Offseason Thread: The Waiting is the Hardest Part

[Jalen Bluntson]

Why is Vonleh still under contract for 20-21 in this scenario?

Joakim Noah?

Ugh

[BowlRips]

Jalen usually knows...

[dakomish23]

Joakim Noah?

Ugh

I keep blocking this out

[iLLmatic860]

How can Max Kellerman consider himself a New Yorker and continuously say that the Nets fanbase can take over New York.


I really cant tell if hes dead serious or trying to stick with his gimmick lol

[Deeeez Knicks]

Even if we don’t like the ’20 or ’21 free agent class at this moment, we can keep our flexibility open and make it easier for trades. There are always stars becoming available for trades. It makes it easier when you have cap space or mangeable contracts.

[HEZI]

We gonna max out a damaged KD

We deserve it though. I hope he got a nice suit game

[drekwins]

I see people falling into the trap of:

"THIS IS THE BIG FA YEAR! IF THE KNICKS DON'T SPEND IT NOW, ALL THE FUTURE FA YEARS SUCK"

This is the mentality that led to maxing out Alan Houston with no competition. That had the Knicks decide Eddy Curry was "worth it". Throwing cash as undeserving guys like Eisely, Anderson, Jeffries, Big Snacks. Trading for Bargs because "THE TEAM HAS TO WIN NOW WITH MELO!!!" Trading all the young guys for Melo because the "HE MIGHT SIGN WITH THE NETS!!!". Yes, I know they'd have to have gotten rid of guys to fit him in. Fine, they could have traded them.

I'm not going to rehash the entire, roughly 16 year sordid history of the Knicks feeling they "have to make moves" and perhaps the sorts of people within the fanbase that works for.

F*ck that approach.

Nothing good in FA? Save the money. Keep rolling it over. I could personally give a f*ck if they don't spend it for 5 years.
That's a bit extreme, but I know the extreme alternative hasn't worked for 16 years.
Is there a place where some signings could happen - some iterative steps, but maintain a max slot after? Sure. But those have to be done VERY carefully.

Yeah, I see people using this as a reason to overpay for guys like Randle or DLo, or still give KD with one leg 40 mil a year

I guarantee you, if you go back 2 years and look at the consensus of the board, none of us would think we'd be in a position to sign KD and either Kyrie or Kawhi, or really anyone now. But then, this year, we start getting linked to guys and stuff. Obviously it hasn't happened yet and might not happen, but that's no reason to panic spend

That's why we went out and overpaid for THJ, cause we didn't think we'd have a use for that money. I'll admit, I had that mindset too with him, but as we all know, that turned into a mistake

I think it's fair to say DLo is comparable to THJ, not because they're similar talent levels, but because you're essentially overpaying a guy for 1 good year and assuming he's gonna continue to improve cause he's young. While DLo is better than Tim was, we'd also be paying him significantly more, and if he never improves, he's gonna end up another deadweight contract. And just cause right now we don't see anyone we'd spend that money on regardless doesn't mean they won't be there in the future

You never know what's gonna happen, so you should always retain flexibility is my position

IMO, I think that DLO is more comparable to Beal signing for the max... which was very questionable at the time. John Wall (who is incredibly selfish with money), was pissed off and had a lot of outspoken quotes.

THJ's deal is different because he just didn't have near the talent level. DLO actually has the potential to make his deal look like a bargain. He is already a Top 10 PG, an all-star, been to the playoffs and amongst the best young PGs in the league. It's also rare to get a shot at a 23 year old after their rookie deal. The next time we go after a PG, they're likely to be 7-8 years in and closer to 26-28 years old.

[god shammgod]

i feel like a lot of you love russel because he plays locally and you see him a lot. if you listed the best players 25 and under he's not top 20.

[snadler]

Bondy-The Knicks are not expected to be in the mix for Russell or Harris. New York still believes it’s in the hunt for Kawhi Leonard, Irving and Durant. But, according to a source, the Knicks will punt their $70 million-plus in cap space if they can’t land one of those Tier A free agents. In other words, they’ll use the money to lock in one-year deals and do this all over again in 2020 when Anthony Davis, DeMar DeRozan, Draymond Green, Ben Simmons (restricted) and Pascal Siakam (restricted) hit the market.

[snadler]

All this wasted talk on DLo when the Knicks aren’t even interested

[Deeeez Knicks]

How can Max Kellerman consider himself a New Yorker and continuously say that the Nets fanbase can take over New York.


I really cant tell if hes dead serious or trying to stick with his gimmick lol

I doubt he believes that but he just tries to say stuff that's controversial like all the other talking heads.

[knickstape4ever]

Read on Twitter

The Knicks are not expected to be in the mix for Russell or Harris. New York still believes it’s in the hunt for Kawhi Leonard, Irving and Durant. But, according to a source, the Knicks will punt their $70 million-plus in cap space if they can’t land one of those Tier A free agents. In other words, they’ll use the money to lock in one-year deals and do this all over again in 2020 when Anthony Davis, DeMar DeRozan, Draymond Green, Ben Simmons (restricted) and Pascal Siakam (restricted) hit the market.

[HEZI]

We are going after Demar and Draymond Green if we fail to land a big star this summer? Lol

Oh this is good now. Forget DLo we need big fish like Demar and Draymond. Y'all wanted this

[Fury]

i feel like a lot of you love russel because he plays locally and you see him a lot. if you listed the best players 25 and under he's not top 20.

25 and under? Think he is, man

[iLLmatic860]

Bondy-The Knicks are not expected to be in the mix for Russell or Harris. New York still believes it’s in the hunt for Kawhi Leonard, Irving and Durant. But, according to a source, the Knicks will punt their $70 million-plus in cap space if they can’t land one of those Tier A free agents. In other words, they’ll use the money to lock in one-year deals and do this all over again in 2020 when Anthony Davis, DeMar DeRozan, Draymond Green, Ben Simmons (restricted) and Pascal Siakam (restricted) hit the market.

Jesus that draft class is terrible. A Demar and Draymond led free agency. Lol

[god shammgod]

the sham plan is still in the works. i salute them if they follow through. foh with your d'lo talk.

[drekwins]

Hopefully DSJ has a Randle/DLO-esqe year. 18-20 points and 7-8 assists per game. That could change our outlook considerably when trying to acquire talent. He has the ability to put up those numbers.

[DOT]

i feel like a lot of you love russel because he plays locally and you see him a lot. if you listed the best players 25 and under he's not top 20.

Giannis
Embiid
Beal
Booker
Towns
Doncic
Jokic
Fox
Simmons
Ayton
Tatum
Murray
Siakam

That's what, 13? Definitely better, not counting guys in this draft. I guess you could say he's top 20, but it gets pretty nebulous after like 10

[VCBC]

I also can't believe how easily people forget that cap space represents something other than a spot for FA's to occupy.

How soon people forget.

Don't worry, if the Knicks max out sub max cat guys and later people bitch about how the Knicks couldn't get in on certain trades when stud players became available, I'll be sure to remind you. Often.

Homegrown homers didn't want AD, no chance they want to trade the amazing eventual cap casualities DSJ, Knox and Frank for a disgruntled stud

[thebuzzardman]

Thanks for spelling that out, I always forget who is potentially due, when.


Let's keep in mind that cap space isn't only for FA. The amount of space a team is under the cap facilitates other moves, whether being able to conduct lobsided trades (still under the cap post trade) or being able to absorb some star player into a max slot. Or even being close to a max slot, but having a player or two easily shed.

yeah. no long-term salary commitments to the unworthy while we're still on a rebuild timeline.

we have another season of control even after this one for the 2017 draftees. so having cap space allows you to be ready to capitalize on all kinds of opportunities.

not loving 2020 FA class though. so we have another impasse even if we love these guys. their cap holds come into play a la KP in 2021 FA.

Cap holds do become an issue eventually. This is one of the main reasons why I only really love Mitch, RJ and Dotson on our roster. They're all either rookie deals or very reasonable. As far as DSJ, Knox and Frank... they're going to be salary cap casualties unless they really show something major. Even so, it'll probably only help to increase their values so we could trade them to another team.

Very good point.

Don't think it's an accident the following things are happening.

That the Knicks are looking at sh*t ton of young athletic guys, some are PG's and some are wings. All sorts of guys on the GLeague team and various options around UDFA, GLeague etc with tallish PG's, or shooting PG's etc

Look at the summer league team,minus the drafted guys or last year and also recall Kadeem and Jenkins

Kadeem - cheap, PG, plays defense, decent midrange
Jenkins - shooter, hustles on D
Iggy - Tall, semi athletic, hustles, can shoot
Wilkes - tall, athletic, decent shooter, defensive issues (can he fix them)
Peters - short, athletic, can shoot it
VJJ King - tall athletic wing
Zak Irvin - tall PG
Amir Hinton - tall PG


The Knicks are filling their development pipeline of guys who could replace DSJr, Frank, Trier, Dotson, even Knox, at cheap prices

Please people, don't be dense and think I think all these guys will pan out or are better than DSJr etc. It's that they have a bunch of chances that a tall athletic wing or tall PG will pan - about 8 chances, or 1 in 4 for a PG or SG/SF, and also 6 picks in 4 years, or whatever it is.

Trust me, the Knicks will be getting out from under rookies going on 2nd deals with cap hits with the quickness.

I like Frank. I like DSJr. I expect a good chance neither one lasts first this offseason, then past next year. Knox? Who knows. But they've already started their hedge. They even have options if Trier or Dotson cross a cost/performance line