he's better. There's no indication he's playing less games, the guy is 33, not 39 or 40.

Is he on the decline? Sure, but he's still hands down way better than anything we have and with him this team is a playoff team.

I think the Team he goes to will overplay him. There's a reason why he didn't get to 60 games this season. Some of it has to do with the play of Scheinder. But a bigger part is his play. I would not feel comfortable having him play 60+ games.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#66 » by whysoserious » Thu May 10, 2012 10:44 am

Drake_02 wrote:I think the Team he goes to will overplay him. There's a reason why he didn't get to 60 games this season. Some of it has to do with the play of Scheinder. But a bigger part is his play. I would not feel comfortable having him play 60+ games.


The guy was hurt for a bit, played 55 games, won 31 games this past season, had a .919 save percentage and 2.41 GAA....doesn't sound too bad to me and still a million times better than what we got from our goalies.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#67 » by Drake_02 » Thu May 10, 2012 4:02 pm

whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:I think the Team he goes to will overplay him. There's a reason why he didn't get to 60 games this season. Some of it has to do with the play of Scheinder. But a bigger part is his play. I would not feel comfortable having him play 60+ games.


The guy was hurt for a bit, played 55 games, won 31 games this past season, had a .919 save percentage and 2.41 GAA....doesn't sound too bad to me and still a million times better than what we got from our goalies.

Still, the age, and the price he might come at. I don't want to get rid of a decent player/prospect for luongo, especially when there's a guy like Vokun out there who could be had for 1 million bucks.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#68 » by YogiStewart » Thu May 10, 2012 5:09 pm

know what else won't surprise me?
Reimer and Vokuhn.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#69 » by Drake_02 » Thu May 10, 2012 5:47 pm

YogiStewart wrote:know what else won't surprise me?
Reimer and Vokuhn.

It wouldn't surprise a lot of people.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#70 » by whysoserious » Thu May 10, 2012 11:17 pm

Drake_02 wrote:Still, the age, and the price he might come at. I don't want to get rid of a decent player/prospect for luongo, especially when there's a guy like Vokun out there who could be had for 1 million bucks.


Age, 32 and still in his prime. Price tag is still in the average for a good goaltender, cap hit is decent and pay at the end is minimal. We are two CBA's away from his last years under the deal, the cap does nothing but go up ever since it's adoption.

The problem has been for the Leafs that they keep going for cheaper alternatives, here you have a chance to get what is still one of the better goalies in the league. I wouldn't give up a ton for him, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't go after him. He'd easily be the best goalie since Ed Belfour and that was a guy coming towards the end of his career. This is a guy on the tail end of his prime, not end of career yet.

BTW, Cujo was signed here when he was 32 and did nothing but great things and helped this team get to the playoffs every year he was here.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#71 » by Drake_02 » Fri May 11, 2012 12:35 am

whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:Still, the age, and the price he might come at. I don't want to get rid of a decent player/prospect for luongo, especially when there's a guy like Vokun out there who could be had for 1 million bucks.


Age, 32 and still in his prime. Price tag is still in the average for a good goaltender, cap hit is decent and pay at the end is minimal. We are two CBA's away from his last years under the deal, the cap does nothing but go up ever since it's adoption.

The problem has been for the Leafs that they keep going for cheaper alternatives, here you have a chance to get what is still one of the better goalies in the league. I wouldn't give up a ton for him, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't go after him. He'd easily be the best goalie since Ed Belfour and that was a guy coming towards the end of his career. This is a guy on the tail end of his prime, not end of career yet.

BTW, Cujo was signed here when he was 32 and did nothing but great things and helped this team get to the playoffs every year he was here.

You think a team like Tampa Bay won't give up a first rounder for Luongo? They will. I don't see the point on doing this when the Leafs think Reimer is their future, and all you need is a one year veteran. Whats the point on taking Luongo and his Cap hit? I know he is a great goaltender, but this guy is not going to be a long term Peice. There's no point on giving up a asset for a guy like Luongo when you could just use 1 million bucks for a guy like Vokun.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#72 » by Drake_02 » Fri May 11, 2012 1:51 am

Random thought: What about Evander Kane? Great forward and is a RFA this year. A trade could be worked out.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#73 » by Crowned » Fri May 11, 2012 3:47 am

Drake_02 wrote:
whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:Still, the age, and the price he might come at. I don't want to get rid of a decent player/prospect for luongo, especially when there's a guy like Vokun out there who could be had for 1 million bucks.


Age, 32 and still in his prime. Price tag is still in the average for a good goaltender, cap hit is decent and pay at the end is minimal. We are two CBA's away from his last years under the deal, the cap does nothing but go up ever since it's adoption.

The problem has been for the Leafs that they keep going for cheaper alternatives, here you have a chance to get what is still one of the better goalies in the league. I wouldn't give up a ton for him, but that doesn't mean you shouldn't go after him. He'd easily be the best goalie since Ed Belfour and that was a guy coming towards the end of his career. This is a guy on the tail end of his prime, not end of career yet.

BTW, Cujo was signed here when he was 32 and did nothing but great things and helped this team get to the playoffs every year he was here.

You think a team like Tampa Bay won't give up a first rounder for Luongo? They will. I don't see the point on doing this when the Leafs think Reimer is their future, and all you need is a one year veteran. Whats the point on taking Luongo and his Cap hit? I know he is a great goaltender, but this guy is not going to be a long term Peice. There's no point on giving up a asset for a guy like Luongo when you could just use 1 million bucks for a guy like Vokun.


Tampa isn't going to send a first for Loungo, they'll have to send salary back as well. He's a fit there, but it won't be easy working something out.

Vokoun won't sign for a million dollars, he'll get more than that.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#74 » by Crowned » Fri May 11, 2012 3:49 am

Drake_02 wrote:Random thought: What about Evander Kane? Great forward and is a RFA this year. A trade could be worked out.


Why on earth would Winnipeg trade Evander Kane?
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#75 » by whysoserious » Fri May 11, 2012 12:22 pm

Drake_02 wrote:[You think a team like Tampa Bay won't give up a first rounder for Luongo? They will. I don't see the point on doing this when the Leafs think Reimer is their future, and all you need is a one year veteran. Whats the point on taking Luongo and his Cap hit? I know he is a great goaltender, but this guy is not going to be a long term Peice. There's no point on giving up a asset for a guy like Luongo when you could just use 1 million bucks for a guy like Vokun.


You pointed out Luongos Cap hit but it's actually comparable for a top goaltender. Then you pointed to his age, and he's only 32/33. Then you pointed out he can't play 60 games but he played 55 games and won 31 and missed time for some injuries. The guy has good numbers, is still a good goalie and then you point to the team he had, well he saved that teams bacon plenty of times this past season and helped get that team to the finals last year.

You can make all the predictions you want, but you really have no basis for them so far in Luongo's career. The guy gets an unfair amount of flack from many different angles. He is one of the better goalies in the league, at 32/33 he's got about 5 good years left and in the last 20 years, one of our most successful runs was when we signed a 32 year old goaltender.

Reimer has proven and shown he's not good enough, neither is Monster so you your solution is to get a one year gap and be right back in the same position next year we've been in for years.

I'm not even saying we should get Luongo, but to dismiss him is an absolute joke to me and typical of many Leaf fans. There are many options out there and the Leafs should explore everyone of them. My preference would be to target Bernier/Schneider first and then work backwards.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#76 » by Drake_02 » Fri May 11, 2012 6:26 pm

Crowned wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:Random thought: What about Evander Kane? Great forward and is a RFA this year. A trade could be worked out.


Why on earth would Winnipeg trade Evander Kane?

Maybe because he is a RFA, and they might not feel that they can re-sign him. He would bring a lot in return to Winnipeg.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#77 » by Drake_02 » Fri May 11, 2012 6:46 pm

whysoserious wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:[You think a team like Tampa Bay won't give up a first rounder for Luongo? They will. I don't see the point on doing this when the Leafs think Reimer is their future, and all you need is a one year veteran. Whats the point on taking Luongo and his Cap hit? I know he is a great goaltender, but this guy is not going to be a long term Peice. There's no point on giving up a asset for a guy like Luongo when you could just use 1 million bucks for a guy like Vokun.


You pointed out Luongos Cap hit but it's actually comparable for a top goaltender. Then you pointed to his age, and he's only 32/33. Then you pointed out he can't play 60 games but he played 55 games and won 31 and missed time for some injuries. The guy has good numbers, is still a good goalie and then you point to the team he had, well he saved that teams bacon plenty of times this past season and helped get that team to the finals last year.

You can make all the predictions you want, but you really have no basis for them so far in Luongo's career. The guy gets an unfair amount of flack from many different angles. He is one of the better goalies in the league, at 32/33 he's got about 5 good years left and in the last 20 years, one of our most successful runs was when we signed a 32 year old goaltender.

Reimer has proven and shown he's not good enough, neither is Monster so you your solution is to get a one year gap and be right back in the same position next year we've been in for years.

I'm not even saying we should get Luongo, but to dismiss him is an absolute joke to me and typical of many Leaf fans. There are many options out there and the Leafs should explore everyone of them. My preference would be to target Bernier/Schneider first and then work backwards.

What I said before was that he would win 35 games. If he can't win 35 games with the Canucks, how is he going to win 35 games with the Leafs? The Canucks are a way better team than the Leafs. Even with Luongo, this team isn't a cup contender. This team only turns into a Playoff team.

No, he probably doesn't have 5 years left. He probably has 3 years left. Im basing that on how the average NHL goalie performs when they are 35+. Most 35+ goalies are backups and not a teams number one goalie.

Im not dismissing the possibility of getting Luongo, but with the Options this year, Like Bernier,Vokun,Schneider,Clemmensen, why get Luongo? I think you think that Luongo will come pretty cheap. I think it will take a first rounder/decent player and a decent prospect. Like you have stated, Luongo is a great goaltender, so why would he come at such a cheap price. You have said that you dont mind the cap hit, and there is plenty of years left on that contract, but still, a great goaltender is a great goaltender.

Luongo gets a unfair amount of flack because he hasn't proved anything. Great, you had a great regular season, but that doesn't matter when your in the playoffs. Look at boston, and now the Rangers could be eliminated. It doesn't matter what you have done in your career, it matters if you won the cup or not, and Luongo has not won the cup.

My solution is too to get a mentor for Reimer. BB has said this kid is the real deal, so I think with the one year of veteran presence, Reimer will develop and then in 2013-2014 season, all we need to do is look for a backup.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#78 » by whysoserious » Fri May 11, 2012 7:23 pm

Drake_02 wrote:What I said before was that he would win 35 games. If he can't win 35 games with the Canucks, how is he going to win 35 games with the Leafs? The Canucks are a way better team than the Leafs. Even with Luongo, this team isn't a cup contender. This team only turns into a Playoff team.


He didn’t win 35 games, he won 31 out of his 55 starts, that’s pretty damn good. If he plays in 5 more games you don’t think he gets to your supposed 35 win benchmark? Seriously, what is this arbitrary benchmark you’ve made? Obviously Vancouver is a better team than us but that doesn’t mean he loses value in being part of it. His last 6 seasons, 47 wins, 35 wins, 33 wins, 40 wins, 38 wins, and 31 wins….so where exactly is this call out to slow down.

Toronto is not Vancouver so he might not win a lot of games, but who knows, other than this tailspin this team was still finding ways to win, add an elite goalie and who knows where he and the team go.

Drake_02 wrote:No, he probably doesn't have 5 years left. He probably has 3 years left. Im basing that on how the average NHL goalie performs when they are 35+. Most 35+ goalies are backups and not a teams number one goalie.


Where is this 3 year mark, many elite goalies have played past the 35 wins. There’s a 40 year old goalie helping a team reach the conference finals. And Luongo was in the SC finals just last year.
Tim Thomas never won more than 35 games and led a team to the finals at the age of 37, it’s not unreasonable to think Luongo’s got a good 5 years left in him if not more. Where as you’re just making up a number of 3 years left with no basis.

Drake_02 wrote:Im not dismissing the possibility of getting Luongo, but with the Options this year, Like Bernier,Vokun,Schneider,Clemmensen, why get Luongo? I think you think that Luongo will come pretty cheap. I think it will take a first rounder/decent player and a decent prospect. Like you have stated, Luongo is a great goaltender, so why would he come at such a cheap price. You have said that you dont mind the cap hit, and there is plenty of years left on that contract, but still, a great goaltender is a great goaltender.


Bernier and Schneider will cost more but are younger – Def worth a look. Clemmensen and Vokoun are nothing but stop gaps and don’t do the kind of change necessary. Luongo may not come cheap or he may. You’ve made up the price tag but there’s nothing to base that on yet. It’s gonna be difficult for Vancouver to move him because of the length and money, and what other teams cap situations are. Plus teams know Vancouver is possibly looking at change, so assets may be tougher for them to demand. We shall see. Plus you never addressed my point about this coming CBA and the one after. He could very well be amnestied out of the next CBA if that’s in there. And the cap keeps going up making his hit less and less of an issue over time.

Drake_02 wrote:Luongo gets a unfair amount of flack because he hasn't proved anything. Great, you had a great regular season, but that doesn't matter when your in the playoffs. Look at boston, and now the Rangers could be eliminated. It doesn't matter what you have done in your career, it matters if you won the cup or not, and Luongo has not won the cup.


There’s no guarantee no matter what goalie you have. But I’d rather take a chance with one of the better ones in the league than going with an unproven one thinking we’re catching lightning in a bottle. Isn’t that what we tried this year and look what happened.

Drake_02 wrote:My solution is too to get a mentor for Reimer. BB has said this kid is the real deal, so I think with the one year of veteran presence, Reimer will develop and then in 2013-2014 season, all we need to do is look for a backup.


Your solution is flawed and Reimer has proven less than Luongo yet you’d go with him and some vet help and not take a chance on a proven goalie that can get you to the playoffs as opposed to one that has yet to make the playoffs.

I’m not saying go full court on Luongo, but it’s foolish to me to say we’ll pass, especially with the reasons you’ve listed so far.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#79 » by MoeMoney » Sun May 13, 2012 5:25 am

YogiStewart wrote:Check it out and tell me if I'm wrong.

Here's the quick summary as to why I think it makes sense.

First, if Boston goes out in the first round, there will be changes. They need to upgrade in some areas (probably 1 more top d-man and some more scoring talent up front).
They are stacked at the goalie position so they can deal from a position of strength. You keep your younger goalie, who has more long-term promise, and you trade your higher-paid veteran who may only have a few years left.

They're also likely some hard feeling against Thomas. The Bruins started to lose shortly around the White House visit controversy. Thomas's goaltending also started to suffer around then.

We all know how Burke likes his Americans, so Thomas fits the bill (sorry, but Burke does). and how many other teams need a top-notch goaltender? the Lightening, maybe the Oilers, maybe the Blackhawks? The Wings need a goalie upgrade but they will probably stick with Howard.

The only flaw to my theory is: what's Thomas's value and do the Leafs have anything to send back? I'd argue that a goalie prospect, a b-level d prospect and a 2nd round draft pick would get it done. even that may be too steep. Thomas has 1 year left on his contract (at $3 million) so he's a rental goalie of sorts. and an affordable one.

Think about it...


LOL off that pedestal dude...that is definitely NOT going to happen...it defies logic and all your points mean nothing...sorry.
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Re: My thought: Leafs will go after Tim Thomas 

Post#80 » by whysoserious » Sun May 13, 2012 9:25 pm

Drake_02 wrote:
Crowned wrote:
Drake_02 wrote:Random thought: What about Evander Kane? Great forward and is a RFA this year. A trade could be worked out.


Why on earth would Winnipeg trade Evander Kane?

Maybe because he is a RFA, and they might not feel that they can re-sign him. He would bring a lot in return to Winnipeg.


What has been stated that shows that Winnipeg may feel like they can't re-sign him? You're just making up speculation based on nothing in reality.

Would every team including the Leafs love to have an Evander Kane? Absolutely, but there's nothing to suggest there's any sort of play for him. Winnipeg seems to actually be ahead of us and would re-sign him in a heartbeat.

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