SacKingZZZ wrote:c3j3h wrote:SacKingZZZ wrote:
I'm saying it could surely factor in, in particular in the potential of losing him for nothing, but the plan remains the same as it has been, start winning and show Cousins this can work. That's the only true way.
Wait are you the guy that told me that Courtney Lee and Solomon Hill would make a better defensive combo than Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green? This is starting to make a lot more sense.
Gonna go ahead and bow out of this now...
Wait a minute, this is bowing out twice then because you did it the last time
I showed you the stats that proved both Hill and Lee had a higher DFG% than Green.
OK, this comment and your other one are dumb enough that you brought me back just to shut you up.
The bolded part of your post almost makes me feel bad about the complete dismantling of your argument that is about to follow this sentence, as it makes me think that you don't even understand what it is we're talking about here. Having a higher DFG% is a BAD thing. That means that their opponents make more shots against Hill and Lee than they do against Danny Green, which just proves my point. Here, let me explain a bit further.
First of all, to address your other post directed at me, I've never posted on RealGM before. I created this account right around draft day (I think) and have no other accounts. I post about the Kings on SacTown Royalty and on Reddit, with a similar username, and have been doing so for years. I have no idea what the hell you're talking about, but given the Courtney Lee/Solomon Hill thing I don't think you do either.
About that. I didn't respond to you last time because I thought you were trolling me. It's such a stupid argument that I didn't think you could possibly serious. In fact, I remember mentioning it to a friend of mine and he didn't believe that I had actually found a real person who believed that.
So here ya go. I'm assuming that you're not dumb enough to argue that Solomon Hill is somehow a better defender than Kawhi Leonard, right? Here's some comparisons just in case you don't think winning the Defensive Player of the Year award 2 years in a row is enough proof:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=leonaka01&p2=hillso01&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=leonaka01&y1=2016&p2=hillso01&y2=2016&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=I went ahead and included a comparison of their careers head to head, as well as last season alone head to head. If you take a look, you will notice that Kawhi beats Solomon Hill in literally every single defensive metric measurable. In fact, Kawhi is better at almost every single measurable statistic period. I'll assume you don't need me to break that down any further.
Now, since we're discussing defensive duos here, I'm assuming that the crux of your argument essentially boils down to Coutney Lee being a better defender than Danny Green, correct? Seeing how Kawhi and Hill are SFs and Green and Lee and SGs, that seems like a logical assessment to make. But then again, I wouldn't describe any of the arguments you have made as logical so...who knows? I'll run with it anyway.
Here is Danny Green's career vs Courtney Lee's career.
Before I get started on explaining to you how wrong you are, let's first note a couple of minor differences between the 2 players.
First of all, Danny Green is 2 years younger than Courtney Lee, and has played 1 fewer season.
Second of all, Danny Green barely played at all as a youngster. He appeared in a grand total of 28 games over his 1st 2 seasons in the NBA, and didn't make a single start. Courtney Lee, on the other hand, has appeared in at least 71 games in every season of his career except for one, when he was injured and played only 58 games. Lee started more games his rookie season than Green played...total...in his 1st 2 seasons.
Lee has played 600 career regular season games, compared to 402 for Danny Green.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=1&p1=greenda02&p2=leeco01&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=All this adds up to a whopping, landslide victory for Danny Green in the defensive department. Despite the fact that Green has played in 198 fewer career games than Courtney Lee, Danny Green has MORE DEFENSIVE WIN SHARES!! That alone should be enough, but there's more. Green has a higher career Defensive Box Plus-Minus, a higher Steal %, higher Block %, more steals per game and more blocks per game. Danny Green also has a lower career Defensive Rating than Courtney Lee by a full 6 points over their careers.
Danny Green is literally better by every single measurable stat defensively, whether you look at the Advanced Stats, the Per-Game stats, or the Per 36 minute stats. It doesn't matter. They all point to Danny Green.
Then we can look at just this past season, where the stats are even more lopsided in Green's favor:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/play-index/pcm_finder.cgi?request=1&sum=0&p1=greenda02&y1=2016&p2=leeco01&y2=2016&p3=&p4=&p5=&p6=Again, landslide victory for Danny Green in literally every single measurable defensive stat, no matter how you break the stats down. Danny Green posted a full 10 points higher in Defensive Rating. Courtney Lee had a negative Defensive Box Plus-Minus. Green had 2.4 more Defensive Win Shares... I'm getting bored going over all of this.
I have no idea what kind of bull cherry picked stats you came up with to make some silly point about Courtney Lee, but it really doesn't matter. I vaguely remember you posting some article about Lee being a good defender? Well let's see what Zach Lowe thinks:
http://grantland.com/the-triangle/danny-green-spurs-transition-defense/But hell, why not go even deeper? NBA dot com has some pretty great sortable stats available for all sorts of cool things. One of those cool things is Opponent FG% from various spots on the floor. They list 6 zones with sortable stats. I went ahead and filtered the stats down to Starting Guards over age 28 to narrow down the list enough to make it easier to search for these 2. So let's take a look at how our boys fared, shall we?
http://stats.nba.com/defensivehub/#!/oppshooting/player/?sort=Less%20Than%205%20ft.%20FG%20PCT&dir=-1&Season=2015-16&SeasonType=Regular%20Season&PlayerPosition=G&StarterBench=Starters&CF=AGE*G*28&PlayerExperience=VeteranLESS THAN 5 FEET: Danny Green: 53.2% Courtney Lee: 59.5% Winner: DANNY GREEN
5-9 FEET: Danny Green: 39.5% Courtney Lee: 39.6% Winner: DANNY GREEN
10-14 FEET: Danny Green: 39.6% Courtney Lee: 37.2% Winner: COURTNEY LEE
15-19 FEET: Danny Green: 42.5% Courtney Lee: 41.4% Winner: COURTNEY LEE
20-24 FEET: Danny Green: 34.7% Courtney Lee: 37.5% Winner: DANNY GREEN
25-29 FEET: Danny Green: 34.3% Courtney Lee: 34.0% Winner: COURTNEY LEE
So overall, they are split pretty damn evenly across the floor in terms of Opponent FG%, taking down 3 categories each and putting up similar numbers in nearly every category. However, analyzing this further, Danny Green wins in a landslide close to the basket as well as on long-2s, whereas the 3 categories that Lee wins are all very close between the 2. Either way, I gotta give credit for being a better midrange jumpsuit defender in terms of Opponent FG% this season.
Given the fact that they performed pretty much equally in Opponent FG% throughout the floor, I would have to say that narrowing things down to Defensive Metrics, Per Game Stats, and Per 36 minute stats is the best way to decide who has the greater all-around effect defensively. That gives the victory to Danny Green, and it's really not close.
I'm not saying Courtney Lee is not a good defender, I'm simply saying that Danny Green is better. And I think I proved my point.
However, your argument was that Courtney Lee and Solomon Hill are a better defensive wing combo than Kawhi Leonard and Danny Green, and as far as that argument is concerned, it would be REALLY difficult for you to be any more wrong.
Now, it's bad enough that you're completely wrong about a subject that is so simple that any serious basketball fan should inherently know it without looking. But to top it off, you have been a total dick about it!
I can't believe I had to go through all of that trouble just to prove how ridiculous your argument was. Unbelievable. You sure as hell make one helluva ambassador for this forum though, as I feel like damn near every interaction I had on this board has gone pretty close to the way this one did.
